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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 23 of 23. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by sunnydays on January 14, 2008, at 22:01:57
The subject line says it all. Will he be there tomorrow? What if he's different? I don't want him to be different. And the connection might not be there right away, which scares me. I wish I had more of a sense of continuity with this relationship. I just don't know how to make it happen.
Anxious!!!! Just breathe...
sunnydays
Posted by Dinah on January 14, 2008, at 22:27:00
In reply to anxious... will he be there? will he be the same?, posted by sunnydays on January 14, 2008, at 22:01:57
He'll be there. And he'll fundamentally be the same. It may not be perfect attunement, or it may be, but whether it is or not, you'll get back to where you were soon enough.
I expected it to be bad after Christmas, and it wasn't at all. My therapist maybe expecting that it might be bad made it ok. I'm not sure about that.
Posted by Daisym on January 14, 2008, at 23:27:30
In reply to Re: anxious... will he be there? will he be the s » sunnydays, posted by Dinah on January 14, 2008, at 22:27:00
He'll be there. It might be hard at first.
You know how kids are doing pretty OK and then their parent shows up to get them from school or daycare and they just fall apart? It might be like that - all that stored up anxiety and all the little things that went wrong and made you unhappy...and he wasn't there...and it felt like forever...and now...finally...
And out it all comes.
So just go with whatever and know that this is only one session and over all your relationship is strong and things will feel close and connected soon enough.
Let us know how it goes.
Posted by muffled on January 14, 2008, at 23:37:05
In reply to anxious... will he be there? will he be the same?, posted by sunnydays on January 14, 2008, at 22:01:57
Posted by JoniS on January 15, 2008, at 8:16:12
In reply to anxious... will he be there? will he be the same?, posted by sunnydays on January 14, 2008, at 22:01:57
Sunny
Hope it went well. I imagine it might be a lot like Daisy said. - Anyway that's how I picture it will be if I ever go back.
wishing you well
Joni
Posted by Phillipa on January 15, 2008, at 13:22:10
In reply to Re: anxious... will he be there? will he be the same? » sunnydays, posted by JoniS on January 15, 2008, at 8:16:12
Was he the same? Did he meet your needs? And support you? Phillipa
Posted by MissK on January 15, 2008, at 17:46:22
In reply to anxious... will he be there? will he be the same?, posted by sunnydays on January 14, 2008, at 22:01:57
It's been my experience that my T doesn't really change that much, that it's more myself that is that changes or is different.
Hope your fears were eased.
Posted by sunnydays on January 15, 2008, at 20:27:06
In reply to anxious... will he be there? will he be the same?, posted by sunnydays on January 14, 2008, at 22:01:57
....and more or less the same. He said it was really nice to see me back, in this really warm voice, with a smile, and that was so nice. It felt like he really meant it.
We talked a little about how it is really hard for me to remember anything when I come back to school - I get on the plane, fall asleep, and wake up in a different world. And it's like I never left. And I had a hard time talking about being home, because I feel no connection to being there. I don't understand why, and it feels weird.
My T seemed very interested and said that part of it is the trauma stuff and that part of it is not having a stable parental model, someone I can depend on to be the same. So I have trouble believing the world will be the same in three or four days as it was today, and it's hard to remember that far ago.
Does anyone have anything to add to that? Do you know what he might be talking about? I expect I'll bring it up again at some point.
sunnydays
Posted by rskontos on January 15, 2008, at 21:25:18
In reply to he was there.... » sunnydays, posted by sunnydays on January 15, 2008, at 20:27:06
Suunydays, my t/p-doc says the same thing, that I had no stable parent model to trust and so I trust no one and that I might run from him. He says this every time I come. I don't believe the world to be the same or people to be the same. But then again I dont expect anything from anyone so not to be disappointed. And if he does the least thing from he knows I will disappear. Like today, I mixed up the appointment time, showed up WAY early and he rearranged the time so he could go ahead and meet with me, I got upset and said I would come back but he had already sent the other young man away. I said why would you do that, he said I know he will be back, you I don't know if you can make it back or will. It is my fault anyway for changing your appt. time so much. I was floored he took the blame. It was my fault. I got home and found the appt, card. I had the wrong time. I was 2 hours early. He saw me anyway. He is trying to retrain me to see him as a stable parent. It will take a while as neither of my parents were stable. So I do understand what your t is saying. When your parents are not stable you trust no one to be stable or your world to remain stable. Does this make more sense. As part of your therapy you should start to see him or your t as the stable one. at least that is what mine says. I can't even remember my appt time much less if the world is the same LOL.....
