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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 20 of 20. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Gracie2 on November 6, 2001, at 18:27:51
I just wondered how everyone else is doing with their spouse/significant other. My husband was supportive at first but now he seems to be getting tired of me and my emotional problems. He is growing distant and resentful that I'm not working much. Everything is my fault. I asked him if he wanted to go to marriage counseling but he said that was just "mud-slinging".
Still, things are going from bad to worse, and I'm starting to wonder what I would do by myself after living with the same man for 18 years. I suppose he is going through a mid-life crisis. He wants a wife who is cheerful and industrious and organized and neat and friendly, a "normal" person who socializes easily, has no need for a psychiatrist, does not suffer from mood swings or any other mental aberration, particularly the really bad days I have from time to time, when I cry easily and don't want to get out of bed.
Maybe he will leave, I don't know. I can't become that person he wants, much as I would like to. But it is so strange to think of being alone after all these years.
-G
Posted by Greg A. on November 7, 2001, at 0:01:24
In reply to Unhappy spouse, posted by Gracie2 on November 6, 2001, at 18:27:51
Hey Gracie,
Y'know - I think us mentally ill people are too hard on ourselves about how we affect others. We worry about the times when we are too tired to do anything, too anxious to be social, or too depressed to make a decision. But we are very conscious of other people's feelings, in fact too much so. We are very tolerant of the problems that other people have because we know all too well how our brains can malfunction. So we're not half bad really.
We are not unique in facing marital and relationship problems in our lives. Look how many 'normal' marriages break up.
For me, the mid life crisis thing happens to coincide with a period when I am really struggling to stay on top of my illness. I question all parts of my life in terms of whether they are good for me or not. Drinking, job, wife . . . I too wonder what life would be like without my partner of 20+ years. I certainly don't know the answer to that one. I guess I am a typical middle aged male. I look at my wife like I look at cars. The newer, more sporty models are really attractive to me, but I am unsure whether i can afford them or would quite enjoy them as much as i think I would. I suspect they are much higher maintenance than I would be comfortable with.
Sorry Gracie - just rambling on - but please don't try to 'become the person that he wants.' If he's anything like me, he has no idea what he wants.Greg
Posted by wendy b. on November 7, 2001, at 0:30:44
In reply to Unhappy spouse, posted by Gracie2 on November 6, 2001, at 18:27:51
>Sorry Gracie - just rambling on - but please don't try to 'become the person that he wants.' If he's anything like me, he has no idea what he wants.
Gracie,I think Greg's comments (except the woman/car analogy!?) are very much on target. Your 'problems' are just something to bitch about because like Glen says, he doesn't know what he wants, either... But still, within that, he is trying to control you and may I say, manipulate you. Like you need to keep the money coming in, or he won't love you? What is that about?
So he complains at you, instead of being supportive of you. Wouldn't it be nice if he could just put his arm around your shoulder, and say: "Can I get you a cup of tea?" or something, when you feel like you can't get out of bed. Why the hell can't he do that, huh, would that be SO HARD? after all the years and the kids and the support you've given him? Didn't you mention one time you put him through school? What the hell was that? Sounds like you were 'the woman he wanted you to be' then, right? Sounds 'supportive' to me... I bet he wasn't exactly Prince Charming to live with when he was a student. So just think of it this way: IT'S PAYBACK TIME!!
No seriously, though. You're ill. What if you had breast cancer or something? Would he be blaming you for having that? I doubt it. Also, bitching and moaning about you and your problems means he doesn't have to look himself in the mirror. As long as the focus is on *you*, he can just keep being the 'together' one. Bullshit. You sound very honest and open, not someone who's difficult to talk to, not unloving, not unkind.
Just my random thoughts, I wish you well, I hope your husband realizes what a treasure he has, before it's too late...
best,
Wendy
Posted by tina on November 7, 2001, at 9:33:14
In reply to Re: Unhappy spouse, posted by wendy b. on November 7, 2001, at 0:30:44
"Wouldn't it be nice if he could just put his arm around your shoulder, and say: "Can I get you a cup of tea?" or something, when you feel like you can't get out of bed."I have a husband who does that and it just makes me feel sooooo guilty for not being able to be what he needs.
