![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 15 of 15. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Susan47 on October 6, 2005, at 4:29:04
It's coming, soon. And what will you do, my dear? Where will you be? Who will be with you? Who will be just thinking of you, who will yearn for your eyes, your smile, the sound of your voice?
I will.
I miss you almost beyond bearing.
It's tantalizing, and hopeless, remembering that there was a time when I didn't realize you even truly existed;
that you weren't more than simply a dream I must once have had, of everything I ever wanted in my life.
The peace that I had then; when love was never threatening, never exciting, never realized.
A life I had, a life not lived.
Had I not actually known you, I may have gone to quietly to my end, living yet not. Perhaps not living, either, because life had become a living death and there was no more point in dragging it out any further.
So, thank you. Thank you for that, which is a great deal.
A great deal more wonderful than even a parent has ever done for me, other than to give me life.
You, a stranger, gave me a gift of love.
You're incredibly beautiful.
I'm not speaking of your eyes, or your smile, or anything about your physical self.
Do you know that? Do you know you can be "seen"?
Perhaps you also have that gift, the gift of seeing... seeing what you wish to see, and making it real.
You Were my life, for a long time.
I hope, soon, that I can take over, for myself.
That I won't need you, the idea of you, the remembrance is much more bearable. What was, yet wasn't, is, but isn't.
Maybe that makes no sense.
Maybe you'll never read these lines.
Maybe you'll dismiss the whole thing as ramblings.
I have no control over that, I've never had real control over anything, that's the beauty of having a brain .. you can rationalize so much.
I gave my soul away the day I allowed "Love" to truly enter my vocabulary, in reference to you.
Posted by Susan47 on October 6, 2005, at 4:36:01
In reply to Thanksgiving, posted by Susan47 on October 6, 2005, at 4:29:04
Love is such a foolish subject.
Anybody who reads any nonfiction by now will kind of realize that life didn't begin with homosapiens and won't in all likelihood, end there either.
And none of any of our lives means anything, really, in the end.. unless, of course, there is an Entity, a Deity, an existence of something outside our physical selves that makes sense or order out of all our emotional and physical states of being ...
But how can anything as perfect as existence itself be outdone?
It's the transience of living that makes its value. That's where the value lies; it's not forever. It's here, now, to be cherished and gone. So then, maybe love isn't such a foolish subject after all. Because love is transient too. It has to be, unless it lives after life.
Posted by Susan47 on October 7, 2005, at 19:58:01
In reply to Re: Thanksgiving, posted by Susan47 on October 6, 2005, at 4:36:01
It's so strange, it's such a very strange feeling, indeed, thinking that no one understands these words, the ones on this thread, as I do. But maybe sometimes people read things and do understand every line, because it has a relevance they've experienced, that they can attach it to .. or maybe it's just that their vocabulary is so similar to yours, some shared brain experiences that make them understand .. but that's usually not ever really the case. but then maybe it is, because you know how people often end each other's sentences, sometimes I think it happens right away when you meet a person, other times it takes longer, but it definitely is a real phenomenon. Has it been scientifically proven? Anyway that's not the point. The point is, next week I probably won't understand what I wrote here two days ago and I may not even understand why I'm writing now, because my brain could be on a totally different wave pattern .. out of sync with myself. It happens, and it's horrible. And 'cause it happens to me I know it happens to other people as well. It's like you have several different personalities, almost, and it's only when you're in one way of thinking that you can understand exactly what you said or wrote or thought before, in that same state.
In another state, you can't relate. It's like, you know it was you, but it isn't the you that you are right now.
Sheesh. This is exhausting. I haVe tons to do and I'm late for all of it.
I'm also, not quite feeling myself. A bit wired.
I like talking to myself, maybe a bit too much.
That's what girlfriends are for.
Posted by Susan47 on October 8, 2005, at 15:04:38
In reply to Re: Thanksgiving, posted by Susan47 on October 6, 2005, at 4:36:01
If there's an entity that exists beyond life that takes the value out of living for the now because then suddenly "life" takes on a different meaning, it doesn't actually end with death and its transient quality is gone, or some of it anyway, it suddenly becomes just a portion of some longer journey, so hell if you screw up here you have more chances later as long as you believe in Christ or whatever, and have your Last Rites ... Oh my. I don't think that's a good way to look at things, it's one of those deeply underlying things we're not supposed to look at.
Posted by Susan47 on October 8, 2005, at 15:08:21
In reply to Re: Thanksgiving, posted by Susan47 on October 6, 2005, at 4:36:01
So does that mean if you live life inadequately in love, you never get Love right, that you have more chances later?