Glad your T is a warm smiley type..... And of course he means it.... I think the problem is connection.....you haven't a connection to school when you gone right? To you, your gone and so school is gone from your mind right? But not your T he isn't gone? Your t you still think about, I am guessing.. and that is a good thing I think.
rsk
Posted by Phillipa on January 15, 2008, at 22:31:25
In reply to Re: he was there.... » sunnydays, posted by rskontos on January 15, 2008, at 21:25:18
Does it ever go away as neither of my parents were there or stable Mom died when I was l7 and I raised myself she was sick from the time I was two and I'm 61 today and still afraid. Love Phillipa
Posted by Daisym on January 15, 2008, at 23:48:52
In reply to Re: he was there.... » rskontos, posted by Phillipa on January 15, 2008, at 22:31:25
I'm glad he was there and warm and welcoming. :)
Finding a way to stay connected and have continuity is pretty hard. I think we developed habits of bracing ourselves everytime we returned home, whether we were gone an hour or a week. You just never knew what kind of response you would get to things. So it is pretty ingrained and part of who we are.
But the next experiences you are having with your therapist will likely go a long way to undoing this. It the meantime it is scary and painful.
I'm glad you are talking about it.
Posted by rskontos on January 16, 2008, at 7:52:01
In reply to Re: he was there.... » rskontos, posted by Phillipa on January 15, 2008, at 22:31:25
Does what go away, I am afraid I don't understand your question? I too raised myself as my mother was not only unstable but cruel, moody, delusional, and a unreachable. Very scary at times and you had to be on guard....my father was on another planet, unreachable and did not want to be a father so wasn't.
So in psychotherapy the therapist assumes the role of a stable parent in order for you to have that stable role in order for you to move on and get that finally in your life. Then hopefully one day you are able to transition from that. So yes I assume you are able to to move and and it goes away.
Is this what you mean....I am not sure I understand really what you are asking? rsk
Posted by Phillipa on January 16, 2008, at 18:31:36
In reply to Re: he was there.... » Phillipa, posted by rskontos on January 16, 2008, at 7:52:01
Yup you got it too bad my therapist believes in the here and now and leave the past behind that it's over and done with. Had the same type of Father as you. Oh well at my age forward before death. Love Phillipa not making light of this really just sorry when younger they didn't really use theraphy that I knew of anyway. Maybe Freudian?
Posted by star008 on January 16, 2008, at 23:11:02
In reply to Re: he was there.... » sunnydays, posted by rskontos on January 15, 2008, at 21:25:18
rsk
you found a gem in a p-doc.. i am so happy for you.. is he being your t too?? I would like to find that.. it would be easier.. maybe??
Posted by rskontos on January 17, 2008, at 9:10:51
In reply to Re: he was there.... » rskontos, posted by star008 on January 16, 2008, at 23:11:02
Thanks star, Yes he is my t too.....it is easier if they are the right one. He can prescribe meds and he knows what is going on without needing updates....He is a smart one that Dr. X......rsk
Sorry things are so hard for you now.....I am having hard time finding many words but am there in spirit......
Posted by sunnydays on January 17, 2008, at 17:28:33
In reply to Re: he was there.... » sunnydays, posted by rskontos on January 15, 2008, at 21:25:18
> Suunydays, my t/p-doc says the same thing, that I had no stable parent model to trust and so I trust no one and that I might run from him. He says this every time I come. I don't believe the world to be the same or people to be the same. But then again I dont expect anything from anyone so not to be disappointed.
*** I'm sorry you feel that way. I feel like I am continually disappointed, so I think sometimes I expect/wish for unrealistic things from others. I don't think it really is an expectation, though, more like a really strong want.
And if he does the least thing from he knows I will disappear. Like today, I mixed up the appointment time, showed up WAY early and he rearranged the time so he could go ahead and meet with me, I got upset and said I would come back but he had already sent the other young man away. I said why would you do that, he said I know he will be back, you I don't know if you can make it back or will. It is my fault anyway for changing your appt. time so much. I was floored he took the blame.
