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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 25 of 30. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by llurpsienoodle on November 27, 2007, at 15:31:20
I told my T a big ugly one today. He gets to be the first one to hear the secret. It came out in disjointed chunks. I admire the way he was able to put it together coherently and then help me make sense out of it. goodT. he even got out his notes from last session to help us remember what we were talking about that triggered this big ugly one.
Did I mention that he usually offers me a cup of coffee, which I always refuse, but that today I accepted. with cream and sugar thank you. niceT
But then he told me a story from the perpetrator's perspective that underscored how perpetrators use denial, etc. to delude themselves into believing that they have done no ill.
I do not know why T ended on that note. I am not interested in forgiveness. I only want somebody to sit with me and hold my pain.
I came home with a big black blank in my consciousness. I lay in bed and tried to think. I could not think. my consciousness had been stolen. Either I had the black blank, or I had the big ugly flashback, which gives me a visceral reaction of nausea. There was no happy medium.
Then I woke up 2.5 hours later. I don't know how to hold this one.
T told me that this is in the past and not to allow it to taint my present. Not to go home and (censored). I kind of grunted sarcastically. yeah right.
Sorry, I just felt like sharing.
-Ll
Posted by llurpsienoodle on November 27, 2007, at 17:08:42
In reply to trauma processing no triggers, posted by llurpsienoodle on November 27, 2007, at 15:31:20
I just feel like hiding in a hole. what happened is just too much for me to process right now.
REMEMBER, http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/psycho/20071120/msgs/796625.html
muffled wrote above that these feelings shall pass.
Will they? This is the trigger that hit me last week. It's still there. festering. rotting.I'm gonna go knit. I can't even eat. I feel so sick
Posted by Dinah on November 27, 2007, at 17:25:38
In reply to Re: trauma processing no triggers » llurpsienoodle, posted by llurpsienoodle on November 27, 2007, at 17:08:42
I'm sorry, llurpsie, that you're feeling so bad.
Muffled's right. The intensity of the feelings does pass. Our bodies just aren't built be able to maintain that level of physiological arousal for long periods of time. It *will* pass, no matter how little it feels like it now.
In the meantime, is this one of the times your as-needed medication was made for?
Posted by Muffled on November 27, 2007, at 17:33:31
In reply to Re: trauma processing no triggers » llurpsienoodle, posted by llurpsienoodle on November 27, 2007, at 17:08:42
That you share your burden w/another.
My T saiys same thing.
She say that the person has dead eyes cuz they have to dissociate to do what they do.
I think there is not requiered forgiveness at this time.
I dunno whats to be done.
I still hiding under my bush(see my thread below...)
I don't understand this stuff. The way I have dealt with it is its not mine, it belongs to someone else.
It still touches us and makes us feel so repulsive and bad, and so we not try and think of it so bad we try not to think.
But apparently we supposed to somehow realize the REAL pic in that its not the kids fault cuz the kids for frikken sakes, just kids.
Its the seriously messed up adults fault.
But the kids pay.
But we goto try and learn that we got it WRONG.
And its bad and sh*t frikken happens and its bad and wrong, but you know what LL??? YOU ARE A GOOD PERSON, you hear me? You just messed, but like my T says, in between its OK to breath and pretend nothing happened. To take bits at a time.
I gonna have no post left to post cuz I answering my own questions??Wassup w/dat eh?
Oh LL I just want you to know this is all so sh*tty and it feels sh*tty, but it gonna pass, and things gonna get better, and we gonna end up more REAL, and naot haunted no more. And we can help others too.
Take good care of you OK?
Distract in good ways if you can.
M
Posted by Muffled on November 27, 2007, at 17:35:28
In reply to Re: trauma processing no triggers » llurpsienoodle, posted by Dinah on November 27, 2007, at 17:25:38
and not all at the same time....as prescribed....
Be safe.
M
Posted by Dinah on November 27, 2007, at 17:37:08
In reply to as needed=as prescribed, posted by Muffled on November 27, 2007, at 17:35:28
Yes, of course.
