![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 7 to 31 of 47. Go back in thread:
Posted by Sebastian on May 23, 2004, at 17:33:30
In reply to miss all done...., posted by karen_kay on May 21, 2004, at 18:28:09
I don't understand. You are a woman. But you want to meet my husband? So I am gay. And you will find another man to support you.
Posted by All Done on May 24, 2004, at 2:39:33
In reply to miss all done...., posted by karen_kay on May 21, 2004, at 18:28:09
>> will you marry me? i'm sorry i've waited this long to ask, but i really do fear rejection.
Oh, Miss Karen!!! Of course I’ll marry you. How on earth could you imagine I might reject your generous offer of your hand in marriage? An offer no one in their right mind could refuse. (Wait, am I in my right mind?) But I must say, it’s about d**n time, Miss Thing! I’ve only had to beg and plead with you every day for the last three weeks! And to top it off, you’ve been going around all willy-nilly asking everyone and their brother to marry you or give you a ring. Hmpf! But whatever. You’ve finally come to your senses.
>> and do you promise to mother my future children and be as wonderful a mother to them as you are to your child now? i promise to find some man to support us both, so you can stay home and care for the children. and then i can spend the money on the worthless things i buy (and definetely NOT air conditioning, though i would reconsider for the sake of the children).
You’re too sweet :). So, who’s going to support us? I’m thinking kid. Or does it really have to be a man? Perhaps spoc could as she hasn’t given you a ring, yet. Maybe they both could? Can we work that out? I think it would be the Perfect Plan.
What’s up with the air conditioning thing, though? A/C is a must, so you better reconsider or else we’ll just have to call the whole thing off. I’m sorry. This is where I draw the line.
>> and do you promise to still be my friend, as well as my wife? i would still need your advice of course, and i hope it wouldn't be biased considering you would be marrying the second best woman in the world.
I’ll always be your friend, kk. That is, as long as you agree to the A/C thing.
>> and would you introduce me to your mother? i may be tempted to wear a habit when i meet her, would you be able to explain that to her? and if you couldn't would you at least just laugh about me behind my back, and not in front of me? and would you also say 'good one' to me when your mother wasn't around?You would have to meet Mom. It’s a prerequisite to the marriage thing. Maybe we could bring spoc along and she could wear a short skirt or something. Does she wear skirts? If not, kid probably would. Then, my mom wouldn’t focus on your habit. Then again, she probably wouldn’t notice anyway. She’s a little self-centered, you know.
And I would not laugh at you - only with you, my dear.
>> and would you introduce me to your husband as well, or would you try to hide me from him (as if he doesn't know me already! i am kelly, you know)? i think that if you do decide to marry me, it's very important that i meet your husband.Well, I’ve apparently cleared up the whole Karen/Kelly misunderstanding. He now knows you’re Karen, but he believes you may be a 14-year old boy. I explained to him that that is impossible. You are at least 18. He’s not quite convinced yet, though.
So, in fact, you should meet him so we can get this mess figured out. He will like you. You will like him. But you’re not allowed to ask him to marry you.
>> and miss l, if we did get married, would you care if i gain weight?
No. Does this have to do with that whole commercial thing? I thought the women stay skinny and the men get fat.
>> would you care that i sometimes am dense?
Is this a trick question?
>> would you care that i don't discipline my dog (and that i can't even spell it!)?
I don’t discipline my dog, either. Will your dog try and poop on mine, though?
>> would you be prepared to cook dinner every night?
Absolutely NOT! Is this a deal breaker?
>> do you mind that i don't wear my seat belt?
Yes.
>> and that i smoke (oh, i know you hate that!)?
Yes. Talk to kid about getting some gum or a stripper. Whatever works for you.
>> and that my head is small and i can't wear hats?
Again with the trick questions?
>> do you care that i have monkey arms and big feet?
I have chicken legs and big feet as well. Oh, our poor children…
>> and that i have no breasts?
I’ve told you before, I have enough for the both of us.
>> would you be ok knowing that i may one day hope to find someone to buy me a pair? would that bother you?
This will not bother me provided he or she will buy me a new car.>> and would it bother you if i'm the bride and you are the groom?
Can’t we both be the bride? Where do we have to go for that? Is it Massachusetts?
>> or could we both wear pretty dresses?
Are they both going to be white? We can pretend, can’t we?
>> could kid be my maid of honor? or would you want him to be yours?
I can’t decide. He would look stunning in the mint green dress with rhinestones that I have picked out for him. And I don’t really want him to be in charge of fixing the train on your dress. He might take the opportunity to crawl under and that would just be embarrassing for everyone involved.
>> would you wear a kilt just because i always wanted to marry someone scottish.
Dr. Bob is going to wear the kilt, remember? Maybe he plays the bagpipes, too. Should we ask?
>> and could we get married in vegas, by fat elvis?
Well, duh.
>> and would my dog be there?
Will he eat the flowers?
>> would you pet him if he went to the restroom on your dress?
I would give him an extra treat.>> miss l, i know this is quite a tempting offer. i hope you will take your time to consider (but not too much time of course, go with your instincts) my special offer. please do let me know, but if your answer is no, let me down easy. i can't stand having a broken heart. oh, but you have to buy the ring of course. nothing too fancy really, just enough to be visable from mars. perhaps you could take donations or plan some sort of a scam? just don't tell me about the scam or i'd feel really bad when i wore the ring.
Don’t worry about the ring. Ever since the day I met you, I’ve been saving my pennies for the most beautiful ring I can find. At $.02/day, I’m quickly approaching $5.00, so don’t fret, my dear, I can guarantee it will be something very special, indeed.
I hope I’ve answered all of your questions. I realize they are important, thought provoking, life changing questions and I can only hope the offer still stands after you read this.
I have a question. Will I be All Kay? Will you be Karen Done? Perhaps we should both hyphenate All Done-Kay and Karen Kay-Done. In any event, I think we should both stick with Ms. I’m not a fan of Mrs.
Ms. All Done
Posted by Scott in Vermont on May 24, 2004, at 8:04:22
In reply to miss all done...., posted by karen_kay on May 21, 2004, at 18:28:09
"…promise to find some man to support us both, so you can stay home and care for the children"
I can't figure out if I was offended at the base application of MAN supporting everyone, or inspired that you would consider communal living as a realistic alternative to the ridiculous social-economic slavery known as the nuclear family.
I'll think on that one and get back to you.
Posted by kid47 on May 24, 2004, at 11:00:52
In reply to Re: miss all done.... » karen_kay, posted by All Done on May 24, 2004, at 2:39:33
you had better be prepared to spend some BIG money on the shoes. As we are all well aware, shoes make the outfit. And I'm not talking about those trashy pumps you two are so fond of...and another thing.....I wouldn't be caught dead in a "mint green" anything although the rhinestones are a classy touch. Wedding party attire just SCREAMS for chiffon and lace....I would, of course, expect nothing less. Maybe something form fitting with a little "peek-a-boo" neckline and black leather accents, but nothing tawdry.
As far as me being the only breadwinner (or chips and cheese in KK's case) I will win as much bread as minimum wage ( that's about $2.60 an hour..right Karen?) can afford. My doggy tanning salon is doing quite well so we could live like royalty for at least 48 hours.
All Done. You are quite correct. Karen Kay has asked everyone from Bill Murray to the Pope for their hand in marriage. She asked me several months ago and I still haven't been able to get her to set a date. She keeps making excuses....something about some weird pact between her and Chevy Chase...and Paul Simon....and some guy named Alfonzo, that prevents her from marrying till the next leap year. So I wouldnt hold my breath on this if I were you.
And Karen's mom? Lovely woman but something about her scares the bjeezus outa me. The first time I meant "mom" she was dressed as a circus clown and kept saying "did I stutter!!??!" She does make a killer (vodka) Martini, however.
