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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by Dinah on June 8, 2004, at 19:51:50
In reply to Re: Waaaaaahhhhhhhh » Dinah, posted by Aphrodite on June 8, 2004, at 19:36:03
Posted by antigua on June 8, 2004, at 19:56:08
In reply to Re: Waaaaaahhhhhhhh » fallsfall, posted by Dinah on June 8, 2004, at 19:47:14
I'm really sorry you're going through all this. You seemed to have really made an effort to please your therapist. I get it. I would have done the same. But Dinah, you know yourself better than anyone. You tried it, but it didn't feel "true" to you. Believe in yourself, trust yourself. I'm sorry he doesn't feel safe anymore. I wish I could make it so for you because you've often spoken of the good work you've done w/him.
best,
antigua
Posted by fallsfall on June 8, 2004, at 20:40:59
In reply to Re: Waaaaaahhhhhhhh » fallsfall, posted by Dinah on June 8, 2004, at 19:47:14
>I don't even think I like him anymore.
>I don't feel safe there anymore.
Dinah, you need to talk to him about this.
Posted by Pfinstegg on June 8, 2004, at 20:41:24
In reply to Waaaaaahhhhhhhh, posted by Dinah on June 8, 2004, at 16:00:35
Aw, Dinah, I can really commiserate with you. I have also had some awful hair occurences- wanting just a little temporary color, or a few highlights, and getting either darker than I have ever been, or unnaturally *golden*. Did you have semipermanent color, or the permanent kind? The semipermanent gets more natural- looking very quickly, and washes out completely in about six weeks, usually.
After many painful experiments, I think I have found the right way to approach the whole thing. my hair is dark blond with a little grey in the front. About every 6 months, I have highlights- just a few- those are permanent. Then over that I have a semipermanent dark blond rinse, which gradually washes out. It looks natural, which is the most important thing. I do think it might be worth it to wait a little before having anything more done, as it may get much more natural-looking, or you may get to like it. Or you may like it just as it naturally is, without any added color.
As to the sort of rift this has created with your therapist, I feel very sad about that, and hope it isn't permanent. It seems like you have usually had such a strong connection with him, and have done so much good work together. Having read your posts over the past year, you seem to be so much healthier and happier now than you were a year and a half ago. I know you don't really like me to say that, but I do think it!
It's so tricky when therapists make ANY kind of comment about appearance, I think. You T. may have gotten himself unwittingly into a *mother* position by expressing his views. I guess we have all had mothers urging us to look prettier in various ways, with the mothers doing the choosing of what those things will be. I would be very angry if my T. said anything like what yours did, because it is an implicit criticism, and it also detracts from your position as an adult who can and should make all those decisions yourself. But I do hope you will tell him all the things you have told us here and will be able to work it through, because there is so much else that is valuable between you. If it's any help, I get very angry, negative feelings towards my T. on a regular basis- from unconscious pressures of my own usually, or sometimes because he seems not to understand me. But working through those very unpleasant feelings has, so far, always been so worth it. We end up with a stronger alliance than ever, even though during those hard times I feel, also, that I don't even like him, and might do well to quit. Will you let us know how things go, both with him, and with your hair? We'll be thinking of you.
P.
Posted by gardenergirl on June 8, 2004, at 22:16:21
In reply to Re: Waaaaaahhhhhhhh » Dinah, posted by Pfinstegg on June 8, 2004, at 20:41:24
Dinah,
I'm so sorry this backfired for you. I'm sure it must have taken a great deal of courage to change your hair color. It sounds like you and your T had an honest discussion about his prejudices. He did ask how he can do better. I hope when you are ready you give him a chance.In the meantime, try to notice often how the darker color highlights your light colored eyes. Enjoy that aspect at least, until you make a change.
Take care. We love you no matter what color your hair is or even if you had none!
gg
Posted by tabitha on June 9, 2004, at 1:38:51
In reply to Waaaaaahhhhhhhh, posted by Dinah on June 8, 2004, at 16:00:35
brave Dinah, I'm so sorry you're not happy with your hair. I don't have much experience with hair dye, but it can eventually be improved, right? And did you ask if the salon would modify it at no charge since it ended up darker than you wanted? Seems like they might do that.