Posted by llurpsienoodle on November 27, 2007, at 17:39:00
In reply to Re: trauma processing no triggers » llurpsienoodle, posted by Dinah on November 27, 2007, at 17:25:38
I drank 2 cocktails. now I feel even worse.
I'm gonna give it an hour before I take my antipsychotic candy. as prescribed.
-Ll
Posted by sunnydays on November 27, 2007, at 18:30:18
In reply to trauma processing no triggers, posted by llurpsienoodle on November 27, 2007, at 15:31:20
I wish I knew how to help you Ll. One thing I will say is that I'm proud of you for telling your T. It must have been soooo hard to say. Disjointed chunks is usually how I tell memories the first time - a lot of times I end up having to revisit them and they get more coherent as time goes on. And good for you for accepting the coffee! Mildly funny story - my old T used to always have a bottle of water for himself and at the start of every session he would offer me a bottle of water too. I always said no at first because I was way too anxious or not thirsty. Well, he started making a big deal about how I'd never accept a bottle of water, etc. It got to the point where I wouldn't have accepted one if I'd been dying of thirst because he would have been too proud of himself over it! So good for you for accepting the coffee. How did it feel to drink it in front of him?
Perhaps your T ended on that note not because he was trying to get you to forgive but because of something I tend to do all the time. I want to know how this could have happened to me or why it happened or how could X have possibly done this. And this may have been your T's way, however clumsily, of trying to get you to see why people do these things. My T usually tells me there is no explanation or that my mom was mentally ill or different things. But I could see how what your T said might feel hurtful to you or pressuring you to forgive. Can you clarify with him what he was getting at?
I hate the big black blank. Today in T I was talking about something and I have no idea what it is. I try to remember what we were talking about and I remember just before and just after, but I get to my T saying, "Maybe you could tell her..." and cannot remember AT ALL what he said I could say. It scared me enough so that I even said after he said it that I had no idea what he just said, it was totally gone from my mind. And it feels like it bleeds over into other stuff too. It's your brain's way of telling you it is overwhelmed and to take it easy.
Sleeping is a good thing to do I often find after overwhelming sessions. Can you pet your cat? Knit? Try to do whatever you can to keep your brain engaged and interested in something safe. It helps with the thoughts some, although when these things are so strong, there's nothing I don't think that will make them go away. You just learn how to tolerate them I think. Babble, call your T if it still feels overwhelming later tonight or tomorrow. But remember that was then and this is now. You are safe now. You are taking care of yourself now by going to T and going through all this stuff.
It's ok, Ll. Take care and stay safe please.
sunnydays
Posted by llurpsienoodle on November 28, 2007, at 7:52:23
In reply to Re: trauma processing no triggers » llurpsienoodle, posted by sunnydays on November 27, 2007, at 18:30:18
Thank you all for your concern and for writing back with so many ideas. Babblechat last night helped a lot. Distraction is good. helped me to pull my mind out of the dark stuff. And for future reference, the cocktails were NOT helping. not a good idea at all. Alcohol is a depressant indeed.
I think I'm safe right now. I'm pretending like it's a normal morning and I don't want to think of the trigger.
I'm just a little slower today than usual. The RhinoVirus is on its last legs. Soon I will be over it.
If only psychological ills could follow such a predictable pattern. First I sneeze, then my throat hurts, then my nose runs, then I cough my brains out.
First I'm triggered. then I feel scared. then I remember that I'm not supposed to tell anybody then I remember that telling somebody helps the hurt go away. then I get scared of telling a secret then I try to talk my way out of it. never happened to me. no way. then I'm triggered again. repeat as many times as there are triggers. Throw in some bad dreams and maybe some depressive, self-destructive, dissociative feelings.
bake at 450 until charred crispy.