As far as children...you are both PERFECT mother material, and with your combined stunning beauty, I have no doubt the children would be absolutely gorgeous. I am concerned however, that the mix of your personalities might produce willfull, demanding, stubborn, prone to excess, moody, too lovely, too sweet, too amazing, mathematically challenegd kids. If we could get my DNA in the mix this might help dilute some of the more undesirable characteristics....plus *assuring* they would be REALLY good looking.
No air conditioning is most definitely a deal breaker for me. I am much too pretty to sweat. End of discussion.
I think including spoc in the preceedings is a must! We desperately need someone with a sense of humor and decorum. She/he? would most definitely fill this void. She/he/it is however, a bit flighty and aloof....which makes her/him even more fascinating.
I'm thinking a June wedding would be most apropriate. June brides are always the lovliest. Maybe around the 14th or so?...and the music. I think a "Fat Elvis" singing a mix of Broadway show tunes punctuated with some Marylin Manson favs would be perfect!! And finally, CONGRATULATIONS!!! I'm sure the two/three/four of you /us/them, will be eternally happy!!! Now explain just once more, how it is I fit in to all of this?kid
Posted by Sebastian on May 24, 2004, at 18:01:26
In reply to miss all done...., posted by karen_kay on May 21, 2004, at 18:28:09
Ivan
Posted by karen_kay on May 26, 2004, at 19:56:11
In reply to Re: miss all done.... » karen_kay, posted by Scott in Vermont on May 24, 2004, at 8:04:22
have you made up your mind yet? if not, please do allow me to explain the reasoning for the comment in question.
1. i said 'find a man' because i'm not very good at charming women. (apparently i'm not as good as i think at charming men, eh?) i would have no chance of finding a woman to take care of me, as i find i don't always get along well with women. it would be much easier for me to find a man to swindle than a woman, since i've become accustomed to swindling men rather than woman. if it works, why change it right?
2. i said 'so you (a woman, miss all done) can care for the children' because i know that she really wants to stay home and care for children. now, if she'd prefer to slave away in her office for me, so i could spend her money instead, i'd offer her to work very very hard at work so i could stay home and spend her money. i personally would rather not work or care for children, as i find i'm better at doing other things, particularly spending money and worrying. now, if only i had all the free time in the world to do such things, wouldn't life be grand?
i hope this clears up any confusion you or others may have had regarding my post. i assure you i'd happily swindle women, if only i were confident enough in my abilities. and i assure you i hold no contempt for men, i only dislike them a little bit.
Posted by Scott in Vermont on May 27, 2004, at 10:24:17
In reply to mr scott, posted by karen_kay on May 26, 2004, at 19:56:11
I have read your clarification post, and I have come to my conclusion. I am neither offended nor inspired. I'm nonplussed.
Good luck in your endeavors, though. If you find a way to make it work, let me know.
:)
Posted by karen_kay on May 28, 2004, at 16:47:22
In reply to Re: I will marry you » karen_kay, posted by Sebastian on May 24, 2004, at 18:01:26
i wouldn't doubt that it was me at 'the party' you were referring to. when i drink, i get rather wild. and if you'll marry me, you have to send a ring of course. no cheap ring will do. not for me of course. and about parting ways so quickly, i've been known to do that as well. it's a fault i have. i am easily distracted. a good way to hold my attention is with diamonds.
so sebastian, while i'm flattered you said you'd marry me, i'd be even more impressed if i saw that ring, something i have yet to own. sure, promises, promises. i've heard all that before. but, until i have that rock on my finger, i can't make any commitments. you understand right? i've been promised to many here on the site (we'll keep that a secret, ok! shhh! don't tell anyone we're engaged,, ok?) but i still haven't seen a ring! and it's the ring i want. go figure. and i'm pretty easy to get along with too. i just don't understand.
Posted by karen_kay on May 28, 2004, at 17:36:07
In reply to Re: miss all done.... » karen_kay, posted by All Done on May 24, 2004, at 2:39:33
so, it's a go? i'm going to the highest bidder now (or whoever sends the ring first. beggars can't be choosers at this point dear. i think at this point i'd settle for a cracker jack box ring)
and i would have asked you sooner, but you were on my back about it every day and didn't give me the space i needed. a girl has to do things in her own time, you know. you can't expect a proper proposal if you are breathing down my throat with your whining and complaing 'when are you going to ask me? when? when? when?' you see what i mean?
and i'm not too picky about who supports us really, as long as someone does. i know i can't support us. perhaps we could persuade both spoc and kid to support us? maybe scott in vermont could support us too? and we do have a new daddy on the way, so maybe he could send some money every once in a while too? but, i can't be expected to work. of course you wouldn't expect that of me, would you? don't expect too much from me, i wouldn't want you to set your hopes too high. i do promise to entertain you though. (hey, at least i'm being honest and upfront, right?)
and i suppose if we could afford ac it would be ok. but, only if we can afford it. and getting my hair done comes before ac always!
about your mom: if i laughed at her, or called her a 'midget' (yes, i've done that accidentally with my old man's mom) would you be mad or laugh? and if i called our new dad 'fatter than elvis' would you laugh or be mad (yes, i've done that too)? apparently, i don't always think before i speak dear. could you find the humor in that, or would you be mad at me? and if you fell down and i laughed, would you be angry, or could you forgive me? (and i would laugh, i can almost promise it, but i promise when i fall i laugh too and you can as well!)
and how do you know i'm not 14? i could be, you know! your husband knows for a fact i'm not, since he saw me last week in vegas, but you can't be certain. if i were only 14, would you send me lunch money? and will you buy me a swim suit, since i've misplaced mine? and will you buy me everything i ever wanted, or at least find someone to buy everything i want for me? like a pony and a rich husband?
i'll wear my seat belt, but i won't quit smoking, not even for a stripper or gum. maybe i can become a stripper who chews gum, and the smoking won't matter that much?
and will you share your breasts with me? cani have them on the weekends, and you can have them through the week? will that arrangement work for you? or can i have just one and you can have the other (i'm rather partial to the left one i think, it seems to be bigger than the right one)?
and i know i can still wear white. you can wear red, and no one will think a thing about it. none of my family expects me to marry anyone 'pure' anyway. so, i'll wear white, you can wear red, kid can wear pink, sebastian can wear grean, bob in yellow, and scott in blue. how does that sound? (and everyone knows you won't be in that dress very long anyway dear. especially if there is alcohol involved.)
about the last name: well, we couldn't take kid's name because my initials wouldn't be good (i never can marry anyone with the last name beginning with a k). we could take scott's last name. that would be karen kay vermont and all done vermont. or, we could go with sebastian's name. karen kay sebastian and all done sebastian. i like miss honey's name alot. couldn't we marry her just for her name. karen kay honey. i like the sound of that :) miss honey, will you marry me, just in name (unless of course you really are interested, then we can talk later... and of course, if bean ever smartens up, we can get divorced...) all done honey.. don't you like the sound of that?
Posted by karen_kay on May 28, 2004, at 18:02:36
In reply to If you think you can get me to wear a dress..AD/KK, posted by kid47 on May 24, 2004, at 11:00:52
your dress would be pink dear, not green. and it wouldn't be trashy, i promise. you can pick your own shoes, possibly flip flops if you like.
and since your doggie tanning business is doing so well right now, do you think all done could swing by and get her chicken legs tanned? it would have to be free for us of course, since we are all getting married and will be family.
and about family, would you introduce me to your family too, if we are all getting married? i'm thinking we could have a three-way marriage (unless sebastian, spoc, jai, scott or anyone else speaks up and want to join in the fun). but, would you let me meet your mother? and would she love me, like my mother loves you (even if she shouts 'did i stutter? and gives you a blow up doll for christmas)? and would all of your family like me, even your mean wife? can you promise?
about chevy chase: i've always had a thing for chevy chase you know, but i can be persuaded to drop that crush rather quickly. and paul simon is just the right height for me you know. and he did marry a woman dx with bipolar disorder (nevermind they were divorced and she did play a princess in a film. i could be a princess in real life, couldn't i? you could buy me a gown and slippers and a crown and i could pretend to be a princess and you could pretend to be paul simon and we could be dilusional for the rest of our lives, right? are you prepared to do that?)
about dna: i think with my personality, all of our good looks, your charm, all done's charisma, and all of our disorders combined, we'd have some pretty great kids or some very bad kids. but, they'd be the very best bad kids ever, right? just the thought of children is making m belly hurt. let's not discuss that until we have a full-time nanny to bear, raise, love, care for, send to college, mother, father and completely look after, ok? i'll have nothing to do with children until i have some very good drugs or until they create a bubble that you can wrap around a child until they turn 18.
june wedding: hmmmm, a bit soon, isn't it, considering i still don't have a ring. perhaps if i had that ring, i'd reconsider. and you'd have to take my name, i couldn't take yours. and you are filthy rich, right? and you love to travel, right? and you'd buy me breasts, right? and hire a lawyer so i could have the dog. and kill spiders for me. and push the shopping cart. and keep the rain away. (this is just the beginning of my demands. if it's too much right now, tell me so i don't get my hopes up)..
