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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by Dinah on August 15, 2002, at 10:57:40
Can anyone compare and contrast these for me?
Sometimes I think my dissociation is self-hypnosis, and I'm not altogether sure what the difference is. Moreover, when I try to meditate, I think I slip over into self-hypnosis. Is that what it's meant to be, or am I doing it wrong?
Thanks for whatever clarity you can give me.
Dinah
P.S. I asked my therapist about the difference between dissociation and self hypnosis and he's still thinking about it.
Posted by judy1 on August 15, 2002, at 11:48:41
In reply to Self hypnosis, meditation, dissociation, posted by Dinah on August 15, 2002, at 10:57:40
There are probably few differences between the states except that meditation and self-hypnosis are results of concious decisions to achieve that state, while dissociation is an unconcious coping style (and therefore for me more frightening because I don't have control). I also think dissociation on the far end of the spectrum involves an amnestic quality, where you lose actual time- hours sometimes days. This doesn't happen with self-hypnosis or meditation. I am talking about the far end of dissociation, not the common type that everyone experiences- like forgetting how you got somewhere driving. Hope this helps- judy
Posted by Dinah on August 15, 2002, at 12:06:31
In reply to Re: Self hypnosis, meditation, dissociation » Dinah, posted by judy1 on August 15, 2002, at 11:48:41
It does Judy, and it's sort of what I had thought. I think I do it both consciously and as an unconscious defense mechanism. And I've been trying to keep better track of which is which. Because sometimes when I now think I'm self-hypnotizing, I didn't realize before that I was doing it as deliberately as I was. (If that makes any sense at all.)
I've been playing around with it a bit, and trying to gain more control over the process. I have found that I can put myself into a trance or dissociative state to calm myself down and make myself sleep (as an alternative to cutting). And I have also found I can block thoughts and forget about things on purpose. My husband and I were in a disagreement this morning and he said something that I found hurtful. As I was in the process of replying, I consciously tried blocking what he had said and what I was about to say. It worked enormously well. I stopped mid-sentence and I can't recall now what the discussion was about or what stupid thing I was about to say. But I do remember that the incident occurred.
Maybe what I'm trying to do is to bring the whole process further under my control. Because dissociation seems like a useful skill that gotten away from me right now. And I'd like it to just be more of a useful skill, like self hypnosis. And maybe if I can control when I do it on purpose, I can also control not doing it automatically. Hmmm. I'm not sure what on earth I'm saying. But it *seems* like a good idea.
Posted by terra miller on August 15, 2002, at 23:16:38
In reply to Self hypnosis, meditation, dissociation, posted by Dinah on August 15, 2002, at 10:57:40
hi. this is slightly causing steam to come out of my ears as my brain overloads. :-) but some thoughts are that dissociating you cannot consciously choose to do because the definition of dissociate is to "not associate" or keep the information separate. you can't remember remembering. on the other hand, part of your brain that you aren't aware of can initiate dissociating. (more steam out the ears.)
i go into a trance all of the time in therapy. drives me crazy. but it's a way, i think, that i reassociate material. i don't always retain it, but it comes further forward in my recall.
i think when you are in a conversation or event that is painful and you get yourself to listen while "being somewhere else" that this is self hypnosis of sorts. it would be "dissociation" if in the process you failed to recall part of the event or emotion from that event. but it wouldn't be something you chose to do.
now this gets totally skewed and confusing with DID, so i won't even attempt to explain that because it would put more holes in my denial system that i need right now. :-)
meditation involves focusing. it may include self hypnosis of sorts. but typically and generally it involves focusing on a particular issue in order to mull it around in your head or master it or relate to it. i think of it as meditation being an action; self hypnosis is a state.
now i'm really confused. :-) <giggle>
~terra
Posted by Dinah on August 16, 2002, at 5:29:54
In reply to Re: Self hypnosis, meditation, dissociation » Dinah, posted by terra miller on August 15, 2002, at 23:16:38
Hmmm. OK, then I must be doing meditation wrong. I use it as another way to "go away" or empty my brain completely.
I think I'm going to continue honing my self hypnosis skills though so that hopefully the automatic stuff will decrease. So that I can protect my brain and my brain doesn't feel it needs to protect itself. Does that make any sense?
I'll let you know if it works.
Posted by judy1 on August 16, 2002, at 11:48:20
In reply to Re: Self hypnosis, meditation, dissociation » Dinah, posted by terra miller on August 15, 2002, at 23:16:38
terra wrote:
i think when you are in a conversation or event that is painful and you get yourself to listen while "being
somewhere else" that this is self hypnosis of sorts. it would be "dissociation" if in the process you failed to recall
part of the event or emotion from that event. but it wouldn't be something you chose to do.This happens all the time to me in therapy- I dissociate when my therapist brings up a painful subject. I have no idea what she just said, nor do I know what happened. I just hear her say my name and I feel confused and try to cover and fail miserably. I have tried to meditate to calm panic attacks- the deep breathing, etc., but I am always aware of what is going on. I don't try to self-hypnotize myself, I think I would be too frightened. Take care, judy
Posted by Dinah on August 16, 2002, at 14:14:38
In reply to I think this is perfect, posted by judy1 on August 16, 2002, at 11:48:20
He doesn't buy my theory about gaining more control, because he doesn't think that more control over initiating it will lead to more control over stopping it.
He just thinks I'll use it more often.
Ah well. I'll give it some thought. (And then quite probably do what I want to do anyway. Stubborn me.)
Posted by terra miller on August 16, 2002, at 14:15:54
In reply to I think this is perfect, posted by judy1 on August 16, 2002, at 11:48:20
Posted by .tabitha. on August 16, 2002, at 15:13:25
In reply to Re: Self hypnosis, meditation, dissociation » terra miller, posted by Dinah on August 16, 2002, at 5:29:54
> Hmmm. OK, then I must be doing meditation wrong. I use it as another way to "go away" or empty my brain completely.
>Dinah, I wouldn't say you are doing it wrong. There are different types of meditation, and some do aim at producing an empty mind or blissful experience. I'm more interested in awareness meditation (also called insight meditation) where the goal is to remain present and the focus is on the here-and-now, including sensations, emotions, and thoughts. The simplest way to start is to focus lightly on the sensation of the out-breath. When the mind wanders, you gently bring it back. You're just trying to hold awareness, not to produce a particular state.
Just wanted to toss this in.
T
Posted by Dinah on August 16, 2002, at 16:03:56
In reply to Re: Self hypnosis, meditation, dissociation » Dinah, posted by .tabitha. on August 16, 2002, at 15:13:25
Posted by terra miller on August 16, 2002, at 17:58:46
In reply to Re: My therapist disapproves :(, posted by Dinah on August 16, 2002, at 14:14:38
interestingly enough, had a similar discussion with my therapist. i was asking him about certain behaviors and he balked and told me that if he told me that i would work extra hard not to do them instead of actually working through things. and so i wouldn't be helping myself in the end, but prolonging the process. this made sense to me. i hadn't considered that side of it.
terra
Posted by Dinah on August 16, 2002, at 18:39:35
In reply to Re: My therapist disapproves :( » Dinah, posted by terra miller on August 16, 2002, at 17:58:46
I do understand (I think). But it feels so darn good to have control over something I don't usually have control over. I'm not sure I can give that up. At least until I feel confident in it.
This is the end of the thread.
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