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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 14 to 38 of 58. Go back in thread:
Posted by happyflower on November 10, 2005, at 9:56:53
In reply to Re: Thanks all the thing is he does it very innocently » Tamar, posted by orchid on November 10, 2005, at 8:59:25
>
> My father is a very nice person at heart. He is just being blind and stupid in this one particular thing. Maybe with enough pull backs he will sense it.
>
Your posts sound so familar like the ones about were your DH was hitting you. You say he is nice and loves you but he still hits you anyways. I see a pattern here, I wish you could stand up for yourself against the abuse you are taking. What is happening to you isn't right.
Posted by B2chica on November 10, 2005, at 10:17:04
In reply to I am afraid I might give up one of these days, posted by orchid on November 10, 2005, at 5:29:00
it's interesting that your thoughts of giving up in life coincide with you moving back home and near your father.... remember, thoughts are ok, but crossing the line into action is not. so explore your thoughts. what's at the root, what's pushing these thoughts of death into your mind? is it other thoughts you don't want to deal with so your escaping into thoughts of death?
also, your dad may be playing the innocent card but if it makes you uncomfortable then it needs to stop. some people are just naturally touchy feely people but there are boundries and if they can't figure them out on their own, YOU need to say them. someone mentioned a really tactful way of saying this, something about your my dad and i love you but don't do that.
and PLEASE don't give up. this is a lot to cope with, but i KNOW you are strong. it may not feel like it now. but i've read your posts for a long time and i KNOW you have it in you. just hang on. heck just stand there and i'll hang on to you....PROMISE. i've got a grip like a pit bull. i won't let go as long as you need me. and if i get tired i'll create a babble rope, me, gg, happyflower, tamar, daisym all the others well all hang tight.
ALWAYS come here. voice what you feel. as long as you say what pains you it won't have control over you!please take care
b2c.
Posted by allisonross on November 10, 2005, at 12:54:50
In reply to Re: Thanks all the thing is he does it very innocently » orchid, posted by Tamar on November 10, 2005, at 6:45:57
> >Dear Orchid: (I posted to your original post, but lost it somehow...it was long, too!) arrghh. Thanks everyone for your support.
> >
> > I am really confused. What my father does is not sexual.Lying on top of you....is sexual.
That is why it never occurred to me it was wrong when I was growing up. He just does everything in a very innocent and non sexual way.
He hopes you will think that, but if he is not mentally impaired in some way, he KNOWS what he is doing is wrong.
But the effect on me is very bad.
I know.
I was molested too.Bottom line? if what some is doing you is causing you confusion, and pain, it is wrong. Would he stop if you told him that if it happens again, you would tell your mother?
>
> Well, I guess part of the question is: what is sex? I know if *any* man (or woman) got into bed with me and tried to lie on top of me I would interpret it in a sexual way.of course. Maybe others wouldn’t. I don’t know. But I think most people would.
>
> I think a parent and child can sleep together innocently.Of course, but your situation is about a parent and a grown woman.
My kids get into bed with me sometimes. I sometimes get into bed with my two-year old and cuddle her. But it’s not every day; it’s maybe once every three months, and it’s generally because *she* wants it rather than because I want it. And I think that’s the thing. You didn’t want it; you dad was/is the one who wants it. It’s wrong of him to coerce you.
>
> I don’t know how innocent he can really be. You’ve told him you don’t like it. You pull away from him when he does it. You’ve asked him not to do it. If I remember correctly, you said that even his friends used to tell him he wasn’t being sensible towards you when you were a kid. And yet he persists in doing it, and in finding excuses: trying to persuade you that it’s good for you. That doesn’t sound like innocence to me. I know you meant sexually innocent… But nevertheless, it sounds to me as if this is now a question of the power he exercises over you. And if he’s touching you in ways you don’t like and refusing to stop… I think it really does constitute assault, even if it’s not overtly sexual.
>
> > I am not in any real danger. But it is just so subtle.Abuse can be very subtle. The abuser doesn't want you to know what he is doing, and hopes you won't figure it out. The last thing he wants, is anybody to know.
I wish I had a T to talk about this. :-(
you can call a women's shelter, they can help, or also any mental health clinic, or hospital.
Can you lock your door, so he doesn't try to lie on top of you on your bed?
