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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 20 of 20. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by wishingstar on July 16, 2006, at 19:29:27
I am considering admitting myself to a local hospital psych unit for a few days or so. I have never been inpatient before, although definitely should have at times. I was wondering if anyone could share their experiences/thoughts/etc regarding that?
I am feeling much worse than I have felt in a long time the last few weeks. I am starting to feel unsafe with myself again (not actively so, but enough that I'm afraid of what tomorrow will look like, you know?)
To admit myself would be a huge burden.. I'd have to take time off work (many issues involved there), lie to a lot of people (or be honest, but lots of problems there too) about where I was, and likely pay a LOT that my insurance would not cover, on top of thousands of dollars of medical bills I already have from non-psych related things. Because I'm not feeling actively suicidal at this moment, and becase of all those issues, I dont know if it's the right decision or not.
I just need a break. I need someone to hear that things arent okay. I need to be able to stop and take care of myself for a minute, and quit trying to keep going like nothing is wrong. Sometimes is very wrong and I just need help.
I'm sorry to post so much recently when I really have not contributed much to others. I am just not at a place right now where I really can produce anything helpful or expressive for other people right now. I really do genuinely care about everyone on here, and I am still reading every message... but Im sorry for being less than an equal member. I promise I will make it up when things stabalize for me a little. Thanks for understanding everyone.
Posted by Racer on July 16, 2006, at 20:08:20
In reply to hospitalization, posted by wishingstar on July 16, 2006, at 19:29:27
>
>
> I'm sorry to post so much recently when I really have not contributed much to others. I am just not at a place right now where I really can produce anything helpful or expressive for other people right now. I really do genuinely care about everyone on here, and I am still reading every message... but Im sorry for being less than an equal member. I promise I will make it up when things stabalize for me a little. Thanks for understanding everyone.I can't offer any suggestions regarding hospitalization, but I can speak to that last paragraph:
There is no great PsychoBabble Balance Sheet that shows how much we've put in or taken out of the pot. There's just PsychoBabble, and the people who post here. Sometimes you need more and ask for it, sometimes you have more to offer and offer it.
From each according to his/her abilities, to each according to her/his needs.
Ain't it great? No apologies needed.
Posted by sleepygirl on July 16, 2006, at 20:25:27
In reply to hospitalization, posted by wishingstar on July 16, 2006, at 19:29:27
I relate to the needing people to hear that things are not okay.
You really don't have to feel guilty about not contributing a lot to others. Just take good care of yourself.
Posted by TherapyGirl on July 16, 2006, at 20:27:22
In reply to hospitalization, posted by wishingstar on July 16, 2006, at 19:29:27
My heart aches for you more than you can know. I have SO been there and done that.
Here's what I can tell you about psych hospitals: they are really good at making it impossible for you to hurt yourself; they are really bad (imo) at actually helping you.
I've been inpatient twice, 10 years ago. In my case, they overloaded me on psychotropic drugs that completely destroyed my ability to function in the actual world. I didn't get better until I took myself off all those drugs. I realize my case is unusual, but I feel compelled to share it with you. In addition, most of the people there were much less able to deal with life than I was. So for the most part I didn't meet people who could be support partners, you know? Also, with the exception of the rec. therapist, everything they had me signed up for (group, individual, arts and crafts, whatever) was completely lame. And finally, it took me 3 years to pay off my portion of the bill.
Sorry to be so negative, but if you have ANY other options for keeping yourself safe, I would take them.
((((((((WishingStar))))))))))))
Posted by Jost on July 16, 2006, at 20:30:40
In reply to hospitalization, posted by wishingstar on July 16, 2006, at 19:29:27
I don't know, wishingstar, but is there anyone you can turn to for support? Even if you need to travel, and stay in another city, and take a few days or week off from your job?
I've never been in a hospital, but I'm worried that you wouldn't find what you're looking for there.
Do you use any ADs or other medications? could you get anything for anxiety?
I wish I knew what to say about this, or what resources were available to you-- only because I'm not sure a hospital would be a good, nurturing environment-- & that, more than anything, might be what you need. It might not be what a hospital is good at providing.