I liked Greg's comments about being overly sensitive to others feelings. It's a part of my illness. I always assume I know exactly what the other person is thinking or feeling and I always assume it's negative toward me. Like I'm a burden or they don't want to listen to me again.....or I bet he thinks I'm a lazy good for nothing lay about. Greg's right, don't change who you are. Your SO may indeed have no idea what he wants and may be going through his own crisis. Councelling would be a great thing but I suspect your husband doesn't want to look too deeply at himself right now and is afraid. He is probably lashing out at you due to some of his own inadequacy fears. He probably gets angry because "as the man" he should be able to "fix" you and he can't. You should be happy with HIM, but you're not. It's likely insecurities on his own part that make him less than supportive of you. He feels helpless and useless and is blaming you for it. Your illness reflects badly on his ability to be a man in the eyes of his peers/family whatever cuz men 'fix' stuff....
However, of course it is not your fault. Like Wendy said, if you had cancer, he wouldn't blame you but he would still feel just as helpless and would probably still have the inadequate feelings and misplaced anger. I think a little education about your illness would do him some good. Would he be willing to read up on it or talk to an impartial party who can explain it to him??my best to both of you
Tina
Posted by mair on November 7, 2001, at 12:26:37
In reply to Re: Unhappy spouse, posted by tina on November 7, 2001, at 9:33:14
>
>Gracie - I have gone through periods when I've worried alot about the effect my depression has on my family, and in particular on my marriage. When my husband seems distant or withdrawn i nearly always decide that he's sick of putting up with me and my problems. My therapist's big issue has been that while my depression may have an effect on my family, the impact is not anywhere near as great as I think it is, and that my depression colors my thinking about what's going on with my husband. When I'm not so depressed, for instance, I might attribute his distance to some preoccupation that has nothing to do with me. I don't always buy into this (it's tough to break those self-blame patterns of thinking) but I do think there's a grain of truth there, and it's possible that you're distorting how much you have to do with your husband's unhappiness. My husband is not the marriage counselling type, but he did attend a session once with me, where my therapist had him speak to my influence on him and the kids. I helped some and maybe your H would do something like that.Mair
Posted by Glenn Fagelson on November 7, 2001, at 21:21:24
In reply to Unhappy spouse, posted by Gracie2 on November 6, 2001, at 18:27:51
> I just wondered how everyone else is doing with their spouse/significant other. My husband was supportive at first but now he seems to be getting tired of me and my emotional problems. He is growing distant and resentful that I'm not working much. Everything is my fault. I asked him if he wanted to go to marriage counseling but he said that was just "mud-slinging".
> Still, things are going from bad to worse, and I'm starting to wonder what I would do by myself after living with the same man for 18 years. I suppose he is going through a mid-life crisis. He wants a wife who is cheerful and industrious and organized and neat and friendly, a "normal" person who socializes easily, has no need for a psychiatrist, does not suffer from mood swings or any other mental aberration, particularly the really bad days I have from time to time, when I cry easily and don't want to get out of bed.
> Maybe he will leave, I don't know. I can't become that person he wants, much as I would like to. But it is so strange to think of being alone after all these years.
> -GDear Gracie,
That's too bad; it doesn't sound like your
spouse is too supportive of your condition. We
all need support, don't we?
Hang in there, Glenn
Posted by Krazy Kat on November 8, 2001, at 13:19:32
In reply to Unhappy spouse, posted by Gracie2 on November 6, 2001, at 18:27:51
Boy, does this sound similar to my situation, Gracie. We've hit a very hard time since I "started taking care of myself" last April and let my husband see the worse of the depression. I'm not working now, though I did before, and that really irks hims. Going through the meds, trial and error, has been horrible. He takes everything too personally, and doesn't give things time to work.
I was convinced Tuesday afternoon that we would be separating. By Tuesday night, we had Talked and Talked and agreed to go to counseling.
I married so young, 21, that I, too, have trouble seeing myself alone, and yet I really crave it at times.
What else is going on? Do you think he needs a major wake up call?
- K.
Posted by Willow on November 9, 2001, at 7:37:45
In reply to Re: Unhappy spouse » Gracie2, posted by Krazy Kat on November 8, 2001, at 13:19:32
Kat
> I was convinced Tuesday afternoon that we would be separating. By Tuesday night, we had Talked and Talked and agreed to go to counseling.Glad to hear this!
> I married so young, 21, that I, too, have trouble seeing myself alone, and yet I really crave it at times.
I think we really need our own space. I seem to have lost "myself" as my stamina decreased, which at times have left me frustrated. Another person can't make us happy that has to come within, but suprisingly they can make us miserable if we let them.
I often find myself asking my mother why she didn't warn me that life could be like this!