Posted by karen_kay on May 28, 2004, at 18:19:12
In reply to Re: mr scott » karen_kay, posted by Scott in Vermont on May 27, 2004, at 10:24:17
you are not inspired? now i am baffled! usually i either offend or inspire, but never baffle. this is a new one for me. i guess it's better to cause some sort of a reaction in you than none at all, but i'd rather inspire you, mr vermont. what could i do to inspire you? if i were to pull this off, would that inspire you? or, if i were to send some of the profits to you, would that help inspire you, or would that offend you? i'd rather not offend you, but i don't want to baffle you either.
oh dear, now i'm baffled. will you marry me mr vermont? i could try to get someone to take care of all of us, that way you could work with your hands (wood work that is) and watch the sun rise on your front porch (did i get it right this time?).
i am curious though. didn't you mention you have a job in telecommunications (am i wrong?)? i am wrong sometimes. do you mind telling? that's my major and i'm curious...... oh, and do you think you could find me a job (and that's a joke, unless of course you could :)
take care mr vermont (does that make you sound like a contestant in a beauty pageant? do you like it?)
Posted by Jai Narayan on May 28, 2004, at 20:37:56
In reply to Re: mr vermont » Scott in Vermont, posted by karen_kay on May 28, 2004, at 18:19:12
Posted by Scott in Vermont on June 1, 2004, at 14:53:37
In reply to Re: mr vermont » Scott in Vermont, posted by karen_kay on May 28, 2004, at 18:19:12
When I answered your post on Friday, I wasn't really "here". I have collected myself and I am "back".
That having been said, I would indeed be inspired if you were able to pull this off, and there is no need to share the profits.
With regards to your marriage proposal, I must remind you that I am still "married" even though I am in the process of divorce, and I am also aware that if I do re-marry my "wife" will file for reappraisal of support. So perhaps rather than making it a piece of paper, you would consider this instead:
The house I live in is an old Vermont farmhouse with 9 rooms. There is room enough for at least 3 other adults there. I'm not opposed to the idea of a collective "family" community that works towards the common goals and overall good of it's members. There is all sorts of work to be done that doesn't involve a commute in the morning. The garden is huge and is a daily task. There are childcare issues in the summertime. There are housework items that seem to keep getting rescheduled. There is decorating that isn't even being scheduled. 24 hours in a day and 7 days in a week just isn't enough in this artificial existence called "modern living".
I did review your desired position requirements. I don't think there is currently an opening for the position of "do nothing but reap many benefits". If you would consider changing that to... say perhaps "garden weeder & waterer, light housework, laundry on odd days and cook once or twice a month" then a position might be available.
The benefits included in this position include (but are not limited to) sunrises on the front porch, listening to the frogs in the pond across the road chirp in an evening sonata that lulls you to sleep, 260+ acres of woodland for fun and frolic, a freezing cold brook with deep pools under long waterfalls for summer dips, fresh veggies
I do work in telecommunications. It is a good job and remains strong even in this current economic downturn. I do know that the company has a hiring freeze and will not be looking to replace any positions that vacate. It's not "downsizing" per se because no one is being let go...they just aren't being replaced. Most of the people leaving are retiring after 30 or 40 years in service. It's a good company. I'll be staying here and splitting my family duties between "income generation" and "physical labor". If I can find someone to fully take over the "income generation" portion, I'd be more than happy to fully head up the "physical labor" division of the family.
If you were able to find someone to bankroll the collective family as a whole, then you would be hailed many cheers would be offered in your name. And of course you could pick any job for yourself that you wanted, including "sit around and do nothing except whatever whim hits you".
So there's my offer. And here's a few extra perks or detractions, depending on your view: I would never care if you gained weight, so long as you maintained decent self-esteem. And since everyone is dense at some point or another, I would take it in stride. The lack of dog discipline might be an issue... jumping on people is one thing, but if it chews up one of my favorite books (and yes, they are ALL my favorites)... we might be having a very rich and oily meat with dinner the next evening. I can cook and so can my girlfriend (gasp! You didn't know about her, eh? No worries, she's not jealous unless you claim exclusivity, and then you're in trouble) so that is covered. Seat belts are the law in Vermont, and not wearing one subjects you to a ticket. I have no problem with smoking. I'm curious how small your head is... not being able to wear hats sound bizarre. Monkey arms are great for weeding the garden, I imagine, and big feet means we can share footwear. No, I do not care that you have no breasts, and yes, I would be ok with surgical enhancement if it was something you wanted to do and it had a healthful and positive impact on your self-esteem.
After reading some of your other comments, I can also say that "marrying" you, in a legally binding sense, may not be in my long-term best interests. But don't take it personally. I don't see marrying ANYONE again to be in my long-term best interests, and let's be honest...I have to be all about taking care of Scott, because I'm the only Scott I have an no one else is going to do it for me (although I have wished that someone would recently). If you can deal with participating in an extended family that expects at least some kind of effort out of you that produces a positive result and you can deal with living in collective "sin", then perhaps we have more to discuss.
And yes, I do feel very special being called Mr. Vermont.
Posted by karen_kay on June 2, 2004, at 11:24:03
In reply to Re: mr vermont, posted by Scott in Vermont on June 1, 2004, at 14:53:37
now, when you said this: "I don't see marrying you to be in my long-term best interests." (please note, this has been edited to fit my needs, because there is only one karen and my needs are what's important here, right?) does that mean no? are you easily persuaded? if so, i assure you i can change your mind.
consider this:
point number one: i'm not really as lazy as i appear. spiteful, yes. lazy, no. i would be willing to move to vermont, provided you supply the following:
*a ride, preferably in the middle of the night so i can just sneak away and never look back
*a place to live (i'm not picky, a car will do fine. ac not required)
*utter happiness (is that possible?)in return, i will provide the following....
*cocktail parties for you and your friends (male friends, right? doctors, lawyers, engineers preferred) btw, i am an excellent hostess. i refill drinks the instant they are emptied, always offer second servings, strive to assure no one is 'left out' of the gathering, make a mean vegetarian lasagna, and when i drink too, things are always fun (did you say you have a pool? at least a bird bath?)
*i have no problem with having dinner prepared a few times a month. does dominoes deliver where you are?
*i love gardening, but i lack motivation. so, i do need someone there to keep me on track. i often help others with their gardens, so perhaps if you remind me that it's not my own garden i'm tending, things will work out fine.
*about children... babies, not so good. old enough to use the toilet and i'm fine. but, i must require they wear helmets at all times (think i'm kidding?). i won't raise my voice or get angry with them for any reason, but again, babies i don't do well with.