Perhaps write him a letter, and tell him that if he touches you again, you WILL tell your mom
(even if he doesn't think you will, or thinks your mom won't believe you, it might make him think.
If he DOES do it again, yell in a loud voice: STOP it, etc......
He is counting on your silence, and the secrecy (just like when you were a child)
I think you ARE in danger; your mind is a precious, valuable thing; your feelings are all you have to tell you what is going on with you. Always trust your instincts, sweetie.
There is NO excuse for him violating you. He is molesting you. This is unbelievable and so painful for you. There is no "innocence" here. He is not a child.
>
> It seems to me that you *are* in real danger… at the very least, there is danger to your mental health. It’s hard to maintain a sense of self when people invade your person in such a confusing way. Maybe that’s why you’re having thoughts about death… maybe you want to escape? I think you do need to be protected: I know it would be extremely difficult for you to leave, but if your father doesn’t agree to completely stop touching you, I wonder whether you can consider all the possible ways of leaving, even if they are difficult.
>
> At the very least, can you go stay with a friend for a couple of days? I think it might be easier for you to think about what to do if you’re able to get out of your parents’ house for a little while.
>
> Please stay as safe as you can!
> Hugs,
> TamarWoops, got to the bottom here, and realized Tamar and I are "talking" at the same time? Techie glitch, I guess.
Sorry, dear Orchid; we all want you to be safe.
hugs, Allison (tons of hugs)
>
>
Posted by allisonross on November 10, 2005, at 13:07:00
In reply to Re: Thanks all the thing is he does it very innoce » Tamar, posted by allisonross on November 10, 2005, at 12:54:50
Posted by allisonross on November 10, 2005, at 13:09:51
In reply to **trigger** I have been feeling somewhat suicidal, posted by orchid on November 10, 2005, at 4:51:00
> Dearest ((((Orchid)))): Can you get into therapy?
I have been feeling somewhat suicidal also in the past couple of weeks. On and off.
>
> Life seems to be a constant war. Nothing goes easily, and I have to fight for everything, and things seem so difficult. Even though I enjoy being with family etc, I just get so down.It's exhausting, isn't it, sweetie.
Best advice I have? Find a therapist, and start to heal; it is hard, difficult work, but well worth your effort. If you ever want to e-mail me: wacalice@aol.com
Love and tons of hugs, Ally
Posted by Jen Star on November 10, 2005, at 18:15:11
In reply to Thanks all the thing is he does it very innocently, posted by orchid on November 10, 2005, at 4:42:04
hi Orchid,
the thing IS sexual, since it's 2 adults touching and lying together, and since you're having weird feelings about sex with your hubby. Something doesn't have to involve intercourse to be "sexual." Sometimes even a glance or a caress can be very sensual/sexual in nature!It IS abuse, because you don't like it, and because it's abnormal, and basically -- you don't want it.
It IS abuse. It's not right. And it's OK to stand up for yourself - do not permit it any longer! It's NOT innocent -- and it's ridiculous to think it would cure arthritis.
Yikes.
Orchid, I hope you're OK.
JenStar
Posted by Jen Star on November 10, 2005, at 18:23:02
In reply to I was clearly abused, posted by orchid on November 9, 2005, at 21:47:01
Orchid,
it seems to me that you're going down a bad path of despair. At least in the USA, you had culture and law on your side, even if you chose not to exercise the right to use them.In India, culturally, men usually have dominance over women. You seem to be falling into a trap where you are losing your self-esteem and sense of self-worth, and just doing what the men in your life want you to do. And what THEY want you to do seems to be getting further and further from what YOU want for yourself. It seems that your depression and suicidal feelings are related to this move back to India, back to dependence, away from independence, away from your individual identity.
I worry about you without a job, without close friends, with family that 1)are abusive (dad) and 2)look the other way (mother.)
I sooo wish you could stand up for yourself. Why don't you? I'm not asking that out of a desire to be b**chy or snide. I'm really curious and worried. Why DON'T you stand up and tell them to stop it? Why DON'T you leave? Why DON'T you come back to the US, alone? (or go to a different part of the world, or India, alone?)