**** He cares about you. He realizes that it is hard for you when he changes your appointment time and was recognizing that that was making it hard for you to feel safe. I think he was really trying to show you he cares about you and that you are a very important person that he wants to see.
It was my fault. I got home and found the appt, card. I had the wrong time. I was 2 hours early. He saw me anyway. He is trying to retrain me to see him as a stable parent. It will take a while as neither of my parents were stable. So I do understand what your t is saying. When your parents are not stable you trust no one to be stable or your world to remain stable. Does this make more sense.
**** Yeah, I never know what mood my parents will be in when I am at home from one moment to the next. I never know whether they will be loving or critical, happy or angry, etc.
As part of your therapy you should start to see him or your t as the stable one. at least that is what mine says. I can't even remember my appt time much less if the world is the same LOL.....
**** I do see him as fairly stable, but there are still so many things that scare me. Every time he doesn't answer an email I freak out that he's sick or dead, when really he told me that when he's busy he doesn't respond. He forgets to call me when we set up phone sessions, just because his memory for that kind of thing isn't the greatest. And he was injured last year for over a month, which really shook me. So there are little breaks and ruptures. But I think he wants me to see that even when there are those things, he is still fundamentally the same person, he acts the same, feels the same way about me, etc. Which I am starting to get more of a sense of.
>
> Glad your T is a warm smiley type..... And of course he means it.... I think the problem is connection.....you haven't a connection to school when you gone right? To you, your gone and so school is gone from your mind right?*** Well, if I have schoolwork or something, I'll be stressing about getting it done, but it doesn't feel like school the place is there, just like there is some sense of impending trouble or doom if I don't get the work done.
But not your T he isn't gone? Your t you still think about, I am guessing.. and that is a good thing I think.
*** I think it's good too. Sometimes I don't feel like he's there, and then sometimes I miss him intensely. But you're right, that probably is good.
sunnydays
Posted by sunnydays on January 17, 2008, at 17:30:49
In reply to Re: he was there.... » rskontos, posted by Phillipa on January 15, 2008, at 22:31:25
> Does it ever go away as neither of my parents were there or stable Mom died when I was l7 and I raised myself she was sick from the time I was two and I'm 61 today and still afraid. Love Phillipa
I think the point of therapy is to make the fear go away to a degree. To help you identify reasons for the fear, and then ways of better coping with it and managing it so it doesn't impact your life in a crippling way. I'm sorry you are so afraid. Some of it might be biological too. My anxiety is a combination of unstable parents and biology I think. At an early enough age, having unstable parents can fundamentally change one's brain chemistry so that the organization of the brain is different than it would otherwise be if the parent was more stable.
sunnydays
Posted by sunnydays on January 17, 2008, at 17:35:05
In reply to Re: he was there...., posted by Daisym on January 15, 2008, at 23:48:52
> I'm glad he was there and warm and welcoming. :)
**** Me too. When we were walking back to his office he kept looking back at me (I always walk behind him) and smiling, and I think he was trying really hard to let me see that he was still the same and hadn't changed.
>
> Finding a way to stay connected and have continuity is pretty hard. I think we developed habits of bracing ourselves everytime we returned home, whether we were gone an hour or a week. You just never knew what kind of response you would get to things. So it is pretty ingrained and part of who we are.**** Yeah. I posted above to Phillipa about the brain chemistry changes that occur too. I don't know too much about it, but I am taking a biopsychology class this semester that might answer some of that for me.
>
> But the next experiences you are having with your therapist will likely go a long way to undoing this. It the meantime it is scary and painful.
> I'm glad you are talking about it.
