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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 24 of 24. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Aphrodite on August 30, 2004, at 18:01:56
I did not consciously choose to go to a male therapist. In fact, the second on my list of people to call was a female therapist, but I liked the first one, and I stuck with him. It's been up and down, and sometimes I attribute it to gender, and sometimes I think it's just the dynamics of any two human beings. However, as I move into more traumatic material, am crying more, and have to discuss sexual matters, I wonder if a female would be better.
What do you guys think? Was it a conscious decision for you?
It could be that I am just subconsciously looking for an "out," because this work is getting very hard. It probably has nothing to do with the fact that he is man. That said, I'd drop him like a hot potato if Gardenergirl was available nearby;)
Posted by caraher on August 30, 2004, at 18:42:27
In reply to Male or female -- does it matter?, posted by Aphrodite on August 30, 2004, at 18:01:56
It certainly makes a difference, and for some it may even be the difference between "working" and "not working," but I hesitate to generalize. I've seen a psychiatrist (female) and two psychologists (1 male, 1 female) and "interviewed" one other psychologist (female). I'm male. I never consciously made it a part of my decision. I think I probably do prefer a female therapist but not to the point that I have ever made that a conscious preference. It's at best a secondary consideration for me.
If you're aware of significant sexual issues you need to deal with it makes this aspect more important (obviously, I think)...
Posted by gardenergirl on August 30, 2004, at 19:01:38
In reply to Male or female -- does it matter?, posted by Aphrodite on August 30, 2004, at 18:01:56
Awww, you made my day. Although that's a little odd, because it's your pain that did it. :(
I didn't have much choice about male or female, I don't think. I got the person who did the intake, which turned out to be a great match. I don't know if I would have been given the opportunity to change within the center if I decided I couldn't work with him.
I think after a year, I would feel comfortable talking with him about sexual issues, and in fact a couple times we have. It's embarrassing, but I think it would be with a female T, too. It's just not the same as talking with a close girlfriend.
Perhaps you can talk with him about whether or not you feel comfortable about going in this painful direction? He may have some insight into it that helps.
Warmly,
gg
Posted by Dinah on August 30, 2004, at 19:43:52
In reply to Male or female -- does it matter?, posted by Aphrodite on August 30, 2004, at 18:01:56
I suspect it's no coincidence that my therapist is male, although I didn't set out for it to be that way. But part of the way therapy works for me is that he makes me feel safe, and I think that may be partly a function of his gender. For me anyway.
But the mental health professionals I have most destested have also been men. Abrasive offensive men. And I would have liked the EMDR woman therapist fine if she hadn't made an unfortunate remark. So maybe it's just more of the mesh than it is the gender. A woman would have to be strong enough to inspire trust, and a man would have to be soft enough to inspire trust. So an Alan Alda type man would be ideal for me?
I never have any problem talking about sex. Well, not about sex in general. And the stuff I do have trouble talking about has to do with me, not his gender, and would be the same no matter who he was. I don't really see him as *that* kind of man.
But that's just me.
Posted by daisym on August 30, 2004, at 19:54:41
In reply to Re: Male or female -- does it matter? » Aphrodite, posted by gardenergirl on August 30, 2004, at 19:01:38
Before I was doing this work, I would have said working with a female would be best. That was based on instinct and some of the readings I've done. Now I can't imagine doing it with anyone but MY therapist...male or female. He is really sensitive around the sa stuff...and when we've discussed "grown up" sexual stuff, he is so matter of fact that it was pretty hard to stay uncomfortable for long.
I think if I had a female therapist, I might be more reluctant to show how hard it is for me to cope with all of this. It is a pride thing, professional woman to professional woman, etc. Throw in my need to live up to my mother's standards...it explains a lot why I ran from the two female therapists I met first.
