Posted by tealady on October 12, 2003, at 18:13:32
In reply to Re: female hormones » tealady, posted by JLx on October 12, 2003, at 9:44:32
> > Lee has got it wrong IMO. (I should quote you some of Larrian's comments but I'd better not...just say she reckon Lee has got his biochemistry all wrong)
>
> I suppose that's why he's NOT in the mainstream! ;) His approach must work for some women though, the question I'd have then is why, if the underlying theory is wrong.My guess is some women need the cortisol etc. and some of the progesterone does convert to estrogen (if lucky), ..the conversion would be individual..I think I gave an example of one woman who appeared to convert a lot to estrogen. There are "typical" pathways followed and sometimes other pathways followed..it's individual.
Also you never know but there may be other thing are bodies use progesterone for...it makes sense to me..they just haven't discovered it as yet. The known stuff here is probably just the tip of the iceberg.
That's why I really like to hear/read of folk's individual experiences..they are real
I've found that most women who have success with progesterone, usually cycle it..like days 12 to 26..and only take for a few months at a time.
Most unsuccessful take constantly for over a year...probably their cortisol levels just build up too high after this..then they start showing signs of cushings>
> > OK, this is MY understanding of how it works briefly...
> > Estradiol begins to rise day 5ish, and starts to surge day 10 inducing ovulation around day 12-14
> > If your estrogen levels got high enough so you did ovulate you produce progesterone to thicken the lining for receiving the ovum. This is the luteal phase...the problem part. ..the PMS etc part is when the progesterone rises/falls...the progesterone can cause swings in estrogen..larrian takes this a bit further by suggesting the swings in estradiol can alter thyroid binding globulin..which alters tsh..which altrs sensitivity to salt..which causes bloating..and if we don't have adequatre serotonin thru good diet(like we consume too many junk carbs), we get moody, depressed .... It's probably a heap more complicated <g>
>
> One thing that's more complicated is being in the uncertain time of peri/menopause. I'll be glad when it's just done! I've been in PERImenopause now for about 7 years.
>
> > using low dose estrogen sends signals back to the adrenals to take a rest.....
>
> > "Hormones and the Mind" is a book I did buy which explains how Dr Klaiber, a psychoneuroendocrinologist used hormone therapy
>
> Was this a good book?Well it's a couple of years since I read it. I liked it at the time, as I had always thought my hormonal levels should be treated instead of just being handed out AD's ..but docs are scared of estrogen, due to cancer etc, and for some reason seem to think antiD's are akin to jelly beans for women <g>
I used to find them difficult to tolerate.
I think I like this book at the time as it was agreeing with what I had always suspected for me, that if you get the hormonal levels corrected the depression will lift, or at least his patients could then respond more normally to the antiD's.>
> > Progesterone cream probably if used long term..like over one year probably make you fat as it increases testosterone/cortisol,
>
> That's just the opposite of what the estrogen-dominant folks say, though I lean towards agreeing with you that John R. Lee and co. have it wrong.
>
> > yep, cortisol will make you crave carbohydrates
>
> I really don't see why it would ever be advised then, as usually people are trying to LOWER their cortisol levels. At least I am, especially after reading "The Cortisol Connection".well some people have too low cortisol..where the stress has lasted a long time usually
>
> > I'm not sure about Boron, let me know how it goes....it has only just come popular over here. I didn't realise it had a hormonal impact like that.
>
> I've been taking it for a while, 3 mg once or more per day. It increases estradiol apparently. I read that here http://www.y2khealthanddetox.com/Osteoporosis.htm and here: http://www.ithyroid.com/boron.htm
>
> > Also Estradiol is not fat soluble so it can't be absorbed thru skin in a cream, only two other estrogens,(estrone, estriol) are but Larrian says " you don't want them because they increase fat and cause prolonged excitation of the estradiol receptors".
>
> I see on the thyroid site discussion link you posted that some woman are putting estriol creme on their faces and hands for cosmetic reasons. Have you tried that?<g>..yes, it works. I haven't tried the type they buy though. It's popular in France and Germany...has been for a long time.
>
> > "Homocysteine does NOT exist in Australia" <g>
>
> Hey, lucky you! ;)guess we all have to work within limits
>
> >You know, that is why I'm never sure of "amino acid chelates"..I have no idea WHICH amino acid, and I have not been able to find out. I have sensitivities to MSG, so I guess glumate is out for me too? Magnesium glutamate does sound bad...I wonder if that is what you could get if you bought magnesium amino acid chelate?
>
> My understanding is that it's too excititory to the brain -- at least for certain depressives and I'm apparently one of them. If they won't say what it's chelated WITH, I'd think they're not a very good company as that's something we should know.None of the companies I contacted would say..the best answer I got was ..whatever is cheapest at the time
Taurine, btw, is calming to glutamate's excitatory-ness, so if you eat something, feel weird, it might be worth a try. It worked for me after I had suicidal ideation after trying L-glutamine.
>
> > Hope this helps,
Thanks, re DHEA I haven't tried....probably will start next weekend. Both DHEA and progesterone are only available under doc's scripts over here..
>
> Thanks for the detailed response and links/info in this and the following post. :) I think I'll give natural progesterone a pass for a while. I am actually feeling pretty good these days, on tyrosine and the rest of the handfuls of stuff I'm taking. (I'm going to start a thread on DHEA.)
>
> JL
>
Jan
poster:tealady
thread:256950
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/alter/20031003/msgs/268745.html