Is there anyone or anywhere else?
So sorry that you're not feeling safe--- :(
Jost
Posted by wishingstar on July 16, 2006, at 20:56:36
In reply to Re: hospitalization » wishingstar, posted by Jost on July 16, 2006, at 20:30:40
I'm feeling really hopeless when it comes to other options right now.
As I've posted about, I'm seeing one T temporarily while I'm out of town, and have my regular T at home. I'll be back home in mid-August, although I dont know that going back will help (or hurt) much. I'm glad I have my Ts, but I can only afford once a week, and it just isnt cutting it at all right now.
Meds are a huge issue I finally gave up on a few weeks ago. My insurance will not cover the doctors visits or the meds, so there's no way I can afford a regular pdoc. I have called every agency I can find both in my hometown and my current city (right outside DC) and cannot find any place where I can be seen on a sliding scale without leaving my therapist and switching to one at their center, which is just not an option right now. I've also tried the free clinic, community service boards, etc. My university (I'm a grad student) has a counseling center and a contract with the local psych clinic to do free med management, but will not take me as a client... they require you have a therapist with them to get the med management, but because its brief therapy, will not allow me to have a therapist there. I've tried. I spoke with the director of the center to try to get around this, but no luck. It all makes me very mad.
Unfortunately my job is only 8 weeks long and I am the head teacher, so taking off time is just not feasible unless I was hospitalized or otherwise unable to make it. Time off is causing a lot of drama with the administration anyway right now, so asking could likely stir up a lot of trouble. I have thought of talking to the school director (who I know fairly well) and telling him what's really going on, but I know there's nothing he can do, so I'm not sure it's really worth it.
I think youre probably right that I wouldnt get what I'm hoping for in the hospital, at least in part. I know it wouldnt be warm and nurturing. I guess I've done such a good job of pushing away any close friends I had a year or so ago that I really dont have many supports anymore.
The biggest mistake I've made was accepting this job which required me to stay with my parents for 8 weeks. But too late now. There are only 4 weeks left, but this feels like an eternity.
I know you're right that it isnt the best solution and other supports would be better. I guess I'm just feeling awfully lost and helpless right now.
Posted by wishingstar on July 16, 2006, at 20:57:05
In reply to hospitalization, posted by wishingstar on July 16, 2006, at 19:29:27
Posted by wishingstar on July 16, 2006, at 20:59:54
In reply to Re: hospitalization » wishingstar, posted by TherapyGirl on July 16, 2006, at 20:27:22
Your experience is pretty similar to what I've heard from many people. No real help really occurs. In a way, I sort of dont care whether anything gets fixed or not right now.. I just need a break. I need to feel safe and "watched" even if it's not in a warm, caring way. But in truth, will I hurt myself seriously if I'm not watched? Likely, no... so it's probably not the best choice.
I appreciate hearing your experience and recommendations.. I know you're right. I just wish I knew what a better option was right now.
Posted by wishingstar on July 16, 2006, at 21:01:58
In reply to hospitalization, posted by wishingstar on July 16, 2006, at 19:29:27
I know this is true, but I cant help but feel bad about it. I am terribly afraid of coming off as needy or selfish... I just dont want others to think I dont care about them too. Thank you.
Posted by Jost on July 16, 2006, at 21:14:50
In reply to Re: hospitalization » wishingstar, posted by TherapyGirl on July 16, 2006, at 20:27:22
Wishingstar, I'm going to think about this more. Maybe the weekend at home has been hard. Maybe you'll be a little better if you can get through tonight?
Do you have a favorite book that you used to love? maybe you could get that out and reread it. I have a few, and sometimes I take one down, and let the narrative carry me away.
I can't believe this isn't a way through this.
One thing I know, though, is that friends will be there, even if you pushed them away. Is there any friend you think about, or would like to talk to? anyone you were really close to?
If you can't think of someone, I'll still be thinking, because your well-being is worth your doing what you need. I wouldn't want you to disrupt your job, because you probably wouldn't feel right about it, and it might have ramifications afterward for your own peace of mind.
