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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 9 of 9. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by annierose on August 21, 2005, at 17:12:29
Been thinking about you. I know it's been a tough time lately. Lots going on in therapy. And sending kids off to college. You've been on my mind and I hope all is well.
Posted by daisym on August 21, 2005, at 19:10:26
In reply to Dasiy - how are you doing?, posted by annierose on August 21, 2005, at 17:12:29
Thanks for thinking of me Annie. I keep thinking I'll post but everything I write sounds mundane or whiny, so I erase it. The kid doesn't leave for 3 weeks, so I'm pretending like it isn't happening.
Things in therapy are hard, and yet I feel curiously detached this weekend. Like there was so much emotional overwhelm that I have to go cold again. Or maybe it is too much and I'm pulling back? I'm not sure.
I've been dreaming again and taking the dreams into therapy has been scary. There are parts and pieces of me that haven't been there before, like a baby. My therapist said it was interesting that I was bringing my infant self into therapy via the dreams. But as much as I want to talk about the dreams, when I start, I get overwhelmed with body sensations and pain and I feel sick to my stomach and my head hurts. It's just too hard!
We did attempt to give "little Daisy" her own session on Wednesday. Objectively, it was fascinating. We started with a journal piece that could only have been written about age 7 or so and worked from there. In allowing myself to drift back and really see and describe things I came to realize that I've held back whole parts of the stories. I kept saying, "I've told you this" and he would say, "not this part, not this way." There are a lot of "if I never had" or "I should haves" here -- culpability that is deeply felt. I told my therapist that I hate the look on his face when I tell these stories. He asked what the look was and I answered, "sadness. Some anger but mostly sadness." He nodded his head and said he isn't angry at me at all, but rather at my dad and more importantly, he feels sad because it is sad. But he said he can handle his own sadness, it wasn't for me to worry about.
But I do worry about it... I worry a lot. And I have no idea what to talk about tomorrow. Every subject feels dangerous. Any suggestions? The weather seems safe.
I hope you aren't sorry you checked on me. It was very sweet.
Hugs from me,
Daisy
Posted by annierose on August 21, 2005, at 22:48:20
In reply to Re: Dasiy - how are you doing? » annierose, posted by daisym on August 21, 2005, at 19:10:26
Dasiy -
I'm so glad I asked. You are doing such hard work. I know. I keep saying that. But bringing in your baby self, you can't go much further than that. It's so important.
I brought in a dream this week. I think bringing dreams into therapy is a little scary. It's material that we are not quite ready to deal with, so the dream brings it to our therapist. And then together, we work on de-coding the information, like a puzzle.
I have experienced some body sensations in therapy before too. It brought me right back to 7th grade. I always had stomach aches, nausea, etc. So much so, the doctors ran tons of tests (I missed lots of school). In the end, the doctor told my mother, with me in the room, that I may be experiencing some depression, and should seek counseling. My mom used this information as punishment. Inside, I was thrilled at the possiblity to talk to someone. Instead, my mom threatened to take me to therapy if I didn't go back to school. I was a good kid. I went back to school, didn't want to cause trouble. So when a few weeks ago in therapy, I had that instant nausea sensation, it freaked me out. My T asked what could she do to help, if there was anything she should do differently. I didn't know how to respond. My mom never asked questions like that, how to help.
What type of sensations do you experience? Do you share them with your T? Is he able to help you? And can they help us with that? I don't know.
I agree with your T that you do not have to worry about him. We all feel sadness for what little Daisy endured. It is sad.
I think it's okay to go into tomorrow's session with nothing to say. Those are usually the most productive sessions. Your unconscious will bring the material. And I know you have the courage to speak the words (I'm learning this courage from you and other babblers all the time).
My daughter is only going into 6th grade, and college seems like some far off event in the not too distant future. It will be here before I know it. Three weeks and 2 of your sons are off? or just one? Imagine how the dynamics will change for the child left at home, and for mom and dad. Adjustment all around. Very difficult.
Let me know how tomorrow's session goes. Sharing my dream with my T surged my intensity need ... and I don't like it one bit! No siree. But I'm anxious to go to keeping working on this strange relationship we call "therapy".
Annierose
Posted by daisym on August 22, 2005, at 0:02:05
In reply to Re: Dasiy - how are you doing? » daisym, posted by annierose on August 21, 2005, at 22:48:20
You ask lots of good questions, Annie. I don't know if our therapists can help with the body sensations other than to normalize and interpret them, like most other things. When I was feeling sick, he reminded me to breathe and to just give it a minute. He quietly, very, very quietly said, "this means we are near something important, but we don't have to know what yet, we can inch up to it together." Knowing he won't rush in with an idea makes me feel safer. And he wants me to tell him about the body sensations, just like I tell him about my thoughts and feelings. When I told him my thighs were tight and there was pain in my "lower parts" he asked me if I was protecting this area, clenching to defend. He reminded me that I didn't need to, I was safe, that this was old and while what I was feeling was real, this time I could control it and consciously relax these muscles. It took a few minutes but it worked. He almost always follows up body memories by asking if I can feel little Daisy hanging around and if she has anything she'd like to tell him. I make this face at him and he now knows this means, "yes but I was't going to tell you." I've come to think that therapy is a little like dancing, or sparring, with a long-time partner. They know your moves, know when you are really on and know when you are distracted. And you them. I guess that is one of the benefits of frequent sessions.
