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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 16 of 16. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Partlycloudy on December 29, 2008, at 11:08:49
I know I said I wasn't going to come back until after the new year, but a lot has been going on.
And I had that nice old take back of the pbc, such a great holiday present, no matter who delivered it :-)
Been seeing my T twice a week lately. Doing a lot of processing, of the PTSD stuff, of mom stuff, of family stuff. Much of it has been feeling like whacking my head against a wall, like - "OK, this time, I'm GETTING it. I get this message." Mother - NOT there for me. Family - NOT there for me. As my therapist has said to me, more than once, "the well is dry, and there is not enough water for you to bring to it to make it wet again." There is no nurturing to be had from my family, no acknowledgment of emotions or feelings, whether good or bad.
Where is my way forward? Because staying where I've been, hoping that I'll get what I desire the most, is most certainly making me sicker and sicker. So, for me, the only answer can be to let go. There are no family for me, there really is no home for me to go back to, not unless I'm willing to take giant leaps backwards in my health and recovery. It's not enough that I be OK with what they have to give me, because they actually don't give at all; they just suck you dry, and fill themselves up with drinking, with pills, with talking without saying anything.
This is hard, but it feels like the right way forward. I think it is the only way up and out for me. My family can't help me heal. My mother is utterly incapable. I have to find these things elsewhere, within myself, perhaps in other people in my life, I don't know.
It has totally sucked to have been away from babble throughout this part of my journey, but I think that too was necessary. I have been absolutely rubbed raw and completely agitated. My sleep is still not solid yet - it turns out that I haven't been eating enough, either (having trouble chewing and swallowing). So Christmas was torture. But it's the other side. I held my head, and rocked back and forth, and the time passed.
Things have to get better.
Posted by workinprogress on December 29, 2008, at 11:27:18
In reply to Letting go of family and home, posted by Partlycloudy on December 29, 2008, at 11:08:49
Will write more later, my family is getting out the door and being freaky about it, so I can't write more. But.... *****I soooooo get it***** and big hugs to you. I particularly get the no feelings and the talking about nothing. So glad to be leaving it today!
WIP
> I know I said I wasn't going to come back until after the new year, but a lot has been going on.
>
> And I had that nice old take back of the pbc, such a great holiday present, no matter who delivered it :-)
>
> Been seeing my T twice a week lately. Doing a lot of processing, of the PTSD stuff, of mom stuff, of family stuff. Much of it has been feeling like whacking my head against a wall, like - "OK, this time, I'm GETTING it. I get this message." Mother - NOT there for me. Family - NOT there for me. As my therapist has said to me, more than once, "the well is dry, and there is not enough water for you to bring to it to make it wet again." There is no nurturing to be had from my family, no acknowledgment of emotions or feelings, whether good or bad.
>
> Where is my way forward? Because staying where I've been, hoping that I'll get what I desire the most, is most certainly making me sicker and sicker. So, for me, the only answer can be to let go. There are no family for me, there really is no home for me to go back to, not unless I'm willing to take giant leaps backwards in my health and recovery. It's not enough that I be OK with what they have to give me, because they actually don't give at all; they just suck you dry, and fill themselves up with drinking, with pills, with talking without saying anything.
>
> This is hard, but it feels like the right way forward. I think it is the only way up and out for me. My family can't help me heal. My mother is utterly incapable. I have to find these things elsewhere, within myself, perhaps in other people in my life, I don't know.
>
> It has totally sucked to have been away from babble throughout this part of my journey, but I think that too was necessary. I have been absolutely rubbed raw and completely agitated. My sleep is still not solid yet - it turns out that I haven't been eating enough, either (having trouble chewing and swallowing). So Christmas was torture. But it's the other side. I held my head, and rocked back and forth, and the time passed.
>
> Things have to get better.
Posted by antigua3 on December 29, 2008, at 11:45:33
In reply to Letting go of family and home, posted by Partlycloudy on December 29, 2008, at 11:08:49
I think you've got it right: your family is never going to fill that need. You can't make them, and you can't make them change. You can only change how you react to them.
I don't say any of this lightly. It is a tremendously difficult thing to do. I expect nothing from my family of origin anymore, and it took decades to get there, but you AREN'T going to take that long (do you hear me?). I would visit my mother for years and then have major meltdowns afterwards (drinking, I mean). It had to stop, and the only way was for me to tell her what had happened to me--just state it, and not go into details because she didn't want to hear them--and then go from there. That was enough for me.
But, I'm also lucky in a way because my father is dead. I don't have to ever see him again and I don't need anything from him--no apology or explanation, because while I really think I would get the apology, nothing would be enough. I had to find a way to make it enough in my own mind. I'm still working on it, but I really try hard not to expect anything from my family of origin.