*and what type of housework items are you suggesting? i don't mind cleaning, if that's what you are suggesting. i don't like dishes though. can we use paper plates and plastic forks instead? i'll wash glasses, but only because you can't drink wine out of a plastic cup. wait, i guess you can. so, plastic utensils it is, right?
benefits to marrying karen:
*entertainment
*i am quite lovely
*your friends and family will adore me, i promise
*you will be the luckiest man in vermont (tempted to say the world, but let's not push it)negatives to marrying karen:
*not applicable
so you see mr vermont, the benefits far outweigh the potential negatives to marrying me. i could list many more benefits, if you still haven't made your mind up at this point. i agree that the 'piece of paper' isn't important here. what is important is the RING! we don't even realy have to get married, i just want a ring. no need to tell your girlfriend, in fact i won't tell my boyfriend either. just in case this doesn't work out, i'll have a back up plan. i'll tell him i went away to a commune for the summer (or however long this affair lasts). i have no problem with living in 'sin'. i assure you of that. but, i would want to claim sole exclusivity over mr vermont. i think your girlfriend may not be fond of this. how could we solve that problem? perhaps tell her i'm the nanny? or housekeeper? or your sister? ok, sister would be pushing it.
so, i'm giving you just one more chance to rethink your decision. i've never had someone say no to my proposal before, but rather than feeling hurt and rejected i'm feeling excited and a bit more assertive. i'm not too proud to beg mr vermont. but, i must warn you, i'm married to a poor, canadian woman. can she move in with us too? oh, and will you help me pay off all my bills? and buy me a pony? and i have to have liquor in the house at all times. don't be concerned, it's not a problem.
did i persuade you yet mr vermont, or do i need to think of a new strategy? oh, and that shirt looks nice on you today :)
Posted by Scott in Vermont on June 2, 2004, at 14:11:54
In reply to rejection? » Scott in Vermont, posted by karen_kay on June 2, 2004, at 11:24:03
Well now. Please understand that it is not my intent to hurt or reject. I prefer to have relationships start from a genuine and honest platform. That leaves less room for neglectful errors in the future.
Marriage, as in a legally binding document that ties me to your assets and debts, ties me to your future well-being in the form of support payments should we get divorced… that simply is not going to happen (unless you drop 3 of my Ambiens into my beer and then haul my semi-comatose butt off to the JoP… make sure someone there is CPR qualified in case I drop off the edge, ok?)
But you do present a strong case. So I will reply to the following:
I can provide a ride in the middle of the night. However, Canada is a pretty big place. I would request that you get as close to Montreal as possible. Quebec City is a potential pickup point, and Toronto is out of the question unless you promise to buy me lunch on the way back.
A place to live… well, I think I already described the place that I’m offering. You can choose between the back room and the front room, neither is in use right now. My recommendation would be the front room, as it can be fitted with an exterior door with no problem and has an independent heat source, and has the most beautiful view of the rising sun out of the entire house (well, except the porch).
Utter happiness… hmm, this one is more difficult. But in coming to America, you will be granted the inalienable rights to life, liberty, and the PURSUIT of happiness. If it’s good enough for the rest of the country, it’s good enough for you. But I’ll see what I can do in the “happiness” dept. I’ll address that a little further down in this dissertation of why you should and should not take me up on my offer.
Cocktail parties (off the subject, but I always snicker when I see that word. The one in front of “parties”. Juvenile, perhaps… but I still think it is funny) would not be necessary, because frankly I don’t like cocktails (snicker) and my friends are generally not associated with the kind of people who would be attending cocktail (snicker) parties. If I could interest you in a slightly less regimented itinerary, all of my friends are heathen and we basically drink a lot and run around naked in the woods. In the wintertime, we build big fires, drink a lot, and run around naked in the woods but not too far from the fire. It’s not “high culture” for sure, but it is fun. Your veggie lasagna would be an absolute hit; there are not many meat eaters (finances mostly, as opposed to ethical reasons). And I do not have a “pool”; I have a large brook with waterfalls that created natural pools at the bottom. Perfect for wading or sitting in, not advised to be dove into.
No, Domino’s does not deliver where I am. However, I have a microwave. I don’t mind if you heat something up. It’s the effort I’m looking for, and respect.
Motivation? Did someone say “motivation”? I was in the US Army for 6 years. I can provide all sorts of motivation. But prior to that, I’ll take your advice and ask you if you’d come out and help us with OUR (not YOUR) garden. That way you’re doing something nice for someone else and get that warm fuzzy feeling for doing something nice for someone else without clouding it with thoughts that you’re doing your job or that you “have” to do this.
My kids are 6 and 8. They have been going to the bathroom by themselves for a long time. I do have to ask about the helmet requirement, though. Please follow up on this in future correspondence.
Housework, for all intent and purposes, means pick up your own messes and tend to your own laundry. Self-sufficiency is the desired end-result when it comes to housework. For the unscheduled things like vacuuming or dusting, you would be required to make some sort of effort, or at least barter that task off somehow. As far as dishes go, I won’t allow paper or plastic in our home because it’s economically wasteful and it’s bad on the environment and it reeks of slothful laziness. For a big party, yes. But daily use? No way. I’ll do the dishes myself if that is what it takes to keep that junk out of our home.
I have reviewed the additional benefits of “marriage” to you. Entertainment is a major plus. There is no Cable at the house and the Internet is dialup only. I play many different instruments and I like to sing, but I’m the only one who is doing this right now and would prefer a duet. Do you play any instruments? If not, can you juggle? Or can you spin a good tale? Entertainment is always welcomed.
Being quite lovely is a plus, but it does not impact my decision one way or another. In all honesty, I look for more in a person than what is considered “beauty”. It is your mind, your heart, and your spirit that I will find attractive. Being a hottie will be icing on the cake, yes, but it’s not the reason I want the cake.
My friends and family would adore you anyway. They judge people the same way I do, for the most part.
Luckiest man in Vermont, eh? Well, this issue would have to be addressed sooner or later, so I may as well do it now. My girlfriend assures me that I am already the luckiest man in Vermont, and part of that is because there is no claim of exclusivity. I cannot and will not be “owned”, nor will I allow someone else to submit to that particular form of emotional slavery. It works for other people, true, and it is a healthy and positive thing for them. It did not work for me, and I do not want to feel “trapped” again.
Therefore, I would have to introduce you as exactly what you would be- another member of an extended collective family who was there to share in the duties and benefits of our collective family.
A ring is no problem. My friend Jon is a metalsmith and he specializes in jewelry. I hope you don’t mind ornate silver, because I cannot afford gold, and if there is a rock on it, it’s not going to be from a deep mine in South Africa, if you get my drift. That having been said, I encourage you to remain in contact with your boyfriend, so that if this situation doesn’t work out, you do have a fallback plan. I respect people who cover their bases and leave options open.
The poor Canadian woman would be welcomed, with the understanding that she would be subject to the same requirements as you. However, if you will vouch for her and ensure that her share of duties is performed (and the beauty here is that the more people there are, the less general duties there are) then she has nothing to worry about.
As far as helping you pay off your bills, bear in mind that my income is supporting a lot of people already. If you have outstanding debts, you may wish to consider getting a part-time job here (I’ll allow you to use my car for transportation providing you know how to drive and have a valid driver’s license) and towards that end I’ll help you with your assigned duties here so that you have the time off from the family to pursue generation of income elsewhere to address your debts.
I will not buy you a pony. But if you chose to acquire one on your own, there is plenty of room for it. The costs and responsibilities associated with the pony will be entirely yours to address and absorb (although I am sure you can get other people to go in with you on this).
Liquor in the house is not only no problem, it’s guaranteed to be there. Three things I will not go without is alcohol, nicotine, and caffeine. As far as nicotine and caffeine go, I’m not too fussy, but for alcohol I prefer beer, vodka, and mead on special occasions. We’ll be brewing our own mead, by the way.
I come to the end of this massive opus that I wrote instead of working. So I find that it is time to answer your final question… did you persuade me? In a way, yes. My core remains the same, but I’m open to discussing further the suggestions you have offered, and I think we can work this into a realistically achievable goal for everyone involved.
By the way, did I happen to mention that my family is Scottish? I’m serious. Clan Macleod, Harris sept Beaton.
