![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 9 of 9. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Angel Girl on June 4, 2004, at 3:42:50
Today my sister told me that she misses the old me when we did things together. Jeez, that seems like a lifetime ago, the memories are vague.
I miss the old me too. Where have I gone? Will I ever come back? I just sat there and cried. :(
AG
Posted by Caper on June 4, 2004, at 7:01:02
In reply to Today my sister told me ..., posted by Angel Girl on June 4, 2004, at 3:42:50
Hi Angel Girl,
I couldn't help responding to your post. My mother has said things before during brief "well" periods that made me cry- things like "I feel like I have my girl back"- then I'd get messed up again and feel so bad about hurting her.
I also have a child and to hear him say, "I miss you so much when you're in the hospital, I take your pillow, spray your perfume on it, and hug it when I sleep"- well, that breaks my heart. But even at 10 years old he tells me, "I miss you a lot, but I don't mind if you have to stay awhile if it makes you better."
I'm not sure if this is your first time with mood trouble or what the diagnosis is. BUT, although I know our type of problems are chronic and may tend to return. My point is that I reached a place when I was 23 that was _so_ low for _so_ long I really didn't think things could change for the better. But they did. I got a good doctor, an awesome therapist, and graduated from the school of my dreams, then went on to law school. There I started a slip that hasn't yet let up.
But my point is that there are times when it does get better- in my case for several years and for others one psychological crisis doesn't necessarily mean more further down the road.
Please don't beat yourself up over this. I know I don't always follow my own advice, but try to treat yourself (in your thoughts) as kindly and as understandingly as you would your sister or best friend if they had your problems. You didn't sign up for these problems, they just happened. Do what you know you should (see doc and therapist or whatever) and let your sister know you miss the old days too and that you love her and are trying to get better.
Hope this helps a little.
Caper
Posted by Angel Girl on June 4, 2004, at 9:38:37
In reply to Re: Today my sister told me ... » Angel Girl, posted by Caper on June 4, 2004, at 7:01:02
Hi Caper
I've been on and off depressed since I've been 17 and I'm 50 now, gasp!!!! I've had a rough life and really came ungluded in the summer of 2001. I didn't seek any professional help until Oct 2001, at which point I was told I had severe depression and put on Effexor XR. After starting therapy, my therapist thought I had BPD and sent me for an evaluation but I was then diagnosed with BPII, that was the summer of 2002. I was rapid cycling several times a day and I couldn't handle it. I then starting seeing a different pdoc and was put on mood stabilizers with my Effexor XR. Once up to the appropriate level of the mood stabilizer, my rapid cycling came to a dead halt and left me with depression ever since. Initally I resided in what I call the "black hole" and was extremely suicidal. Thankfully, that has passed but the depression continues on. I'm not near as bad as I was back then but just the same it is chronic. Sometimes I wonder if it'll ever go away. I know I do feel hopeless. I had dumped that therapist because she always belittled me and right now I am actively looking for a new therapist but not having much luck so far. I know that therapy would help me immensely. I think meds can only go so far. I have to learn better ways of dealing with situations and stop being so self-destructive.
I did tell me sister that I missed the old me too. I feel she is within me waiting to get out but I'm not sure I know how to release her at this point. That's where I think therapy can help me. Life like this is HELL and nobody deserves to live this way.
Thanks for your reply and I wish all the best for you in getting better.
AG
Posted by Caper on June 4, 2004, at 13:38:49
In reply to Re: Today my sister told me ... » Caper, posted by Angel Girl on June 4, 2004, at 9:38:37
Hi Angel Girl,
Seems we have some things in common. My depression started very early too (age 7, I'm 31 now) and I have also been diagnosed with Bipolar II. Some docs add on the "rapid cycling" thing and some don't. I should also add that about 17 months ago I started "self-medicating" with alcohol and am now a full-fledged certified alcoholic. Please, please don't let this ever happen to you! I read a statistic that about 60% of bipolars end up addicted to something so please be careful. The mood disorder alone is bad enought but when you add addiction things get downright horrible! None of the meds work right when you're drinking a depressing substance every few hours.
