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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 9 of 9. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Penny on September 2, 2003, at 10:33:51
that some people think you should always talk about how you're feeling, ask for help when you are down, etc., but when you do, they act overburdened by what you have to say?
Yes, I'm going on about my dear darling roommate again. She returns home today from her long weekend away, and I'm dreading it. Even though she was all nicey-nice when she left and even called me Friday evening to see how my sleep clinic and pdoc appointments went.
My parents were here over the weekend and we went Saturday night to the sad sad Carolina football game. Still, I got quite misty-eyed at the beginning when they played the national anthem followed by the alma mater. The last time I was in that stadium was my college graduation. It was great seeing all the students decked out in Carolina blue and cheering the Tar Heels to their loss to Florida State (ugh!!!!!).
So, that too was enough to bring tears to my eyes AGAIN.
The parents left on Sunday, and I didn't feel well anyway, so spent the remainder of the day Sunday sleeping and doing laundry. Then I pretty much slept all day yesterday as I had a splitting headache that I couldn't shake. Finally got rid of it last night, just in time to go to bed.
What a holiday.
And, with all my free time, a couple of things occurred to me about my roommate situation:
First, she asked me why I want to move in December - and I didn't think about it at the time, but she is the one who came home and said she was moving, well before I ever mentioned it. I will remind her of that if and when she brings up the subject again.
Second, she has gotten upset with me on more than one occasion for not telling her when I feel bad (hence my question at the beginning of this nonsensical post). One night I lay awake a long time thinking/fantasizing in a way about suicide - how I would do it, the plans surrounding it, etc. I didn't get up and go to her in the middle of the night and say, "I need to talk..." I didn't want to talk. I continued feeling bad the following day and she asked what was wrong and I finally told her and then she said, "Well, you could've come and woken me up. You don't have to lay there when you feel that way," etc. etc. But what I tried to tell her is that I didn't want her 'help', or her attempt at help, and if she truly understood where I was coming from, she would realize that.
She acts as though I'm supposed to tell her everytime I'm feeling bad. But, to add insult to injury, when I AM honest with her about how I am feeling, she acts as though I'm placing this big burden on her shoulders. As though she is trying to bear the weight that I am trying to bear on my own. I don't WANT her to take on my depression. As crazy as it sounds, it is MY depression, and no one can take the pain away from me, and the only people I truly trust to help me deal with it are my therapist and my pdoc, and the folks on this board.
I feel like she tries to mother me, and in the process is smothering me, and when I don't turn out to be as dependent on her as she would like, she gets resentful.
And, again, I can't take it anymore. She's not my mother. She's not my sister, or my aunt, or even my cousin. Not that those people have any more of a right to try to 'fix' things for me than she does, but she tries to intertwine her life into mine too much. And if I don't let her completely take care of me, she shuns me. It's all or nothing at all.
Why is that?
Posted by Dinah on September 2, 2003, at 11:57:58
In reply to So, why is it..., posted by Penny on September 2, 2003, at 10:33:51
Well, I can only tell you my approach with my husband. He too really doesn't want to know the gory details, but gets hurt sometimes that I don't tell him everything. He wants the intimacy, but not the responsibility.
I just sit him down and tell him we can share a lot of things, but that I employ the professionals for this purpose and to please leave that between them and me. He doesn't need to know the details any more than he needs to know my daily blood sugar readings. He does and can know the generalities. But he's not my father or my therapist. And frankly his interventions usually aren't that helpful, and that's ok because he isn't supposed to know what to do. He's not a professional.
He both does and doesn't like it. He sees my therapist as the boundary between my craziness and him. He likes that. But he wants the intimacy of total truthfulness. Frankly, total truthfulness is waaaay overrated. There are things he's probably thinking that I'd just as soon not hear, and vice versa.
If you can inject enough fondness and intimacy into the explanation as possible, reassure her that your health is *not* her responsibility so she doesn't *have* to know your status, and draw boundaries you might be able to negotiate this hurdle at least. It's not really a problem between my husband and myself on a regular basis. But you have to do it with warmth and affection for it not to feel like a rejection.
Good luck with her return!
Posted by Penny on September 2, 2003, at 12:24:42
In reply to Re: So, why is it... » Penny, posted by Dinah on September 2, 2003, at 11:57:58
I understand what you're saying, but when I have tried in the past to convey to her that I certainly don't expect her to go out of her way to be there for me and that I don't want to share everything that's going on with me - every breakthrough in therapy, every med change, etc. - no matter how tactfully and lovingly I try to put it, she gets offended and resentful.
At the same time, she doesn't share everything with me either, and I am VERY okay with that! She is a type 2 diabetic, she doesn't take her meds the way she should, she is overweight and weight loss would help with her disease, etc., but, ya' know what? It's none of my business. She is a grown woman and I have to trust that she can take care of herself even if I disagree with the way she is doing it.
Perhaps I am not coming across as tactful and caring as I have tried to be - but now, after saying it over and over again, I am just plain tired of having to repeat myself. I feel like she has selective hearing and selective memory. And, even when I try to put myself in her shoes, when I try to see things and hear things from her perspective, I find it extremely hard. It's much easier when I'm not so directly involved, as I would be if I were a third party and impartial, but from where I'm standing, I just don't understand how she can take my not telling her every little thing that is going on with me and not telling her every time I feel bad as a rejection.