Posted by karen_kay on June 2, 2004, at 15:31:06
In reply to Re: rejection? » karen_kay, posted by Scott in Vermont on June 2, 2004, at 14:11:54
i think both myself and my new wife should fit in fine with you and your friends. put some liquor in us and the clothes come off. and doesn't everyone love fires? the bigger the better, right?
i should tell you though, i live in the united states, not canada. i only married a canadian and we haven't had a chance to meet just yet but i have a really good feeling about her. she did neglect to inform me she was poor before we tied the knot. perhaps she could take a lesson from you in being up-front and honest?
and you called it "our" garden..... are you sure you don't want to get married?
about cooking: i love to cook for people. so, if you invite your friends over often, i'll cook. i just don't like to cook for myself. and you'll have to do the grocery shopping of course. i can't push the cart. does that bother you?
and you called it "our home".... are you sure you don't want to get married?
and you said (were you talking while you typed this?) you play many instruments..... now, you have a job in t-com, you are scottish (wowsa! i've always wanted to marry someone scottish), you don't mind smoking or drinking.... BUT!!!! do you play the banjo? it all depends on this one question. if you don't play, i advise you to learn and soon!
about helmets: i worry. i'm afraid they'll bump their heads. will you require your children to always wear helmets in my presence? even when they are reading (and i'll read them a bedtime story too.... i'm good at that!). this is almost as important as playing the banjo!
now, i can't sing nor can i dance. i do dance and sing in the car and shower, does that count? but, i can be quite entertaining, especially when drinking. it's my fine point. and it's rather entertaining when i'm dense, even for me. i do cartwheels too. i sometimes fall into fires when i'm drinking, but i recover very fast. and that's entertaining for some people, including myself. and the lack of clothing keeps me from catching fire quickly. i knew there was a reason i take them off!
about driving: first of all, you didn't say "our car". but, i've never had a ticket (ok, a seat belt but i got out of a speeding ticket in the process). i only hit nonmoving objects (another reason for the helmets. and i never wear a seat belt, unless i see an officer. will you try to make me wear one? would you be mad if i moved your seat while i was driving? or lost some of the cd's in the car? and please tell me you drive a fast car!
about being owned: of course if we do this thing, i'd have to own you. but, if you prefer, i will do so in a way so that you don't realize it. would that help? and it would have to be an open relationship for me, because i just can't be tied down with one husband. but, you can't have another wife. if you do have another girlfriend, i must not know. or, it could get fun if i do know. i must choose her and she must fit my standards, if we are all going to be involved. is that better? oh, but of course i am your favorite. i would have to be! and even if you weren't my favorite, i'd make you believe you were, promise!
i do like the way you wouldn't give me everything i want. it makes things more challenging i think. but, i will not discuss the pony option. you must get me a pony. if not, i'd have to find a boyfriend to get me a pony. i may lose interest in you and look towards the other boyfriend. and then, you'd be heartbroken. so, for your own sake, perhaps you should rethink the pony thing and just get me one. a pony isn't just a pony. it's for your own emotional health dear. and i couldn't share my pony with anyone, it would have to be MY pony and my pony only. not even my wife could ride my pony. i'd share my husband (with a suitable girl i guess) but not my pony. and i'd flaunt my pony too! and laugh at everyone who couldn't ride it. would that be ok?
but, keep in mind everything is up for negotiation. oh, but our mail carrier must be super friendly. may i bring my mail carrier with me? i really like her and she gives my dog treats. and the guy at the gas station who sells me smokes. can he come too? and i'm still concerned about your girlfriend though....
oh, and would you get mad if i hit on your friends?
Posted by gardenergirl on June 2, 2004, at 21:17:42
In reply to did someone say naked? » Scott in Vermont, posted by karen_kay on June 2, 2004, at 15:31:06
Posted by Scott in Vermont on June 3, 2004, at 8:27:22
In reply to did someone say naked? » Scott in Vermont, posted by karen_kay on June 2, 2004, at 15:31:06
Now we’re getting to the meat of the offer.
I’m rather pleased that you rank getting drunk and running naked in the woods high on your “fun things to do” list. I would never have made participation mandatory, but I’m genuinely pleased to see that no coercion on my part will be necessary.
I misunderstood your point of origin. The original idea still stands, however. If I’m driving more than 10 hours to get you, you’d better buy me lunch.
When I used the word “our” to refer to the garden, it was to show the sharing capacity I am capable of. No, I do not want to get married in a legally binding sense.
Well, you didn’t say you liked to cook for other people! That changes things a LOT. And no worries on the grocery shopping, it falls under the duties and responsibilities of finances, which I maintain myself.
When I used the word “our” to refer to the home, it was to show the sharing capacity I am capable of. No, I do not want to get married in a legally binding sense.
Yes, I did talk out loud when was writing the previous (and current) epic. I’m here to let you know that I have been plucking at the banjo for some time, and while I’ve yet to master the instrument, most people are impressed with my playing. My friend Jon (the metalsmith) is an incredible banjo player.
Trust me about the helmets- if they have made it this long without a head-bumping incident, I think they will be just fine without them. However, if it will make you feel better, you can wear a helmet yourself in case you ever bend over to button a shirt and #BONK#…
Singing in the shower and car is good practice for singing in other places. Even if you cannot sing well, the effort is what is appreciated. However, I must caution against falling into fires. The fires we have are pretty big. If you fall in, you might not be getting out. Jumping over fires is a good thing (it’s a traditional practice, actually) but no falling IN. If I have to keep you away from the fire, I will.
You are right that I didn’t say “our” car… it’s MY car and while I will share it I don’t want any misunderstandings about who has the yea or nay say about what does and does not happen with it. I cannot be there 100% of the time to hold your hand, so if you choose to not wear a seat belt, be prepared to accept the consequences if you are pulled over or get into an accident. Yes, you can move the seat to fit you and no I won’t get mad, it makes good driving sense to have the seat properly positioned. And so long as you are losing your OWN CDs, I don’t care. By the way, I do have a fast car. It’s a Volvo 740 Turbo.
Owned… well, this is going to be a problem. You know how I am about honesty and openness. If you wish to pretend that you own me, in your mind, then I suppose that is ok, but any overt actions that make me feel trapped or owned are right out, period. The “up” side of this is that of course our relationship would be open. If the whim hits you to be involved with someone, feel free to do so. My only rules are is that you’re safe. If I were to have another girlfriend (or boyfriend) I would of course be open about it. Secrets serve no good for anyone and create jealous situations that are unnecessary. As far as group participation, I’m not opposed to it but I have been in those situations before and it’s not always a positive experience for everyone… there can be no coercion and no pressure. And I don’t feel any need to have to be your “favorite”.
If you have to find a boyfriend that will provide you with a pony, then so be it. I will not incur the expense, nor will I accept any of the responsibility in caring for the pony. The pony is your dream, and since you’re not willing to share it, we’ll list it under the “personal pursuit of happiness” as opposed to “mutual collective interest”.
We don’t have a mail carrier, we have a PO Box. But if you would like to have your carrier visit us (I don’t know how keen she would be on moving) then that’s fine. As far as the guy at the gas station who sells you your smokes, same idea but if either of them want to come, we’ll make room so long as they provide effort towards the collective.
No, I do not mind if you hit on my friends. In fact, I would go so far as to say that if you do hit on them, don’t be a tease. Make good on your flirtations.
I am thinking that, with a few minor issues, this can work.