I don't think so. Love is as valuable as life. But then that makes pain valuable, too, and suffering, and sorrow and negative emotions and acts and feelings because all of that is transient too, but it's all part of what makes life, and existence is definitely not valuable to those who only suffer, but we make it so when we set out to believe in an Other. It's our way of rationalizing why we can't change things, or why we won't because Sacrifice is not something that most Homosapiens does very well. Sacrifice is a learned behaviour? So is love. Hmh. Just thinking.
Posted by AdaGrace on October 8, 2005, at 19:56:15
In reply to Re: Thanksgiving, posted by Susan47 on October 8, 2005, at 15:08:21
I read everything you write. Whether here or elsewhere on this site. I'm infatuated actually. You seem to be someone I can relate to on many planes. Not responding doesn't always mean not understanding or not caring. Damos said it to me best a while back. What you write hits so close to home that I contemplate what to say back for so long I just simply don't know what the right thing is to say.
You are a beautiful soul Susan. You truly are. And I know, seriously know what it is like to feel so much love and not receive it in return.
Thinking of You,
AdaGrace
Posted by sunny10 on October 10, 2005, at 11:38:16
In reply to Re: Beloved Susan » Susan47, posted by AdaGrace on October 8, 2005, at 19:56:15
so much of what you wrote was so true for me that I just had no more to add...
The hardest thing for me to act upon is to unlearn the need for love. Once we learn something from our society, it is very hard to ignore it... some things are just harder to disbelieve than others, I guess.
What I AM working hard on is living for the moment. We DON'T know what happens next... should I be in a state of waiting (for the axe to fall, for a better afterlife, whatever) or should I be living the life I have right now? I think I need to live the life I have now- whether I am doing it wrong or not is really up to me. My opinion of myself should be the one that matters most- as long as it is rooted in reality and not guilt feelings, or depressive low self-esteem, that is!!
The only thing I'm not doing at the moment that I want to do is travel... but I am saving up my money to make a big move. Either to Texas or to Hawaii- both are on the table at the moment... and then I can save up some MORE money to go visit my wonderful friend, Susan47!!!
(((((((((((((MMMMMMMMMWWWWWWWWWAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHH)))))))))
to you both!
Posted by Susan47 on October 10, 2005, at 22:32:34
In reply to Re: I'm with AdaGrace, posted by sunny10 on October 10, 2005, at 11:38:16
No, don't unlearn the need for love. It's required. A human being has a requirement to be touched in order to survive. In infancy. In adulthood the lack of loving touch can lead to major depression and illness. We can understand that. We live it. Where is your son, Sunny? AdaGrace, do you and your little munsters (how old are
they anyway?) hug, touch, kiss? God, I miss cuddling with my childen, I haven't cuddled with a male, a man, for a very, very long time, and I need to so terribly much, I need to be cherished, to be touched, to be looked at, I need it all so much, and I'm never going to stop wanting or needing it, no matter how much the lack of having it hurts me.
Posted by Susan47 on October 10, 2005, at 22:35:24
In reply to Re: I'm with AdaGrace, posted by sunny10 on October 10, 2005, at 11:38:16
I think you can just make me a week's stopover on your way to Hawaii. By that time we'll have made a good connection and you'll get to know my town. Then I'll come holiday at your house :) ... I'm going to have to charge up my credit cards to make this trip, and frankly, the ONLY reason I'm even considering it, is for my sweet children. And they deserve a couple of weeks of my undivided attention. How's your son, Sunny? How will you feel about being so far away from him?
Posted by sunny10 on October 11, 2005, at 7:35:21
In reply to Re: I'm with AdaGrace » sunny10, posted by Susan47 on October 10, 2005, at 22:35:24
my son is doing all right, actually. It's quite surprising since my ex-husband lost his job (again) and then they both got kicked out of my ex's wife's house... Now she wants a divorce.
They have just this weekend moved back into my ex's childhood home. There is animosity between my ex and his brother- fighting over whose house it is since their parents are deceased... Of course, the brother has somewhere else to live and my ex and son don't!
There is a chance that my ex will take a job in Atlanta, Georgia. My son doesn't want to move, but I think it would actually be good for him. My son decided last year that he is bisexual (I'm not sure one can know that at 13 with low self-esteem) and he made the mistake of telling all of his friends at school. Now school is even more difficult with the teasing than it ever was. A new school might be just what the doctor ordered!!
