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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 16 of 16. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Kath on July 18, 2006, at 15:44:33
When my husband & I got back from a week away at a cottage, my son & his girlfriend had gone to British Columbia (half-way across the country) by bus.
They'd left their rented home & pretty-well everything in it...AND had given the landlord a letter saying that I had power of attorney to deal with all the belongings in the house!!!
As it turned out the house was a disaster!I knew NOTHING about it!
I'm GLAD they're gone. And I'm glad in a way that they "dumped" dealing with their stuff on me because it is SO NOT O.K. that it gives me the strength to do the magic "D" word - DETACH.
I am not answering any long distance calls (there's a different ring fortunately). My son was leaving a message from each bus stop -
"Sorry I didn't say goodbye. I'm calling to see what you guys are doing. Will call from the next stop. Luv ya." - as if nothing at all out-of-the-usual had happened!The house was a disaster. Stuff all over the place - clothes & photos & everything all over the floor - beer bottles, junk, dirty dishes all over & a full sink.
I notified the landlord that I had known nothing about anything, but that there were things in the house that I wanted. 4 of my son's friends & I went through their things. There were things I'd lent him & some family things that I didn't want to have thrown out. We bagged up all the clothes & linens for a shelter that said they'd accept stuff & wash it themselves.
Somehow it felt better giving stuff away than having it thrown in the garbage.
It was hard seeing some of the stuff that he was prepared to walk away from.
I had some good crys with hugs from his friends (who I've known for years). The friends were appalled at him just up & leaving!
Anyway, I put a message on my phone for him, telling him that I'm not in a place emotionally where I want to talk to him...that I'd had a lot dumped on me.
I have no idea when I'll want to talk to him. I think not until (or unless) he gets a job, holds it & is in the process of paying me money he borrowed ages ago.
I'm starting to feel pretty darned FREE. There's been grief to deal with....that a kind, sensitive kid has gotten so involved in masking his pain in drug use that he's left everything behind. That my son isn't the person he used to be....that pretty high up on the list of things that are important to him is: drug use
Pretty painful. But I only touch on those feelings VERY briefly. I'm concentrating on my feeling of being FREE....free from being involved in his life.
I'm going to a counsellor (hubby's work provides free counselling in crisis situations) - went yesterday for the first time & I think it'll be very helpful for me in getting through this.
The hard part is going to be when he leaves a message on the machine needing help. THAT will be hard. BUT there are Social Services provided free in B.C. same as here, so he'll be able to go there.
Kath
Posted by AuntieMel on July 18, 2006, at 16:12:30
In reply to I'm Back my son's gone to B.C., posted by Kath on July 18, 2006, at 15:44:33
Great news!! (in a way)
He probably left it for you to deal with (instead of someone else) because he knew you would rescue the family stuff.
He was probably also hoping you would store his other stuff for him.
Bad assumption, huh. Or is that bad assumption, eh?
Posted by Phillipa on July 18, 2006, at 17:01:40
In reply to Re: I'm Back my son's gone to B.C., posted by AuntieMel on July 18, 2006, at 16:12:30
Kath reminds me of when my Son took my car and disappeared with his wife and joined the military. Didn't hear from them for a year til he parachuted into Pananma. Love Phillipa
Posted by Dinah on July 18, 2006, at 19:47:51
In reply to I'm Back my son's gone to B.C., posted by Kath on July 18, 2006, at 15:44:33
I'm so sorry, Kath.
I'm glad you were able to detach. It'll be healthier for you.
Posted by cloudydaze on July 18, 2006, at 19:52:48
In reply to Re: I'm Back my son's gone to B.C. » Kath, posted by Dinah on July 18, 2006, at 19:47:51
I am so proud of you!!!
Be strong,
Cloudy
Posted by Kath on July 19, 2006, at 12:02:49
In reply to Re: I'm Back my son's gone to B.C., posted by AuntieMel on July 18, 2006, at 16:12:30
LOL - I did NOTTTTTTT store anything for him except 1 box of books - that's it!!!!!!!!!! And the only reason I brought them home was for my daughter to see if any of them were hers.
Yayyyyyyy for me! I didn't even conSIder keeping any of his stuff - or hers for that matter. I had a slight twinge when I picked up her journal, but into the garbage bag it went.!! I feel slightly guilty about that, but you know what - if they were at a place where they'd leave everything, then so be it. In the future if they have pangs about anything, it might let them realize how messed up substance abuse can make you.