BEST WISHES
Willow
Posted by LyndaK on November 10, 2001, at 2:14:42
In reply to Unhappy spouse, posted by Gracie2 on November 6, 2001, at 18:27:51
Hmmmmm .... Funny how we think we're the "only one" that is facing a certain situation until we find out how much company we have. Just my 2 cents ... I found that just working hard at my own recovery (often times in the face of my husband complaining and guilting me and sabotaging my efforts) was the best thing for "us". Staying on my meds, staying in therapy, and staying in contact with my friends helped me get on more secure footing emotionally. I'm more in touch with my feelings and can express them better. I'm more conscious about the importance of communicating what I think and feel and grant my own opinions validity. I don't buy into his hurtful criticism so easily and am able to see it for the manipulative maneuver that it is. And when the criticism is valid I can accept it without feeling like I have to go kill myself now. But it's not easy. I feel resentment that I took steps to get a little more clued-in about myself while he's still running around clueless. Our marriage is still troubled and I still feel like leaving at times ... but I'm still hangin'!
Keep doing the work for yourself. And don't leave your recovery sitting in your therapist's office (like I did for too long). Take it home with you. Start applying it. It won't be automatic; you have to think about it. Something only becomes automatic after you've repeated it a lot!
Well I guess that was more like 20 cents!
Hang in there!
Lynda
> I just wondered how everyone else is doing with their spouse/significant other. My husband was supportive at first but now he seems to be getting tired of me and my emotional problems. He is growing distant and resentful that I'm not working much. Everything is my fault. I asked him if he wanted to go to marriage counseling but he said that was just "mud-slinging".
> Still, things are going from bad to worse, and I'm starting to wonder what I would do by myself after living with the same man for 18 years. I suppose he is going through a mid-life crisis. He wants a wife who is cheerful and industrious and organized and neat and friendly, a "normal" person who socializes easily, has no need for a psychiatrist, does not suffer from mood swings or any other mental aberration, particularly the really bad days I have from time to time, when I cry easily and don't want to get out of bed.
> Maybe he will leave, I don't know. I can't become that person he wants, much as I would like to. But it is so strange to think of being alone after all these years.
> -G
Posted by Gracie2 on November 14, 2001, at 20:13:19
In reply to Re: Unhappy spouse, posted by LyndaK on November 10, 2001, at 2:14:42
My husband of 18 years walks in and says he doesn't want to be married anymore. He says that he feels more like my babysitter or caretaker instead of a husband.This is crap. I did have a very bad year last year, was hospitilized twice, but since then - this whole year - I haven't had one "crazy" episode, I've been alright. So where he came up with that "babysitter" business...I guess it was the best he could think of.
You know, he can be such a selfish prick, I'm not even sure I want him to stay around. I know he's mad because I haven't been working regularly, which makes me feel like I'm just a paycheck.
Well, we haven't worked out any of the details yet. I guess I should work two jobs so I can save my money and get away from HIM.
And so, how was your day?
-Gracie
Posted by Dinah on November 14, 2001, at 22:43:37
In reply to Well it happened, posted by Gracie2 on November 14, 2001, at 20:13:19
I'm so sorry this happened, Gracie. I wish there was something I could say. It's too bad he's so opposed to counseling.
Is there anyone with you for support right now? This has to have been an enormous shock to your system, even if you did see the problems building up.
Dinah
Posted by LyndaK on November 15, 2001, at 3:11:36
In reply to Well it happened, posted by Gracie2 on November 14, 2001, at 20:13:19
Hi Gracie,
My heart goes out to you (and my stomach has a knot in it for you). What you say hits so close to home for me. The feelings; the fears. I've been married to my husband for 16 years now. It's a long time to be with someone -- almost half my life really; so I definitly identify with those feelings.
A couple of statements in your original post jumped out at me:
You said he didn't want to go to counseling because it was just a bunch of mudslinging.
First, it sounds like a statement made by someone who has little-to-no knowledge/experience of marriage counseling, or had a previous BAD experince. It also "smells" of insecurity on his part about his own behavior and the part it may play in the problems you're having as a couple. (It's soooooo much easier to just blame it all on you -- especially since you're in a vulnerable state right now).Another statement that jumped out at me was something about "you just can't be the person he wants". I can't recall how many times that statement has echoed through my own head over the years -- but I finally figured it out. . . My life is NOT about being the person he (or anyone else) wants. My life is about being the person I AM. I am happiest when I am behaving in a way that SUPPORTS who I am instead of behaving in ways that DISCOUNT or SABOTAGE who I am. (And, by the way, HOW I am when I'm depressed is not WHO I am. I view my depression as a set of symptoms that let me know that there's a problem that needs my attention).