Sometimes when I'm hopeless I can only think of closed doors, but there might be one that's ajar. Maybe you're not seeing that one?
Jost
Posted by Racer on July 16, 2006, at 22:24:48
In reply to Re: hospitalization » TherapyGirl, posted by wishingstar on July 16, 2006, at 20:59:54
>I just need a break. I need to feel safe and "watched" even if it's not in a warm, caring way.
That sounds as though you want to feel loved and nurtured, which is pretty much universal. And it also makes me think maybe your parents aren't providing that? Sometimes, for me, thinking about the loving and nurturing I've gotten from my mother over the years makes me feel pretty much as though a psych hospital -- heck, a velcro wall -- would be a pretty good choice.
So, four more weeks at this job, and then you go home. You can do that -- and I'd say the more you stay out of your parents' house, the better you'll be able to get through. Can you invite another teacher out for coffee? To see a comedy show? A band? Can you go to the library and read up on bonobos or Ann Radcliffe? Can you hang out in your classroom and either tutor students or work on lesson plans? Can you journal? Can you get through by pulling a quilt over your head and turning on the TV?
>But in truth, will I hurt myself seriously if I'm not watched? Likely, no... so it's probably not the best choice.
Yep, I'd say you've hit the nail on the head there. I have been in psych hospitals, both voluntary and involuntary, and it's not a pleasant place to be. What's more, even if you go in voluntarily, they may not allow you to leave quite so easily. You may not have the freedom to say, 'Whoops, this ain't what I signed up for...'
When you get home, can you check with those agencies again? From what you've written here, it doesn't sound as though you're feeling heard by your regular T, so switching to a T at one of those agencies where you could see a pdoc for meds, too? I know you said that your school center turned you down, but could you try again? Say that you need short term counseling for adjustment to this eight week job you just finished and staying with your parents? Or something else?
Again, I've had a very bad experience with a T, and it took much, much longer to get over the damage than it took to cause it. Truly, I'm not over it now, and it's been more than two years. If you're not feeling heard and validated in therapy, something is very, very wrong. It's true that she doesn't have to say that you're right about everything, she is supposed to challenge you to find new and more effective ways to negotiate your way through this world, but it's still important that you feel heard first.
Good luck.
Posted by ElaineM on July 16, 2006, at 22:57:16
In reply to Re: hospitalization » wishingstar, posted by Racer on July 16, 2006, at 22:24:48
Wishingstar: You sound so despondent, and desperate. To consider admitting yourself to a hospital is a big deal - you must be hurting terribly. I agree with everyone else that, unless you become actively suicidal, that you should avoid it. Does your hospital offer outpatient treatment? Would that be accepted the same way with your employer? I've mentioned the benefits of my inpatient stays, but all but one were on specific, ED units. The time I was forced to go to a regular psych. hospital was absolutely terrifying. I, too, would reiterate that it's definately not the place to go to feel cared for.
Are there any support groups you could join in the time being -- like drop in self-help groups. You can usually search them on the internet for each city. And you can go to as many or view meetings as you need. To be in structured, regular-therapy-like setting. They are free, and I think it would be closer to what you have in mind than a hospital.
My university is very accomodating when it comes to servicing undergrads, grads, and alumni. It makes me so upset that they would turn you away. I confided in my TA about all the difficulties I've been going through (not the T stuff) and how hard I was finding it to cope. She helped so much. Could you talk to your academic advisor. At my university they routinely intervene in crisis situations in terms of setting up support systems. Perhaps he/she could get more strings pulled at the counselling center. I would even lie when I went, or bend the truth: if they only treat short-term patients, then present them with a short-term problem. Say anything. Do what you need to to look after yourself. My school pays for a high percentage of medication too. I really think you should get someone else at your school on your side.
Some schools even offer free peer mentoring, with psych grad students. If you didn't have any friends you could talk to, that could at least be something. See how your appointment back home goes (it's still coming right?) Maybe it will help, even in a small way.
You're getting so close to making it through your stay at your parents house. Half way! And then you'll be back in your own environment and be able to deal with your T options so much better. And you can post as many times as you want here.