The only way I could do this was to start taking care of myself. You do this already, so I don't know what I could offer in the way of help, except to say that this "new" stuff has to have time to settle, in your mind and body, and that seems to be brutalizing your body right now by not being able to eat, pain, etc.
I don't know pc. It sounds simple to say, "You're getting there; it will pass," because I know it will, but I know how terribly hard the journey is. But you will get there. You have to find something to hold onto. For me, it was faith, and I don't mean religious faith, I just mean some kind of faith that I kept telling myself, "everything is going to be OK." And even when things aren't OK, I just keep holding on and having faith. Hey, maybe it's having faith in myself. I just thought of that.
I wish you weren't suffering so much. I can't imagine the physical pain you're experiencing and how you need for that to settle down so you can relax. Maybe it's like finding your center. I posted about losing mine recently, and how horrible it feels not to have a center to hold onto, but my pdoc says it's shifting and it will come back. I have to believe that, while I work on readjusting meds, etc., eating less sugar, whatever, and just hold on.
Again, I'm just so sorry you're hurting so much.
antigua
Posted by Partlycloudy on December 29, 2008, at 12:10:35
In reply to Re: Letting go of family and home » Partlycloudy, posted by antigua3 on December 29, 2008, at 11:45:33
I guess I'm finding it hard because my mom was (and continues to be, really) the perpetrator of neglect and emotional abuse. When I told her what had happened to me at age 11, recently, she said, "I don't know what I would have been able to do for you."
OK - inappropriate. She could have reported the guy to the police, gone to the high school he went to, maybe saved a little girl's life.
Mom is alive and well and trying to call me. I hung up on her yesterday without speaking a word, because I know that at this point she's feeling angry and hurt, but it's not up to me to help her feel better. She's a Bad Mother. Was, still is.
So things continue to be difficult. And the rest of my family resemble nothing else so much as a bunch of clams; and right now I'm kind of like a jellyfish, see-through and somewhat poisonous.
My mission is to keep my caloric intake up as much as I can. It was never my plan to lose weight over the holidays, but right now I'm slurping protein shakes, eating pudding and jello and yogurt. Blech. (Oh, and Spaghettios - no chewing.)
hugs to you
pc
Posted by Phillipa on December 29, 2008, at 12:59:12
In reply to Re: Letting go of family and home » antigua3, posted by Partlycloudy on December 29, 2008, at 12:10:35
PC a bit of reversal family origin dead or only sister doesn't speak to me don't know why. Leaves three grown kids not even a Christmas card or e-mail. So just husband who yells and screams. So what's better? I don't know. Phillipa
Posted by Partlycloudy on December 29, 2008, at 14:15:46
In reply to Re: Letting go of family and home » Partlycloudy, posted by Phillipa on December 29, 2008, at 12:59:12
Well, this is entirely my choice. I could easily keep spending my money and time trying to get blood from a stone, continuing to visit them while none of them ever bother to come down the other way; send emails while none are initiated by them; and even phone calls are a once a year thing (though not this year - they got the word I was "unwell" and so left me alone in my misery).
So I'm making the choice to say - This is NOT enough. I deserve better than this. And I rather doubt that they will notice my retreat.
It's all about choices. How I react to their actions, whether I decide to engage in their hurtful ways. I guess I finally got to the place where I had to - had to, mind you, say no more for me, thank you. Here is my boundary, and you may not cross it. I'm told it's a sign of strength.
Posted by DAisym on December 29, 2008, at 14:44:19
In reply to Letting go of family and home, posted by Partlycloudy on December 29, 2008, at 11:08:49
Such wise words and so painful. You aren't just letting go of what is but of what you always wanted it to be.
The good thing is that you have the opportunity to create HOME for yourself with your husband. You have a loving partner who wants you to feel safe and nurtured. I found that when I created my own room two years ago, I gave myself a great gift. I didn't even know I needed it but I now guard my sanctuary selfishly.
I think one of the reasons I haven't told my mom about what happened to me is that I fear she'll give me the same response your mom did - "don't know what I would have done for you." I think I need to hang on to the fantasy of her leaping to my rescue, at least a little while longer. (Not to mention of the fear of her disbelief, but that is another thread.)
I'm glad you are so connected to your therapist and able to see her frequently. I'm sure it helps to have her hold you.
Posted by Partlycloudy on December 29, 2008, at 15:24:03
In reply to Re: Letting go of family and home, posted by DAisym on December 29, 2008, at 14:44:19
Between my therapist and my pdoc, I am feeling very well cared for. From my husband I seem to be getting a lot of lessons on how to build and maintain boundaries. That's what made Christmas so hard - he doesn't get the not being able to eat thing, and he was really cross with me for not eating all the food he'd put on the table - yes, him. I was struck low on the sofa, and he had gone to an Italian catering place and bought tons of food. I just couldn't touch any of it. But he's trying.