It comes down to trust. Trust that they won't hurt you or lead you down memory lane too fast. And my therapist is always conscious of the fact that telling is retraumatizing in some ways, so he never wants me to feel like he is voyeuristic about it in any way. He will circle back for details but never presses and he is careful to use terminology that reflects mine.
*sigh* I wish I could tell you that talking to a woman would make it easier. I'm afraid the truth is that the whole thing is just plain hard. Telling anyone what happened is painful, embarrassing and is likely to produce huge amounts of fear. It literally feels like your insides have shattered because the emotions that were trapped are released with such fury. I couldn't believe (still can't) how knocked down I felt (feel) when we work on specific memories.
I think you've invested a lot in building a relationship with your therapist. Is there something that makes you think he can't handle it? Or is he reacting in an over-protective way? Or are the words just impossible to force out?
Take especially good care of yourself right now.
Daisy
Posted by thewrite1 on August 30, 2004, at 23:18:20
In reply to Re: Male or female -- does it matter?, posted by daisym on August 30, 2004, at 19:54:41
I knew I wanted a female. I had a male T before and I don't feel I made any progress with him. I don't think it was his fault so much as my reluctance to talk to him about things.
Posted by tryingtobewise on August 30, 2004, at 23:30:30
In reply to Male or female -- does it matter?, posted by Aphrodite on August 30, 2004, at 18:01:56
Well, I started with a male, and he was ok, but I eventually switched to doing both therapy and med management with my female psych MD. Quite honestly I think the male T was "smoother", always knew what to say & what to ask. However, I appreciate the female T so much more because she is not perfect, her office is a mess, yet I still feel I can "model" myself after her. (Ok -- major transference thing there I know.) Having no effective female role models in my life, I really need that.
I will also add, that the few times sex has come up it has been just as difficult with the female T as with the male. Maybe even moreso, because as I said he was very smooth & calm and made everything seem so easy to talk about.
Hang in there.
:)
Posted by lucy stone on August 31, 2004, at 8:34:19
In reply to Male or female -- does it matter?, posted by Aphrodite on August 30, 2004, at 18:01:56
I knew I wanted a man, and I knew I wanted my T to be older than me. I am a professional but have not achieved as much professionally as I could have, primarily because of the problems that led me to seek therapy in the first place. I have major envy issues with other professional women that I thought would get in the way. My T has been a good fit and although talking about sex is a bit awkard it has gotten easier. I think it would have been harder with a woman. As my therapist tells me, though, sooner or later the issues come out even if we try to avoid them. I once asked my T what his wife did, hoping to find out that she was not as accomplished as I am. I found out that not only is she a professional, she is very, very successful in her field. It was devestating for me, but opened up that area in my therapy and I had to address it (a good thing).
Posted by Miss Honeychurch on August 31, 2004, at 12:02:01
In reply to Male or female -- does it matter?, posted by Aphrodite on August 30, 2004, at 18:01:56
I consciously chose a male T because the LCSW I saw before him was way too chummy for my taste. I thought I would like the hugs etc., but found I wanted strict boundaries and a formal setting (not sure why). I thought a male would be less likely to have all the personal items in his office or ask me if I thought he should get a boob job (which the LCSW did!!!).
I also wanted a daddy. I wanted a male authority figure, something I have never had in my life. We have yet to talk about sex however and I'm hoping that never comes up!
Posted by gardenergirl on August 31, 2004, at 18:37:31
In reply to Re: Male or female -- does it matter?, posted by Miss Honeychurch on August 31, 2004, at 12:02:01
> I thought a male would be less likely to have all the personal items in his office or ask me if I thought he should get a boob job (which the LCSW did!!!).
>OH MY DOG! I can't believe she did that! Wowsa. Glad you got out of that situation. By the way, what was your response? I think I'd still be dusting my jaw off after picking it up off of the floor.
gg
Posted by alexandra_k on August 31, 2004, at 19:58:59
In reply to Male or female -- does it matter?, posted by Aphrodite on August 30, 2004, at 18:01:56
Personally, I prefer to work with males myself. I think it is because I prefer the falling in love kind of transference over the I hate your guts kind of transference. One could consider an Oedipus complex, but I think it is more to do with my mother being my primary abuser, and my father being distant and avoidant so that I kind of longed for him and wished I could be closer.