-Ll
Posted by Llurpsienoodle on November 28, 2007, at 7:57:02
In reply to Re: trauma processing no triggers » llurpsienoodle, posted by sunnydays on November 27, 2007, at 18:30:18
> I wish I knew how to help you Ll. One thing I will say is that I'm proud of you for telling your T. It must have been soooo hard to say. Disjointed chunks is usually how I tell memories the first time - a lot of times I end up having to revisit them and they get more coherent as time goes on. And good for you for accepting the coffee! Mildly funny story - my old T used to always have a bottle of water for himself and at the start of every session he would offer me a bottle of water too. I always said no at first because I was way too anxious or not thirsty. Well, he started making a big deal about how I'd never accept a bottle of water, etc. It got to the point where I wouldn't have accepted one if I'd been dying of thirst because he would have been too proud of himself over it! So good for you for accepting the coffee. How did it feel to drink it in front of him?
felt like we were closer than usual. a little more casual. not quite so formal and forced.
>
> Perhaps your T ended on that note not because he was trying to get you to forgive but because of something I tend to do all the time. I want to know how this could have happened to me or why it happened or how could X have possibly done this. And this may have been your T's way, however clumsily, of trying to get you to see why people do these things. My T usually tells me there is no explanation or that my mom was mentally ill or different things. But I could see how what your T said might feel hurtful to you or pressuring you to forgive. Can you clarify with him what he was getting at?I will try my best. I think I intimidate him sometimes. I will ask him why he always wants me to look at both sides of thins. Why he won't reinforce my role as victim (of course he doesn't want me to think of myself as a victim) why he won't tell me when I'm hurting "it wasn't your fault" I wish he would say that more often.
>
> I hate the big black blank. Today in T I was talking about something and I have no idea what it is. I try to remember what we were talking about and I remember just before and just after, but I get to my T saying, "Maybe you could tell her..." and cannot remember AT ALL what he said I could say. It scared me enough so that I even said after he said it that I had no idea what he just said, it was totally gone from my mind. And it feels like it bleeds over into other stuff too. It's your brain's way of telling you it is overwhelmed and to take it easy.
>
> Sleeping is a good thing to do I often find after overwhelming sessions. Can you pet your cat? Knit? Try to do whatever you can to keep your brain engaged and interested in something safe. It helps with the thoughts some, although when these things are so strong, there's nothing I don't think that will make them go away. You just learn how to tolerate them I think. Babble, call your T if it still feels overwhelming later tonight or tomorrow. But remember that was then and this is now. You are safe now. You are taking care of yourself now by going to T and going through all this stuff.
>I babblechatted and went out for eggnog milkshake. and I knitted too. I think the zyprexa candy helped lots.
> It's ok, Ll. Take care and stay safe please.
(((sd))) you are such a gem. thanks for your ideas
hugs,
-Ll
Posted by Muffled on November 28, 2007, at 13:29:08
In reply to safe?, posted by llurpsienoodle on November 28, 2007, at 7:52:23
Posted by Phillipa on November 28, 2007, at 14:06:45
In reply to Re: trauma processing no triggers » sunnydays, posted by Llurpsienoodle on November 28, 2007, at 7:57:02
Keep up the good work and use candy as needed okay? Phillipa
Posted by llurpsienoodle on November 29, 2007, at 17:35:28
In reply to Re: trauma processing no triggers » Llurpsienoodle, posted by Phillipa on November 28, 2007, at 14:06:45
I had a dream last night. it had the same content as my intrusive thought/flashback.
!(@#$U&%!#@)@!%@
I can't escape it, can I?
Posted by llurpsienoodle on November 29, 2007, at 17:54:46
In reply to bad dream, posted by llurpsienoodle on November 29, 2007, at 17:35:28
Either I have a very low tolerance for psychological discomfort (likely)
or
I am under some stress right now (likely)
This particular memory is really ugly and nasty. I didn't even want to talk about it. I have no way of getting it out of my head now, and no T until next tuesday. pretty heavy stuff. so foul that I wonder how other people can look at me and not know how nasty I feel.
T already tried to fit me in again this week, seeing my discomfort at the end of the last session. it won't work tho.