Sorry for the rant but I just wish I could warn everyone in the world- no matter how old or young you are, addiction can get you and you won't see it coming.
As far as therapists go, my advice is shop around as much as you can. Give each one at least a few sessions, but don't let yourself be put down. I also think though, that one of the worst things a therapist can do is to be _too_ nice to a depressed person- they have to be able to prod you a little and make you talk about things you'd rather not sometimes. Otherwise I felt like I was being given permission to wallow in my sorrows..this is just my opinion, of course.
I think a good therapist combines empathy with the ability to call you on it when you're not trying hard enough. With both of my really good therapists there have been times I've been absolutely ENRAGED by some things they said, but later realized I had that emotional reaction because what they said was true! Definitely don't go to a therapist who belittles you or makes you feel put down, but be aware that you won't always hear what you want to hear. If you get angry and storm out (as I did several times) the therapists have seen it before and will not hold a grudge.
One of my favorite expressions from my numerous hospitalizations is "Feelings are not good or bad, feelings just ARE." Remember that and try not to beat yourself up, okay?
On that note, have you ever considered a brief in-patient hospitalization? If your insurance can cover it, a good small private hospital can do a world of good. The group therapy in a good hospital can be amazing! I swear I've learned more from other patients than from the doctors and staff there.
I hope you keep posting if you have anything you want to get off your chest. Best of luck to you!
Caper
> Hi Caper
>
> I've been on and off depressed since I've been 17 and I'm 50 now, gasp!!!! I've had a rough life and really came ungluded in the summer of 2001. I didn't seek any professional help until Oct 2001, at which point I was told I had severe depression and put on Effexor XR. After starting therapy, my therapist thought I had BPD and sent me for an evaluation but I was then diagnosed with BPII, that was the summer of 2002. I was rapid cycling several times a day and I couldn't handle it. I then starting seeing a different pdoc and was put on mood stabilizers with my Effexor XR. Once up to the appropriate level of the mood stabilizer, my rapid cycling came to a dead halt and left me with depression ever since. Initally I resided in what I call the "black hole" and was extremely suicidal. Thankfully, that has passed but the depression continues on. I'm not near as bad as I was back then but just the same it is chronic. Sometimes I wonder if it'll ever go away. I know I do feel hopeless. I had dumped that therapist because she always belittled me and right now I am actively looking for a new therapist but not having much luck so far. I know that therapy would help me immensely. I think meds can only go so far. I have to learn better ways of dealing with situations and stop being so self-destructive.
>
> I did tell me sister that I missed the old me too. I feel she is within me waiting to get out but I'm not sure I know how to release her at this point. That's where I think therapy can help me. Life like this is HELL and nobody deserves to live this way.
>
> Thanks for your reply and I wish all the best for you in getting better.
>
> AG
Posted by Angel Girl on June 5, 2004, at 12:54:41
In reply to Re: Today my sister told me ... » Angel Girl, posted by Caper on June 4, 2004, at 13:38:49
Caper
I'm sorry to hear that you are also an alcoholic. I can't imagine dealing with both things at the same time, especially when alcohol is a depressant. Have you ever tried to quit the alcohol, maybe in a re-hab center? I have the addiction of over spending, so bad that my sister has taken over my finances so that I don't get myself back into tremendous debt as I've already done twice. I've been extremely close to being homeless, especially the last time. Thankfully for me, my Mom was able to pay off all my debts but of course, now I live with the guilt that she did that for me. I wish you all the best with yours. Don't be so hard on yourself. Somehow, you'll find a way to improve your situation although I know it won't be easy for you.
I'm looking for a therapist who is compassionate but yet will tell me what I'm doing wrong and help me to make the right decisions and how to handle situations that I don't handle very well now, ie: relationships. I don't want to be yelled at or belittled and I don't think that is the right way for anybody to have therapy. I want someone who can hopefully understand me yet teach me appropriate behaviors and of course, I know I will hear things that are hard to hear and I'll have to talk about things that are difficult for me to talk about. Somehow I'll manage with both things. I know that they are necessary in order to get better.