You can make it. (((((ws)))))
thinking of you, EL
Posted by wishingstar on July 17, 2006, at 12:13:28
In reply to Re: hospitalization » Racer, posted by ElaineM on July 16, 2006, at 22:57:16
I think I have really exhausted my options at my school. My advisor does know my situation and although I do confide in her occasionally, she is not very available and doesnt know of any other options either. She actually contacted the counseling center for me as well and that didnt work either. I am actually a psych grad student myself, and there is no mentoring program in our department except for undergrads. I actually work as one of the mentors for the undergrads (can you believe that?) I have also spoken to the woman who directs this mentoring program but again, with little luck. I have tried the counseling center multiple times and contacted several people there directly (where I thought I might have connections) and it just hasnt been succesful. I cant imagine another try would be any different. I did consider lying or taking only a small part of "everything" for brief counseling but I decided with my T that trying to split myself like that would probably not be the best idea for me. Then again, this isnt good either, so maybe I should reconsider it..
I did participate in group for a time a few years ago and it was helpful then. I'm not sure I'm really at a place where group would be beneficial for me right now though. I'm having a hard time even talking to my T about anything real, and I'm not sure that the "I'm not alone" experience of group would really help me right now. Alone (in my situation) is one thing I actually dont feel recently, if that's a positive.
I hope that getting away from my parents house will help, but I'm not sure that this is just a problem related to them. I hope it is.
Thanks for your ideas. I dont mean to sound so negative. I'm just really frustrated and feeling very helpless - I feel like I've tried everything! I will think about the counseling center idea again.
Posted by vwoolf on July 17, 2006, at 12:13:39
In reply to hospitalization, posted by wishingstar on July 16, 2006, at 19:29:27
Wishing Star, I don't often post here, but this a subject I have thought lots about, so I'm breaking my rule.
I have been hospitalized twice, both times voluntarily, both times many years ago. Like you I needed to get away from my parents. I didn't think I could cope any longer.
I remember very little about the first hospital. I have since learnt that it is a very small psychiatric unit in a general state hospital that only takes 16 patients for three months at a time each. It is closed off from the world and very protected - at no time are you out of sight of a member of staff. There are more staff than patients. It is highly therapeutic - you see a therapist every day, a psychiatrist once a week, there is group every day, as well as OT, meditation groups, breathing exercises etc etc. In other words it is quite hard work. Only high functioning patients are accepted on the programme. When you leave you go into a day care programme.
Second time round I went into the admissions ward of a large state psychiatric hospital, which is one of those huge Victorian buildings with towers and gargoyles set in a huge park. This was very different. It was a very heterogeneous group of people, many of whom were actively psychotic. We sat around and smoked all day. The main purpose of the institution seemed to be to stop people from committing suicide. There were bars on the windows and no doors on the toilets. It smelled sour, of deep depression and onions and urine. I spent a couple of months there. I saw a therapist twice in that time. Then I was released. One day I was in, the next day out. Boom!
Yet strangely, of the two is the second one that I yearn for. Often when things get rough I ask my t to send me to hospital. She says I can go if I wish, but on two conditions: not to the second one, and it must be my decision. If I feel that I can't manage then I must admit myself. Then she asks me if that is what I want.
I have always said no. It's funny, simply knowing that I can go if I want to takes away the desire, and gives me the strength to carry on. Also, knowing that she can see my pain, that she acknowledges it makes me feel stronger. I so long for dependency on the one hand, to be cared for and nurtured. But on the other I long for autonomy. I want to be an adult. By putting the choice in my hands, she places me in an adult situation and my choice is for strength and growth rather than weakness and regression.
Because in a sense that is what the second kind of hospital encourages. Passiveness and dependency. Once you have been there you understand that it is not satisfying in any way. But you keep longing for it because the opposite implies hard work and growth towards maturity.
Although I sometimes long for it, I would not go back there. If I were desperate, I would go to the first kind of hospital again. But not the second.
