![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 14 of 14. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Caper on June 15, 2004, at 1:35:14
Hi to all,
I was just wondering how everyone was doing regarding their recent attempts at sobriety or maintaining sobriety.
I think there is equal value in both success stories and the stories of people, like me, who are still stuggling, so if anyone feels like talking about their most recent experiences, please do. I'd love to hear how you're doing.My best to you all,
Caper
Posted by partlycloudy on June 15, 2004, at 10:02:46
In reply to that alcoholism thing (sigh), posted by Caper on June 15, 2004, at 1:35:14
Let's see. This past weekend I snuck a drink when my spouse was taking a nap. How very admirable.
I am trying to make arrangements for me not to be alone when he's out of town (like this week). Tonight I have therapy. Tomorrow I go to the gym (first one I've joined since 1986). Thursday he gets home again - not to plan too far ahead, but I'm hopeful.
I'm realizing that the drinking is part of a life long pattern of feeling ashamed and needing to hide "bad" behaviours like this. I anticipate the disappointment, or worse, disapproval my actions result in, and that makes it worse.
It really hurts to be a human bean.
Posted by Caper on June 15, 2004, at 13:30:25
In reply to Re: that alcoholism thing (sigh) » Caper, posted by partlycloudy on June 15, 2004, at 10:02:46
Hi,
I'm grateful for anyone who takes the time to answer me, but you and one other person in particular post things that (sorry to be sappy) but really touched me. Probably because I see myself in you.
For this one though I have to say first of all, please try not to be so hard on yourself! At least you're trying and seems to me, correct me if I'm wrong, that you're not drinking as much as you used to. (?)
But I think I really do understand your comment regarding the drink while the spouse was sleeping....I couldn't count the number of times I "had to change my clothes" in the past year or so. That was my way of getting my son to leave my room for a minute when it had been too long and I was starting to go into withdrawals (or to be very honest, maybe just WANTED some at that point). He innocently wanders off while I frantically pour and gulp, change some kind of clothing to back up my story, and then rush to try to brush my teeth so no one smelled anything on my breath.) I feel awful every time I have to sneak or lie and since this addiction started I've done that so much- it astounds me how I've sunk so low so fast!
Your plan of trying hard to keep busy during your husband's absence sounds like a very good strategy. And the gym? A wonderful thing to do for yourself. I'm a strong advocate of exercise as "therapy" and also just as a way to get out of your head for an hour-- but in a good way rather than with alcohol or drugs.
I am glad to hear that you are hopeful. Like I said already, sounds to me like you are doing better and I hope I'm right.
I hope this isn't out of line, but your first post to me, in which you told your story of the road to addiction made me cry but not really in a bad way. The ending especially was just ....me. And to hear someone else articulate so well what I feel was pretty overwhelming really. It made me sad that someone else had those same thoughts and issues, but for the most part it helped (even through tears!) because it made me realize I'm not alone and you sound like such a kind, classy person that it somehow made me feel better about myself too. I suppose the thought was "she thinks like me and she sounds great...could it be possible I'm not as awful as I think?"
It was just a very honest, moving post and I thank you for it and I hope with all of my heart that you will start to see yourself as others do. The more of your posts I read, the more I know that the good things you have a hard time seeing in yourself must be true.
This was a longer babble than I intended, but I just wanted to let you know how much your post helped me and how much I admired your insight.
Very best wishes regarding your continuing recovery. Take care.
Caper
> Let's see. This past weekend I snuck a drink when my spouse was taking a nap. How very admirable.
>
> I am trying to make arrangements for me not to be alone when he's out of town (like this week). Tonight I have therapy. Tomorrow I go to the gym (first one I've joined since 1986). Thursday he gets home again - not to plan too far ahead, but I'm hopeful.
>
> I'm realizing that the drinking is part of a life long pattern of feeling ashamed and needing to hide "bad" behaviours like this. I anticipate the disappointment, or worse, disapproval my actions result in, and that makes it worse.
>
> It really hurts to be a human bean.
>
Posted by partlycloudy on June 15, 2004, at 14:14:52
In reply to Re: that alcoholism thing (sigh) » partlycloudy, posted by Caper on June 15, 2004, at 13:30:25
Caper, your reply post made me cry. Guess it's a weepy kind of day. I am touched that you can see yourself in my story. I think at one level or another, many of our stories will be familiar. it's been many, many years, however, since anyone referred to me as "classy", so thank you for that, too.