I've recently read that other than word of mouth, the best way to find a therapist is through a referral service. Is this what you have done, or what method did you use? How do most people find a therapist?
I love your saying 'Feelings aren't good or bad, they just Are'. I'll have to remember that. I'm just trying to accept that my feelings count, regardless of what they are, doesn't mean that I don't have to work on them though. God knows I have a LONG road of therapy ahead for me.
To be honest, being an in-patient scares me to death. I think I would be more depressed than I am now. I'm panic stricken to be in unfamiliar places with unfamiliar people. I would have to be taking my Xanax constantly. I do however, go to a group therapy at a hospital and I'm really enjoying it and learning new ways to cope. You're right, it is good to hear what other people with depression are dealing with. It helps you to see you're not alone and maybe they've learned a coping skill that I haven't. I feel I have somewhat a bond with other people who are also suffering because I strongly believe that unless you've been in our shoes, you can't even phathom what it is like.
Good luck to you too.
AG
> Hi Angel Girl,
>
> Seems we have some things in common. My depression started very early too (age 7, I'm 31 now) and I have also been diagnosed with Bipolar II. Some docs add on the "rapid cycling" thing and some don't. I should also add that about 17 months ago I started "self-medicating" with alcohol and am now a full-fledged certified alcoholic. Please, please don't let this ever happen to you! I read a statistic that about 60% of bipolars end up addicted to something so please be careful. The mood disorder alone is bad enought but when you add addiction things get downright horrible! None of the meds work right when you're drinking a depressing substance every few hours.
>
> Sorry for the rant but I just wish I could warn everyone in the world- no matter how old or young you are, addiction can get you and you won't see it coming.
>
> As far as therapists go, my advice is shop around as much as you can. Give each one at least a few sessions, but don't let yourself be put down. I also think though, that one of the worst things a therapist can do is to be _too_ nice to a depressed person- they have to be able to prod you a little and make you talk about things you'd rather not sometimes. Otherwise I felt like I was being given permission to wallow in my sorrows..this is just my opinion, of course.
>
> I think a good therapist combines empathy with the ability to call you on it when you're not trying hard enough. With both of my really good therapists there have been times I've been absolutely ENRAGED by some things they said, but later realized I had that emotional reaction because what they said was true! Definitely don't go to a therapist who belittles you or makes you feel put down, but be aware that you won't always hear what you want to hear. If you get angry and storm out (as I did several times) the therapists have seen it before and will not hold a grudge.
>
> One of my favorite expressions from my numerous hospitalizations is "Feelings are not good or bad, feelings just ARE." Remember that and try not to beat yourself up, okay?
>
> On that note, have you ever considered a brief in-patient hospitalization? If your insurance can cover it, a good small private hospital can do a world of good. The group therapy in a good hospital can be amazing! I swear I've learned more from other patients than from the doctors and staff there.
>
> I hope you keep posting if you have anything you want to get off your chest. Best of luck to you!
>
> Caper
>
>
Posted by Caper on June 6, 2004, at 6:15:20
In reply to Re: Today my sister told me ..., posted by Angel Girl on June 5, 2004, at 12:54:41
Hi Angel Girl,
Hope you are doing well. In answer to your previous post:
Yes, unfortunately I have tried in-patient alcohol detox numerous times, but it has yet to last more than a few weeks- it is just so easy to pick up that bottle for an hour or two of oblivion! I take hope from the fact that most people don't quit until after many attempts though. Right now, I'm off the hard liquour and using wine as sparingly as I can. I have visit with a good friend (whom I have not seen in years) coming up a week from today and don't want to miss it, but after that I'm checking myself into a hospital I've never been to before, one that was recommended by both my current therapist and my former psychiatrist (who is an absolute sweetheart! I owe her tons of money but she doesn't harass me and she's still always there for me when I need her, even though I'm not technically her patient anymore.)
Regarding how I found my psychiatrists and therapists:
I was really really POOR when I first sought help for my depression in 1995 so I had no choice but to go to the county "income-based" clinic. But I lucked out- my therapist was amazing and I'd still be seeing her now but she moved far away after about a year. The psychiatrist at the county place is good too....very soothing, but it's frustrating trying to get an appt. because he's so busy.