Posted by karen_kay on June 3, 2004, at 9:51:32
In reply to Re: did someone say naked? » karen_kay, posted by Scott in Vermont on June 3, 2004, at 8:27:22
of course getting drunk and naked is ranked as one of my funnest things to do. it merely takes a suggestion of "karen, get naked and start the revolution" to have me swimming naked in the pool. nevermind that there was no 'revolution' only a drunk, naked girl in the pool (and that was just last weekend). and sometimes it doesn't even take liquor. my canadian wife and i have discussed (on several occassions) our "meeting" which would consist of running naked through the streets. i'm easily persuaded see, if someone dares me to take my clothes off (nevermind the policemen around the corner), off they come. but, the suggestion must be there. oh dear, and the times i've embarrassed my sweet mother with my nakedness. but, it was good for business, though i awoke with a stranger's name on my rear. apparently i was having a great time, and the pictures proved it, but i remember very little. i think in the past few years, the phrase i've heard from my mother the most (aside from 'did i stutter?') is 'karen kay, put your clothes on'. i'm glad she loves me. (oh, and my wife is very similar as well. she has her own 'naked stories' that i wish she would include in the conversation. you must meet my wife (but not before i do of course) if this is going to work.
now, i'm not even sure where vermont is, but it sounds lovely. geography isn't my strong suit. i don't know how far of a drive you are looking at, but your efforts will be rewarded. i can cook (when prompted to), do laundry, housework, brush a dog (are children's grooming needs similar? or at their ages, aren't they old enough to bathe themselves?), talk crap like no one's business, and i have even been known to be pleasant and soothing on very rare occassions. but, how could i buy you lunch? i have no money. should i ask my boyfriend for some money, so i can buy scott lunch because he's coming to get me? for some reason, i don't think he'd be handing over the cash (but again, i could be wrong). i suppose i could try to steal you a sandwhich from a gas station. would that be good enough for you?
so were you joking about 'our' home and 'our' garden? if not, is it possible for you to put my half (quarter? just how many people will be living there?) up for sale, so i can buy you lunch and something nice for myself? will it be enough to buy me a pony? is that a possibility, to sell my portion of 'our' home, so i can finally get that pony i've always wanted?
you can play banjo, but jon can play better? can i get his number when i move into 'our' home? better yet, can jon move in too?
i consulted the atlas and it appears that vermont is probably further than 10 hours away (but, reading maps isn't my strong suit). but, when i tried to measure the distance with my fingers, i found it is only about 80 miles away. i think i have something wrong with my measuring capabilities.
how did you know i bump my head often? i especially hate low ceilings with ceiling fans. that's a potential disaster in the making. why in the world would someone install a ceiling fan on a low ceiling anyway? were they not thinking about tall people? (off subject, but not really... i choose not to wear hats (other than the fact that they make me look funny) because if i wear a baseball cap i often find i am ducking down because i think it's a low ceiling, rather than the bill (is that right?) of the hat. so, not only do they look stupid on me, they also make me look stupid since i'm always ducking for no apparent reason.)
oh, and i won't wear a helmet. never! i'll suffer a head injury from hitting a cabinet before resorting to wearing a helmet most of my life. that's a chance i'll have to take.
and if you don't mind that i don't sing well, i'll sing. but, when you laugh at me, it'll cause me to laugh at me too. so, i won't accomplish much singing, only laughing and i can find all sorts of things about myself to laugh at without using singing as an excuse. so, wouldn't it be more enjoyable to laugh at someone else singing, that way we can share the fun and still be entertained?
can you jump over fires? my friends and i used to have parties out in the woods and by the end of the night, we'd be jumping over fires, burning the benches to keep the fire going and even once threw the host's guitar in the fire. he was angry, but he should have known it's dangerous to keep any type of wood that close to the fire, especially when wood is running low.
and about fires.... all this talk caused me to dream last night i was running from the police (i haven't a clue why, i didn't do anything wrong but my first instinct is to run) and they set my arm on fire! now i'm dreaming about fire. (and you said you'd keep me away from the fire. that's sweet (i think?). i didn't know you cared. but, will you keep the police away if they try to set my arm on fire?
about 'YOUR' car. you sound like my boyfriend now. this will be something we have to resolve in the future. i assure you i wouldn't steal 'YOUR' car and run away to canada.
but, this does start the discussion.... how do i know that when you are angry i wouldn't hear about 'your' home or 'your' children (wait, if not *legally* married, then i wouldn't have any rights to the children, correct? so, i couldn't say, sell them on e-bay if i needed money?). i'm willing to share my suitcase and clothing with you. not to mention my charming personality, my work ethic, and my attention and affection. so, why not 'our' car? you wouldn't have to sign anything, therefore it wouldn't be legal. and if i did steal 'our' car, you could still report me (you wouldn't do that though, would you?). so, how about we change the wording just a bit and call it 'our' car? to make me feel better about things? pretty please?
i like the open relationship idea. however, would i have a voice in your options? would i be able to say 'now scott, i don't approve of her or him.' and if i did say that, would you listen? and if you istened, would you heed my advice? and just how many relationships are we talking about here? and could i still pretend to be committed to you, even though you know i'm not. like, if jon was sitting on the couch naked, would you allow me to say 'oh, he's dusting' and go along with it, even though we both know he's not? i do need an answer for this one because it's very important to me to make the person i'm in a relationship with feel as if we are exclusive, even when we both know that isn't true.
ok, what if i was willing to share the pony? just a little bit. like, others could feed and groom the pony, but not ride the pony? and if i was riding a pony, could i wear riding gear? i may even make an exception to the helmet rule, just because they look so darn cute on pony riders. (oh, and does a pony run really fast?)
you don't have a mail carrier? when you go to get your mail, do you stop and talk to the person working, to make it feel almost as if you do have a mail carrier? i would have to bring my mail carrier with me. if she won't come willingly (how could she not? i think i could talk her into it) i may have to use force. would that upset you?
now, the imprtant question.... about your friends. say i did find one (or 6) of your friends acceptable and 'made good on my flirtations' would you and your friend(s) compare notes? and what if i decided i like one (or 3) of your friends better (in bed), but still wanted to live with you? would sex be a big issue? would you be jealous? is it our bed or your bed? if it's our bed, is there a problem with me entertaining your friends there, but not you? and what if you are sleeping and i want to entertain one of your friends (or 6)? would you get up and leave, so i could use the bed? or would you be angry? and if you ewre angry, would you still just get up and leave? and would you be angry at me or your friend (s)?
now, i must warn you of some of my 'bad' sides. i don't like being told no, and will do everything to avoid it. for the first few years, sex and affection works. after that, i tend to move on to kissing feet and begging. once that works no more, i have been known to lay on the floor in a ball until i get my way (usually chinese food or to watch something on tv, though in this case it could be the car). will this work? will this be a problem? how would you handle this situation?
and this sounds too good to be true. why aren't more people jumping in to move to vermont? sheesh! maybe some people wouldn't know a good thing if they read it on babble?
Posted by Scott in Vermont on June 3, 2004, at 13:03:53
In reply to Re: did someone say naked? » Scott in Vermont, posted by karen_kay on June 3, 2004, at 9:51:32
Getting drunk and running around naked is not a daily occurrence, my apologies if I led you to believe that. While nakedness is common, the “getting drunk” part is usually reserved for times when I don’t have to be terribly responsible the next day (as in go to work). Also, there will be no running around naked while the children are present. This is not debatable. The first time the children go back to Mommy and tell her the interesting story of how Daddy had a party with a bunch of people running around naked would be the last time the children came to visit. I have enough problems right now, losing the children doesn’t need to be added to that list.
On that same line of thought, having fun is a good thing, but waking up with a stranger’s name written on your butt and having pictures of the good time you had but cannot remember… well, if that is what you want to do, then do it, but you might want to consider the repercussions of your behavior. Incidentally… you wouldn’t happen to have those pictures anymore, would you? ;)
Vermont is located in the northeastern part of the United States. It is bordered by New Hampshire, New York, Massachusetts, and Canada (Province of Quebec). I live in Central Vermont, which means I live more to the middle of the state than I do the north or south. I live in the upper elevations. If buying me lunch is a problem, perhaps I’ll just mail you a bus ticket so you can travel on your own until you are close enough to where I can pick you up and not need lunch. I would prefer that you not ask to borrow money or steal anything.
I was not joking about the home or the garden or anything else. But do know that while you would be welcomed to share in all the things available here, selling items off (particularly children) is deeply frowned upon and would create an untenable situation at the home. Chances are, you’d be asked to leave. So please consider the impact on the overall collective before taking action that could have a negative impact.
Jon may move in with us anyway. He’s currently working towards different a new job, but depending on how it works out he may set in with us for a short time. Jon is my best friend in the world, and without him I would be much more lost than I am now.
