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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by mystickangaroo on December 20, 2010, at 0:57:36
In reply to Re: I try to never do this, but...., posted by Abby Cunningham on December 19, 2010, at 23:07:01
(((((((10derheart)))))))
Again no words of wisdom here. Just a big owwwww and some virtual chocolate if you like it.
Keep taking care of yourself.
Posted by jane d on December 20, 2010, at 2:01:46
In reply to I try to never do this, but...., posted by 10derheart on December 19, 2010, at 21:52:28
I'm sorry. It's just so hard sometimes.
Jane
Posted by 10derheart on December 20, 2010, at 2:06:11
In reply to (((((10derheart))))), posted by Solstice on December 19, 2010, at 22:23:49
Thank you so much, Solstice. It seems you always make time for people's stuff. You must be a great friend.
I don't think there is any special wisdom, at least not in the human realm. I think even my ex-T (whoa-it hurts to use that description more than I can say)has lost his way, especially just lately. You never expect your rock to get this cracked and wobbly.
Thanks for caring.
Posted by 10derheart on December 20, 2010, at 2:21:07
In reply to Re: (((((10derheart))))), posted by annierose on December 19, 2010, at 22:30:32
Annie, you are always so warm. You make me feel like you can somehow understand something you couldn't really understand (not knowing the specifics, I mean).
The hell of it is long-distance, long term (over 5 years total) *therapy* was terminated abruptly 10 months ago, yet he was willing to relate in limited ways and we continued contact, eventually having several healing sessions by phone and I visited my old city three months ago, so face-to-face with the goal of "doing over" such an awful termination. All was getting SO MUCH better, then today, he just writes - no more anything is the "right thing to do." No sorry, no why, no nothing. In fact he said "no explanations."
:-(
Sometimes I think he's insane, sometimes I think I am. It hurts horribly to be furious and curse a man you've loved and respected for years (and still do). So confusing.
Yes, my beautiful granddaughter who is nearly four wipes all the grief away, albeit temporarily. She is an angel. But....but....I can't be with her 24/7 and night comes....
Posted by 10derheart on December 20, 2010, at 2:23:48
In reply to Re: I try to never do this, but...., posted by Abby Cunningham on December 19, 2010, at 23:07:01
I'm sorry for that. If I read about it here (and I may have if you posted) I may have forgotten the story or mixed it up with others. Sorry.
It should NEVER happen, but our darn therapists are flawed human beings (gasp) who make mistakes (bigger gasp!) and that just sucks.
Thanks for replying.
Posted by 10derheart on December 20, 2010, at 2:24:56
In reply to (((((((((((10der)))))))))))) (nm) » 10derheart, posted by muffled on December 19, 2010, at 23:18:20
Posted by 10derheart on December 20, 2010, at 2:32:05
In reply to Re: I try to never do this, but...., posted by mystickangaroo on December 20, 2010, at 0:57:36
I love chocolate, virtual or not. The trouble is sometimes I just want to eat it to cover up emotions.....
I am trying to think of ways to take care of myself. Ruminating alone is NOT a great method. I had a good chat with a very wise and trusted friend tonight and instantly felt relief. So that was a good choice.
You are kind to post to me, msk.
Posted by 10derheart on December 20, 2010, at 2:34:41
In reply to Re: I try to never do this, but.... » 10derheart, posted by jane d on December 20, 2010, at 2:01:46
It certainly is, jane.
You sound like you know. Really know.
Therapy, ex-therapy, all of it, is the most worthwhile yet hardest, most excruciating process I can think of in my life. I know it's helped and will still somehow, but ruptures, total breaks, therapists mistakes and missteps....they are almost too much to bear.
Posted by Helana on December 20, 2010, at 10:23:22
In reply to I try to never do this, but...., posted by 10derheart on December 19, 2010, at 21:52:28
I am so happy you reached out 10derheart. ((((10derheart))))...hang in there! You are so strong. Just keep believing in yourself and the good! Don't give up. I will be thinking of you this holiday season!