I wish I could help. I hope this post doesn't make you mad or upset or sad. I'm just worried, and I want to be honest with my feelings.
take care, and please keep posting!
jenStar
Posted by orchid on November 10, 2005, at 19:20:21
In reply to Re: I was clearly abused » orchid, posted by Jen Star on November 10, 2005, at 18:23:02
Thanks everyone for your thoughts.
The strange thing is, my mother does know. It is a little weird arrangement we always had in my house. I never had a separate bedroom growing up. We always used to sleep in the same room. It isn't that uncommon here. And he hugs me etc even right in front of her, and she doesn't object. That is why I am pretty sure he doesn't realize what he is doing is wrong and could lead to problems for me.
And I do know my father. He has some issues, but he is a very good person at heart. And he knowingly wouldn't have caused me any problem.
I keep thinking I got confused and it was my mistake. But my second T said it is abuse. On one hand, I was aware of it beign not so proper. And on the other hand, there was nothing sexual, so I couldn't say a clear no to it so far.
Even now, I think he doesn't really realize it as being inappropriate. But it led me to so much of confusion about my role, my sexuality and my identity etc. I keep longing for people who are not available to me, and have difficulty in accepting myself and my feelings.
And now I have a choice to leave anyday. Nobody is holding me here. But I love my parents very much. In fact, I think I might have some kind of dependancy issues with my dad. I even think I cannot live without him in this world. Another hard part to admit is, I like his touching. I don't like him hugging me too closely etc, but I like to hold hands etc. But sometimes even he hugs me very closely I feel quite nice and comfortable. I am so used to it. It is a shameful thing to admit, but I guess lot of people who get abused by their parents start liking it. In mycase, I didn't realize it was even inappropriate for a long time. Actually I did realize it many times it was not appropriate, but I didn't realize the extent of it. It was shameful and comfortable at the same time.
But maybe it is time to put a full stop to it. I am gonig to confront my father if he does it again. I already told him once or twice, but maybe I should say it more firmly.
Posted by Dinah on November 10, 2005, at 20:14:23
In reply to For all (connection speed isn't that good), posted by orchid on November 10, 2005, at 19:20:21
You definitely need to say it firmly and unambiguously. If he touches you, no matter whether it is overtly sexual or not, against your will, it is wrong. Just plain wrong. Everyone is entitled to respect for their own bodies, which includes freedom from unwelcome touch.
It doesn't matter if it's sexual. It's not right to tickle someone against their will either.
But I was especially concerned with the fact that he's saying that his hugging you can cure your arthritis. That doesn't seem all that innocent to me.
If you haven't been clear to him so far that you don't want certain types of touch, now is the time to do it.
You might be surprised. With my therapist's encouragement, I set all sorts of boundaries with my parents in the last several years. And wonder of wonders, if I upheld them, they respected them. And weren't even horribly angry about it.
Posted by orchid on November 11, 2005, at 1:26:40
In reply to Re: For all (connection speed isn't that good) » orchid, posted by Dinah on November 10, 2005, at 20:14:23
Thanks Dinah.
I have decided to tell my father to not touch me like that hereafter. I think if I insist, he will get it. Maybe that is better, than silently hurting myself and getting even more confused.
Posted by orchid on November 11, 2005, at 1:32:00
In reply to Re: For all (connection speed isn't that good) » Dinah, posted by orchid on November 11, 2005, at 1:26:40
Actually now that I openly said it and read everyone's views, I am feeling much more clearer and peaceful. So far, I was extremely confused by the whole thing. I think if I don't allow any other subtle things other than what is strictly appropriate for a father, then I will also be much clearer in my own issues and identity etc. Maybe that will help me get rid of my confusion with my husband also. Maybe that is better for everyone concerned.
Thanks all. I really am happy for the support that i always get in this board. it means a lot to me.
Posted by orchid on November 11, 2005, at 7:44:00
In reply to Feeling much better - thanks all., posted by orchid on November 11, 2005, at 1:32:00
Any suggestions on how to say it in a non offending way? I was thinking of telling him today, but it seems very difficult. I don't want to accuse him of abuse, but it is so difficult to get the words out. I once told him over the phone, but that was on the phone and it seemed easier. Now face to face seems to be much harder. But he doesn't seem to understand silent pull backs.