And throughout this, my son is a complete champ. He is doing well at school after a difficult start with a tough teacher (his first experience with a tough one!). He seems to have developed a talent for making new friends, so he is pretty happy- all things considered. And I'm happy that he is suddenly so good at making friends- that means he can do so in Atlanta, too, if he needs to.
As far as how I would feel being so far away, well, first off, they might be in Atlanta anyway, no matter where I am. Secondly, if I got my son to visit during his school holidays, we would actually have some quality time together instead of the few hours here and there that we see each other now!
I am doing okay with the love part, Susan, didn't mean to worry you. I am just too dependent because I feel like I need someone to love me in order to live. And that can't be true, so I'd like to unlearn the "need" for love. I'd rather
want it and get it, than "need" it and chase men away! I'm doing pretty good at ignoring the need part and just enjoying the want part right now...Anyway, I'd better get back to work.
By the way, I'd love to stop there for a week on the way, but I promised my SO that I would be rock climbing with him on the way!! I'd schedule a solo trip after getting where I'm going and landing a job so I can pay for that next trip!!
Bye, love, talk to you later,
Sunny10
Posted by Susan47 on October 11, 2005, at 22:47:03
In reply to Re: I'm with AdaGrace, posted by sunny10 on October 11, 2005, at 7:35:21
I probably should be babbling to you, because this is personal but.. I couldn't understand what you were saying about your son. Because you said he's okay but honestly his circumstances are horrible, I don't understand how any child could be doing okay it sounds like his dad is messed up right now big time. Can you spend more time with him, or do you want to? He sounds totally confused, Sunny. He doesn't sound all right from here, at all. I'm wondering if you're really able to pay attention to what's happening for him, right now. Are you, really and truly? I mean, what I'm reading is he has no place to live, no stability in his home life right now, an uncertain future (okay, we all do but there're extremes too), a father who's constantly on the warpath with someone, he thinks he's bisexual at 13, being teased at school for it (I'm not sure either that he could know that at 13, and if he really does then that would concern me, because who is he having sex with and if so is he being safe? 13! Where'd his experience of this come from? Why would any child say this unless (s)he wants the negative attention?)
And if I'm wrong and I hurt your feelings I'm sorry, if I made you angry or defensive or anything then just feel free to blast off on me. How is your personal relationship with this boy, are you two close? It sounds like he tells you a lot, and that's something, but I would still think he needs his mom. I let my own adult son go too soon, and I regret that to this day. So maybe it's my own experience talking.
Posted by sunny10 on October 12, 2005, at 9:43:38
In reply to Re: I'm with AdaGrace » sunny10, posted by Susan47 on October 11, 2005, at 22:47:03
ok, I'll try to respond to all...
yes, part of me does believe that he says he's bisexual because
a) he wants the attention HIS way (he's been teased his whole life about being "gay"- mostly because he's emotional, not into sports, et cetera)- I think "bisexual" at least allows him to like girls even though everyone thinks he's gay.
b) I think he's at the age where he's attracted to people (male and female)because he perceives them to be better, stronger, better looking, smarter, et cetera... Kinda like a hero worship
c) the media makes sexual preferences an open topic! When we were kids, we had no idea what being gay WAS, much less claim to be it? There is some "celebrity status" to being gay or bisexual now, in the kids' eyes!He DOES tell me everything, so I'm pretty secure in the knowledge that he has only ever kissed someone on the cheek- it was a boy and it was because of a dare!
Kids his age are ruthless....
What I meant by he's doing really well is that he is not becoming overly depressed over all of these changes like when he has suffered from depression in the past.
He DOES have somewhere to live- I said that they moved into my ex's parents house last weekend. He likes being in Grandma and Grandpa's house... as a matter of fact, the only thing that upset him was that HE didn't get to sleep in their bedroom- the master bedroom!
His father is and always will be on the warpath with someone. It is something that my son has come to accept with the help of his therapist.
Don't think for a second that I am uninvolved. Just because we don't live together doesn't mean that I don't know what's going on with him.
He has been so confused and depressed in the past(and suffers from ADHD), that he IS, comparitively speaking, doing REALLY well!!
I guess you would have to know all of the history to understand how I can say he's doing well at a time like this.
Just know that for him, a "time like is" is actually the norm... His father and I got divorced, he lived with both of us, then only with his father, then in a new apartment by the time he was with me and with his father again, then moved into a house with his father and father's new wife while he was still with both of us- splitting custody time, then my SO and I moved him while he was splitting custody time, then he went to live full time with his dad, then I moved again, then I moved again, then his dad and he had to move into his grandparents' house.