You're right, I don't drink 1/4 as much as I used to in my heyday. I also can't tolerate the alcohol as well, either. I can see how much better I am doing, but that next morning when you wake up and think that perhaps dying might be better than how you feel; when the hangover lasts 12 to 16 hours (a sign of age and conflicting with my meds); when your entire digestive system rebels at the abuse you're putting it through; well, that's when I get down on myself.
You know how you have a little devil on one shoulder and a little angel on the other (I always pictured them as Jerry from Tom and Jerry)? I think my angel took a hike when I wasn't looking, a long time ago. And I'm trying to conjure a new one.
Tonight I start EMDR therapy. I am anxious, afraid, hopeful, excited, and optimistic. (I think that's more pluses than minuses.) Last night I couldn't get to sleep and I swear, I swear, that I saw my life race through my head. Not just the memory things from looking at old photographs, but very particular incidents reran through my head.
I remember my father passing out in the lazy-boy chair that was busted and wouldn't close anymore. It smelled so disgusting even the cat wouldn't try to scratch it. I remember many evenings when he wouldn't be able to make it up to bed and would be draped on the sofa, so I was always afraid of asking any kids over after school, in case he'd already be there. I remember when he had his drivers license suspended for a DUI (this was the good old days), and he had my brother drive him to and from work every day. I remember how much my brother hated being wed to dad's needs. I remember my father's business partners who were exactly like him. They'd cover for each other whenever one of them would have a "lost weekend". I remember when my dad missed Christmas one year and bought everyone 1/2 price cheesy presents in the after holiday sale. I remember keeping that gift, unopened, until I left home. I remember when my mother finally left the marriage and I was the only one of 4 kids left living at home. My grades dropped and I barely graduated high school. University was out of the question. I became my father's caregiver until I married and ran away from home. far away, to another country.
I remember when my dad became ill with cancer and he accepted the news with an equanimity that enraged me. It's like he looked forward to the end. I remember sitting with him before he went into the hospital to die, rubbing his too-boney back and smelling the pungent odour of death and decay all around him. I remember my siblings sitting on the far side of the room, unable to approach and comfort him. I was able to make my peace with him, tell him I loved him and that I would miss him.
He died when he was 53 years old, in 1985.
I don't want his life. I decided not to have children so this cr*p shoot of a gene pool would end. I didn't want to give anyone on this earth memories like I have.
Posted by antigua on June 15, 2004, at 16:38:56
In reply to Being alike » Caper, posted by partlycloudy on June 15, 2004, at 14:14:52
My heart just breaks for you partlycloudy, except I'm really, really glad that you're trying the EMDR (let us know how it goes). The images of your father bring back so many of mine--despite all that he did to me, I was the one who cared for him when he was dying. I was left alone w/my father once his marriage(s) broke up and I was always left to pick up the pieces of his drunken binges. Why did I do it? Why did I waste so much of my life?
I really try not to drink at all anymore because like you, I refuse to pass this on to another generation. I want all of the abuses to end w/me.
antigua
Posted by Caper on June 15, 2004, at 22:03:03
In reply to Being alike » Caper, posted by partlycloudy on June 15, 2004, at 14:14:52
Partlycloudy and antigua,
Thank you both so much for your honesty regarding what you went through as children. Because as much as it hurts to hear it, people like me _need_ to hear it very much, to face up to the damage they will do to their children.
I cried again(!) while reading both your posts because I do NOT want to hurt my son. I know I am though, even though I'm a fairly recent alcoholic and was never abusive or mean or even noticeably drunk around him. But my drinking has definitely hurt him anyway, I try not to kid myself about that. I was already chronically depressed and then I added on the alcohol. Last summer we couldn't do as much of any of the things we used to do because I knew I couldn't drive and I constantly had to make excuses and I ... I could go on and on but I'm sure you get my meaning.
I'm actually crying pretty hard right now but trying to keep it together to get your advice. My son is 10 years old and and I think it was in January that I finally realized I had to tell him straight out- Mom is an alcoholic now, that's part of the reason I keep having to go to hospitals.
I was advised to do this by therapists, who told me that he probably knew more than I thought he did already anyway, and that if he didn't know specifically about the alcohol (turns out he didn't) he would still be wondering, worrying etc., and that it was best to be honest.