This is really hard. But one good thing taht happened is, I have forgiven myself for all the blame that I took upon myself. And all the confusion. If now, my father has so much of control and power over me, I could never have done anything as a child. And I do know that even as a child I didn't encourage it and tried to pull back several times in silent protest. But I didn't have the courage to say no firmly. But it is time I did it.
Posted by Dinah on November 11, 2005, at 9:09:30
In reply to how do I say it?, posted by orchid on November 11, 2005, at 7:44:00
"Dad, I love you, and I know you love me. I'm not a little girl anymore, I'm a grown woman with a husband. The way you touch me sometimes makes me feel uncomfortable. I'm going to have to ask you not to touch me except (fill in what sort of touches are acceptable). If you do, I'm afraid I'll have to get up and leave each time you do it. I'm not saying you're doing anything wrong. I am saying what I am comfortable with and able to tolerate."
And then most importantly, do it. If he touches you inappropriately, say "I'm sorry, Dad. I asked you not to do that, and now I'm going to have to leave. I'll see you later."
Just suggestions of course. It'd come much better in your own words.
But I did something similar with my own father, along the lines of
"Daddy, it upsets me when you yell and scream or threaten to kill Mother. I'm afraid that if you do that, I'm going to have to hang up the phone, or leave the house. I'm sorry. I love you. But I just can't tolerate the feelings that yelling and cursing cause in me." Then I did it. He fussed some, but got the idea and while he wasn't perfect afterwards, he was way better because he knew I meant what I said, and he loved me.
Posted by allisonross on November 11, 2005, at 10:53:57
In reply to how do I say it?, posted by orchid on November 11, 2005, at 7:44:00
>Dearest Orchid: From the little I read into your words, it seems you are afraid of offending your father, and want to find a gentle way to tell him to stop violating you.
If you found out he was doing this to your children, what would you say? I have a feeling you wouldn't be worried about his feelings.
Try to take that little chid you were so long ago, and take her by the hand.
Speak to her, and tell her that you will NEVER allow anyone to hurt or molest her again.
You can say it nicely, and you already have, right? He doesn't care about what you want. He doesn't hear you.
I don't think there is a "nice" way to say: Stop molesting me, dad......he is violating you, and disrespecting your boundaries.
It is very difficult to have boundaries when abused as a child (I know, I have had to learn them).
When you are abused/molested as a child the message that you were sent, was that you have no boundaries, and you will be used. you have no rights. Your feelings and thoughts do not exist. how horrific.
(hard to hear I know; we all want our parents' love).
Actually, there IS a book called; Boundaries (it's by Townsend and Cloud, I believe); EXCELLENT book, and I went to their seminar.i wAny suggestions on how to say it in a non offending way? I was thinking of telling him today, but it seems very difficult. I don't want to accuse him of abuse, but it is so difficult to get the words out.
It is scary (did you say you had a t?) He/she could do an intervention, or simply be with you when you tell him, so it won't be so scary.
I once told him over the phone, but that was on the phone and it seemed easier. Now face to face seems to be much harder. But he doesn't seem to understand silent pull backs.
He DOES understand; he is an adult; game playing. What do you think would happen if he did this to someone else? They would have him arrested. he is NOT innocent. He has always known what he was/is doing; he counted/counts on your silence.
>
> This is really hard. But one good thing taht happened is, I have forgiven myself for all the blame that I took upon myself.Good for you! The fault was never your own, but the abused take on the shame of the abuser, while the abuser goes on without a thought to the pain and anguish they have caused. Narcissism.
And all the confusion. If now, my father has so much of control and power over me, I could never have done anything as a child. And I do know that even as a child I didn't encourage it and tried to pull back several times in silent protest.
Children NEVER "encourage" being molested. This is NOT it takes two to tango thing. you were innocent.
But I didn't have the courage to say no firmly.
Do you mean as a child? If so, you were blameless, chidren want to have their dads
(never knew mine)
love them, and are willing to do whatever it takes. He wouldn't have heard you anyway.
You were powerless as a child.
You are not powerless now.
You have a choice. I hope you will choose "life"---that means verbally or in a letter (I wouldn't make it long or complicated);
basically: What you are doing is wrong. If it happens again, I will----fill in the blanks
But it is time I did it.