I feel like I'm gonna lose it.
Emotions
panic
anxiety
sadnessFeelings
chest pains
heavy breathingThoughts
disorganized. scattered. being intruded upon. and then I flinch. but it's not something I can flinch from, 'cause it's in my own head.I go find a safeplace now. bed. under the covers.
go cheer up,
-Ll
Posted by Phillipa on November 29, 2007, at 18:47:39
In reply to Re: bad dream » llurpsienoodle, posted by llurpsienoodle on November 29, 2007, at 17:54:46
Li me too bad dreams all week but mine are due to the surgery. My trick is to go ride my bike and talk to normal folks outside in their yards. You know the ones the ones that at least act normal. Who knows what happens once they are inside but if I were to go to bed or stay in I would think and next thing be on the computer looking up dreaded diseases. Sorry about the dream. Love Phillipa
Posted by Muffled on November 29, 2007, at 20:37:36
In reply to Re: bad dream » llurpsienoodle, posted by llurpsienoodle on November 29, 2007, at 17:54:46
very little sensory stimuli there.
Its warm, dark, VERY safe. The entrance is guarded. Its very quiet. You can hear nothing, cept mebbe water drip now and again. Your brain stops in there. The thots just stop. Magic. They not allowed to be in there. If the thots come you just refocus on how the cave is dark and quiet and warm. You sitting on the ground, which is a little pebbly, but its funny, it don't hurt your bum. You can grab rocks in your hand, and feel them. Some are rough, some are smooth, some are broken off pieces. Sometimes I grab what I think is a rock but it must be dirt or samdstone cuz it crumbles in my hand. The sand is nice too, to just run thru my fingers. And when the water drips, it makes a cool sound, it kinda PLOOPS, and echoes around.
Its is a safe good cave.
You can come there.
Take a break from emotions.
Which WILL ease, but at certain times of day are SO hard to tolerate.
And this is when we lean on others and let them help us.
Cuz it IS hard.
But we can do this. We can get thru this rough part of our journey, and continue on.
Hang in there LL.
You can do this, you been thru it B4, and come out the other side OK.
Take good special care.
M
Posted by llurpsienoodle on November 29, 2007, at 20:46:19
In reply to Re: bad dream » llurpsienoodle, posted by llurpsienoodle on November 29, 2007, at 17:54:46
!)$U*@!$(@$U*!(@$
all my self-destructive coping mechanisms are being stolen from me one by oneno overeating, because I'm doing some cBT dieting skills stuff
no alcohol, becuase it doesn't mix with the meds
no overdoses, because that was one of my promises to T
no cutting, (see above)
so what does that leave me?knitting. angrily. row after miserable row.
pacing
trying not to bite my cuticles
drinking hot tea
babblechatting
cavesitting.
hiding
rocking
earplugs in. noisecancelling headphones on. music LOUD. no body can permeate my place.
meds. as prescribed.thks for helping. muff. you are a sweetiekitty
-Ll
Posted by Muffled on November 29, 2007, at 21:37:57
In reply to trying not to 'act out' triggers » llurpsienoodle, posted by llurpsienoodle on November 29, 2007, at 20:46:19
you can send me a long mutant rambling 15 paqge email if you want.
Just to spend time.
Or write me a story for my ikid.
Can you have a vigorous walk w/hubby?
What bout beating on a pillow?
Or holding an ice cube tight in your hand tight as it melts and really really starts to hurt w/the cold.
Or elastic on wrist, SNAP.
These are some quicks thots
M
Posted by sunnydays on November 29, 2007, at 21:44:16
In reply to Re: bad dream » llurpsienoodle, posted by llurpsienoodle on November 29, 2007, at 17:54:46
Please call your T ll. You are hurting. Just because he can't do an appointment doesn't mean he doesn't have time to call you back. My T says there's always ten minutes in a day to talk to me. Please call and leave a message and say you are struggling with the memory. Please. I'm worried about you.
sunnydays
Posted by Phillipa on November 29, 2007, at 22:38:38
In reply to trying not to 'act out' triggers » llurpsienoodle, posted by llurpsienoodle on November 29, 2007, at 20:46:19
Lurpsie maybe you are trying to do too many things at once let the dieting go it's not that important but your mental health is Love Phillipa
Posted by llurpsienoodle on December 2, 2007, at 21:23:47
In reply to trauma processing no triggers, posted by llurpsienoodle on November 27, 2007, at 15:31:20
I put it aside this weekend, but it's catching up with me again. In my dreams, in my little moments of reverie.