The bigger concern to me is how you're shaming yourself over picking up on your therapist's taste and wanting to please him. That's nothing to be ashamed of. Of course little Dinah wants to know everything about him, and wants to please him, and wants to get his approval. Maybe I can put it in dog terms-- is it shameful when your dogs pick up on your tastes and try to please you? No of course not-- they're just being lovable puppies, and being true to their dog-nature. Same with little humans, wanting to please their primary caregiver.
Posted by Miss Honeychurch on June 9, 2004, at 8:19:14
In reply to Waaaaaahhhhhhhh, posted by Dinah on June 8, 2004, at 16:00:35
Dinah,
I've been there with the hair thing. Especially with such a radical change, it takes a long time getting used to. And just remember, it's only hair. The color will fade. It's usually after a week or so of having my hair colored or highlighted at the salon that I begin to really like it. It softens up. All is not lost!
A break sounds like a good idea to me. Can you do 2 weeks?
Posted by lucy stone on June 9, 2004, at 8:43:12
In reply to Waaaaaahhhhhhhh, posted by Dinah on June 8, 2004, at 16:00:35
I think your T has made a mistake here. From your previous posts it is obvious that you felt that he thought you would look better if you colored your hair. Whether or not he really feels that way is irrelevant, IMO. You got the message from him that it would please him if you changed your hair color. You are very dependent on him and he knows that. You changed your hair partly to please him, and he should know that, too. He has let his personal opinion on how women, and by extension, you, look leak into your sessions and that is not right. He needs to readjust his approach to patients and do a better job of keeping those opinions private. He has been seeing you for a long time, and your desire to please him cannot be news to him. It is something you have been working and and will continue to work on. By all means take a break if you think it will help you, but if you continue with him you need to talk about this. He is right, he has let his personal preferences affect your therapy in a negative way, and he needs to improve in that area. Ts are human, too, and they make mistakes, but when they do they should be called on them.
Just sign me Lucy,
The one who always calls her T on mistakes
Posted by pegasus on June 9, 2004, at 12:16:17
In reply to Waaaaaahhhhhhhh, posted by Dinah on June 8, 2004, at 16:00:35
Well, of course you ended up beating yourself up over noticing his opinion! Did he really say it was "none of your business"? Ouch! I think *that* was his biggest mistake. Even more than letting you see his opinion in the first place.
And furthermore, in my opinion, it is wrong to say that his opinion of you is none of your business. Of course it's your business. Can he really expect that clients aren't going to be curious about that? That they aren't going to pay attention to every little clue he might drop? And justifiably so, IMO. We tell these people the most intimate details of our lives, and then he has the nerve to say that his opinion of you (any aspect of it) is none of your business!?!? I have no idea how he could possibly be rationalizing such a statement to himself. I think his opinion of you, especially if he puts it out there, no matter how unwittingly, is something that could be very relevant to your therapy in any number of ways.
Also, I completely disagree about you not having a relationship with him as a person or vice versa. The person-to-person connection is not the only aspect of your therapeutic relationship, but if you've been seeing him for years, it *must* be part of what's going on. Both from his point of view and yours. It's hard to imagine useful therapy without that part. It's not wrong to have it or want it. And I bet he'd agree with me on that.
I think we need to add your T to the spanking list. If I were in your shoes (and what's wrong with Reeboks anyway?), this would be a big deal to work out with him over the next few weeks. And I hope you'll feel ok about challenging him on some of these things, rather than taking a couple of weeks off. This is big stuff, that can make or break therapy. I'd hate to see it simmer down and you never get the opportunity to say some important things. For example, what you wrote in your first reply to falls was great! I'd love to see you say all of that to your T.
Just my 2 cents, and sorry if I'm being reactive. I did have a strong reaction to your post, and felt very defensive for you. I hope you are able to work with/come to terms with your hair. And same with your T.
((Dinah))
pegasus
Posted by pegasus on June 9, 2004, at 12:24:10
In reply to Waaaaaahhhhhhhh, posted by Dinah on June 8, 2004, at 16:00:35
The feminist in me really wants to point out that this is a great example of how our societal expectations for women can be oppressive. Dinah, you seemed so much happier before you felt this pressure to conform to society's narrow rules about women's appearance, which were just not your style. By encouraging this conformity, your T is being an instrument of sexism, which is not helping you. I totally support you in presenting yourself however feels most comfortable to you. You've made your own style that is fabulous and suits you, even if it is unusual. Your husband and son don't seem to have an issue with it. We at babble love it. It's too bad that your T doesn't seem to fully appreciate it, but that is *his* limitation, not yours. IMHO, of course.
pegasus
Posted by lucy stone on June 9, 2004, at 13:11:50
In reply to Another thought, posted by pegasus on June 9, 2004, at 12:24:10
Posted by Poet on June 9, 2004, at 14:38:29
In reply to Waaaaaahhhhhhhh, posted by Dinah on June 8, 2004, at 16:00:35
Dinah,
I'm so sorry your new 'do has made you so unhappy. It sounds like your hairdresser and your T both messed up.