Courage, dear new little friend...Love n hugs,
AllyI suspect under that gentleness, there must be such anger and rage at the person who was supposed to love and protect you----exploited you.
Posted by orchid on November 11, 2005, at 11:26:41
In reply to Re: how do I say it? » orchid, posted by allisonross on November 11, 2005, at 10:53:57
Thanks Dinah and Allison. You are right Allison - I have lot of anger and rage inside. But I can't seem to be able to access it. I know it is there - it comes out in bursts every now and then, but I can't fully get hold of it.
But it almost feels like a duty to give in to my dad. I am getting all the old feelings back. I used to feel it was my duty to satisfy my father. He never used to like my mom and didn't get what he wanted from her. I almost served as his substitute, and I felt I was obliged to meet his demands. Even now, it feels like a cruel thing to do to him if I ask him to stop. But rationally atleast now I realize what a horrible thing it is if I let him continue with it. I will end up killing myself. But also I feel like, "Oh what will he do if he can't hug me? He will be devastated". But I know it is not right.
I feel so embarassed at myself for allowing this for so long. Why didn't I realize or stop it after 20 or 21? Why did I let it continue even after I was an adult? I kept thinking it was harmless and not sexual - but I did have serious doubts and felt uncomfortable.
Posted by orchid on November 11, 2005, at 11:31:34
In reply to It almost feels like my duty, posted by orchid on November 11, 2005, at 11:26:41
Posted by allisonross on November 11, 2005, at 14:52:08
In reply to It almost feels like my duty, posted by orchid on November 11, 2005, at 11:26:41
> Thanks Dinah and Allison. You are right Allison - I have lot of anger and rage inside. But I can't seem to be able to access it. I know it is there - it comes out in bursts every now and then, but I can't fully get hold of it.
I think I asked you. Are you in therapy? I would say that if not, get there.....yesterday.
you need to figure out why you keep abusing yourself. you probably have a wide range of emotions about this whole situation. A therapist can help you sort those out.
>
> But it almost feels like a duty to give in to my dad.Brainwashed.
I am getting all the old feelings back. I used to feel it was my duty to satisfy my father.
That is because he made you feel that way.
He never used to like my mom and didn't get what he wanted from her. I almost served as his substitute,
You WERE a substitute.
and I felt I was obliged to meet his demands. Even now, it feels like a cruel thing to do to him if I ask him to stop. But rationally atleast now I realize what a horrible thing it is if I let him continue with it.
Yes.
I will end up killing myself.
I have heard that depression is anger turned inwards. Like I said; deep inside somewhere.....the subconscious....you are full of fury that you were molested and abused.
But also I feel like, "Oh what will he do if he can't hug me? He will be devastated".
The old guilty feelings from childhood. You were used to meeting his needs.
But I know it is not right. No it isn't. he knows it isn't.
I think you are in a fight for your very life and sanity. I get from what you said you are visiting him/them? Can you not leave?
>
> I feel so embarassed at myself for allowing this for so long.Shame is destructive.
Why didn't I realize or stop it after 20 or 21? Why did I let it continue even after I was an adult? I kept thinking it was harmless and not sexual - but I did have serious doubts and felt uncomfortable.
Always...trust your gut, but you had/have been programmed/brainwashed into thinking that MAYBE...this was okay; your gut told you it was NOT.
Hope you can talk to a therapist soon. You must protect yourself, and fight the feelings of allowing him to touch you.
Call a women's shelter, suicide prevention hotline, hospital (mental health clinic), etc, they can give you direction. You deserve to find peace.
If right now, you don't feel you can stand up to him; then perhaps think about your children.
Would you stand up for them, if he was doing this to them?
Don't want to sound harsh, but denial is powerful, and that is where you are right now.
It's understandable ; you love him (or think you do), and have been programmed to do whatever he wanted you to do. You don't know how to stop it, and/or are afraid he won't love you anymore? or you will disappoint him?
in the meantime, he is molesting you, and because of it (and the past); you feel suicidal. I hope you will take steps the moment you read this, and call one of those places I mentioned. if you need phone numbers, etc, I will get them for you.