>**** I'm glad too. It just feels like it's taking so LONG. But my T says that since I'm only 21, there's no way I'll be done with all my 'stuff' by now, that no one's done with all their 'stuff' this early in life... that some of my 'stuff' might not even come up until I have romantic relationships and things like that. And that scares me terribly, but at the same time it's good to hear that I'm a little ahead of the game so to speak. I mean, it's not like I pressure myself or anything... :)
sunnydays
Posted by Phillipa on January 17, 2008, at 18:27:38
In reply to Re: he was there...., posted by sunnydays on January 17, 2008, at 17:30:49
I feel this is true as you learn to react in a fight or flight manner in my case hence the anxiety. Read your last post first and would love to know what you learn in your class. Yes you are so young with many changes ahead to look forward to. Sunnydays is lucky to get the opportunity to start her adult life with sorting out her issues. Congrats to you. Phillipa
Posted by sunnydays on January 17, 2008, at 19:16:18
In reply to Re: he was there.... » sunnydays, posted by Phillipa on January 17, 2008, at 18:27:38
I don't feel lucky. :( I wish it didn't feel like there were so many HUGE issues to sort out. But I guess it's cool that I'm still young. Sometimes I feel like I don't have a future, but that's the PTSD.
sunnydays
Posted by rskontos on January 17, 2008, at 19:31:55
In reply to Re: he was there...., posted by sunnydays on January 17, 2008, at 17:28:33
SunnyDays, you know something from the thread that Miss K started and a post by Seldom got me thinking about this. And with what you said, what I have begun to think that therapy and all this is to help with (the transference thing) is that in looking at them (the T's) as a stable parent when they are gone or hurt or at work or wherever they are when we are not around them, they will remain who they are essential to us. That is how we are to begin to see a different way than our parent or parents were to us. And we slowly begin to understand and replace that damaged image in our minds with the one that they have created. If they give an ideal, one in which they are always perfect and never mess up, then when someone IRL does we won't be able to cope any better than we did when our damaged parents gave us their orginial version of how the world works. So in as much as a T replaces them they still must show how to function within the scope of a imperfect world so the relationship with them (the T;s) will not always be perfect to help set up the same scenario that allows us all the situations we will need to help us eventually cope on our own. I hope I make some sense as this idea is just germinating and will I admit go through more changes but I am getting the idea I think.
I hope this helps some. But I do see how you feel and can relate to such a degree. rsk
Posted by sunnydays on January 17, 2008, at 21:32:53
In reply to Re: he was there....Sunnydays » sunnydays, posted by rskontos on January 17, 2008, at 19:31:55
I think I completely agree with you. But that doesn't stop the WANTING for someone in my life to be perfect and all-loving, and never to fail me. Not having it when I was a kid, I feel like I just want it even stronger. I know the goal, I just don't know how to get there. I try and try to force myself to just be realistic and understand all this stuff, and I do understand it rationally, but the little girl is sad and wants someone perfect and that's all she wants and she doesn't want people to keep telling her to be realistic. Sometimes I just want it to be ok to want. I don't expect it to happen, I just want it. So much. I want someone to love me and take care of me.
sunnydays
Posted by rskontos on January 18, 2008, at 10:37:36
In reply to Re: he was there....Sunnydays » rskontos, posted by sunnydays on January 17, 2008, at 21:32:53
Oh sunnydays, it is ok to want, and to dream, and I do understand that wish of that little girl. I often sob over the loss of the innocence of the little girls we all were or boys, that we were not allowed to have it. I realize now I never possessed my innocence for very long and that is sad. My own children have been allowed to have theirs. It is a gift and obligation of parents and sadly there are some parents that rob their children of theirs and we were those children. So yes dream wish and mourn the loss. It is ok. In fact I feel we must. In order to heal we have to. We have to understand that part of us. But we do have the duality of being an adult too that must live in todays world too. And that makes it even tougher. And hence our therapist must enter and help us with all of this because I think alone we can not do it. We need their help . But even the most perfect of parents that do give their children everything right the first go round don't do everything right and shouldn't. Because then children don't learn how to deal with conflict. As an trained educator, conflict management is something parents must teach their children in a structure safe environment. That is something I think we missed too. So part of the struggle we deal with in therapy is learning that too. Parents must show their children their conflicts and how they resolve them. And our therapist must do the same. I think this is when alot of us rebell against our therapist. We want the safe secure world of therapy to exist always. Anyway, go ahead and want and dream of that. Because I think it is important too. But knowing in the adult part of you, that is isn't always part of an imperfect world you then will be fine.
And you know sunnydays, I think you will. You are doing some great thinking and soul searching. With that and your t you will get to where you are going. I feel it deep down. Good luck.
rsk
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