Posted by Ame Sans Vie on September 21, 2003, at 18:54:11
In reply to Re: You're taking way more than you think, posted by utopizen on September 21, 2003, at 15:26:08
> I know he didn't cite euphoria, but I'm perplexed as to why anyone would go to the lengths of using the most criminalized drug in the country (since the amphetamine act of 2000) if they were truly using it for "therapeutic" purposes. As if it's not available from a doctor, this isn't pot we're talking about.
>
> If he isn't using it for euphoria, what then? That's very suspicious-- why would someone do such a thing, not tell a doctor, have a prescription? I find it either hard to believe or a poor idea, either way, it's not something to condone.This person quite obviously doesn't want to get a legitimate prescription for the same reason a junkie would rather take heroin than methadone -- the prescription drugs don't provide the rush. Anyone who's enjoyed street drugs before can relate with that.
> Even if his health isn't at risk, that ignores the fact that a very small amount equals a minimum jail sentence of many years. And he may know the purity, etc., but no one ever knows if someone is looking to get off on a drug charge by informing the cops of a drug buyer.
>
> How many feel confident over their "drug of choice" because of its purity when they see flashing blue lights in front of them as they hold a brown lunch bag containing just enough meth to put off their plans for the next 5 years?
>
> Great, then we get to talk about what drug's the most effective for PTSD 5 years for him from now.I'm fairly sure Chawner is aware of the legal risks of crystal meth addiction, which is why I didn't feel it necessary to bring this up.
> Nevertheless, let's not forget insomnia is not typical in Desoxyn users, so let's not be so certain here. It's generally time-related, like taking it before 6, you won't have an issue.
Insomnia is an extremely common side effect of Desoxyn use -- I mean come on now, it's methamphetamine. True, it's less common the earlier in the day your last dose is, but many can't take a single dose at 8AM without looking forward to a sleepless night.
> And let's ignore the idea that taking it orally in pill form and taking it orally in powder form wouldn't change the pharmakinetics. Geez, of course it would! And let's not even act like he's taking it any other way.
Crystal methamphetamine is smoked, not taken orally, and it's not a powder form of the drug.
> And by the way, l-methamphetamine does induce insomnia, for the love of psychohpharmacology! It just has more side-effects, less therapeutic benefits. Emphasis on MORE SIDE-EFFECTS. Isolating the d-isomer is very complicated, it's not as simple as pretending the l-isomer didn't do anything, it did do something, but mostly induce side effects more than treat the problem it was given for. *That's* why it often means you can halve the dose when you have a d-isomer drug, but that isn't relevant to this case, because in this case we're exclusively concerned about SIDE-EFFECTS, not therapeutic benefits, and these are MOSTLY RESPONSIBLE from the l-isomer, hence why Desoxyn (d-isomer) is signifigantly less likely to induce side effects. Same thing with Adderall vs. Dexedrine, Dex is less likely to induce side effects, insomnia, than Adderall, at equivalent doses. Adderall's 75% l isomers.
Exactly. The l-isomer is not therapeutically beneficial. Thus, its only importance when figuring therapeutic dose of racemic methamphetamine is in predicting a wider range of side effects. Those who smoke crystal meth generally aren't concerned about side effects.
> We're on a board that continiously questions generic vs. brand name drugs, and you're suggesting d, l methamphetamine HCL and d-methamphetamine HCL are equivocal?
That's not at all what I'm saying. See above.
> There's about a hundred different ways to make it, and even the head chemist at Abbott that perfected its procurement advanced its state after it was on the market for two decades.
As I said, methamphetamine does not form crystals unless it is near 100% purity, so one can be relatively sure of the amount of drug their taking it with crystal meth. There isn't another street drug out there that I can say the same thing about. Hell, I can't even say the same thing about FDA-approved generic drugs.
> Purity, insomnia, these are the least of one's worries. These are the worries of good luck, these are worries that you wish you might have the moment you are arrested for possession.
But again, on a forum such as this, it's hardly appropriate to resort to scare tactics regarding legality. It was the pharmacological impact of zolpidem and zaleplon taken with crystal methamphetamine which was on trial here originally, and drug users/abusers will continue to use regardless of any ridiculous legal sanctions that might be imposed upon us. One day it'll all be legal anyway, once people open up their eyes and see that the criminal underground spawned by this laughable "war on drugs", and the deaths caused by ingestion of adulterated drugs, could all be pretty much wiped out if one could just walk into the liquor store and buy an FDA-approved wrap of speed. Didn't prohibition teach us a thing?
> And okay, so you didn't think of all the things I though of, that's okay, but that's also why we are cautious about our own thinking, that's why we see doctors, not drug dealers...First of all, I find it quite patronizing and a bit rude that you would assume I haven't "thought of all the things you thought of," especially when it's quite obvious that I've not only thought this thing through quite well, but I've lived it myself.
Secondly, what to do about those who can't afford to see a doctor? Who don't even know that treatments exist for the disorder they have? Or perhaps they *do* have access to medical care, but have found themselves treatment-resistant to everything the doctor throws at them. Sound familiar?
Illegal drug addicts will always be around, until we smart up and legalize it all.
poster:Ame Sans Vie
thread:261110
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20030917/msgs/262251.html