Posted by shar on January 29, 2004, at 22:16:27
In reply to Re: Jealous women at work - what to do about them?, posted by gabbix2 on January 29, 2004, at 20:03:32
I have to agree with Dinah and Gabbix on this one. Plus, I was around during the birth of the feminist movement (well, let me clarify...I was not a suffragette, women already had the vote). I'm referring to the mid/late 1960's into the 70's. Actually, I was quite active in 'the movement.' So, my perspective is extremely different from that of Phoenix girl and some of the other writers.
My 20's and later years were spent not full of competition and envy and hate towards other women, but with an understanding of the inherent value of women (ok, men, too...I'm really more of a humanist than feminist, but I like using feminist because it has become an f-word, and I want to do what I can to bring it back into normal conversation) and the things women share (body, mind and spirit) that connect us. Plus, I was committed to righting what I perceived as wrongs perpetrated on women just because they WERE women (such as equal pay for equal work, reproductive rights, the opportunity to be educated, work options that did not include being harrassed sexually by others--that kind of thing).
Moreover, I was raised with a view of beauty that had a little hook: if someone wasn't beautiful inside, they weren't beautiful; and, alternately, if someone was beautiful on the inside, they were beautiful. It was the whole book...cover thing.
I was physically attractive (tho I would not say I am now), I have always been a tomboy (no makeup and jeans, except sometimes for parties the black off the shoulder minidress with a red sequined cummerbund, and 4 inch heels type thing), somewhat rebellious, very bright, and counted among my friends males AND females from the top to the bottom of the socioeconomic ladder and several races and creeds thrown in. I've always had more female than male friends, talked about boys, played make-up, played Barbie and war games. I never 'stole' a man (ick!), and never had one 'stolen' (tho I did have one who had a one-night-stand); nuff said on that score. I'm very competitive, but it shows itself more in board games than begrudging others their gifts.
There have been women I did not like, and men, too. Actually, it would be more accurate to say there are characteristics and traits I don't like and don't want to be around, regardless of the chromosomal makeup (or physical features) of the bearer.
Stereotypes really concern me a lot. Whether they are about women or blacks or eye-ties (like me) or short people or smart people.....they may contain a kernel of truth, but by and large they simply don't hold up very well if one looks at the gender/ethnicity/brains of individuals rather than "them" (groups). And, even looking at groups is pretty tricky. A body of research has shown that roles more than traits differentiate males and females, and there are greater within-group (same sex) differences than between-group differences (male vs. female) when measuring traits.
Finally, about men not being competitive with each other in the way that women do, it might not look the same because certain behaviors are proscribed for men, but it happens. And, sometimes the solution is to take out on women what they'd like to do to the men at work.
Shar the Feminist Med-head who doesn't even know whether or not this treatise made any sense.
poster:shar
thread:306196
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/social/20040120/msgs/307096.html