There is also another thing that would stop me. Once you have been hospitalized you feel as if you really are mentally ill, really are mad. You carry a stigma in your own mind. I have never told anyone about my hospitalizations, because I have always been filled with shame about them. Only in the last year have I begun to be able to integrate them in some way, and have started telling select friends about what it was like.
I am sure that there is a place for hospitalization. I am sure that at times life can simply become too much. I am not sure that I would be alive today if I hadn't been to those hospitals. Yet I would make it my last choice. I would try and exhaust all other avenues first.
I am sorry things are so rough for you. It must be hard to have to appear competent and in control when you are so full of despair inside. The teaching world is also not very sympathetic towards mental illness. Try and hold out for the four weeks if you can. It is not a long time. But if you must go, make sure it is a place that will open up possibilities for you, not close them down. And then go and give yourself up to it.
My thoughts are with you
A warm hug.
vee
Posted by wishingstar on July 17, 2006, at 12:25:53
In reply to Re: hospitalization » wishingstar, posted by Racer on July 16, 2006, at 22:24:48
You're right, my parents definitely dont provide any love or nurturing. In part, that is exactly what I'm looking for. That's probably part of what I've been looking for from my T for a long time as well. I think there's also a part of me though that just doesnt want to have to worry about being safe - doesnt want to have the debate or the possibility even there - for a time. I'm so tired and worn down from the constant battle in my head.
I do try to stay out of my parents house as much as possible by going out to do errands, out with friends, etc. Unfortunatley I dont really have a lot of friends, but I do spend a lot of time roaming the mall and similar, just to be out of the house. It seems to help. Distancing myself from them physically (and emotionally) is a trick I learned in high school and it has served me well (sometimes too well) ever since.
I wrote a little about trying to make up a problem or pick a small piece of everything to present for brief therapy at the center in my post to ElaineM. I have talked to my T about doing that, but we decided it probably wouldnt be the best thing for me. Then again, this isnt working either, so maybe it needs to be reconsidered. The trick would be to present well enough for brief counseling but badly enough to need meds. If they asked if I ever felt suicidal or had a history of SI, I would have to lie or be referred out (as I have been previously).
If I do end up leaving my current T then yes, I may find one at a center where I can also get meds. The only problem with that is that all the centers that do that are at least an hour away. I live in a small town and there is only one mental health center for the community, and I worked as a case manager for them for awhile, so being a patient would not be an option. But driving the hour would probably be worth it. If I do leave my current T, that is what I will do, but right now I'm trying to salvage my relationship with her. I know it sounds like I'm just full of excuses.. maybe I am. I dont know. I see my regular T this thursday and I'm going to talk about the issues I have with her, so that will probably answer those questions of whether or not it's salvagable.
I really dont think going home will make me feel any better. I dont think it's really related to being with my parents as much as self-esteem and other issues right now. Home has another whole set of issues which I voluntarily got myself into a year ago and am now paying the price for for another year. Why do I do these things to myself? Whine whine whine.
Posted by wishingstar on July 17, 2006, at 12:37:44
In reply to Re: hospitalization -- wishingstar, posted by Jost on July 16, 2006, at 21:14:50
Thanks for the thoughts jost. I did get through the night (obviously) and I'm at work right now. I always feel a little better at work.. preschoolers are a natural anti-depressant I think.
I need to make another trip to the library. I checked out a few recently but have been trouble getting through more than a page or 2 without losing my concentration. It's really frustrating as I do really love to read, but it's just hard right now. I'm going to try to find some more attention-grabbing books and hopefully find something that will do it right now. Reading is always a good escape.
I know you're right about friends. Unfortunately, my closest friend (who I havent talked to in a month or longer) cannot understand depression and just isnt someone I can talk to. He is 15 years older than me and cannot see past how lucky he feels I am for being so young and x, y, and z and therefore, should just wait until its sunny again and then things will be just fine (I wish!!) The others.. I guess I have no excuse. I think they probably would listen and would care, if I reached out.. it's just hard, you know? I wont try to give excuses or explain it because I know you all understand. And I know I just need to do it. I know.
