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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 124 to 148 of 148. Go back in thread:
Posted by thuso on July 2, 2005, at 23:49:06
In reply to Re: SOMEONE MAKE THIS INSANITY STOP!!!!! » thuso, posted by 10derHeart on July 2, 2005, at 23:36:16
> Rarely are threads deleted - unless the poster posts while blocked. I think for one reason - it can help with understanding civility boundaries...with newbies, for example, if they can read through all kinds of *expressions* of opinions...and see at what point PBCs and/or blocks are issued...
>
> Although in this case, well, never mind...
>
> <sigh>
>I definitley don't mean all of their posts in this thread, just the more recent ones where they both act like little children. It's those posts that really go overboard. I doubt you'll disagree, but we'll see what Dr. Bob does.
I wonder how long it will be until he gets on and sees this. Anyone want to take a guess? I'm guessing it won't be until tomorrow. It's starting to get late.
Posted by linkadge on July 3, 2005, at 2:37:04
In reply to Re: SOMEONE MAKE THIS INSANITY STOP!!!!! » 10derHeart, posted by thuso on July 2, 2005, at 23:49:06
I do not stand behind flmm's approach.
It is *our* responsability to weigh the pros and con's of our treatment on a daily basis. If there is one lesson to be learned from this page, it is that, to an extent, you must be your own doctor.
Patients need to understand the gravity and depth of the situation, and the treatment.
Aspirin can save lives, but it can also kill you.
I am not telling the families of the victom of aspirin death to keep quiet, and not tell their story. OTOH, I am not telling Bayer to halt sales of aspirin.
The pro's and con's must be continually weighted and counterballenced.
I am not angry in the least at Nevrov for coming an sharing his story, because without these accounts, the situation would be incompete.
Linkadge
Posted by ed_uk on July 3, 2005, at 5:48:09
In reply to Re: No Comment Nezirov on Expertise Alternatives, posted by Nezirov on July 2, 2005, at 18:48:04
Hi Nezirov,
>I have submitted a scientific paper with case reports on the persistence of sexual side effects after using SSRIs to a medical journal.
That's interesting, which journal? Do you think it will get published? Which sexual side effects persisted most frequently? How many case reports have you collected?
>When I initially got anxiety in 2001 (while working as a postdoc at a major medical university)........
Tell us more about yourself. Are you a chemist? Just a guess.
Kind regards
~Ed
Posted by TofuEmmy on July 3, 2005, at 8:22:25
In reply to NEZ and Impotence, posted by flmm on July 2, 2005, at 22:27:53
Regardless of what sort of posts other people make,...you still can't disparage them without possibly getting PBC'd yourself.
It would really stink to get blocked due to commenting on their conversation, eh? It's simply not worth it.
em
Posted by SLS on July 3, 2005, at 9:42:26
In reply to Re: No Comment Nezirov on Expertise Alternatives, posted by Nezirov on July 2, 2005, at 18:48:04
> Because I have been persoanlly effected by the inappropriate pushing of thsee drugs, I have submitted a scientific paper with case reports on the persistence of sexual side effects after using SSRIs to a medical journal.
> I believe that there are other peristent effects of these drugs that last long after discontinuance, such as apathy and some cognitive deficits. I haven't experienced those myself, but I have heard from many people who have.
It is manifest that exposure to antidepressants produces long lasting effects that persist for months and years after their discontinuation. This is why people often do not respond well to the same drug that they had taken previously. I don't care to theorize why, but this phenomenon is a common theme here. It is not a great leap of abstraction to acknowledge the possibility that what you propose here merits a closer look.
You would be surprised how open minded people on Psycho-Babble are. However, it is difficult to contend seriously with someone who fails to understand the biological nature of MDD and Bipolar Disorder. Manifest again is that these illnesses have biological components, many of which are self-perpetuating despite psychotherapeutic intervention. With modern technology, we now see the abnormalities in the morphology and physiological function of the brain in both trait and state of affective disorders. It is difficult to take seriously someone who has concluded that "chemical imbalances" don't exist to the degree estimated by epidemiologists without having studied the science behind the conclusions offered by modern psychiatry.
Keep an open mind and try to ask questions that are not rhetorical in nature. We will all learn more that way. Affective disorders are, unfortunately, biological. This is, of course, little more than my stating an opinion that is shared by many. Your opinion may differ. If you would like to debate the biological nature of Axis I disorders, feel free to. It will help reinforce many principles that lead to current opinion. You've got to be focused though, and try not to make global statements that do not address the details of the genesis of that opinion.