Thanks for your support! :-) Kath
> Great news!! (in a way)
>
> He probably left it for you to deal with (instead of someone else) because he knew you would rescue the family stuff.
>
> He was probably also hoping you would store his other stuff for him.
>
> Bad assumption, huh. Or is that bad assumption, eh?
Posted by Kath on July 19, 2006, at 12:04:01
In reply to Re: I'm Back my son's gone to B.C., posted by Phillipa on July 18, 2006, at 17:01:40
Jeez - at least he didn't take my car!!!
K
> Kath reminds me of when my Son took my car and disappeared with his wife and joined the military. Didn't hear from them for a year til he parachuted into Pananma. Love Phillipa
Posted by Kath on July 19, 2006, at 12:16:43
In reply to Re: I'm Back my son's gone to B.C., posted by cloudydaze on July 18, 2006, at 19:52:48
Thank you so much for your support. It feels nice.
I spoke with his good friend yesterday & he told me that about 3 times over the past 3 months my son had been really depressed & had talked about his drug use problem. Even though he didn't do anything about it, it IS a first step that he does know & acknowledge that he has a problem.
Then I saw another friend, who said he receives emails every couple of days from my son's girlfriend & she says my son has been 'clean' from drugs for almost 2 weeks.
Initially this news threw me a bit:
'oh dear, here he's trying to clean up & his Mom won't speak to him'
'oh jeez, should I email him & tell him I love him & am pleased to hear he's cleaning up, but am still not in a place where I can talk to him'
'maybe it's better for him to have me NOT talking to him; might help him keep the reality of where his behaviour got him to'
Those type of thoughts go through my head. I'm pretty chilled-out though. Not worrying. Not obsessing. Feedback on the above is welcome though. I've got a phonecall in for the counsellor I'm seeing to call me. Don't know if I mentioned my husband's work covers it for about 8 sessions. And this counsellor allows 1 15-minute phone session between appointments. I think that is so sensible.
Thanks again for your support.
Kath
PS - last evening there was a phonecall from BC (which we didn't answer) & no message was left. I didn't know what to think of that.
Posted by cloudydaze on July 19, 2006, at 17:35:17
In reply to Re: I'm Back my son's gone to B.C.- to you all, posted by Kath on July 19, 2006, at 12:16:43
> Thank you so much for your support. It feels nice.
- I am glad to be able to help:)
> I spoke with his good friend yesterday & he told me that about 3 times over the past 3 months my son had been really depressed & had talked about his drug use problem. Even though he didn't do anything about it, it IS a first step that he does know & acknowledge that he has a problem.
- the depression is not a surprise. Once upon a time, i used drugs & alcohol to self-medicate. And my mom still drinks way too much. The depression could be the underlying cause of his abuse, or it could be the other way around.
> Then I saw another friend, who said he receives emails every couple of days from my son's girlfriend & she says my son has been 'clean' from drugs for almost 2 weeks.- That's good news!
> Initially this news threw me a bit:
>
> 'oh dear, here he's trying to clean up & his Mom won't speak to him'
>
> 'oh jeez, should I email him & tell him I love him & am pleased to hear he's cleaning up, but am still not in a place where I can talk to him'
>
> 'maybe it's better for him to have me NOT talking to him; might help him keep the reality of where his behaviour got him to'
>
> Those type of thoughts go through my head. I'm pretty chilled-out though. Not worrying. Not obsessing. Feedback on the above is welcome though. I've got a phonecall in for the counsellor I'm seeing to call me. Don't know if I mentioned my husband's work covers it for about 8 sessions. And this counsellor allows 1 15-minute phone session between appointments. I think that is so sensible.
>
> Thanks again for your support.
>
> Kath
>
> PS - last evening there was a phonecall from BC (which we didn't answer) & no message was left. I didn't know what to think of that.- You should only talk to him when you feel comfortable doing so - When you feel like you can be strong enough to talk to him and give him emotional support without going overboard or feeling obligated to help him in other ways, then by all means, talk to him.
Keep us updated!
Posted by AuntieMel on July 20, 2006, at 13:13:16
In reply to Re: I'm Back my son's gone to B.C.- to you all, posted by Kath on July 19, 2006, at 12:16:43
Part of truly getting off substances is to make amends.
But first you have to really realize you have amends to make. And how messed up you really were.
You could maybe have one of his friends email him that he isn't shut out forever, but he has to prove he's clean first.
*Really* prove it. For more than two weeks.
Besides being good for you, making him act like a grown-up is good for him.