Posted by Dinah on December 20, 2010, at 11:35:24
In reply to I try to never do this, but...., posted by 10derheart on December 19, 2010, at 21:52:28
It hurts to lose contact with someone we love. The similarities between unwanted termination and unwanted divorce or being dumped in a long term relationship are striking. It hurts. It really hurts.
For me anyway, it makes it even worse that there is nothing really that can be done. We have power only over ourselves and can't really change their decisions or their feelings and beliefs. Being impotent can make me frantic. I'm not always good at acceptance of the things I cannot change. I'm not sure if you react the same way, but if so, it can add even more intensity to the feelings of loss.
I probably don't need to remind you that he really does care about you, even if he's made this decision. He kept in contact in a way my therapist never would have. That may not help very much right now, as the remaining ties are broken, but maybe in the future it will.
I wish there was something I could really do.
Posted by 10derheart on December 20, 2010, at 12:12:54
In reply to I try to never do this, but...., posted by 10derheart on December 19, 2010, at 21:52:28
It's as if he slit a hole in some part of me and emptied out my insides, suddenly. Really suddenly.
I am more stunned by this abrupt change of stance than I even was when he terminated me by email, out of the blue, originally.
But my metaphor falls apart, as someone with no insides couldn't ache this much.
Posted by 10derheart on December 20, 2010, at 12:16:23
In reply to Re: I try to never do this, but...., posted by Helana on December 20, 2010, at 10:23:22
Helana, thanks so much. I know you're right. I have so much be be thankful for...it's just so hard not to narrow my focus in on this relationship.
He's so important to me and cannot even have the decency to wish me Merry Christmas, but instead says oh, BTW, no more contact from me and I will not explain.
Yeah...and Happy New Year to you, too :-(
My thread is NOT one to read at the holidays. Sorry.
Posted by gardenergirl on December 20, 2010, at 13:00:23
In reply to Re: I try to never do this, but.... » Helana, posted by 10derheart on December 20, 2010, at 12:16:23
I'm so sorry. Thinking of you, my friend.
gg
Posted by obsidian on December 20, 2010, at 21:33:31
In reply to I try to never do this, but...., posted by 10derheart on December 19, 2010, at 21:52:28
Anytime
((((((10derHeart))))))
Sorry about the pain you are in :(
Posted by PartlyCloudy on December 20, 2010, at 21:39:16
In reply to I try to never do this, but...., posted by 10derheart on December 19, 2010, at 21:52:28
unconditionally
Posted by Daisym on December 21, 2010, at 0:41:41
In reply to I try to never do this, but...., posted by 10derheart on December 19, 2010, at 21:52:28
((((Tender))))
I am so sorry for your pain and I truly do understand both the empty feelings as well as the intense loneliness that comes with all of this. When you get divorced or lose a loved one, you usually have some social support or can grieve more openly. This is such private pain - like you said, no one really understands the depth of the connection unless you've been there. I'm glad you reached out here.
I'm struggling myself right now with a very big rupture and I too have not really wanted to write about it. It is complicated but a lot of my hesitation to find support around this has to do with my therapy being really deep (though not trouble free, of course) for so long - and my therapist being so good, that I'm mortified and devasted that this happened. I can't believe that "I've" screwed this up.I didn't mean to make this about me - I am just trying to let you know you aren't alone. And I really like what Dinah said - we can't control anyone but ourselves, as frustrating as that is. And like all relatioships, change happens. And therapists are human, as much as we wish they weren't, and therefore influenced by the world's ill winds. If I had to guess, I'd say he is struggling with his own feelings about the unusual boundaries of this relationship and perhaps the energy it takes to maintain it. We rarely cut things off with someone to hurt them but rather, we usually do it to protect ourselves or when we can't face the hurt we know we are causing. It is a sign of too much caring, not none at all.
Keep writing. I hope it helps
Posted by 10derheart on December 21, 2010, at 1:06:14
In reply to ((((10derheart)))) » 10derheart, posted by gardenergirl on December 20, 2010, at 13:00:23
Thank you so much, gg. It matters a lot to me.