There probably are doors ajar that I'm not seeing, you're right. I wish I knew what they were. The possibility of paying a pdoc out of pocket and just putting it all on a credit card has been there since the beginning, so I guess it isnt true that there arent any options, but I really would hate to do that. I dont need any more debt than I already have. But it's an option.
I really appreciate your understanding and thoughts. Really. Why does it have to be so difficult?
Posted by Jost on July 17, 2006, at 22:00:04
In reply to Re: hospitalization -- wishingstar » Jost, posted by wishingstar on July 17, 2006, at 12:37:44
I hope your day and night have been better. Preschoolers must be bouyant and lively companions--
I think the group might be worth a try--if you're up to it. Just to have some friendly faces, and a feeling of connection.
Don't give up-- if you get through a few more days, you may find some better feelings.
I know you know-- and can figure this out, better than any of us -- but if I make a suggestion or two-- I know they may not feel right, and you've probably thought of them yourself-- but it might jog you just a bit in a good direction.
So if you do have another good impulse, as you did in calling Anne (are you still going to see her?)-- maybe you'll be able to take the next step, whatever that is-- even getting one of those page-turners-- despite its being possibly a little over-the-top.
Jost
Posted by Racer on July 18, 2006, at 0:25:50
In reply to Re: hospitalization -- wishingstar, posted by Jost on July 17, 2006, at 22:00:04
For mindless and entertaining and just generally fun Page Turning, may I recommend "St Dale," by Sharyn McCrumb? It's about a pilgrimage to the sites of Dale Earnhardt's life, by a mystery writer -- although there's no mystery in it, really. She's a great story teller, though, and it's a fun book.
Or, if Dale Don't Do It for you, you might like "Songcatcher," same author, just a great story...
I do hope you feel better, Wishingstar, and that you survive all this to find yourself feeling much better than you thought you could.
Posted by Jost on July 18, 2006, at 4:14:58
In reply to Re: recommendation -- wishingstar » Jost, posted by Racer on July 18, 2006, at 0:25:50
I got the book. I feel kinda guilty, ordering a book for $.01 plus postage. But-- I"m cheap. So I did it.
thanks for the recommendation.
Jost
Posted by llrrrpp on July 22, 2006, at 15:24:28
In reply to Re: hospitalization -- wishingstar » Jost, posted by wishingstar on July 17, 2006, at 12:37:44
> Thanks for the thoughts jost. I did get through the night (obviously) and I'm at work right now. I always feel a little better at work.. preschoolers are a natural anti-depressant I think.
>
> I need to make another trip to the library. I checked out a few recently but have been trouble getting through more than a page or 2 without losing my concentration. It's really frustrating as I do really love to read, but it's just hard right now. I'm going to try to find some more attention-grabbing books and hopefully find something that will do it right now. Reading is always a good escape.Since reading is difficult for you right now (I've been there too- it's AWFUL) how about watching movies? You mention that you go to the mall a lot- maybe you can go to the movie theater too. It's a good place to stay safe for a couple of hours. It's plenty distracting- in a good way :)
I play with preschoolers too. I TOTALLY agree that they are a wonderful anti-depressant. If you're not too exhausted, can you work extra hours in the evening? baby-sitting? or volunteering to read stories to kids in the hospital, or teach swimming lessons at the pool?
I'm so sorry you're feeling so terribly. I was at this point a few months ago. It was terrifying. At one point I was terrified that my T would recommend hospitalization. A few weeks later, I was actually hoping that it would be presented to me as an option. I was really disappointed when T told me that if I went to the hospital I might be safe overnight or for a few days (that's how long such emergency hospitalizations usually last) but that it wouldn't help me get better. I was devastated. I just wanted the hurt to end. And now I find out that there is no easy way out. T actually told me "If you think you are depressed now, just wait until you're in the hospital". ugh. That was so cruel. Now I understand better. He was able to recognize that I was safe, even though I was hurting SO bad that I didn't recognize it myself.
If you need meds, perhaps paying out of pocket is not a bad option?
If you need to get away, there are much nicer destinations for your money than a psych ward. And the photos will be nicer too.
((((wishingstar))))
hang in there.
-ll
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