Posted by Lou Pilder on February 13, 2014, at 15:23:13
In reply to Lou's replyThe Hsiung-Pilder discussion-gudphoar, posted by Lou Pilder on February 13, 2014, at 15:20:33
> > > > You also state that telling others what to do is not conducive to the civic harmony and welfare here because telling others what to do is different from telling others what to believe. Here in this case, I as a Jew am being told what to do, to convert to Christianity, so that I could save myself first.
> > >
> > > > Here in another post the past practice is that when someone tells another what to do, that could be putting down that person.
> > >
> > > I agree, it wasn't sensitive to your feelings, but that's different from putting down Judaism. And I usually don't consider telling someone what to do once to be pressure/harassment.
> > >
> > > Bob
> >
> > Mr. Hsiung,
> > There are many parts to the post in question that says something like: [..Convert-Lou Pilder and save yourself first...convert to Christianity...] that are at issue here. You wrote,[...I agree, it wasn't sensitive to your feelings...]. That alone could be a way to post a repudiation in the thread where the post appears. But it is much more than that, for the statement you say is not sensitive to my feelings but you also say that is different from putting down Judaism. Let us look at this post from the past practice of your to see what {putting down} of a faith could mean here by you. The post {implies} that if one road is right then others are wrong and is considered by you to constitute {putting down} other faiths. The key in your past practice here in relation to posts that put down other faiths is by {implication} as to what can be seen. In the post in question, the poster telling me to save myself first by converting to Christianity from Judaism has many {implications}.One implication is that since I am a Jew, that Judaism does not lead to being saved and that Christianity does. That constitutes a generally accepted understanding of what putting down of another faith implies. The implication is that Jews can not be saved unless they convert to Christianity so that the implication is that Judaism is an inferior religion to Chrsitianity and by further implication the Jews will miss out on salvation because they do not convert to Christianity. I feel put down when I read that implication. And your rule is to not post {anything that could lead one to feel put down}. By implication, a subset of readers could think that the statement in question also puts down Islam, and all other faiths that are not Christian. For if Jews need to convert to Christianity for salvation, then would not Islamic people and all other people that are not Christian also have to do the same? So the statement not only leads me to feel put down when I read it, but there could be others also led to feel put down by the statement.
> > Lou Pilder
> > [ faith, 602 ]
>
> Mr. Hsiung,
> When a statement is not sensitive to another's feelings, the person could feel put down. I feel put down when I read the statement because you admit that the statement is not sensitive to my feelings. In your rules here, when one rule is broken, many other rules could also be broken, like if a statement is not semsitive to another's feelings, the one that the statement is directed to could feel put down. This is because in your rule to not post what could lead someone to feel put down, the {feeling} is a result of what is posted and that could even be a jump to a conclusion about another or something insensitive or accusative. All of those could lead the subject person to {feel} put down and your rule is not about what is seen, but what the recipient {feels}. And I feel put down by the statement that you say is not sensitive to my feelings when I read it.
> But it is much more than that. For {pressure } is defined more than one way. One way is by repeated questioning or repeated statements, but another is by what any consequences could be to the recipient if they do not do what is said for the subject person to do. An example hypothetically could be if one poster tells another poster that they are to convert to Christianity or they will not be saved. The {consequences} of not being saved could be considered by a subset of readers to be {pressuring} the subject person.
> Let us look at your post from the past practice here which shows that when another's faith is put down, that could constitute pressure by you. And the {putting down} in your past practice here could be considered by a subset of readers as analogous to the statement in question as putting down another faith because in the statement in question Judaism could be thought by a subset of readers to be made out by the poster as {inferior} to Christianity because the statement says to convert to Christianity for me to save myself first. It also jumps to a conclusion that Judaism does not lead to salvation which a subset of readers could think is an insult and criticism of Judaism as being a faith that lacks a way to be saved and by implication could mean that Jews all over the world, not just me as a Jew here, can not be saved unless they convert to Christianity. To criticize a faith is to {put down} that faith. So a subset of readers could not only think that the post puts down Judaism, but those readers could also feel put down because the post remains unsanctioned and you say that unsanctioned posts have statements in them that are not against your rules. So a subset of Jewish readers could feel humiliation not only when they read the statement, but to see that you say that the statement is not against your rules because it is unsanctioned. And to say that one religion is to be embraced as in this case to be saved, is to demean all others as you admit.
> This stance that you show here has historical parallels that your prohibitions posted to me here prevent me from posting about. But I say to you, that as long as you allow statements that could lead a Jew to feel put down, which are anti-Semitic statements, there could be a subset of readers to see what you are doing as an invitation to post anti-Semitic expressions here that could lead to Jews being victims of anti-Semitic violence as that those readers could act out hatred toward the Jews in the community where they reside for you say that you do what will be good for this community as a whole and those readers could think that it will be good for their community as a whole also.
> Never again.
> Lou Pilder
>
> http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20020918/msgs/7795.html
correction:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/admin/20020918/msgs/7795.html
poster:Lou Pilder
thread:1050116
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/admin/20131217/msgs/1060646.html