Posted by pullmarine on October 1, 2000, at 4:12:08
In reply to Re: Now I'm angry, ToddFromPhoenix, because..., posted by SLS on October 1, 2000, at 0:13:18
beautifully put. could not have done a better job myself. You coined the word autoeuthanasia,and i coined the term: post-natal abortion. I consider my life to be a living hell. it's been this way since my teens, and personally, I look forward to dying, and I will do anything I can to speed up the process. I will never deny information to someone who truly wishes to die.
JOHN
>
> I am always angry when I hear of someone who has ended their own life because they were in so much pain. Mental or physical.
>
> I work very hard to avoid saying "God damn it!" I always say "gosh darn it" as a substitute. I rarely slip. However, when my next door neighbor told me that another neighbor's daughter, who I had met, suffering from major depression killed herself, I was very cognizant and purposeful of my instantaneous reaction, "GOD DAMN IT!" Boy, was I pissed. God damn it. I still am.
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> > My father died several years ago, painfully and alone,
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> I'm sorry. I can't imagine such a thing. Both of my parents are still living.
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> > without ever having done anything at all worth remembering.
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> Perhaps he did. You're here.
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> > All he had were failures and misery.
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> According to whom?
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> > You wanna know why I get angry about that? He had opportunities all his life to make that life better. You know what he did about it? NOTHING. Not one damn thing. All he ever did was run away. And he couldn't even say that he didn't hurt anyone. He hurt almost everyone in his life.
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> I have compassion for your father. I know people like him. I want better for them and everyone around them.
>
> > I've been miserable. The doctor I was assigned by the county when I was last depressed and uninsured told me that the drugs were just fine, working as expected, but I couldn't expect to feel any relief because I was too screwed up! You think I didn't think about grabbing a gun???
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> Did your father commit suicide?
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> > Here's something you're not thinking about: reality.
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> Who's?
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> > You married your wife because you thought well of her. At least, I imagine you did. Do you have any idea what really happens when someone dies by gunshot?
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> == >
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> I cannot share your reality of priorities and perceptions of import.
>
> -----------------------------------------------------
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> > First of all, it's not easy to clean up that sort of mess.
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> > Secondly, did you know that it's illegal to do it yourself in many areas?
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> > Blood, after all, is hazardous waste!
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> > Think of the expenses your wife would incur at a time when she's least able to deal with it.
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> > And guess what, she'll have to deal with it.
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> She doesn't have to. But we hope she would.
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> > There's no agency to step in and fix things for her.
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> "And guess what, she'll have to deal with it."
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> There are a plethora of agencies that can help her deal with it.
>
> -----------------------------------------------------
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> > Do you really want her to have to go through the horrors of that just because you ran away? She'll also be facing the pain of you running away from her in such a terrible way.
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> People often get over loss. No one gets over extant pain - de facto.
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> > And you know what else? You not only hurt everyone around you if you do any such thing,
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> Everyone around him probably would be hurt, however...
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> I find this to be the most selfish argument proposed against someone's decision to do something that might be in their best interests - or even in their worst interests. "Who's Life is it Anyway?" Who's interests are more important, yours or mine? Who's right is greater to be more interested in himself than others, yours or mine? Who would know better what is best for me, you or me? Possibly you. I have been known to exercise bad judgment when deciding what is best for me. This is especially true when I am depressed or in pain. Of course, suicide is not in everyone's best interests. You and I both know that for sure. However, do either of us know for sure that it is no one's best interest to bring their life to a deliberated endpoint. Why do people put their dogs to sleep? I hope you would exceed to someone's request to be treated no worse than a dog.
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> Euthanasia? What about autoeuthanasia?
>
> I came up with the word "autoeuthanasia" many years ago in an effort to delineate it from other types of suicide. I will fight for my right to exercise it for as long as I live, whether or not I exercise it.
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> > but you cheat yourself out of the chance to experience something better.
>
> I know this is a stupid question, but I have to ask it. Are you a fortune teller? Chance is an abstraction in that it is nothing more than conceivable. Opportunity is to be extant. Can you guarantee someone that an opportunity will present itself to them? Can you tell them how long they must endure excruciating pain before it does?
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> > That's like cheating at solitaire.
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> You can cheat at solitaire. You can't cheat pain or death. Even morphine can't help many cancer victims cheat their pain.
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> > How can anyone respect someone who cheats at solitaire?
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> I can. Sometimes it feels good to cheat at SOLITAIRE. I like to feel good. In this game, it is one's SOLITARY discretion as to if and when. But, after all, it is just a game.
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> > Now, I've expressed my anger and hope that someone reminds me of this next time I'm suicidal.
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> Whatever it takes. I will also try other things to help you save your life. Life is precious.
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> Pain is sometimes transient. Sometimes not.
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> > Here's hoping that JC helps, and that you find relief. But damn it to hell, don't find relief for yourself by committing your wife to hell!
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> Whatever it takes.
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> God bless us all.
>
>
> - Scott
poster:pullmarine
thread:42903
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20000926/msgs/45582.html