After I moved to finish my college degree I tried a university hospital psych clinic but just couldn't connect with anyone so I stopped going. Then when I started "slipping" in law school I called physician referral number and got the number of a really good psychiatrist who does therapy as well as meds. (She is the one I referred to earlier).
To make a long story short ( or am I too late? *smile*) you really just have to shop around.
I'm glad you like the "Feelings aren't good or bad, feelings just ARE". It helped me a lot. We feel bad enough already without feeling guilty for our feelings, for heaven's sake! Another line from one of my hospitalizations is "Would of, Could of, Should of." About not beating yourself up for the past. What's done is done, and the focus should be on today- as hard as that may be.
As far is inpatient, my opinion is if you already have a good group therapy to go to, you probably are getting the real benefit of hospitalization already. UNLESS...you start to feel like you might hurt yourself. If that ever happens, please, please, seek help.
I'm not going to lie, inpatient programs are scary as hell- but only for about the first twelve hours. Then you begin to see that the others are mostly just like you- people needing help and seeking it. At least 75% of the people in the hospital you would never ever know of their problems if you met them on the "outside". Plus (hope this doesn't sound cruel) you'll see people much worse off than you- and it will give you some feeling of relief.
The patients who have been there for a few days and know the routine are great about taking new people under their wings and making them feel more comfortable. This was done for me, and I had the chance to do it for someone else recently. The poor woman was shaking and crying and I just walked over, introduced myself and said "this is a safe place, they'll help you, it'll get easier and do you want a hug?" She said yes and it was the best feeling in the world that I made a scary (but brave) thing she was doing less scary. I really think we can do so much for ourselves, if we open up. That's why I like groups so much.
The worst thing about inpatient is having your things gone through and having some taken away- it makes you feel bad. But it's not just for your safety but for others' who may be suicidal. My favorite quote from a nurse is "you'd be surprised what people could get up to with this dental floss". *smile*
Anyway, I wish you the very best, and if you ever do consider inpatient and want more info on what it's like, feel free to ask. Caper@playful.com is my e-mail. If I don't answer it's because I'm back in the detox/hospital myself.
Take care of you and be kind to yourself!
Caper
> Caper
>
> I'm sorry to hear that you are also an alcoholic. I can't imagine dealing with both things at the same time, especially when alcohol is a depressant. Have you ever tried to quit the alcohol, maybe in a re-hab center? I have the addiction of over spending, so bad that my sister has taken over my finances so that I don't get myself back into tremendous debt as I've already done twice. I've been extremely close to being homeless, especially the last time. Thankfully for me, my Mom was able to pay off all my debts but of course, now I live with the guilt that she did that for me. I wish you all the best with yours. Don't be so hard on yourself. Somehow, you'll find a way to improve your situation although I know it won't be easy for you.
>
> I'm looking for a therapist who is compassionate but yet will tell me what I'm doing wrong and help me to make the right decisions and how to handle situations that I don't handle very well now, ie: relationships. I don't want to be yelled at or belittled and I don't think that is the right way for anybody to have therapy. I want someone who can hopefully understand me yet teach me appropriate behaviors and of course, I know I will hear things that are hard to hear and I'll have to talk about things that are difficult for me to talk about. Somehow I'll manage with both things. I know that they are necessary in order to get better.
>
> I've recently read that other than word of mouth, the best way to find a therapist is through a referral service. Is this what you have done, or what method did you use? How do most people find a therapist?
>
> I love your saying 'Feelings aren't good or bad, they just Are'. I'll have to remember that. I'm just trying to accept that my feelings count, regardless of what they are, doesn't mean that I don't have to work on them though. God knows I have a LONG road of therapy ahead for me.
>
> To be honest, being an in-patient scares me to death. I think I would be more depressed than I am now. I'm panic stricken to be in unfamiliar places with unfamiliar people. I would have to be taking my Xanax constantly. I do however, go to a group therapy at a hospital and I'm really enjoying it and learning new ways to cope. You're right, it is good to hear what other people with depression are dealing with. It helps you to see you're not alone and maybe they've learned a coping skill that I haven't. I feel I have somewhat a bond with other people who are also suffering because I strongly believe that unless you've been in our shoes, you can't even phathom what it is like.