He took it really well and was very sweet, but when I've relapsed (the times he has known of anyway)-- oh, the look in his eyes when he's found out! To see my baby, my buddy, the whole reason I'm still alive, look at me with a combination of intense love and hurt and disgust and confusion and mistrust (and knowing it was my own fault) is probably the worst pain I've ever experienced.
So my questions to you both (and any other child of an alcoholic) are:
1. Did I do the right thing in acknowledging the alcoholism? Admitting it, trying my best to explain addiction, telling him he had every right to be angry with me but that I was trying very hard to get better?
2. Did your parents acknowledge they had a problem with alcohol?
3. What can I DO (besides getting sober and staying that way, of course) to help my son or to make it easier on him? I guess what I'm asking is can you think of anything your parents could have done or not done or done differently that would have made it a little easier on you?
4. I drink a LOT when I relapse severely, but it's a steady, all day drinking. I've never once passed out or blacked out or even had anyone say to me- you're drunk aren't you? Does this help at all? For my son I mean. Are your worst memories those of the blackouts/passing out/doing something embarassing in front of you and your friends (when you did bring them around)?
I'm not asking for absolution here, really. I know I've hurt him, but if anyone has any thoughts on what could help me to make things as easy on him as possible until I finally beat this addiction, I'd be grateful.
Thanks and best wishes to everyone.
Caper
Posted by Caper on June 15, 2004, at 22:29:34
In reply to Being alike » Caper, posted by partlycloudy on June 15, 2004, at 14:14:52
Once again, your post just made me think of the words kind and classy. It breaks my heart thinking of what it must have been like when your father was passing away. But you have my sincere admiration for being able to deal with it the way you did, making your peace and being there for him.
I know we've only exchanged a few internet messages, but I think in real life if we'd ever come in contact, I'd have wanted to be your friend. I hope that doesn't sound like a weird thought. It's been an extremely emotional week for me and the older I get (I'm 31 now) the easier it gets for me to just say what's on my mind as long as it won't hurt anyone. Plus, I wonder how many times people think sincere compliments about someone but don't say them? I'm working on that too.
Take care,
Caper
P.S. Please do, if you're comfortable with it, share your EMDR experience. I've had that suggested for me too and I'm curious. I've heard some really great things about it and I hope it works well for you.
> Caper, your reply post made me cry. Guess it's a weepy kind of day. I am touched that you can see yourself in my story. I think at one level or another, many of our stories will be familiar. it's been many, many years, however, since anyone referred to me as "classy", so thank you for that, too.
>
> You're right, I don't drink 1/4 as much as I used to in my heyday. I also can't tolerate the alcohol as well, either. I can see how much better I am doing, but that next morning when you wake up and think that perhaps dying might be better than how you feel; when the hangover lasts 12 to 16 hours (a sign of age and conflicting with my meds); when your entire digestive system rebels at the abuse you're putting it through; well, that's when I get down on myself.
>
> You know how you have a little devil on one shoulder and a little angel on the other (I always pictured them as Jerry from Tom and Jerry)? I think my angel took a hike when I wasn't looking, a long time ago. And I'm trying to conjure a new one.
>
> Tonight I start EMDR therapy. I am anxious, afraid, hopeful, excited, and optimistic. (I think that's more pluses than minuses.) Last night I couldn't get to sleep and I swear, I swear, that I saw my life race through my head. Not just the memory things from looking at old photographs, but very particular incidents reran through my head.
>
> I remember my father passing out in the lazy-boy chair that was busted and wouldn't close anymore. It smelled so disgusting even the cat wouldn't try to scratch it. I remember many evenings when he wouldn't be able to make it up to bed and would be draped on the sofa, so I was always afraid of asking any kids over after school, in case he'd already be there. I remember when he had his drivers license suspended for a DUI (this was the good old days), and he had my brother drive him to and from work every day. I remember how much my brother hated being wed to dad's needs. I remember my father's business partners who were exactly like him. They'd cover for each other whenever one of them would have a "lost weekend". I remember when my dad missed Christmas one year and bought everyone 1/2 price cheesy presents in the after holiday sale. I remember keeping that gift, unopened, until I left home. I remember when my mother finally left the marriage and I was the only one of 4 kids left living at home. My grades dropped and I barely graduated high school. University was out of the question. I became my father's caregiver until I married and ran away from home. far away, to another country.