Your hairdresser got the color wrong and doesn't seem to want to admit it. Highlighting may help lighten it and she better not charge you full price for it. It will gradually fade, but if she used permanent dye it will take awhile- I have mine colored every six weeks.
As for your T, he's correct- your appearance shouldn't matter to him, but he should have said it in a less harsh way. Something like I can see that you are working on improving your self esteem, but don't worry about what I think of you, it's what you think of yourself that's important.
Poet
Posted by Dinah on June 9, 2004, at 22:17:03
In reply to Re: Waaaaaahhhhhhhh, posted by Poet on June 9, 2004, at 14:38:29
I'm still waffling on the hair color. Everyone who's seen it (except for my family who have too much sense) is urging me to keep it dark because it suits my coloring better. But I kind of think not. I've got a real "thing" about looking like the person I think I look like, and deviations from that upset me. I think I'm going to try to fix it. I also got a name of a new hairstylist.
As for my therapist, I called to tell him I thought I needed to do some work on my own before I saw him again. To his immense credit, he was enormously apologetic and upset that the session had gone badly. He didn't even do his "Well, it's your choice..." thing that would have solidified my decision to take a break.
Darn it. Just when I'm totally fed up with him, he goes and is good at what he does. Dratted man. I'll see what he says on Friday. I still feel really funny about everything, like I have to separate somehow from him before I see him so that I don't make another intrusive faux pas. But I'll tentatively go in and discuss it with him first. At least I think I will. If I chicken out, I'll go in super-rational mode and blast his derriere out of the water. :)
Posted by Dinah on June 9, 2004, at 22:22:30
In reply to Re: Waaaaaahhhhhhhh, posted by pegasus on June 9, 2004, at 12:16:17
Ouch is right, Pegasus. That was the point that the session turned from bad to disastrous. I had been trying to point out the dynamic of my picking up on his feelings and my excessive need to please him. But when he told me that it was none of my business, it felt like a slap. Maybe it was a slap I needed. But it did feel like a slap. My rational self is super-delighted and is only too happy to help me see the light. You should have heard the internal "AH HAH!! SEE I TOLD YOU SO!!!" that accompanied his statement that it was none of my business. But I can't help thinking that voice is right.
And yes, I think it was a mistake on his part. Even if what he said was the God's honest truth, the way he said it was a mistake.
Posted by Dinah on June 9, 2004, at 22:23:26
In reply to Re: Waaaaaahhhhhhhh » Dinah, posted by Aphrodite on June 8, 2004, at 19:36:03
Posted by Aphrodite on June 10, 2004, at 5:53:03
In reply to Re: Waaaaaahhhhhhhh » pegasus, posted by Dinah on June 9, 2004, at 22:22:30
> And yes, I think it was a mistake on his part. Even if what he said was the God's honest truth, the way he said it was a mistake.You hit the nail on the head, Dinah! I hope Friday goes well for you, and I'm glad you're better, even it just a tad.
Posted by fallsfall on June 10, 2004, at 7:13:43
In reply to Re: A bit more cheerful, posted by Dinah on June 9, 2004, at 22:17:03
I'm glad that he wants to see you on Friday. I really hope you can go. It won't be a fun session, but it probably will be a valuable one. And you'll get the satisfaction of watching him apologize (I know, small satisfaction...).
I think it is important for you to go.
Posted by pegasus on June 10, 2004, at 10:33:04
In reply to Re: Waaaaaahhhhhhhh » pegasus, posted by Dinah on June 9, 2004, at 22:22:30
I'm glad you're feeling better, and I like the way you're dealing with this issue of your hair. I'm sure it's nice to know that other people think the new color looks good, but in the end, it's your hair and it's more important how you feel about it. I know that I *hate* it when I get a different haircut than I expected, because, as you say, it makes me not look like myself. Which I agree can be disturbing. At least this is just hair, and not something permanent like a nose job. Not that I think you need or want a nose job, but my point is that eventually you can get back to your original hair if you prefer that.