With regards to the head bumping… suffice to say I took a guess.
Singing well is not the issue; it’s the effort to entertain. I don’t sing all that well either, so you may well find yourself laughing at me. But it is a small matter, I enjoy singing and I do it anyway. No matter how it goes, it should prove to be entertaining.
Yes, I jump over fires. Usually on May 1st, but I might do it now and then just because I want to. On the same line of thought about fires, wood will never be in short supply. We plan our fires and we always bring in wood. Using my guitar for firewood would not only be ill advised, it would guarantee you an unpleasant evening on the “X” rack in the basement. It is used only in the most severe disciplinary actions, and burning my guitar (or any of my other instruments) would qualify.
I’m sorry about your bizarre dream. One would think that law enforcement professionals would have more effective tools at their disposal. But the good part is that it was indeed only a dream, albeit a disturbing one. And yes, my promise to keep you away from the fire was a sweet gesture.
I am unconcerned about sounding like your boyfriend. It is my car. I will share it. It is my car. You may use it. It is MY car. Period.
I can assure you that you will not hear things like “my home” or “my garden” (of course you will hear “my children” because they are! I was there when they were born, and if memory serves me right, I didn’t see you there. All claims about parentage with the children should be referred to my lawyer) even if I am upset. I tend to deal with things calmly and rationally (unless it involves the selling of my children or the burning of my musical instruments… and my car is an issue at times) so I don’t see too many incidents where I would be terribly upset. I will share my personal things with you, and I appreciate that you would return the same consideration (although I’ll pass on the clothing… I prefer men’s clothing… well, unless you have garter stockings and thong panties… then I’ll consider it on the odd occasion).
Open relationships are the only way this will work, and they have to be approached with mutual respect and consideration. Therefore, if you object to a potential partner of mine, it will be discussed and if you still object, I would cede. We’re talking about… well, as many as possible, but no more than 5 or 6 in a year. This isn’t “long term”, if you get my drift. Life is short. Play hard.
If Jon were naked on the couch, I would probably say “Hey Jon, nice to see you” and then carry on about my previously scheduled business. You can pretend to be committed to me all you want if it makes you feel better. I’m not a terribly jealous person, so long as the person (or people) I’m with are honest with me and allow me to be honest with them.
Again with the pony! Look… the pony is your personal dream, and you want it to be your personal pet. So you can take steps to make it happen. I’ll provide the location for it to stable and I’ll even help build a stable for it, but I’m not spending a single cent on the pony.
No, I do not have a mail carrier, but I know the people at the post office rather well. I went to high school with one of them, and the rest of the people there are friendly and nice. It’s always a nice time to stop in and say hello. You can do that too if you wish. Using force to bring your current carrier to Vermont with you isn’t advisable, but so long as you take the responsibility for your own actions, I’m not going to stop you.
With regards to my friends, if you made good on your flirtations with one (or six) of course we would compare notes! That’s what guys do. And if you liked one (or three) of them better than me in bed but still wanted to live with me, I imagine I’d be busy enough elsewhere to not mind terribly (so long as you were not bitter or spiteful about it… be honest, not cutting) and beds are not an issue, if one was being used for adult activity that I was not invited to, I would sleep elsewhere. If you wanted to schedule adult activity that I would not be involved in, I would appreciate being advised of that prior to going to sleep. If I’m already asleep in the bed and you come in with your entertainment entourage, you’re going to be told to go find somewhere else to play.
I only say “no” when I have to. If you say… “Scott, lets go to Montreal this weekend and go to the All Leather Review at La Track!” then I’ll ask how much we’re going to spend, and if you say anything over $100 (US) then I’m going to say “no”. Pout and kick and cry all you want, you cannot change the financial reality of the situation. I’m not someone who caves to gratuitous whining and sniveling, and yes I do know when I’m being sucked-up to and I generally do not like it because it is manipulative and coercive.
It sounds too good to be true because it is true and there really is a farmhouse in VT where I and my girlfriend live, there really is 260+ acres of land, there really is 9 rooms, there really is a huge garden, there really is a large brook with cascading waterfalls, and we really are thinking about opening up our home to become a more collective community and extended family.
Posted by karen_kay on June 4, 2004, at 0:37:07
In reply to Re: did someone say naked? » karen_kay, posted by Scott in Vermont on June 3, 2004, at 13:03:53
have no fear, i tend to control myself around children (assuming they are over the age of 16, right?) there will be no getting naked in front of them. drunk i can't promise. perhaps we could tuck them in extra early (i start drinking around 4 pm) on those days reserved for drinking? or better yet, maybe we could convince your girlfriend to take them out of the house for a while (say the weekend) so that we may 'be one with nature and find oureslves' among liquor and camp fires (we meaning me and your six best friends of course. you would be invited too, but at this point i'm very interested in jon). now, if your girlfriend taking them out for a weekend retreat isn't a possibility, perhaps you and your girlfriend could take them out for the weekend. if i live there, i want to feel at home. and i only feel at home in places where i'm allowed to strip off my clothes and frolic through the woods, just like every other human being. if weekends aren't an option, then i'll go with weekdays. but, since you have to work you wouldn't be joining us (me and your friends). is that a correct assumption? if this is going to work, i must feel at home and nothing says home like me passed out on the floor or lying naked in the bath tub. would that be ok? could you explain to your children that i was only showering and fell down? or that i slipped while vacuuming and forgot to put my clothes on? i'm starting to get worried about the children. not that i'd be a bad influence of course, but that they may not understand why daddy's new girlfriend frequently is laying on the floor with an empty bottle of bourbon in her hand. would you be able to explain things to them? would you at least lie to them, for my sake?
i swear, i think i've been to your house before. or perhaps my sister's current residence is turning into your plan? it's always a good time, but i do need some time to myself. how would you handle that? could i have 'karen time'? plus, everytime i go over to my sister's house, i seem to end up in some sort of bind, involving her future father in law (he's an engineer you know? would you consider changing professions?), her future brother in law, and my future brother in law. and i'll not even mention the tension between me and her future mother in law. so, if put in this particular setting, i'm almost afraid of my future (or lack thereof). if it is anything similar to what happens at my sisters, i don't know that you could handle it. i'm not entirely sure i could handle it for a long period of time.
oh dear god! i just reread you post. when i first read it, i thought you said you were concerned about sounding like my boyfriend. after taking another look, i have discovered you are UNconcerned about sounding like him. hmmmm... i'll have to think about that for a minute.
what's the "X' rack in the basement? you said it isn't fun, but for some reason i think it sounds rather tempting. i wouldn't want to burn your guitar, but is there a lesser crime i could commit to warrant a trip to the "X" rack?
and i wouldn't really sell your children. i could never be that hurtful. but, would renting them out be ok? even just for a few days, to a good home?
you said you were sorry about my dream. for that, i've decided to forgive you for being unconcerned about sounding like my old man. but, the dream didn't have a 'nightmare' feel to it. i didn't wake up sweating (ok, you caught me, i did but not because of the dream) or breathing heavy (again a lie, but not from the dream). it was just an odd dream. i'm sorry you wasted your sympathy on that. i'll try to be more precise when describing my dreams in the future, so that you don't waste sympathy where it is not needed. now, if you want to be sorry, you could be sorry for not backing down on the pony. also, do you know anything about ponies? i'm rather tall and someone suggested that i couldn't ride a pony anyway. could that be true? if so, isn't that the story of my life. be sorry that i may be too tall to ride a pony :( *and if i rode a pony and my feet touched the ground, wouldn't that just make the pony move even faster?
i think the clothing situation (request)can be arranged.and just how would we work this out with your girlfriend? could she and i compare notes? and who gets to do on dates or to the movies? would you just pick the person you weren't mad at, at the time? what if i wanted my 'scott' time, but your girlfriend did too? how would you decide who to choose? i wouldn't mind sharing really, but i think alone time with 'scott' would be very important. and also, what if i wanted alone time with your girlfriend, at the same time you did? would we just draw straws? i think that since i'm coming in a bit late, i'd feel somewhat inferior at first. i assure you though, soon i would claw my way to the head of the household. but, while i'm sharpening those claws, how would you prevent me from feeling inferior, since i am entering a bit later than you and your girlfriend, so the power structure would be a bit skewed, no?
you'll help build the stable for the pony? that's very sweet, but if i found someone to build it for us, to help with the cost, would you at least pay for half of a pony?
and if i wanted to play in your bed, while you were asleep but not invite you, you'd ask me to leave? i'd feel rejected from that one dear. what if i invited you (knowing you wouldn't want to join in anyway)? then, would you leave? if we share everything, doesn't that include the bed? and what if yours is the only one that doesn't squeak?
i find this arrangement to be very fascinating. and i really like the way you won't budge on certain things and issues. but, you should be up for negotiation for other matters. selling children, no! pony, possibly! moving out of bed so i can have it, YES!!! i'll reread your post and start fresh again tomorrow (or today?). in the meantime, coudl you give me jon's number. at least until we work out the minor details?