>
> I remember when my dad became ill with cancer and he accepted the news with an equanimity that enraged me. It's like he looked forward to the end. I remember sitting with him before he went into the hospital to die, rubbing his too-boney back and smelling the pungent odour of death and decay all around him. I remember my siblings sitting on the far side of the room, unable to approach and comfort him. I was able to make my peace with him, tell him I loved him and that I would miss him.
>
> He died when he was 53 years old, in 1985.
>
> I don't want his life. I decided not to have children so this cr*p shoot of a gene pool would end. I didn't want to give anyone on this earth memories like I have.
>
>
Posted by antigua on June 15, 2004, at 23:44:57
In reply to children of alcoholics- advice for me as a mom? » partlycloudy, posted by Caper on June 15, 2004, at 22:03:03
I'll take a stab at this, but they are only my opinions, based on my experiences. For the record, both my parents were alcoholics, but my mother was one later in life after her divorce. She's been sober for 12 years now, and my father drank for probably 40 years and quit about 5 yrs before he died.
1. Did I do the right thing in acknowledging the alcoholism?
I think so. He knows something is going on and kids always think it's their fault, that they are the cause of your anguish. Or they think you're going to die. Remember, their world revolves solely around them, especially at that age. That said, I've also warned my own children at great length about the genetic components of alcoholism and how they, too, are going to have to watch themselves. Just try not to promise to get better. Say you'll try, but don't make a promise you don't know if you can keep yet. Breaking promises is one of the most difficult traits for a kid to handle.
2. Did your parents acknowledge they had a problem with alcohol?
Nope, not until afterwards. They always denied it. "I just like to drink," or "It just makes me relax." After they both got sober, they began to get an inkling of what they were really like. They didn't have a clue about how bad they were, especially from a child's point of view. Kids need to feel safe and know that you can take care of them. I never felt that safety when my parents were drinking.
3. What can I DO (besides getting sober and staying that way, of course) to help my son or to make it easier on him?
I think you've hit it--quitting of course would be best, but I know how tough that is. I think being honest with them and yourself is the next most important thing. Is your son comfortable bringing friends home? Being embarrassed of our family is natural when we are young, but kids in alcoholic homes have that extra burden of never knowing how their parent will behave. Kids just want to fit in.
4. I drink a LOT when I relapse severely, but it's a steady, all day drinking. I've never once passed out or blacked out or even had anyone say to me- you're drunk aren't you? Does this help at all? For my son I mean.
Are you sure your perception is accurate? Kids notice very subtle differences and changes in our moods. He'll catch on sooner or later, I guarantee you.
I'm sorry if these answers are harsh. I quit because of my kids, because I don't want to see that look in their eyes.
Quitting is so very hard, and I wish you the best,
antigua
Posted by Caper on June 16, 2004, at 1:46:15
In reply to Re: children of alcoholics- advice for me as a mom? » Caper, posted by antigua on June 15, 2004, at 23:44:57
Thank you very much for taking the time to reply. The opinions of people who grew up with an alcoholic parent are the ones whose opinions carry the most weight with me, and I want to do the very best I can while I'm trying to beat this.
I'm relieved you agree that I was probably right to tell him. And the reasons you specified were the reasons that convinced me I should in the first place.
And I have told my son, "honey I wish so much I could guarantee you I'll never do it again but I can't. All I can do is try my best. I know it doesn't make sense to you that I could still do something i know is bad for me and hurts everyone. I can't really even explain it to myself sometimes, but I will try my very best to get better." Do you think that was okay?
Regarding children's need to feel safe- again I agree completely and I just thank God that we are temporarily living with my parents again (after being on our own for 8 years). Even though it is not ideal and it was partly the stress of living with my parents that led me to turn to alcohol, I had so much going on that I think maybe I'd have become an alcoholic anyway, so at least my son never had to be alone with an alcoholic mother. He's the only grandchild and I practically have to _demand_ my rights to make his dinner or be the one who buys him some new toy he's really wanting. So he does have a lot of love surrounding him.