You can (and owe it to yourself and your children) to take back your life.
love, Ally
Hugs, Allison
Posted by 10derHeart on November 11, 2005, at 15:44:34
In reply to Re: It almost feels like my duty***May Trigger** » orchid, posted by allisonross on November 11, 2005, at 14:52:08
Hi allison,
Orchid did mention her thoughts re: seeing another T. in this post above:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/psycho/20051107/msgs/577361.html
Orchid is from India, and she and her husband have recently moved back there from the States and are staying/living with her parents at this time.
Just wanted to clarify for you [re: getting Orchid helpful phone numbers, etc.] since you're new[er] here :-)...(hope that's okay, orchid)
Posted by Tamar on November 11, 2005, at 16:03:15
In reply to It almost feels like my duty, posted by orchid on November 11, 2005, at 11:26:41
> But it almost feels like a duty to give in to my dad. I am getting all the old feelings back. I used to feel it was my duty to satisfy my father. He never used to like my mom and didn't get what he wanted from her. I almost served as his substitute, and I felt I was obliged to meet his demands. Even now, it feels like a cruel thing to do to him if I ask him to stop. But rationally atleast now I realize what a horrible thing it is if I let him continue with it. I will end up killing myself. But also I feel like, "Oh what will he do if he can't hug me? He will be devastated". But I know it is not right.
Yeah, the duty thing. I think it’s very common in people who have been abused as kids.
What will he do if he can’t hug you? He’ll have to find some appropriate ways of gratifying his needs and desires. Like maybe trying to have a better relationship with your mother… Maybe he’ll be devastated at first, but he’ll get used to it. And it won’t do him any damage. Actually, it might be good for him to be placed in a position of looking to his marriage for the sort of comfort he seems to find in his physical relationship with you.
> I feel so embarassed at myself for allowing this for so long. Why didn't I realize or stop it after 20 or 21? Why did I let it continue even after I was an adult? I kept thinking it was harmless and not sexual - but I did have serious doubts and felt uncomfortable.
I think it’s very difficult to make profound changes to a relationship, especially if the other person in the relationship is able to exercise a great deal of power over you. That’s probably why you didn’t find ways of making it stop sooner.
And even if it isn’t/wasn’t overtly sexual touch, it is still touch with sexual overtones… which makes it very confusing.
I like Dinah’s suggestions about how to tell him. And I reckon the book that Ally mentions would probably be useful, if you can get hold of it. Another possibility might be "Boundary Issues by Jane Adams" – I haven’t read it, but I’ve heard good things about it.
The fact is, you’ve already told him, so telling him again is hard, but at least it won’t be the first time he’s heard it. If you tell him, he may try to persuade you that you don’t really mean it. But you’re a strong woman; stick to your guns and insist that it makes you uncomfortable and that he must stop.
I know it’s difficult to do, though…
Tamar
Posted by orchid on November 12, 2005, at 0:15:17
In reply to Re: It almost feels like my duty***May Trigger** » orchid, posted by allisonross on November 11, 2005, at 14:52:08
Thanks Allison. What you are saying is completely right. This is how I feel. I am so afraid of my dad. In fact I have an extremely confusing relationship with him in all possible ways.
Atleast I have made up my mind to not allow this any further - whatever it takes.
Regarding the feelings, I have to work out them still. But I don't have a therapist. And I perhaps can't get one because of so many other factors.
I can leave - that is an option in the worst case. But I am hoping I can work this out.
Posted by orchid on November 12, 2005, at 0:16:42
In reply to Re: It almost feels like my duty***May Trigger** » allisonross, posted by 10derHeart on November 11, 2005, at 15:44:34
Posted by orchid on November 12, 2005, at 0:33:03
In reply to Re: It almost feels like my duty » orchid, posted by Tamar on November 11, 2005, at 16:03:15
Thanks Tamar. You remember once I told you about always feeling restless? I think it is also perhaps part of this.
I have decided to not to let it allow any further. IT has gone on long enough. And it has confused me as much as possible. I am going to say no to my father. When you are abused as a kid, I think it is very hard to define your boundaries and draw the line and enforce it.
I wish I had my second T now to talk through it. She would know what to say. I didn't write down whatever she said, which is a big mistake. I have all the suggestions from my first T written down, but not my second Ts. In fact, she anticipated this and tried to even prepare me for this. I have been trying to recollect whatever she told me.