I know I'm saying alot. I just have 2 more things to say:
1. Truthfully? . . . we ARE difficult to live with when we're depressed (or manic or whatever). We get frustrated with ourselves! Why wouldn't our significant others get frustrated as well?! Not that it justifies his response to bale on his commitment, but just understanding that level of frustration . . . it's somewhat understandable, isn't it?
2. As long as we are doing everything we can to help ourselves, we have nothing to feel guilty about.
Keep focusing on your recovery . . . whether he stays, or whether he leaves.
Please keep in touch.
Take Care.
Lynda
> My husband of 18 years walks in and says he doesn't want to be married anymore. He says that he feels more like my babysitter or caretaker instead of a husband.
>
> This is crap. I did have a very bad year last year, was hospitilized twice, but since then - this whole year - I haven't had one "crazy" episode, I've been alright. So where he came up with that "babysitter" business...I guess it was the best he could think of.
>
> You know, he can be such a selfish prick, I'm not even sure I want him to stay around. I know he's mad because I haven't been working regularly, which makes me feel like I'm just a paycheck.
>
> Well, we haven't worked out any of the details yet. I guess I should work two jobs so I can save my money and get away from HIM.
>
> And so, how was your day?
> -Gracie
Posted by Roo on November 15, 2001, at 8:32:04
In reply to Re: Well it happened » Gracie2, posted by LyndaK on November 15, 2001, at 3:11:36
Posted by Krazy Kat on November 15, 2001, at 8:37:34
In reply to Re: Well it happened » Gracie2, posted by LyndaK on November 15, 2001, at 3:11:36
Lynda:
Thanks for such a wonderful response, even though it was meant for Gracie.
My pdoc always asks me if I feel guilty about anything when I come in - it's so effective because it makes me think about whether I am taking care of myself, and whether there is anything bothering me that really shouldn't be.
- K.
Posted by Krazy Kat on November 15, 2001, at 8:40:00
In reply to Well it happened, posted by Gracie2 on November 14, 2001, at 20:13:19
Gracie:
I'm so sorry. I'mm glad you're angry - you should be.
This illness is very hard on relationships. My husband has said similar things to me recently.
How is your heart? Are you still very much in love with this man? Do you think he just needed to get this off his chest and is going to "come to his senses", so to speak?
Please let us know what happens.
- K.
Posted by Krazy Kat on November 16, 2001, at 10:22:18
In reply to Unhappy spouse, posted by Gracie2 on November 6, 2001, at 18:27:51
Posted by LyndaK on November 16, 2001, at 21:10:46
In reply to Lynda-Excellent Response! I printed it out! (NM), posted by Roo on November 15, 2001, at 8:32:04
Thankyou for your response. I assume that means that you found it helpful or could relate to it in some way.
Out of curiosity, is that "Roo" as in "Kanga and..."?
Take Care,
Lynda
Posted by LyndaK on November 16, 2001, at 21:21:18
In reply to Re: Well it happened » LyndaK, posted by Krazy Kat on November 15, 2001, at 8:37:34
> Lynda:
>
> Thanks for such a wonderful response, even though it was meant for Gracie.
>
> My pdoc always asks me if I feel guilty about anything when I come in - it's so effective because it makes me think about whether I am taking care of myself, and whether there is anything bothering me that really shouldn't be.
>
> - K.
Yeah. Guilt seems to be a very common theme for me as well. Sometimes appropriate, but a lot of the time not.Take Care,
Lynda
Posted by Roo on November 19, 2001, at 8:43:40
In reply to Re: Lynda-Excellent Response! I printed it out! (NM) » Roo, posted by LyndaK on November 16, 2001, at 21:10:46
Yes, I found it very helpful. Roo is a nickname
my sister gave me. My name is Ruth.
Posted by LyndaK on November 20, 2001, at 11:39:46
In reply to Re: Lynda-Excellent Response! I printed it out! (NM), posted by Roo on November 19, 2001, at 8:43:40
> Yes, I found it very helpful. Roo is a nickname
> my sister gave me. My name is Ruth.That's neat! I often wonder what's behind the choice of the user names. I'm afraid I was a little unimaginative with mine.
Take care, Roo.
Lynda
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