As far as your next couple of points regarding if my perceptions of others knowing I'm drinking or not, and whether my son feels comfortable bringing friends home....I thought hard about this for a few minutes and actually I truly do think I am being honest with myself about that. I drank as much as 6 bottles of wine or a liter of vodka a day at my worst and no one knew- not family, friends, my psychiatrist. When I finally "confessed" to being an alcoholic, people literally sometimes staggered and nearly fell over in shock. My mom kept asking "are you sure???" I think that I just developed such a high tolerance so fast that by the time I was truly hooked, I was drinking to maintain. Meaning I had to have it to avoid being sick. (I have terrible physical withdrawals, including hallucinations both tactile, visual and auditory.) So me drinking is still me. I get no high off of it anymore, don't stumble, slur my speech, fall asleep from it. At one of my first detoxes I actually was nearly turned away because they didn't believe I was drunk until they got the blood alcohol level back. (How ironic is that? Trying to convince someone you ARE an alcoholic wasn't something I thought people would ever have to do!)
As far as my son's friends being around me, he seems to have no qualms whatsoever. Since I had him at a fairly young age (barely 21) I've nearly always been far younger than his friends' mothers and somehow that has seemed to give me a certain appeal to his friends. Plus I've always gotten along really well with boy children, especially at this age. Call me on it if you read any sort of inconsistency or apparent denial in this answer though.
I appreciate your answering me and you were not harsh at all- it was exactly the type of honest feelings I was needing to hear. Thank you also for your good wishes- I'm getting things in order over the next few days so I can go to a new detox that's been highly recommended by several doctors I trust. Plus my therapist today told me that she sensed a change in me, that she felt I might truly be "ready" this time. I think (and oh how I hope) she is right.
How are YOU doing?
Take care,
Caper
> I'll take a stab at this, but they are only my opinions, based on my experiences. For the record, both my parents were alcoholics, but my mother was one later in life after her divorce. She's been sober for 12 years now, and my father drank for probably 40 years and quit about 5 yrs before he died.
>
> 1. Did I do the right thing in acknowledging the alcoholism?
>
> I think so. He knows something is going on and kids always think it's their fault, that they are the cause of your anguish. Or they think you're going to die. Remember, their world revolves solely around them, especially at that age. That said, I've also warned my own children at great length about the genetic components of alcoholism and how they, too, are going to have to watch themselves. Just try not to promise to get better. Say you'll try, but don't make a promise you don't know if you can keep yet. Breaking promises is one of the most difficult traits for a kid to handle.
>
> 2. Did your parents acknowledge they had a problem with alcohol?
>
> Nope, not until afterwards. They always denied it. "I just like to drink," or "It just makes me relax." After they both got sober, they began to get an inkling of what they were really like. They didn't have a clue about how bad they were, especially from a child's point of view. Kids need to feel safe and know that you can take care of them. I never felt that safety when my parents were drinking.
>
> 3. What can I DO (besides getting sober and staying that way, of course) to help my son or to make it easier on him?
>
> I think you've hit it--quitting of course would be best, but I know how tough that is. I think being honest with them and yourself is the next most important thing. Is your son comfortable bringing friends home? Being embarrassed of our family is natural when we are young, but kids in alcoholic homes have that extra burden of never knowing how their parent will behave. Kids just want to fit in.
>
> 4. I drink a LOT when I relapse severely, but it's a steady, all day drinking. I've never once passed out or blacked out or even had anyone say to me- you're drunk aren't you? Does this help at all? For my son I mean.
>
> Are you sure your perception is accurate? Kids notice very subtle differences and changes in our moods. He'll catch on sooner or later, I guarantee you.
>
> I'm sorry if these answers are harsh. I quit because of my kids, because I don't want to see that look in their eyes.
>
> Quitting is so very hard, and I wish you the best,
> antigua
Posted by partlycloudy on June 16, 2004, at 7:04:53
In reply to children of alcoholics- advice for me as a mom? » partlycloudy, posted by Caper on June 15, 2004, at 22:03:03
Caper, I'm truly impressed by your efforts and desire to protect your son. Your battle is already halfway won.
>
> 1. Did I do the right thing in acknowledging the alcoholism? Admitting it, trying my best to explain addiction, telling him he had every right to be angry with me but that I was trying very hard to get better?
>
I think so too. My dad never said a single word about having a problem with drinking, at least not to any of us kids. I know he and my mom had many many serious talks about it, but he never pursued medical help or went to AA that I know of.
We're not a communicative family, even now. I think if he had said something to us my siblings might not have had the resentment that they feel to this day. The acknowledgement of being an alcoholic is the best and only way to begin recovery.> 2. Did your parents acknowledge they had a problem with alcohol?