Perhaps the reason why I didn't stop it after I was an adult is also partly becuase of the fact that I never was at home all the time. I was away from home from 16 and only visited on the holidays. And I suppose I didn't want to spoil my holidays by arguing about it and even then, I think it would have been very hard to stand up against my father. I have extreme dependancy issues with him and am terribly afraid of him. And I love him at the same time.
I can't get hold of the books you have suggested.
I wish I had someone to talk about it. But I don't have any way of doing it here. I can perhaps look for a new T, but I will be travelling back and forth between my house and my in laws house frequently, and I will also be gone week after next for a month for some treatment for my arthritis. So getting to a new T is not workable for the next few months atleast.
Posted by 10derHeart on November 12, 2005, at 0:40:16
In reply to Thanks 10der. (nm) » 10derHeart, posted by orchid on November 12, 2005, at 0:16:42
oh, you're welcome. Just thought maybe to save you a little typing of the "facts" lots of us already know, for allison and maybe others reading.
(((orchid))) you poor thing. It must be so stressful. It seems like you are between a rock and a hard place, in a way, although you know ultimately you MUST protect yourself and your mental health, or else, the rest won't matter anyway.
But because it's a parent, it's so crazy-making. To resent and even hate at times, then knowing simultaneously you love and need them. I wish somehow your father would get help and/or admonishment from someone he respects and really listens to....a friend? brother? clergy? I just mean so there would be more pressure from another direction on him to stop this harmful behavior NOW. Not just poor you alone, having to suffer while you repeatedly "retrain" him to quit this.
How much (if anything) does your husband see or know about your dad touching you? I thought maybe I read your dad openly holds your hand (which could be fine if you always liked that type of touching and that's ALL the type there was happening...) Does he ever see this? And if so, does he say anything about how he views it? I can't help but think he could be your best ally, Orchid, because he loves you, and he IS your husband with every right...no...extra rights to demand this sick behavior stop...is there a way this could happen?
Stay strong in your focus on being kind to and protecting YOU - your dad will be FINE and none of this at all is your fault!!
I know it's very hard. Please keep posting.
Posted by orchid on November 12, 2005, at 0:58:22
In reply to Re: Thanks 10der. » orchid, posted by 10derHeart on November 12, 2005, at 0:40:16
Thanks 10der.
My husband actually knows about it. In fact when we were about to get married, my family and my in laws family were staying in a hotel just after we arrived from the US, and one day my father was lying on the bed hugging me. And the door was not locked, so my mother-in-law happened to come in to call me for soemthing, and she got very angry seeing it, and she told my husband. And my husband fought with me about it, and I told my dad. But my dad defended his position at that time, and he was talking badly of my husband and my mother-in-law for making an issue out of it. At that time, I didn't defend my husband, (whcih was horribly wrong on my part), but then later, I always tried to silently avoid my dad. And my father had made it a point to not touch me in front of my hsuband. But after my marriage, I have also been pulling away from my dad much more than before, and I have been doing it silently for the past 4 years. But I didn't say no to it firmly and was quite frankly confused and didn't know what to think of it. Since I am pulling away, my father doesn't do as much as before, so mostly it never happens, and even if it happens, I quickly pull away silently.
But still I doubt that my father continues it knowing it hurts me. I still think he does it innocently. But maybe that was just an excuse I gave to myself when I was a kid.
It is quite embarrasing to write everything in detail here, but I need to get it out and work through this.
The good thing is, it was never overtly sexual, so I guess that is why I have atleast this much sanity left in me. It always jsut ended up being a little short of explicity abuse.
Posted by allisonross on November 12, 2005, at 7:23:30
In reply to Re: It almost feels like my duty***May Trigger** » allisonross, posted by orchid on November 12, 2005, at 0:15:17
> Hi, sweetie: Thanks Allison. What you are saying is completely right. This is how I feel. I am so afraid of my dad. In fact I have an extremely confusing relationship with him in all possible ways.
>
> Atleast I have made up my mind to not allow this any further - whatever it takes.
>
> Regarding the feelings, I have to work out them still. But I don't have a therapist. And I perhaps can't get one because of so many other factors.Can you explain? If it is a money situation, there are places to get help.
>
> I can leave - that is an option in the worst case. But I am hoping I can work this out.
>Hugs, Ally
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