>
> Good luck to you too.
>
> AG
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > Hi Angel Girl,
> >
> > Seems we have some things in common. My depression started very early too (age 7, I'm 31 now) and I have also been diagnosed with Bipolar II. Some docs add on the "rapid cycling" thing and some don't. I should also add that about 17 months ago I started "self-medicating" with alcohol and am now a full-fledged certified alcoholic. Please, please don't let this ever happen to you! I read a statistic that about 60% of bipolars end up addicted to something so please be careful. The mood disorder alone is bad enought but when you add addiction things get downright horrible! None of the meds work right when you're drinking a depressing substance every few hours.
> >
> > Sorry for the rant but I just wish I could warn everyone in the world- no matter how old or young you are, addiction can get you and you won't see it coming.
> >
> > As far as therapists go, my advice is shop around as much as you can. Give each one at least a few sessions, but don't let yourself be put down. I also think though, that one of the worst things a therapist can do is to be _too_ nice to a depressed person- they have to be able to prod you a little and make you talk about things you'd rather not sometimes. Otherwise I felt like I was being given permission to wallow in my sorrows..this is just my opinion, of course.
> >
> > I think a good therapist combines empathy with the ability to call you on it when you're not trying hard enough. With both of my really good therapists there have been times I've been absolutely ENRAGED by some things they said, but later realized I had that emotional reaction because what they said was true! Definitely don't go to a therapist who belittles you or makes you feel put down, but be aware that you won't always hear what you want to hear. If you get angry and storm out (as I did several times) the therapists have seen it before and will not hold a grudge.
> >
> > One of my favorite expressions from my numerous hospitalizations is "Feelings are not good or bad, feelings just ARE." Remember that and try not to beat yourself up, okay?
> >
> > On that note, have you ever considered a brief in-patient hospitalization? If your insurance can cover it, a good small private hospital can do a world of good. The group therapy in a good hospital can be amazing! I swear I've learned more from other patients than from the doctors and staff there.
> >
> > I hope you keep posting if you have anything you want to get off your chest. Best of luck to you!
> >
> > Caper
> >
> >
>
>
>
Posted by Caper on June 6, 2004, at 6:23:10
In reply to Re: Today my sister told me ... » Angel Girl, posted by Caper on June 6, 2004, at 6:15:20
I forgot to mention the best thing about inpatient treatment (just in case you ever decide to try it). The best thing is you don't have to _pretend_ anymore. You can drop whatever "I'm okay" acts you put on for the world and really just let yourself feel. Pretending to be okay to spare other's feelings is so exhausting!
One more thing: the environment in inpatient really is not nearly as "down" or depressing as you'd think. We're all just people trying to get better and we seem to be good at retaining our senses of humor and compassion for others.
Best to you,
Caper
Posted by Caper on June 6, 2004, at 6:26:02
In reply to P.S. » Caper, posted by Caper on June 6, 2004, at 6:23:10
Posted by Angel Girl on June 7, 2004, at 19:06:41
In reply to Re: Today my sister told me ... » Angel Girl, posted by Caper on June 6, 2004, at 6:15:20
Hi Caper
I'm not all that familiar with how de-tox works but don't you get a sponser that you can call when you're feeling the overwhelming desire to drink? Maybe that might of helped you? At least you're making some progress by eliminating the liquor and just drinking wine sparingly. That's a step in the right direction. When the right time comes and you feel stronger, you will be successful.
Does your friend know of your problems? Why are you going into a hospital?
That's the route I'm using too, is calling a physician referral service. I did have a couple of recommended pdocs. One hasn't returned any of my calls in the last couple of weeks so I guess I won't be seeing him and the other one is way more expensive that I can afford. I'm extremely POOR and MUST find someone who is totally paid by the government. That's EXTREMELY hard to find but unfortunately I don't have any other options. It certainly decreases the number of possibilities for me.
I think my days of harming myself in a physical way are behind me. Hopefully, if it returns, it won't be as bad as the last time and I would *want* to get help, unlike the last time.