But, I know it's tough.
Posted by Kath on July 20, 2006, at 16:08:26
In reply to Re: I'm Back my son's gone to B.C.- to you all » Kath, posted by AuntieMel on July 20, 2006, at 13:13:16
Hi Both
I just got home & there was a message from my son. Just saying he wondered how we were doing & that he loved us.
He sounded tired. or down. or something.
I guess compared to how I'd normally be feeling, I'm doing jolly well. I only feel a bit sorry for him.
I feel somewhat guilty for not talking to him.
I don't think I'm strong enough yet to talk to him & not get devastated if he's feeling crappy. It would be a kick-in-the-stomach feeling. But maybe that's OK. I HATE feeling bad though.
What would the reason be TO talk with him?
Perhaps the idea of getting his friend to email him is better? What would be better about it?
I could let him know by email that I love him & view his drug use as being in the process of ruining his life & can't handle talking with him until he - until what? - that's a bit hard.....
until -
until he's done whatever he needs to do to solve his drug problem? I don't know exactly what to say. I'm a very wordy person....words are very important to me...
I feel like I have to say JUST the right thing!
I am SO codependent....the inner voice shouts, "You need to say JUST the right thing, JUST the right way - if you mention rehab, you might make him be stubborn about NOT considering rehab...' etc - blah blah blah, goes the inner, scared codependent voice.
Oh dear.
Kath
Posted by cloudydaze on July 20, 2006, at 17:23:32
In reply to Re: I'm Back.... Cloudy , AuntieMel - oh dear, posted by Kath on July 20, 2006, at 16:08:26
Don't worry....you are doing great!
If he has access to email, it might be a good idea that you email him. that way, you have a chance to think about your words, and it's less confrontational.
You asked what would be the reason to talk to him...
well...just to make sure he knows you love him, but you're not going to let him run your life. Again, only when you really feel ready. And don't feel guilty - you need some time to get used to the idea of letting go.A good indicator of him leading a better (drug-free) life would be that he is able to hold down a job, pay his expenses, and be drug free for more than a few weeks, or at LEAST starting rehab, therapy, or a support group.
Hang in there, and keep us updated :)
-Cloudy
> Hi Both
>
> I just got home & there was a message from my son. Just saying he wondered how we were doing & that he loved us.
>
> He sounded tired. or down. or something.
>
> I guess compared to how I'd normally be feeling, I'm doing jolly well. I only feel a bit sorry for him.
>
> I feel somewhat guilty for not talking to him.
>
> I don't think I'm strong enough yet to talk to him & not get devastated if he's feeling crappy. It would be a kick-in-the-stomach feeling. But maybe that's OK. I HATE feeling bad though.
>
> What would the reason be TO talk with him?
>
> Perhaps the idea of getting his friend to email him is better? What would be better about it?
>
> I could let him know by email that I love him & view his drug use as being in the process of ruining his life & can't handle talking with him until he - until what? - that's a bit hard.....
>
> until -
>
> until he's done whatever he needs to do to solve his drug problem? I don't know exactly what to say. I'm a very wordy person....words are very important to me...
>
> I feel like I have to say JUST the right thing!
>
> I am SO codependent....the inner voice shouts, "You need to say JUST the right thing, JUST the right way - if you mention rehab, you might make him be stubborn about NOT considering rehab...' etc - blah blah blah, goes the inner, scared codependent voice.
>
> Oh dear.
>
> Kath
Posted by Kath on July 20, 2006, at 17:42:59
In reply to Re: I'm Back.... Cloudy , AuntieMel - oh dear, posted by cloudydaze on July 20, 2006, at 17:23:32
Thank you SOOOOOO much for the feedback. Once again, I'm printing your reply!! My purse is going to be filled with papers with your words on them!!!!! LOL
see **********below********Don't worry....you are doing great!
>
> If he has access to email, it might be a good idea that you email him. that way, you have a chance to think about your words, and it's less confrontational.*****good point & also then I don't hear his voice if he's 'down'. His friend who my son's girlfriend is emailing told me the other day not to hesitate if I want to phone him for any reason, so I can actually get the friend's email address & forward my email for him to send to my son*****
>> You asked what would be the reason to talk to him...