And he thinks my family is completely batty, so he's supportive of my backing away from them.
I really hope this new year is better for each of us.
Posted by antigua3 on December 29, 2008, at 19:51:24
In reply to Re: Letting go of family and home » antigua3, posted by Partlycloudy on December 29, 2008, at 12:10:35
I'm sorry about what your mother said. My mother said she would have called the police on my father, which helped--a little.
keep taking care of yourself.
antigua
Posted by Partlycloudy on December 29, 2008, at 19:56:51
In reply to Re: Letting go of family and home » Partlycloudy, posted by antigua3 on December 29, 2008, at 19:51:24
Thanks, I'm working on it :-)
Posted by Partlycloudy on December 29, 2008, at 19:59:07
In reply to Re: Letting go of family and home » Partlycloudy, posted by workinprogress on December 29, 2008, at 11:27:18
Thanks, WIP, didn't mean not to acknowledge your post. Hope your household gets back to peace and normal soon.
I think I'm about all cut off now from my immediate family, apart from my sister, who feels the way I do about our mom but is MUCH angrier. I just feel sad.
pc
Posted by Phillipa on December 29, 2008, at 20:11:04
In reply to Re: Letting go of family and home » Phillipa, posted by Partlycloudy on December 29, 2008, at 14:15:46
Personally would like to opportunity to hear parents side of story or an invite to kids instead of being ignored. But that is me. Phillipa ps so we see husband's family.
Posted by workinprogress on December 30, 2008, at 1:15:37
In reply to Letting go of family and home, posted by Partlycloudy on December 29, 2008, at 11:08:49
PC-
No expectation/obligation that you respond to my post, we all have a lot going on in general and in particular during the holidays, some more than others. And, we all give what we can give, I appreciate those who were able to respond and empathize with me. Writing to you is a way to give back I suppose. I only meant to say that I related and empathize.
> I know I said I wasn't going to come back until after the new year, but a lot has been going on.
>
> And I had that nice old take back of the pbc, such a great holiday present, no matter who delivered it :-)
>
> Been seeing my T twice a week lately. Doing a lot of processing, of the PTSD stuff, of mom stuff, of family stuff. Much of it has been feeling like whacking my head against a wall, like - "OK, this time, I'm GETTING it. I get this message." Mother - NOT there for me. Family - NOT there for me. As my therapist has said to me, more than once, "the well is dry, and there is not enough water for you to bring to it to make it wet again." There is no nurturing to be had from my family, no acknowledgment of emotions or feelings, whether good or bad.**********
PC- My heart hurts for you. I think we whack our heads against the wall re this message instinctively. It just can't be real you know? But, unfortunately it often is... I know it still hasn't quite sunk in for me. This last trip might have helped considerably though. The challenge for me.. and I imagine I'm not alone in this... is to not think it's my fault.That said. I am so sorry. But, do you feel good to come to that conclusion? Maybe to stop trying to get something that doesn't exist is relieving... even if painful...?
***********************>
> Where is my way forward? Because staying where I've been, hoping that I'll get what I desire the most, is most certainly making me sicker and sicker. So, for me, the only answer can be to let go. There are no family for me, there really is no home for me to go back to, not unless I'm willing to take giant leaps backwards in my health and recovery. It's not enough that I be OK with what they have to give me, because they actually don't give at all; they just suck you dry, and fill themselves up with drinking, with pills, with talking without saying anything.
>
> This is hard, but it feels like the right way forward. I think it is the only way up and out for me. My family can't help me heal. My mother is utterly incapable. I have to find these things elsewhere, within myself, perhaps in other people in my life, I don't know.
****************
I came to this very same conclusion on my trip. It ain't happening here. Much as I wish it were different, it isn't. And much as I wish I could go home with my T, that's not real either. So, how do I have that? How do I have that love and appreciation and acceptance? I decided the only way was to build it myself. To create that in my family. (I'm still single and very much want someone/a family). BUT- it sounds like you are on your way in that regard. There's still mourning to do for your family of origin, for what you wish you had and now are realizing you never will. But, like you said, letting go of that is a big part of the battle eh? It's hard. It's hard even for me even when it's so obvious. *never gonna happen!!!!*. But, oh... to fantasize. And hope.... even if only unconsciously. I think many of my tears over this trip were as much mourning as they were pain from the past. Still hard though... but maybe letting go is good for you. It sounds like you think so.