That was a very touching thing you did for that woman. I'm sure she appreciated it more than you'll ever know. I'm sure it made you feel better too knowing that you were able to help someone else feel a little more at ease in such a scary situation. I'm not sure I could actually do that, I'm SOOOOOO shy. I would want to but my extreme shyness would probably hold me back. :(
Thanks for your e-mail addy. I hope you have a wonderful visit with your friend and I wish you all the best for when you go back into the hospital and of course, for your recovery. It must be a good feeling to not have to keep saying *I'm ok* all the time. I say that to my family every time they ask, which is every day. Sometimes I wonder if they really believe me but they don't prod me thankfully.
BTW, how long will you be in the hospital for?
AG
> Hi Angel Girl,
>
> Hope you are doing well. In answer to your previous post:
>
> Yes, unfortunately I have tried in-patient alcohol detox numerous times, but it has yet to last more than a few weeks- it is just so easy to pick up that bottle for an hour or two of oblivion! I take hope from the fact that most people don't quit until after many attempts though. Right now, I'm off the hard liquour and using wine as sparingly as I can. I have visit with a good friend (whom I have not seen in years) coming up a week from today and don't want to miss it, but after that I'm checking myself into a hospital I've never been to before, one that was recommended by both my current therapist and my former psychiatrist (who is an absolute sweetheart! I owe her tons of money but she doesn't harass me and she's still always there for me when I need her, even though I'm not technically her patient anymore.)
>
> Regarding how I found my psychiatrists and therapists:
>
> I was really really POOR when I first sought help for my depression in 1995 so I had no choice but to go to the county "income-based" clinic. But I lucked out- my therapist was amazing and I'd still be seeing her now but she moved far away after about a year. The psychiatrist at the county place is good too....very soothing, but it's frustrating trying to get an appt. because he's so busy.
>
> After I moved to finish my college degree I tried a university hospital psych clinic but just couldn't connect with anyone so I stopped going. Then when I started "slipping" in law school I called physician referral number and got the number of a really good psychiatrist who does therapy as well as meds. (She is the one I referred to earlier).
>
> To make a long story short ( or am I too late? *smile*) you really just have to shop around.
>
> I'm glad you like the "Feelings aren't good or bad, feelings just ARE". It helped me a lot. We feel bad enough already without feeling guilty for our feelings, for heaven's sake! Another line from one of my hospitalizations is "Would of, Could of, Should of." About not beating yourself up for the past. What's done is done, and the focus should be on today- as hard as that may be.
>
> As far is inpatient, my opinion is if you already have a good group therapy to go to, you probably are getting the real benefit of hospitalization already. UNLESS...you start to feel like you might hurt yourself. If that ever happens, please, please, seek help.
>
> I'm not going to lie, inpatient programs are scary as hell- but only for about the first twelve hours. Then you begin to see that the others are mostly just like you- people needing help and seeking it. At least 75% of the people in the hospital you would never ever know of their problems if you met them on the "outside". Plus (hope this doesn't sound cruel) you'll see people much worse off than you- and it will give you some feeling of relief.
>
> The patients who have been there for a few days and know the routine are great about taking new people under their wings and making them feel more comfortable. This was done for me, and I had the chance to do it for someone else recently. The poor woman was shaking and crying and I just walked over, introduced myself and said "this is a safe place, they'll help you, it'll get easier and do you want a hug?" She said yes and it was the best feeling in the world that I made a scary (but brave) thing she was doing less scary. I really think we can do so much for ourselves, if we open up. That's why I like groups so much.
>
> The worst thing about inpatient is having your things gone through and having some taken away- it makes you feel bad. But it's not just for your safety but for others' who may be suicidal. My favorite quote from a nurse is "you'd be surprised what people could get up to with this dental floss". *smile*
>
> Anyway, I wish you the very best, and if you ever do consider inpatient and want more info on what it's like, feel free to ask. Caper@playful.com is my e-mail. If I don't answer it's because I'm back in the detox/hospital myself.
>
> Take care of you and be kind to yourself!
>
> Caper
>
This is the end of the thread.
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