I know it is just transference, (just, ha!) but it is still nicer to love (even if it is not real) than to hate and feel angry. That is just my personal preference though.
I CAN'T BELIEVE SHE ASKED YOU ABOUT A BOOB JOB!!! OMG, how on earth did you react? My jaw would have dropped indeed!
Posted by caraher on August 31, 2004, at 21:23:47
In reply to Re: Male or female -- does it matter?, posted by Miss Honeychurch on August 31, 2004, at 12:02:01
> I consciously chose a male T because the LCSW I saw before him was way too chummy for my taste. I thought I would like the hugs etc., but found I wanted strict boundaries and a formal setting (not sure why).
Hugs? Hmmm... I've never seen a T who ever did more than shake my hand and always thought of refraining from physical contact as a sort of professional ethics thing. Not that it's a coldly impersonal relationship - display of emotion, yeah. But just not anything physical no matter how well-intentioned or innocent.
(This reminds me of the "compliments" thread... the only time I ever received a compliment she prefaced it with a statement to the effect that she generally does not tell clients the kind of thing she then told me, but that she did so because she thought it would be proper in the context of my therapy at that time. Which is not to say she didn't ever point out positive things, but that they never involved her *opinion* about me or anything I did or wore or whatever.)
>I thought a male would be less likely to have all the personal items in his office or ask me if I thought he should get a boob job (which the LCSW did!!!).!!!!Unbelievable!!!!
Posted by AuntieMel on August 31, 2004, at 21:44:14
In reply to Male or female -- does it matter?, posted by Aphrodite on August 30, 2004, at 18:01:56
Male for me. Less threatening. I don't feel the 'competition' I might feel with female.
Posted by Miss Honeychurch on September 1, 2004, at 8:21:08
In reply to Re: Male or female -- does it matter?, posted by gardenergirl on August 31, 2004, at 18:37:31
I knew the question was coming, it was just a matter of when, so I wasn't surprised when it was asked. My jaw never reached the ground.
She had been talking about breasts for the past several weeks, just in passing. The session before the boob job inquiry, she said in passing "People like you must feel so sorry for people like me" clearly referring to my breasts. How do you react to that??? I laughed and said I thought all breasts were created equal and quickly changed the subject.
The next session, 5 minutes into it, she asked about the boob job. I said no, don't get one, too dangerous. Needless to say, I never went back!
Posted by gardenergirl on September 1, 2004, at 8:44:39
In reply to Re: Male or female -- does it matter? » gardenergirl, posted by Miss Honeychurch on September 1, 2004, at 8:21:08
Wow, good response.
gg
Posted by Dinah on September 1, 2004, at 9:39:51
In reply to Re: Male or female -- does it matter? » gardenergirl, posted by Miss Honeychurch on September 1, 2004, at 8:21:08
Good for you about never going back!!
I think it's unfortunate that there are enough therapists out there that don't understand where the line should be drawn that we clients need to be aware of it. :(
Posted by Pfinstegg on September 1, 2004, at 19:10:56
In reply to Re: Male or female -- does it matter?, posted by Dinah on September 1, 2004, at 9:39:51
When I was looking for a therapist a year and a half ago, I interviewed four people-two females and two males. I kind of thought that I preferred a man, perhaps because my primary abuser was my father, and I felt that a relationship with a kind, non-abusive male would be very important (it has proved to be- I have a male psychoanalyst who is terrific)
One of the woman therapists I interviewed began talking about face-lifts about 15 minutes into the session. I was startled, and said, "face-lifts??" She said, "oh yes. I'm going to have one. I look at my patients who've had them so I can see who the best plastic surgeons are." I felt so outraged and out of place! And needless to say, was very glad when that session finally ended.