Posted by Scott in Vermont on June 4, 2004, at 8:55:04
In reply to Re: did someone say naked? » Scott in Vermont, posted by karen_kay on June 4, 2004, at 0:37:07
The children are with me 3 weekends out of the month. I am doing everything I can to change that, but for now, I see them Friday night through Monday morning. Monday night through Friday morning the house is “adult only”. Also, the “off” weekend each month is usually fraught with hedonistic activity. So I don’t think you’ll find the presence of children cramping your style. I appreciate your efforts to remain somewhat presentable around them, with the understanding that you won’t have to do it very often.
If you choose to frolic when I am not home, that is your choice and the option is certainly open to you. However, if you have things that need to be done (such as the garden needs weeding) then I ask you to be responsible and weed first, frolic later. And no, I do not mind that some of my friends join you. That’s the entire idea behind this.
If you need “Karen time”, then take it. But do remember that in your absence, someone else is picking up your duties. So please, take the time you need, and then come back ready to get back into the routine.
The “X” rack… it’s a bad place. You don’t want to go there. I suppose it could be used in lesser offenses, but then the intimidation value will be lost. So no, you can’t go play on the “X” rack. No worries, though. There are other devices in the attic. Those are the ones you might be interested in. And thank you for looking into the clothing request.
I fully expect that you and my girlfriend would compare notes. I would be surprised if you did not. As far as “Scott time”, you can work that out amongst yourselves, much like you and I would work out “girlfriend time”. As far as power struggles go, there really is not need for one. There is no “power” per se, it is a collective where we have meetings and discuss things democratically. There are positions appointed, such as I am the steward for the finances. My girlfriend is primary on managing the household items, and we share in the other duties. I do tasks traditionally considered “male” tasks, such as lifting heavy things, fixing stuff, and making sure that things don’t break to the point of needing to be fixed. My girlfriend does most of the cooking and laundry. We shop together. So when you come into this (as well as your poor Canadian wife) there will be a division of tasks and duties, but as you can see, the addition of even one person divides the tasks to the point where each person has a few tasks individually, but everyone benefits overall.
This next subject is something I think you are being unreasonable on, and I won’t shrink from speaking my mind on it. If I am already in a bed and sleeping, and you come in to play with someone other than myself, I’m going to ask you to find somewhere else to play and I do not think that is unreasonable at all. To illustrate this, lets say I’m having a “guy’s only” night and we come into the bedroom where you are already asleep. Would you want me to kick you out of the sack? No! You’d want me to go find somewhere else to play. When you look at this scenario from a different angle, it doesn’t look so unreasonable.
I’m always open to negotiation. And I haven’t said “no” to anything, really. I did not say you could not have a pony, I said I wasn’t going to help you get it. I did not say you “can’t” anything (except sell my children, and no, you can’t rent them either). But I did say that you are responsible for making the individual things you want to happen. Asking me to help you with getting a pony would be like me asking you to help me get something you would have no interest in and did not want to deal with.
How tall are you, anyway?
Posted by karen_kay on June 4, 2004, at 13:42:38
In reply to Re: did someone say naked? » karen_kay, posted by Scott in Vermont on June 4, 2004, at 8:55:04
when you say meetings, it makes this plan sound like work. if we had meetings, how often would they be? and would someone bring donuts? i could bring bagels, but only if there is a panera remotely close by. but, back to the meetings... how often again? and what if i had a question, but you felt it was a 'stupid' question and should not be discussed? and at these meetings, would we be discussing things like:
*sleeping arrangements
*scheduling 'scott' time and girlfriend time?
*who's better in bed
*visitors (or the fact that you may not like my visitors)
*jon sitting naked on the couchwhen you say meetings, are we allowed to air dirty laundry? are they open discussions that allow each person to state their feelings? what if something is said in a meeting that hurts another member of the community? how would that be handled? and what about fist fights? what if that situation were to occur? would people just watch or take action?
so, is your plan more of "roomates with sex" or would there be some type of relationship? would love be involved at all? what if i fell in love with your girlfriend and tried to use you as a pawn to get her? would that be discussed in the meeting? and if i did that, would i be asked to leave? and if i were asked to leave, would you give me a ride? and how would i explain this to my mother? nevermind that one, she'd understand. but, how would i be introduced around? as one of your girlfriends? would i even be your girlfriend (if we had to label things. i'm just trying to get an idea in my head here. bear with me.) and could i introduce you (and your six friends) as all being my boyfriends? or 'casual' partners? what exactly would i be to you? and am i asking too many questions?
about the bed situation: i don't think i'm being unreasonable. i think that if the idea is to share, why not share the bed as well? i would attempt to be respectful of your beauty rest, but i must also respect myself as a person and not settle for a lumpy mattress when the nice, firm mattress is located in your bedroom. right? could we come up with a schedule so i could have your bed on certain days and you could have mine on those days? would that solve this minor problem?
and if i wanted to sleep in your bedroom, with you, would we have to devise a schedule? like: karen monday - friday, girlfriend saturday, alone time, sunday. would this at least be discussed at the meeting?
what exactly do you have in your attic?
ok, let's forget the pony for the time being. but, would you at least pay to get my hair done? this would be a deal breaker if you say no. if i will promise to take on extra activities in the home (or bed, take your pick) could you at least guarantee to have my hair done for me? with taking on these additional tasks, that would make my free time very valuable and i couldn't be bothered with a job. and what about times when i need money? how would that work? again, if i spend most of my time cooking, cleaning, gardening and frolicing, how would i have the time to make money of my own? and also, would you at least contribute to the 'get kk a pair of breasts' fund? how much would you be willing to donate? would this also be discussed in the meeting? i assure you, me having breasts would not just be my own personal dream, as many members of the community could benefit from it.
shouldn't my ability to entertain at least grant me a pair of breasts? you and your six friends could pitch in and buy them for me for my birthday. oh, and also..... what types of presents would you get me? of course i'd expect presents from time to time. and not just for holidays either.
and i'm about 5 9. could be 5 10 maybe? or 5 8? i haven't measured in a while.
oh, and do you have a special apron for gardening? and could i garden in a cocktail (quit laughing) dress? and could we have some cocktail parties at least? maybe just once a year?
oh, and would i be expected to cook thanksgiving dinner? or would we go to your parents? or would we go to my mothers? and would you buy a motorcycle? for yourself of course, not for me.
Posted by Scott in Vermont on June 4, 2004, at 14:09:59
In reply to Re: did someone say meetings? » Scott in Vermont, posted by karen_kay on June 4, 2004, at 13:42:38
My apologies. I have a meeting to attend and I will not be able to respond to this until Monday.
I'm serious. I'm at work.
Have a good weekend.
-Scott
Posted by Scott in Vermont on June 7, 2004, at 7:33:12
In reply to Re: did someone say meetings?, posted by Scott in Vermont on June 4, 2004, at 14:09:59
I'm not at work today. I'm leaving here in about 5 minutes. I'll try to post here tomorrow.
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