*****************
>
> It has totally sucked to have been away from babble throughout this part of my journey, but I think that too was necessary. I have been absolutely rubbed raw and completely agitated. My sleep is still not solid yet - it turns out that I haven't been eating enough, either (having trouble chewing and swallowing). So Christmas was torture. But it's the other side. I held my head, and rocked back and forth, and the time passed.
**********
Good for you. You're out the other side! You survived! That is no small feat. Be kind to yourself. Take it easy. Ease back in. Do something nice and special for you. You deserve it! It's like coming back from battle I think. You're tired and bruised and need care. Kid gloves...
*****************
>
> Things have to get better.**********
Yup... they sure do!Good luck PC. I'll be thinkin' of ya!
- WIP
****************
Posted by Partlycloudy on December 30, 2008, at 7:05:01
In reply to Re: Letting go of family and home » Partlycloudy, posted by workinprogress on December 30, 2008, at 1:15:37
I think I have a lot of mourning to do about my family. I've been carrying bucket after bucket after bucket of my own emotional water to the well, as it were, for years. I've lived far from home since 1983, sometimes overseas, and the separation and isolation is very real in a physical sense.
But I've always found visits back "home" very triggering. I was a heavy drinker for many years and just staying with my mother was enough to send me on a binge, and I never understood what that was all about. When I found my sobriety and started to explore what my various triggers were, it still took me a long time to accept that it wasn't the city that could send me into a tailspin, but the people I chose to be with that agonized me so that I just wanted to stop feeling the only way I'd known how.
I've since had a romp with PTSD and confronting some more monsters in my closet, and pretty much since September it's been a rather rough ride. The deeper I dig, the more my family retreats in terms of support, compassion, encouragement, and yes, what I'd have to say is love. They are so uncomfortable with the expression of feelings - and so much of what I'm going through now is related (pun intended) directly back to my mother and father.
So even though I didn't see any of them over the holidays, it wasn't a pleasant time with them. I had a bad phone call with a sister in law, hung up on my mother, and another brother just dropped me mid email conversation like a hot potato. They don't want to know, don't want to see, I'm too real and hurting.
My therapist says that I'm getting into the "meat" of my healing now. Can we hurry it up, please? Or, where's that fast forward button? And can I eat something without feeling nauseous? Please? Please?
Posted by Little Soul on December 31, 2008, at 9:30:37
In reply to Re: Letting go of family and home » workinprogress, posted by Partlycloudy on December 30, 2008, at 7:05:01
PC - I've just finished reading this thread and am close to crying. I can feel your pain because you are writing my story. The giving up of it all, the silence from family of origin - the excruciating silience, the lack of appetite, the helpful husband, and on and on. I, as you, want so desperately to have that picket fence family but am coming slowly to realize that may not ever be.
I want to say to you that I am sorry for your pain and for your sadness. I know it's magnified by this time of year when all you see anywhere is how happy we should be with family....ba...humbug! I relate to the sofa thing totally. When I'm laying there, I ntoice that I just live minute to minute ,and say to myself, "okay, now I got through this minute and now this one and this one". I can tell you that I have many hours during some days that I feel lifted by my family (husband and adult daughter). They do so much for me and try so hard, so I try to put all that in perspective. I say to myself, "just look at the love in this world, it IS possible and it is possible that I'm loveable too". So in the darkest of times, when I can't get ahold of my T or my three emergency phone numbers I can rely on that as solace.
Please, please know that you don't have to beat yourself up over this because it only gets worse, at least it does when I do that. And the eating thing - mashed potatoes, bananas, and yogart are on my list of favs. Anything mushy, no chewing or crunching please. I take a multi-vitamin and dring lots of water. BTW, which protein drink suits you? I haven't found one that doesn't taste like liquid vitamins.
So my heart goes out to you - really, really! I want you to know I hear you. Take care of yourself and totally be kind to yourself even when you don't want to - no "shoulds" here. Stay in touch. As a newbie, I can already see the outpouring of comfort on this board.
Take care,
Little Soul
Posted by Partlycloudy on December 31, 2008, at 10:00:31
In reply to Re: Letting go of family and home, posted by Little Soul on December 31, 2008, at 9:30:37
You're right, there IS a lot of caring on this board. I treasure the comfort I derive from here; it means so much to me. Part of that comfort is the shared experience.
I'm doing OK with protein shakes from Naked, Odwalla, and the Boost (chocolate) drinks, though they are really sweet. My T also encouraged me to go all out on the comfort foods front, no matter how fatty or salty they might be, so I have a couple of boxes of Kraft dinner for fixin'.
Thanks for reaching out to me.
pc
This is the end of the thread.
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