I still am not sure that I agree that what your T said was correct, even if presented in an unfortunate way. If he were my T, I'd still ask him to explain how his opinion of me is none of my business, considering all of the intimate details that I had given him about me. And I definitely encourage you to mention your thoughts about not having a real relationship with him as a person. I'm curious whether he'd agree with that (I just know my Ts would not). And yet, it seems like those are perhaps more my issues than yours. I'm sure you'll talk about what you need to talk about.
pegasus
Posted by shadows721 on June 10, 2004, at 15:41:01
In reply to Re: A bit more cheerful, posted by Dinah on June 9, 2004, at 22:17:03
I had low lights and highlights put in and I literally looked like someone could play chest on my head. AWFUL!!!! I washed my hair about 20X and someone suggested Prell. It helped along with an another dye job.
Before you give up this look, I would strongly suggest that you get a camera and take a picture. Look at a picture of you now and the way you were. Compare the two. Even if you just go in the mall in a booth and take a picture, it would give you a better idea of how this haircolor really looks on you. It's more objective. I still think going from grey to brown is a shock to the internal eye. Even if it looked fantanstic, your internal eye would be searching for that other color.
Recently, I went more blonde. I am naturally a dark blonde. I thought that the new color looked totally fake. I was actually embarassed to go out. But, when I did, I got compliments from strangers on how beautiful my hair was. I saw my hair color of the ceilings of the store and realized it was pretty and didn't look like an Easter Egg Yellow after all. After that, I decided to keep it.
P.S. I am glad that you are feeling better.
Posted by Dinah on June 11, 2004, at 20:42:14
In reply to Waaaaaahhhhhhhh, posted by Dinah on June 8, 2004, at 16:00:35
I didn't really want to, of course. And since so many things were going on in my life, it was easy to avoid. I'm still mildly hypomanic with the attention span of a flea, my father is in the hospital, the sleep study, a few other things as well. When I didn't bring it up, he did. He was well prepared and apologized for his part of the bad session and said he felt bad that I had been so upset by it. And I rounded up the courage to tell him the things that had really really made it feel bad, and why, even though it was really embarassing. Since he agreed with much of it, it was even more embarassing, but he was nice about it, so it didn't feel horrid - just embarassing.
He says I have a great support system here with you babblers. I agree of course, and just wanted to pass that along.
Posted by Dinah on June 11, 2004, at 20:45:55
In reply to Re: Waaaaaahhhhhhhh, posted by pegasus on June 9, 2004, at 12:16:17
> Well, of course you ended up beating yourself up over noticing his opinion! Did he really say it was "none of your business"? Ouch! I think *that* was his biggest mistake. Even more than letting you see his opinion in the first place.
>For helping me see the core issue in a confusing and difficult session. I don't think I could have weeded it out by this session without your help. He's promised to try to be a bit more sensitive, and says it is helpful to know that when I get upset, he should consider whether this issue has been triggered.
I told him that it was your post that helped me figured it out, and he was very appreciative.
Posted by pegasus on June 11, 2004, at 22:34:47
In reply to Re: A very special thank you to you » pegasus, posted by Dinah on June 11, 2004, at 20:45:55
Well, shucks, Dinah! I'm kinda embarrassed now, in a good way. I'm really glad that my post was helpful! Your message has just made my day. :)
pegasus
Posted by Aphrodite on June 12, 2004, at 5:59:27
In reply to Re: We talked today, posted by Dinah on June 11, 2004, at 20:42:14
Just when you think you've had it with this guy, he goes and does what he does best which is to do the right thing and make it all better. Glad you went.
P.S. Hope all is well with your father.
Posted by Dinah on June 12, 2004, at 8:37:05
In reply to Re: A very special thank you to you, posted by pegasus on June 11, 2004, at 22:34:47
Posted by Dinah on June 12, 2004, at 8:39:31
In reply to There he goes again » Dinah, posted by Aphrodite on June 12, 2004, at 5:59:27
And I rather wished he was able to control his "frustration" (his word, I say anger) the first time. Then he wouldn't need to apologize so frequently. I must push his buttons a lot. But maybe he is modelling good relationship repairing skills. lol.
This is the end of the thread.
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