Oops, see above. (I'm not good about reading ahead! I just type and type and type...)
> 3. What can I DO (besides getting sober and staying that way, of course) to help my son or to make it easier on him? I guess what I'm asking is can you think of anything your parents could have done or not done or done differently that would have made it a little easier on you?
>
Having some family counselling would be fantastic. When I was in high school I told a guidance counsellor what was going on at home (this was after my grades tanked), and she recommended I attend a support group. My brain isn't functioning well at the moment, it's one of those Children of Alcoholics groups. I remember getting some brochures with lots of coping tips and advice. It was the first time I realized that there were other families out there just like mine. I went to one group meeting. I don't remember why I didn't go back (!) except I bet it had something to do with being 16 years old and going by myself.> 4. I drink a LOT when I relapse severely, but it's a steady, all day drinking. I've never once passed out or blacked out or even had anyone say to me- you're drunk aren't you? Does this help at all? For my son I mean. Are your worst memories those of the blackouts/passing out/doing something embarassing in front of you and your friends (when you did bring them around)?
>
You've seen the look in your son's eyes, so you already know he's aware of your state. The few people I have admitted my alcoholism to have been floored. No idea whatsoever. I even fell out of a bar once and landed on my face! After that my drinking pattern went underground. I'm dry as far as the "outside" world knows, including family. I don't drink in bars or social situations. Only when I'm alone and I know I'll have a night by myself to recover do I get down to business. And I have vivid memories of all the stupid things I have down while drunk.Caper - my heart goes out to you. You're a caring mom, you're aware you have a problem, you are trying to recover. That's already more than my dad was ever able to do.
You'll be fine, honest.
Posted by antigua on June 16, 2004, at 11:22:38
In reply to Re: children of alcoholics- advice for me as a mom? » antigua, posted by Caper on June 16, 2004, at 1:46:15
You sound like you are honest w/yourself, and not just rationalizing. That's great. You are your own reality detector. I also agree w/partlycloudy about a support group too.
The only other thing I would add is that there is the belief that alcoholism is a progressive disease and becomes far worse over time. (I'm not saying that I believe that, but it is something I always keep in mind as a strong possibility). You are young and have a supportive environment in which to get help, but you already know that all the help in the world won't help you unless you want it to. Sometimes I think it's just a switch that has to magically go on--enough is enough, but it's so different for everyone. I have some very strong-willed AA supporters in my family who believe that's the ONLY way to go, but I personally believe that we all have to find our own way to make it work.
Keep us posted.
antigua
Posted by partlycloudy on June 16, 2004, at 19:50:37
In reply to Re: Being alike » partlycloudy, posted by Caper on June 15, 2004, at 22:29:34
I have started a thread on the Psych board. Tonight was the first session. I feel like I have a good chance at recovery now. I have never been able to say that before.
Can't say I'm speechless, else I wouldn't be here. I am so grateful, so full of hope for all of us.
Posted by Impermanence on June 22, 2004, at 2:04:30
In reply to that alcoholism thing (sigh), posted by Caper on June 15, 2004, at 1:35:14
Caper the thread is too long and I'm to drunk to read it all or go into details, I just read your first post. I just wanted to give you a big virtual hug and tell you I love you and I'm thinking of you. Stay positive girl, you're a damn site stronger than you think. You will get through this Caper, you're just not ready yet. Give it time my darling.
xxx
Posted by Caper on June 24, 2004, at 16:33:14
In reply to Re: that alcoholism thing (sigh), posted by Impermanence on June 22, 2004, at 2:04:30
And a virtual, heartfelt hug back to you too, Impermanence. I've been missing you here. I may be going into another treatment facility as early as tomorrow, so if I'm gone that's why. Even my therapist has told me that "something seems to have changed" and I may really be "ready" to kick this awful addiction. So I am cautiously hopeful.
And everything positive you say to me, I believe is true for you as well. We WILL beat this. Stay safe and take care of yourself.
Love,
Caper
> Caper the thread is too long and I'm to drunk to read it all or go into details, I just read your first post. I just wanted to give you a big virtual hug and tell you I love you and I'm thinking of you. Stay positive girl, you're a damn site stronger than you think. You will get through this Caper, you're just not ready yet. Give it time my darling.
>
> xxx
This is the end of the thread.
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