I'm glad you shared your dream with your therapist. But I do know about that intense neediness that comes into play. Do you think it is because we feel like we have to check in about what we told them? I always wonder if he shakes his head and sighs after I leave. Or forgets me totally as the next client comes in and he starts thinking about their issues. Mostly I just want to check that he hasn't disappeared into the sunset...there is not real crisis going on. So I'm containing things between sessions, not calling. It is so hard, but I'm making it through. Still, I'm glad tomorrow is Monday.
Posted by annierose on August 22, 2005, at 15:54:39
In reply to Re: Dasiy - how are you doing? » annierose, posted by daisym on August 22, 2005, at 0:02:05
Dasiy -
I'm in a semi-bad state of mind right now, I probably shouldn't be posting. But here I go, forgive me if I'm not myself.
My T tried to explained that neediness feeling, as a form of anxiety, of not really knowing how she feels (even though I do intellectually know she cares about me). I told her about a line from the book you reccommended way back, "A Shining Afflication". Annie Rogers mentions that the feeling we are most afraid of has already happened. That resonated with me. My T reminded me that it's the memory of being unloved and unengaged as a child that makes me uncomfortable with people I'm close to. In other words, what are the "really" thinking/feeling about me? ... it a constant question I harbor inside myself. (I really thought the book was powerful, btw. Loved it, and would like to read it again in another year.)
D - "Do you think it is because we feel like we have to check in about what we told them? I always wonder if he shakes his head and sighs after I leave"
For me, "check in" means check with how my T is feeling about me. Does she still care after I told her this or that? Is she still on my side? I don't think either of our T's shake their heads or sighs ... at least not on a regular basis.
Yes, it is a dance. And today, she didn't want dance with me. Very odd session. I was so happy time was up. I told her I felt very defensive today. I hate feeling defensive. I just couldn't feel her today. She wasn't there, although she walked, talked, smiled. Aarrgh!! I want to be a 2 year old and throw a tantrum.
I hope your session went better. Let me know how it went.
Posted by Dinah on August 22, 2005, at 16:57:34
In reply to Re: Dasiy - how are you doing? » daisym, posted by annierose on August 22, 2005, at 15:54:39
I hate feeling like they aren't there. :( I usually point it out, and sometimes my therapist acknowledges it and brings himself back to the room, or explains that he's off his best. Sometimes he asks me if maybe it's me who isn't there.
I hope things go better for you next time. A bad session can put me in a rotten mood.
Posted by annierose on August 22, 2005, at 18:20:25
In reply to Re: Dasiy - how are you doing? » annierose, posted by Dinah on August 22, 2005, at 16:57:34
Dinah -
I did tell her that she wasn't herself, and I was feeling defensive. I did notice she soften her tone and was "trying" to reach me. I wanted to say, "I can't feel that you're there." But I didn't. I did wonder if it could be me. I don't think so. I was excited to see her, I even shared a few photos of my family vacation (never done so in the past). I was feeling open.
I see her again tomorrow. And for the first time in a long long time, I just don't want to go. I need to. I need to shake this crummy mood.
My daughter just agreed to go for a long walk with me. Maybe that will help.
Posted by Dinah on August 22, 2005, at 18:51:23
In reply to Re: Dasiy - how are you doing? » Dinah, posted by annierose on August 22, 2005, at 18:20:25
Posted by daisym on August 23, 2005, at 0:58:14
In reply to Re: Dasiy - how are you doing? » daisym, posted by annierose on August 22, 2005, at 15:54:39
I hate when I can't "feel" him -- I tell him when that happens and we try to figure out why. Almost always it is me, but still he works hard to figure out how to help me reconnect. I get panicky if we haven't figured it out by the time the session is over.
I've felt withdrawn and disconnected all weekend so I expected to feel that way during the session today. But we managed to find a topic (we usually do) that took us all the way to the end. It was different than what we were talking about last week and he did ask if I was afraid to go back there. I said I just needed a break from it. He reminded me that when I ignore stuff it gets worse but he let it go.
I hope you have a better session tomorrow and whatever is in the way takes you someplace productive. I wish we could read their minds sometimes. Of course, I'm glad mostly that I can't. :0
This is the end of the thread.
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