Plus, she's not my spouse or parent. My therapist describes the arguments we get into as 'lover's quarrels' because of all the drama involved. I'm really trying to step back from it all and distance myself, just for my own sanity. But it is so hard, especially when I have to live with her. I really feel trapped and smothered. I wish I was able to handle this whole situation in a more mature and effective manner, but I just seem to be sucked in by the emotion of it all, and, as I have said, always come away feeling like I am at fault for every issue between us.
I will be so thankful if the apartment complex I'm living in is able to work something out with me. I just really need my own space right now, and I don't have it.
P
Posted by Penny on September 2, 2003, at 12:34:21
In reply to Re: So, why is it... » Penny, posted by Dinah on September 2, 2003, at 11:57:58
I am also sure that I am not the easiest person to live with, especially right now, with my swinging moods and clutter I can't seem to get a handle on, and so on. So, I don't know.
It sounds as though you are much better at dealing with your situation than I am with mine. Does your husband trust that your practitioners are taking care of you and your illness? Does he trust that you are taking care of you and that he doesn't really have a need (or rarely has a need) to intervene?
P
Posted by Susan J on September 2, 2003, at 13:11:47
In reply to Re: P.S. » Dinah, posted by Penny on September 2, 2003, at 12:34:21
> I am also sure that I am not the easiest person to live with, especially right now, with my swinging moods and clutter I can't seem to get a handle on, and so on. So, I don't know.
<<It's so hard to know what's going on when you (I) don't see the actual stuff, but from what you've written, it sounds like you have excellent communication skills, and she doesn't. Sounds like she wants to control every interaction between the two of you, and she can't, and shouldn't.
And please don't blame yourself. Nobody is easy to live with. :-) The only thing that makes it better is open communication, clear communication, and respect for the other person's boundaries. Sounds like you are doing all of those. I don't see so much coming from her side.
Mothering is a way of controlling the situation. Take it from someone who mothered her ex-boyfriend to death. :-) It's not healthy, even when you think you are helping, and it turned "him" into a child.....which of course made me want to mother even more.
Good luck,
Susan
Posted by Penny on September 2, 2003, at 13:24:53
In reply to Penny, I think she's a control freak. » Penny, posted by Susan J on September 2, 2003, at 13:11:47
Thanks Susan.
And you know what's funny? She takes a great deal of pride in 'taking care of' everyone else. A coworker of hers just lost a baby, and she informed everyone in the office that she was going to take care of her "Don't worry about her, I'll take care of her."
I mean, it's wonderful that she wants to be there for her coworker and all, but why does she have to take care of her? Why can't she just be there for her IF the woman needs her to be? Why does it have to cross the line and turn into her mothering her coworker?
Yet she complains about everyone taking advantage of her and about being emotionally drained.
Jeez...
Posted by Dinah on September 2, 2003, at 16:46:28
In reply to Re: P.S. » Dinah, posted by Penny on September 2, 2003, at 12:34:21
Well, my husband probably doesn't have the same temperament as your roommate. He really really doesn't want to be responsible or even notice my problems, so it may be easier to let him off the hook and pawn me onto my mental health professionals. :)
Sorry if I made it sound easy. No relationship is easy. This just isn't one of the more difficult areas in mine.
Posted by fallsfall on September 4, 2003, at 20:12:50
In reply to So, why is it..., posted by Penny on September 2, 2003, at 10:33:51
Penny,
It sounds to me like you know what you want from her - you want her there if you need her, you want her to be your friend, you want her to let you live your own life, you want to not feel guilty when you do tell her what is going on.
Can you tell her that this is the way it is? That if she's always worried about you that it hurts rather than helps? That she can trust you to come and wake her up if you need to do that - if you don't wake her up that you are coping in your own way (you may have to promise to stay alive). That if she makes you feel guilty for sharing with her that you will stop sharing.
If you can really clearly tell her what your needs are and what the only responsibilities are that she has for you, then there might be some kind of chance? (Being who I am I would write it down so there wouldn't be confusion later, but most people aren't me)
You really do sound healthier and healthier. You Go Girl!
Posted by Penny on September 5, 2003, at 8:11:52
In reply to Re: So, why is it... » Penny, posted by fallsfall on September 4, 2003, at 20:12:50
> Penny,
>
> It sounds to me like you know what you want from her - you want her there if you need her, you want her to be your friend, you want her to let you live your own life, you want to not feel guilty when you do tell her what is going on.
>
> Can you tell her that this is the way it is? That if she's always worried about you that it hurts rather than helps? That she can trust you to come and wake her up if you need to do that - if you don't wake her up that you are coping in your own way (you may have to promise to stay alive). That if she makes you feel guilty for sharing with her that you will stop sharing.
>
> If you can really clearly tell her what your needs are and what the only responsibilities are that she has for you, then there might be some kind of chance? (Being who I am I would write it down so there wouldn't be confusion later, but most people aren't me)
- Unfortunately, writing things down with her isn't really effective. Because no matter how tactfully I try to say something, no matter how many times I reread and revise to make sure that I am saying exactly what I mean to say, etc., she will pull things out and twist it around.Had a pretty good therapy session last night and my T said that there is probably no way I will ever be able to be for my roommate what she wants me to be. Truly with her, it's not about what I need, it's about what she needs and what she thinks I need. Whether I need it or not. And to tell her otherwise is just unacceptable to her.
In talking to a reasonable person, your approach would be effective, but my roommate is not always a reasonable person. Sometimes, but not always.
At this point, it's just easier to live and let live and hold on 'til November 1.
>
> You really do sound healthier and healthier. You Go Girl!Thanks! Wish I felt it....
:-(
P
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