Posted by gardenergirl on September 1, 2004, at 19:29:12
In reply to Re: Male or female -- does it matter?, posted by Pfinstegg on September 1, 2004, at 19:10:56
Dog help me if I ever get that jaded in doing therapy....Face lifts and boob jobs? Now who's going to post about lipo?
:)
gg
Posted by Pfinstegg on September 1, 2004, at 19:37:25
In reply to Re: Male or female -- does it matter? » Pfinstegg, posted by gardenergirl on September 1, 2004, at 19:29:12
I just happen to know for SURE that you never will! But it was very disillusioning to realize that that particular therapist couldn't even keep her mind on the basics of an initial interview, and would just talk about her personal obsessions to a prospective patient. She had a good reputation, too- so it just shows you can never tell if you don't check!
Posted by gardenergirl on September 1, 2004, at 19:47:34
In reply to Re: Male or female -- does it matter? » gardenergirl, posted by Pfinstegg on September 1, 2004, at 19:37:25
Posted by Dinah on September 1, 2004, at 22:26:55
In reply to Re: Male or female -- does it matter?, posted by Pfinstegg on September 1, 2004, at 19:10:56
Posted by Starlight on September 2, 2004, at 16:40:56
In reply to Male or female -- does it matter?, posted by Aphrodite on August 30, 2004, at 18:01:56
I personally prefer a woman. It's kind of like your OB/GYN. You can go and tell her you've got cramps and she knows what you're talking about.
But with a man, it seems like there's a communication hurdle that has to be overcome, and it's just the basic difference between the way that men and women communicate and express themselves.
I've had both male and females and feel absolutely no doubt whatsoever that I will never go back to a male.
starlight
Posted by Starlight on September 2, 2004, at 16:43:57
In reply to Re: Male or female -- does it matter?, posted by lucy stone on August 31, 2004, at 8:34:19
It's funny how we all have so many differing opinions. I guess it boils down to what you want to work on and what gender issues you have.
starlight
Posted by CareBear04 on September 3, 2004, at 0:31:22
In reply to Male or female -- does it matter?, posted by Aphrodite on August 30, 2004, at 18:01:56
ooh, interesting reading!
even though i have lots of girlfriends, there are a lot of times when i prefer male company and i think there's something about male attention that i enjoy. i know that sounds bad, but in terms of medical care, my male drs have generally been more interested and attentive and spend more time in consultation with me. i think there are some subjects that are just universally awkward to discuss, and the gender of the dr doesn't usually define whether i'll respond to questions or avoid them. i've had an amazing female pdoc who got me back on track, but i never felt comfortable discussing sex, female problems, contraception, or anything of the sort because she was almost too nice and warm-- very motherly, and i don't talk about stuff like that with my mom, and i didn't want her to think less of me. in contrast, the dr she referred me on to is male, and after awhile, i felt comfortable talking to him about all those things, though i rarely brought the subjects up myself. he was first described to me as "irreverent," and he is blunt, impossible to shock, and he has a much dirtier mouth than i have, which first surprised and then amused me and actually made me more comfortable, like i was talking to a friend rather than a paid professional. i guess some people would rather have the boundaries drawn differently.also, i think for me it's not so much the gender of the dr that matters but the age. i used to feel comfortable seeing men of all ages, but recently, i had a really bad experience with an older male dr (maybe mid-60s?) who made rude remarks about how i'm on more psych meds than anyone he's ever seen and how messed up i must be. my first time in the hospital, i was in a mostly adolescent program, and the two drs who consulted were both old men who gave me candy and patted me on the head but otherwise told me that they were sorry they couldn't help me and that these were supposed to be the best years of my life. i've also had bad experiences with older women pdocs who acted like they had something to prove and never listened to me. otherwise, younger men and women drs usually work out equally well for me, but all else equal, i would probably choose the man.
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