Posted by ParnateStarted2008 on December 6, 2008, at 16:48:41
In reply to Re: Nardil + Insomnia - Re to 'ParnateStarted2008', posted by Vincent_QC on December 6, 2008, at 8:16:39
> > I just posted such a similar topic whoops..
> > Hi Vincent, yes I took Nardil for 1 year and now im on Parnare because Nardil side effects.
> > Anyway, Seroquel XR in my opinion is a bad choice for a sleeping pill. Even the regular version leaves you like a drunken Zombie the next day. If your on XR, I bet you must feel like more of a tired zombie. If its as bad as you say, you'll need a stimulant to keep you awake and alert the next day, but thats to complicated just to be able to use seroquel xr for sleep.
> > I took seroquel many many times on different meds. I found the best time to take it is about 30 minutes before bed. AND only the regular release. Why would your doctor want you to be tired for 24 hours.. weird.
>
> Thanks for the answer...
>
> You're all right...I do my own test... I take one 50mg/xr pill and cut it in half and I crush it until it was all in podwer. I put it in a capsule and I take it 30 minutes before bedtime. I sleep 7 hours, wake up with no side effect from the Seroquel...my brains was a little bit in the fog for 10 minutes, that's normal, but nothing if I compare it to the 2 nights before where I take a 50 mg/pill of Seroquel XR at night...
>
> I see my psychiatrist next tuesday and I will ask to have the normal formulation of 25 mg of Seroquel.
>
> I wonder why my family doctor give me the XR version of it, since it's stay a long time in the blood stream....yes, maybe it's goor for someone who need to have stable medication in his blood to treat schizo or mood disorder...but just as a sleep aid??? That's not a good idea...
>
> > Seroquel adds alot of weight over time (for most people) aswell as nardil.
> > You;ll probably have to switch sleep meds every so often so u dont get addicted to one unique medication eg. Lunesta, halcion etc.
> >
> > My top choices for Nardil insomnia:
> >
> > Trazodone - Its the #1 for MAOI insomnia. It is contraindicated but its still the most popular because you can take it for a long time. Lately Lunesta, Ambien, Sonata.. have been used alot just because they are new. Trazodone can make you tired the next day but it goes away after a couple weeks.
> >
> > Zopiclone - its ok but leaves a horibble taste in your mouth which gets better with time.. It can be used for a bit longer then most other sleeping pills before your addicted to it. Ezopiclone(Lunesta) is the same but half the dose. Ive read its a bit more addictive cuz the potency..
> >
> > I would (and do) go from the zz pills(Zolpidem, Zopiclone, Zaleplone) to the hypnotic benzo's giving each one its suggested time of use or more, I usually go more then switch. I dont think its a very good idea and im trying to find something else.. Im going to the docs today for Trazodone.
>
> Well I post also something about the ZZZZZZ benzos drugs...it was about the fact that they are not very good for insomnia problems...In fact, drugs like Ambient, Zopiclone, Solpidem, name it...are just regular anxiolytic drugs, like Valium, Rivotril or Ativan...
>
> For someone who never toutch a benzo drug to help him with anxiety or social phobia, that's can be a good point to start if you have some insomnia...but for someone like me, who take more than 8mg of Rivotril by day for a couple of years, and more than 12 mg/day of Xanax...I can assure you that the 15mg Zopiclone pills will not do anything to help you to sleep or stay asleep because my gaba brains are used to the hypnotic effect of these drugs...It's why my only options are in the "Antipsychotic drugs or Desyrel(Trazodone)...
>
> My family doc and my psychiatrist don't want to prescribe to me the Trazodone as a sleep aid, because of a possible serotonin syndrome...it's why my family doc choose the seroquel option...but I still wondering why the XR formulation and not the regular one...
>
> For the weight gain, we are all different...I always gain weight on drugs...The only one I uses a long time and where I never take any pound, was the Topamax (Topiramate )...but it cause more cognitive problems than anything else... But all the antidepressants, antipsychotics, anticonvulsives or mood stabilizer drugs give me a lot of weight gain...non wonder why, I feel always hungry...it seem that the only time when I don't feel anxious is when I eat...after it's another thing...I feel guilty because I eat and I gain weight...that'a a very bad never ending circle...I hate that...In one hand you feel more well with the pills (less anxious, less of social phobia and generalised anxiety...) but on others side more overstress about my physical apparence , loose of my self-esteem...that's bad...
>
> > I remember Nardil insomnia, it sucked, I would just get up and eat all night and worry about being tired the next day. Now im on Parnate and the insomnia from this is even worse. I found the best way to sleep on nardil was STRUCTURE! Wake up, eat, bedtime, every day at the same time. with the help of a sleep aid occasionally, if i kept structured enough it was great. If only I could of stay like that...
> > bye4now
> >
>
> I never had a good sleep structure...As a kid and teenager, I was smooking "weeds" to be able to sleep...I do this from 13yo to 20 yo... If I was out of stock for 1 night , it was a nightmare and I was not able to sleep at all...When I stop smooking weeds, It take more than 1 year before I was able to fall asleep in less than 30 minutes...
>
> I worked 10 years at night, so I was able to sleep just 2 or 3 hours an return to work after for another day...doing this 4 or 5 days in a row and after had a good nights of sleep (8hours)to recuperate...
>
> For the Parnate, all I can say is that I can't tolerate it at all...I do only 4 days on 10-20mg day and it was horrible...I was feeling like on speed...but with a big lack of energy at the same time, like I wanted to sleep, but I was too over stress to being able to sleep...I was extemely nervous... I think we all have ours reactions on diverses drugs..I mean, for myself, I'm overstress, with general anxiety, social phobia , depression and a panic attack problems...I need a drug who will calm me , not something who will activiting me... In this regard, Nardil is just on the limit...probably because of his NE and DA action...forget about the GABA action cause i'm already addicted to benzodiazepines so it will not act on the gaba receptors...
>
> But this is another subject...for now I just say thanks to you... ;-) Have a nice day!
>
Hey, you know, between me and you I think we have very similar disorders. My Psych's (had a few) like to say Im Bipolar and it causes the anxiety when I get bad. I do have bipolar2 im not arguing with that but I also am damn sure Social Phobia fits me like a glove with panic attacks leading to agoraphobia and finally depression and alcohol. I wanted to let you know and anyone else who reads this that you are right about the ZZZ drugs and benzo hypnotics. Like you Ive been on Zanax, Ativan, Clonazepam etc So The hypnotic benzos dont work nor do the zzz's except as an anxiolytic. If I take a Very high dose of them I can sleep but whats the use in abusing them, probably will cause more bad then good. eg. Takes about 37.5mgs+ of zopiclone for me to sleep and about 150mg of Temazepam to make them hypnotic, not too sweet. I ve got a bit of a hypothesis on Parnate for anxiety. It seems that when taken in very high dosages 60-200mg/day it can work excellent for many people as an anxyolytic. Im not too sure why yet but im thinking because it hits hard on NE/Epineph/DA below 60mg and when you go higher It begins really working on Seratonin and other antianxiety neurons. Well its what Im trying as Nardil didnt work and im almost on my last resort..
Thanks for your post, made me think.
poster:ParnateStarted2008
thread:866860
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20081204/msgs/867078.html