It's not a very secure past ANY of us have had. That is precisely why I would like his father to take the (really) well paying job down in Atlanta, which is actually something that he would LIKE to do AND be good at. So that my son could actually stay in one place for a while!!!
Yeesh, I know it's bad. Unfortunately, I've done the best that I can in the circumstances.
And I know that's been the best it can be, because my son calls me with both good news and bad. The farther apart we are, the closer we get!!
Don't worry so much!
(But I love the fact that you worry!!!! MMWWAAHH!!)
Posted by Susan47 on October 13, 2005, at 21:38:34
In reply to Re: CLARIFICATIONS, posted by sunny10 on October 12, 2005, at 9:43:38
Fabulous, I'm really glad and that does sound much better than I thought after the first post.. yay. Yay! Because every kid who's secure in being loved and cared for has a big head start, no matter where the other dice fall. Kisses back, lovey. Mmmm-wah.
Posted by sunny10 on October 14, 2005, at 7:55:13
In reply to Re: CLARIFICATIONS » sunny10, posted by Susan47 on October 13, 2005, at 21:38:34
Posted by allisonross on November 4, 2005, at 13:44:56
In reply to Re: I'm with AdaGrace, posted by sunny10 on October 11, 2005, at 7:35:21
>Hi, Sunny! I am Pretty new here (hardly used at all, LOL!).
my son is doing all right, actually. It's quite surprising since my ex-husband lost his job (again) and then they both got kicked out of my ex's wife's house... Now she wants a divorce.
How awful.!
>
> They have just this weekend moved back into my ex's childhood home. There is animosity between my ex and his brother- fighting over whose house it is since their parents are deceased... Of course, the brother has somewhere else to live and my ex and son don't!How traumatic for your son.
>
> There is a chance that my ex will take a job in Atlanta, Georgia. My son doesn't want to move, but I think it would actually be good for him. My son decided last year that he is bisexual (I'm not sure one can know that at 13 with low self-esteem) and he made the mistake of telling all of his friends at school. Now school is even more difficult with the teasing than it ever was.How unbelievably sad for him. To trust, and then have it violated in such a terrible way. He must be so confused.
Do they have a counselor at school? Can he get into counseling now? That would be immensely helpful.
A new school might be just what the doctor ordered!!
>
> And throughout this, my son is a complete champ. He is doing well at school after a difficult start with a tough teacher (his first experience with a tough one!). He seems to have developed a talent for making new friends, so he is pretty happy- all things considered.Must be because he has such a great mom!
And I'm happy that he is suddenly so good at making friends- that means he can do so in Atlanta, too, if he needs to.
>
> As far as how I would feel being so far away, well, first off, they might be in Atlanta anyway, no matter where I am. Secondly, if I got my son to visit during his school holidays, we would actually have some quality time together instead of the few hours here and there that we see each other now!
>
> I am doing okay with the love part, Susan, didn't mean to worry you. I am just too dependent because I feel like I need someone to love me in order to live. And that can't be true, so I'd like to unlearn the "need" for love.I have always felt that way. Spent a whole lifetime abandoned by men. First by my father (never knew him).
We ALL need to be loved; every human on the planet. There is no way to "unlearn" that, and what a tragedy it would be, it we could/did.
I'd rather
> want it and get it, than "need" it and chase men away! I'm doing pretty good at ignoring the need part and just enjoying the want part right now...Wow, I wish I could enjoy the NEED part right now (divorced after 31 years of abuse); been alone for only 5 months, but fortunately, my resilience, and wicked wit and sense of humor, and faith, have stood me in good stead! It's a ahhhh, physical problem, doncha know!
you can read my story. i was published (amazingly) on a psychiatric on-line journal:
www.psychiatricjournal.com
Entitled: The Transcendent Child on Overcoming Verbal and Spiritual Abuse (for the whole sordid story, LOL!
www.churchabusepoetrytherapy.com
(the result of being voted out of my church, because I got a divorce): The Highlight? having my name put on a big screen, followed by the words: CONDUCT UNBECOMING A CHILD OF GOD.
> Anyway, I'd better get back to work.
What do you do?
>
> By the way, I'd love to stop there for a week on the way, but I promised my SO that I would be rock climbing with him on the way!! I'd schedule a solo trip after getting where I'm going and landing a job so I can pay for that next trip!!
>
> Bye, love, talk to you later,
> Sunny10
>
Love your Sunny name.Love to chat with you via e-mail: kinda lonely
Hugs and love to you, and grins, Ally
(wacalice@aol.com)
This is the end of the thread.
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