I got an extra therapy session with my "new-ish" (can 9 months with a T still make them *newT*?) T for Wednesday. She is really good. But she is not MY former beloved-T and she so far is at a bit of a loss to help me cope with much of his behavior this past year, which has sometimes been at least strange and unhelpful, and at worst bordering on unethical and harmful. She is determined to see me through this unusual situation and to be there, though. I was so relieved when she offered a cancellation slot. It's like she knew I was about to break down and say a whole week - over Christmas, no less - when this man just suddenly cut off communicating with me (uh...again) - was waaay too long to wait to come in again.
Well, that was TMI. Do I have stuff bottled up, or what?
Posted by 10derheart on December 21, 2010, at 1:07:48
In reply to Re: I try to never do this, but.... » 10derheart, posted by obsidian on December 20, 2010, at 21:33:31
Posted by 10derheart on December 21, 2010, at 1:10:12
In reply to ((((10derHeart)))) » 10derheart, posted by PartlyCloudy on December 20, 2010, at 21:39:16
How concisely perfect.
That made me tear up in a good way for the first time in two days. Bless you for that, PC.
Posted by 10derheart on December 21, 2010, at 1:19:30
In reply to Re: ((((10derHeart)))) » PartlyCloudy, posted by 10derheart on December 21, 2010, at 1:10:12
Daisy and Dinah, I will get to you. You know I will.
I am just exhausted and unfortunately decided I needed to take a small dose of lorazepam for the second day now. I have not used it since nightmare #1 (initial unilateral, abrupt,unwanted termination) happened ten months ago. The few pills left in that bottle have gathered dust since July. Until yesterday. I guess taking a little bit of a benzo is better than crawling out of your skin from anxiety and rumination and crying instead of sleeping at night.
I am a little overwhelmed with the speed and number of responses here. I don't mean to sound manipulative or falsely modest. I do know I am a nice and good person and probably, if not liked well enough here, at least tolerated or perhaps (I thought) just unnoticed.
People notice and come to help. That is......the epitome of compassion. Babble will never be 'dead' as it's been said sometimes while even one of you angels is acting this way when another says..."I need help today..."
Posted by jane d on December 21, 2010, at 2:27:21
In reply to Re: I try to never do this, but...., posted by 10derheart on December 20, 2010, at 12:12:54
> It's as if he slit a hole in some part of me and emptied out my insides, suddenly. Really suddenly.
> But my metaphor falls apart, as someone with no insides couldn't ache this much.
10derheart,This is the perfect description. It's horrible but it's perfect. The closest I came to your experience was believing for a while that I had been abruptly terminated. It's not the same as what you're going through of course but this was exactly how I felt. I could never found such descriptive words however.
I think Daisy hit on a key part of why this is so awful. That other people aren't there to offer support the way they would if you'd gotten divorced or suffered some more conventional loss. And then I think maybe we internalize that judgment that it shouldn't be important adding guilt on top of the misery. I'm glad you posted here. At the very least we know what a big loss it is.
Jane
Posted by twinleaf on December 21, 2010, at 10:43:57
In reply to I try to never do this, but...., posted by 10derheart on December 19, 2010, at 21:52:28
I am so sorry to hear this. It's just heartbreaking, and mystifying. As a long-time poster, I can remember having the impression of a very strong, warm relationship between the two of you-what sounded like an extremely good fit... When you moved, it seemed as though he was very open to arranging things so that your therapeutic relationship could continue.
You may remember that I had something simiiar happen to me (posting as "Pfinstegg") in 2007. As I have slowly recovered from the rejection by my first analyst, I've had a chance to explore what may have happened with him. My "new" analyst feels that a combination of a close, intense relationship, which we definitely had, plus the pressure of dealing with pre-oedipal (mother-loss) issues were what drove him temporarily over the edge. He said that very early dyadic issues are particularly difficult for some therapists to deal with. The bottom line in his eyes always was that it was a counter-transference problem, and not in any way my fault. It actually took between two and three years for me to get over the terrible hurt, anger and guilt that I felt. But, with time and wonderful help from my oresent analyst, I really did recover and even get strnger. I know you will, too, but still, I'm so sorry you have to go through something so painful, Endings should never be like the one you had.