T is there in my dreams too. i feel shame around him. shame, but some relief that he cares.
I want this moment to be in my past. but it keeps on popping into my future.
I dunno.
tomorrow I have T after nearly a week of downplayed psychocrisis. i hope it goes well. will I accept a cup of coffee? maybe i will.-ll
Posted by Phillipa on December 2, 2007, at 22:02:01
In reply to downplayed delayed psychocrisis, posted by llurpsienoodle on December 2, 2007, at 21:23:47
Lurpsie no coffee the caffeine. Phillipa
Posted by ClearSkies on December 3, 2007, at 6:59:34
In reply to downplayed delayed psychocrisis, posted by llurpsienoodle on December 2, 2007, at 21:23:47
Llurpsie, give yourself credit for living up to your end of the bargain here. You didn't act out, or show self destructive tendencies. You got through this period - survived, if not thrived. Good luck today at T's. I have T today too, with lots to talk about as well.
I'll be thinking of you.
CS
Posted by llurpsienoodle on December 3, 2007, at 7:57:33
In reply to Re: downplayed delayed psychocrisis » llurpsienoodle, posted by ClearSkies on December 3, 2007, at 6:59:34
> Llurpsie, give yourself credit for living up to your end of the bargain here. You didn't act out, or show self destructive tendencies.
Well, my eating was not so in-control. There was some emotional eating. I suppose this ranks somewhere in the middle of the coping mechanisms scale where self-destruction is a 10 and nibbling on a fingernail is a 1. Maybe overeating is a 5?
>You got through this period - survived, if not thrived. Good luck today at T's. I have T today too, with lots to talk about as well.
((((((((Clearskies)))))))))
good luck to us both. I will be seeing T at his home office, which always feels more comfy somehow. Except the couch. I told him that the professional office couch is more comfy. he chuckled and said that the home office one is a hideawaybed. why am I telling you this? I dunno.
> I'll be thinking of you.
> CSand I of you.
I think my klonopin is kicking in. I feel very very anxious. a combination of anger towards my dissertation advisor (long story) and trepidation of telling T about my story. it's SO nasty. I just want to crawl into bed and never emerge.
sorry my thoughts are disorganized right now. I'm just rambling on and on.
Posted by muffled on December 3, 2007, at 12:34:19
In reply to trepidation » ClearSkies, posted by llurpsienoodle on December 3, 2007, at 7:57:33
Hang in there Lurpy. Good luck w/T, and remember, baby steps....
Its OK to take a break and work on strengths for a bit.
It OK to just walk away and pretend there's nothing going on for a bit. To shove it away until your a bit stronger.
If you can that is. Sometimes it just seems to boil up and its time to come out.
Sorta like barfing. It just is. There's not stopping it.
But no matter what, remember you the same Lurpy. You just telling your story to better understand how you can deal with some of your behaviours etc. To take the power of the pain away. To bring it into the light where it can be examined and the truth revealed. That it was sh*tty and it was....and .... etc. BUT, it was not the fault of the kid. The kids responses were that of a KID. The adult(s) in the situation were sick, unwell. And thats the way the world is. Bad things DO happen. But what we need to do is deal with them to the best extent that we are able, then for that which we cannot change...learn to let it go.
We cope, we keep going, and the bad patches pass, and we move on until the next challenge.
You can do this Lurpy.
I wrote this for myself as much as anything I think.
Sigh.
I talk a good line, but I don't follow my own advice....
Take care,
Muffled
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