> well...just to make sure he knows you love him, but you're not going to let him run your life. Again, only when you really feel ready. And don't feel guilty - you need some time to get used to the idea of letting go.********I think to email him is the best right now. I think I'd have to be in a really strong place to talk with him if he's feeling bad. If he's feeling OK then it wouldn't be a problem, but if he's down I think it might screw me up big-time to the point where I'd be viewing him as a victim-of-Life & feeling sorry for him & be right IN codependent danger-zone.******
> A good indicator of him leading a better (drug-free) life would be that he is able to hold down a job, pay his expenses, and be drug free for more than a few weeks, or at LEAST starting rehab, therapy, or a support group.*******good info - thanks*********
>
> Hang in there, and keep us updated :)*******thanks Cloudy. I feel sort of pathetic, needing to ask such questions. I feel like I'm in "helpless little kid" mode or something :-) but I guess that's OK!! I really truly appreciate your support & thanks for saying to keep you updated; it makes me feel like someone really cares & isn't simply answering because they happened to read 'yet another of Kath's son-posts'!! :-))
Thanks Cloudy & by the way, how are you doing?
Kath**********
> -Cloudy> > Hi Both
> >
> > I just got home & there was a message from my son. Just saying he wondered how we were doing & that he loved us.
> >
> > He sounded tired. or down. or something.
> >
> > I guess compared to how I'd normally be feeling, I'm doing jolly well. I only feel a bit sorry for him.
> >
> > I feel somewhat guilty for not talking to him.
> >
> > I don't think I'm strong enough yet to talk to him & not get devastated if he's feeling crappy. It would be a kick-in-the-stomach feeling. But maybe that's OK. I HATE feeling bad though.
> >
> > What would the reason be TO talk with him?
> >
> > Perhaps the idea of getting his friend to email him is better? What would be better about it?
> >
> > I could let him know by email that I love him & view his drug use as being in the process of ruining his life & can't handle talking with him until he - until what? - that's a bit hard.....
> >
> > until -
> >
> > until he's done whatever he needs to do to solve his drug problem? I don't know exactly what to say. I'm a very wordy person....words are very important to me...
> >
> > I feel like I have to say JUST the right thing!
> >
> > I am SO codependent....the inner voice shouts, "You need to say JUST the right thing, JUST the right way - if you mention rehab, you might make him be stubborn about NOT considering rehab...' etc - blah blah blah, goes the inner, scared codependent voice.
> >
> > Oh dear.
> >
> > Kath
>
>
Posted by cloudydaze on July 20, 2006, at 19:17:00
In reply to Re: I'm Back.... Cloudy , AuntieMel - oh dear » cloudydaze, posted by Kath on July 20, 2006, at 17:42:59
I'm here anytime you need me :)
I am doing ok, thanks for asking.
I've been spending way too much time online though....i think I'm just lonely (boyfriend is visiting parents for a week).
-cloudy
Posted by AuntieMel on July 21, 2006, at 9:41:35
In reply to Re: I'm Back.... Cloudy , AuntieMel - oh dear, posted by Kath on July 20, 2006, at 16:08:26
If he's not clean he's going to sound needy and down.
If he is clean he's going to sound down, too, as it would be too early in his recovery.
An email from you would be good. But short, very short so he doesn't have a lot of words to twist against you (addicts are champs at that.)
A simple "I love you. email me when you are better, but I can't handle you when you are using" will be enough.
Posted by Kath on July 21, 2006, at 14:19:28
In reply to Re: I'm Back.... Cloudy , AuntieMel - oh dear » Kath, posted by AuntieMel on July 21, 2006, at 9:41:35
> If he's not clean he's going to sound needy and down.
>
> If he is clean he's going to sound down, too, as it would be too early in his recovery.
>
> An email from you would be good. But short, very short so he doesn't have a lot of words to twist against you (addicts are champs at that.)
>
> A simple "I love you. email me when you are better, but I can't handle you when you are using" will be enough.Good input. I am having trouble contacting the friend who has son's email addy.
I think I'll answer next time son phones (call display is GREAT). At this point, I'll probably say something like, "I love you & wanted to be sure you know that. I'd like you to call again in a few days because I have to sort some stuff out before I'm OK to talk with you. In the meantime, I hope you take good care of yourself."
I have an appointment with the counsellor on Monday, so I could discuss with her what I'll say next to my son.
I like what you said, though A.Mel - it's simple & direct.
I'd probably say "I love you. Phone me when you are better. I can't handle talking with you when you're using. It's too painful for me to see you hurting yourself."
or something like that. Maybe that's not simple enough. I dunno.I'm feeling pretty good today. Somewhat stronger. ALSO it's Friday & I'm tired & am glad it's the weekend!!!
:-) Kath
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