Posted by twinleaf on December 21, 2010, at 14:18:48
In reply to Re: I try to never do this, but.... » 10derheart, posted by Daisym on December 21, 2010, at 0:41:41
Oh, Daisy, that's very distressing to hear. I'm very glad you told us, because many of us have been following your therapeutic journey for a number of years, and had not heard too much recently, We all secretly, or not so secretly, looked to your therapist as a model of understanding, caring and steadfastness. It is very unexpected and upsetting to think that somehow there has been a rupture between the two of you which you have not yet been able to repair.
I once read somewhere that analyses or therapies where nothing goes wrong are also the ones where not much ever happens. The first three years with my present analyst were a long series of ruptures, only some of which got repaired. I guess there was a high enough percentage of repairs to allow things to go along well. It was the successful repairs which proved so helpful, although getting to them was full of stress and uncertainty. I do hope the same for you, and also hope you will post whenever you think we might be able to offer hope, understanding or encouragement.
Posted by annierose on December 21, 2010, at 14:22:51
In reply to Re: ((((10derheart)))) » gardenergirl, posted by 10derheart on December 21, 2010, at 1:06:14
Perhaps this is a piece to the puzzle. I didn't know you began seeing a t in your current hometown/new state. Perhaps when your former t knew this, he decided that it was a good time to close the door and let you move on to the new therapeutic relationship.
Obviously he handled it poorly. And everyone here has so much wisdom in their posts, that I'll need to bookmark this thread so I can re-read them when I feel that kind of inner punched in the stomach hurt from my therapist.
I am happy to know that you sought a new support system for yourself.
You are stronger than you realize.
Posted by 10derheart on December 21, 2010, at 15:59:32
In reply to Re: ((((10derheart)))), posted by annierose on December 21, 2010, at 14:22:51
> Perhaps this is a piece to the puzzle. I didn't know you began seeing a t in your current hometown/new state. Perhaps when your former t knew this, he decided that it was a good time to close the door and let you move on to the new therapeutic relationship.
No, he unilaterally terminated me in an email one hour before a scheduled session back in Feb. Or at least that's what I dragged out of him in the phone call, through my shock & tears since he would *not* come out and say he was ending therapy, but only that he'd become too connected to my life and preoccupied with me, etc., etc. And that he had no answers and I would have to wait (undetermined amount of time) till he figured out what to do. Within a week of that I started seeking a T. to support me through this shock. So I'm saying the order of things was the opposite of what you wrote.
I know it's convoluted because I have not told the whole story chronologically here - yet. I want to and hope to soon. I just know the posts will be ridiculously long and I also dread it in a way. But I'll have to if I want anyone reading to understand. In a nutshell, what my female T now thinks in general (though she is quite baffled at some of his mixed messages) is that he blurred the boundaries between T and friend/buddy so much for so long, caring so much he wanted to be there for me no matter what so I'd be stable when I moved here (2008-reluctantly), then eventually he realized it was unhealthy for us both to go on this way (phone therapy indefinitely) and tried to pull back, but had NO CLUE *how* exactly to do that. There the fumbling, bumbling and harm started as he both tried to get me to detach from him while simultaneously saying we did not have to say a final good-bye. It's a fair assessment but there is a lot more detail....
> Obviously he handled it poorly.
Yes, and that's an understatement. But oh he has tried so hard to do things right and even sought supervision and is SUCH a kind and good man that it is hard for me not to feel as badly for him as I do for myself. Well, almost. I adore the guy, in case anyone hasn't guessed. He is so very humanly flawed, just like me. And therein lies the conundrum with therapists having flaws and weak areas - this very genuine, authenticity is what made my healing with his help possible, yet it also is such that he - frankly - screwed up attempting to draw therapy to a close and hurt me badly. And now (I will explain better later) is doing almost a repeat of last year, out of the blue **again***....
>> And everyone here has so much wisdom in their posts, that I'll need to bookmark this thread so I can re-read them when I feel that kind of inner punched in the stomach hurt from my therapist.
I agree completely.
> I am happy to know that you sought a new support system for yourself.
I had to. I was drowning in grief and confusion.
> You are stronger than you realize.
I don't think so, but in my belief system God is strong enough for everyone, in everything, all the time, so that is where I have to focus. I cannot do this relying on me, me, me.
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