There is a difference between ethics and morality. I thought I'd just throw that in there.
Q: You previously stated the following: "As I've said before, some people do require these medications." Under what circumstances would these people require medications?
- Scott
Posted by SLS on July 3, 2005, at 9:55:36
In reply to Re: Com'on, please Nezirov and, posted by Nezirov on July 2, 2005, at 22:02:11
I know how difficult it is sometimes to remain civil, but this site has become a very important resource for others on the Internet precisely because it is not an unmoderated forum for flaming, but, rather, a gathering of caring people discussing openly important issues with sophistication and positive energy. Every single member whose name I see on this thread has demonstrated these laudable attributes in the past.
- Scott
Posted by ed_uk on July 3, 2005, at 10:10:07
In reply to Please - Let's display our usual laudable conduct., posted by SLS on July 3, 2005, at 9:55:36
Well said Scott :-)
Let's return to the discussion.
~Ed
Posted by Dr. Bob on July 3, 2005, at 11:41:42
In reply to Re: NEZ you have other problems, posted by Nezirov on July 2, 2005, at 19:13:49
> NEZ you have other problems
>
> flmm> When did you escape?
>
> NezirovPlease don't post anything that could lead others to feel accused or put down. I've asked you to be civil before, so now I'm going to block you from posting for a week.
If you or others have questions about this or about posting policies in general, or are interested in alternative ways of expressing yourself, please see the FAQ:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#civil
Follow-ups regarding these issues should be redirected to Psycho-Babble Administration. They, as well as replies to the above posts, should of course themselves be civil.
Thanks,
Bob
Posted by Susan47 on July 3, 2005, at 13:16:50
In reply to Re: Com'on, please Nezirov and, posted by flmm on July 2, 2005, at 22:04:29
Have you looked it up, by the way? In all it's meanings?
Posted by gabbii on July 3, 2005, at 13:18:24
In reply to hey gabbi...my new favorite spelling monitor ;-) (nm) » gabbii, posted by 10derHeart on July 2, 2005, at 23:27:52
Ya, well my own spelling is far from perfect, especially when I'm typing, I make homonym mistakes all the time when I'm posting for some reason. But there are just some words you really *ought* to double check.
On another board I saw someone post that she considered herself highly intellectuel, and I just thought.. oh man.. wipe out.
Posted by KaraS on July 3, 2005, at 13:54:32
In reply to Re: Comment War of the worlds Sucks, posted by flmm on July 2, 2005, at 17:50:20
> By the way, I just got back from seeing "War of the worlds". This is the worst Spielberg movie ever! I am not kidding, it is awful. Cruise etc. should be ashamed of the money they are stealing. This one is bad folks! Ireally wanted to like it. Not possible! Sorry Nez your boy stinx.
I just read Roger Ebert's review of it on his website. He only gave it 2 stars. He pretty much agrees with you on this (and he's usually a big Spielberg fan). Another good reason to stay away from the movie. I really hope it bombs.
Posted by Susan47 on July 3, 2005, at 14:09:37
In reply to Re: SOMEONE MAKE THIS INSANITY STOP!!!!! » thuso, posted by 10derHeart on July 2, 2005, at 23:36:16
It has added a bit of it's own flavour here though, don't you think? I mean, it's been a long time since I've actually witnessed people more than 8 years old saying this type of stuff to each other and the fact that they're adults makes it so much more interesting. There's always the possibility they might escalate to another level. Where would it end, if not for Dr. Bob? With those sorts of comments spewed back and forth, people lose credibility quickly.
Posted by Declan on July 3, 2005, at 15:12:05
In reply to Re: Comment War of the worlds Sucks, posted by flmm on July 2, 2005, at 17:50:20
Spielberg, Cruise.....Terrible films, terrible aesthetics. Who listens to these people? Lots of us I guess, but we should know better.
But anyway what N was saying about bad trends in altruism, competitiveness, etc, referred I thought to the last 30 or so years, not the last 300. I agree. And I think we are going forward into a bit of a crunch.
Declan
Posted by linkadge on July 3, 2005, at 16:05:14
In reply to Re: Comment War of the worlds Sucks » flmm, posted by KaraS on July 3, 2005, at 13:54:32
I really hope the movie does not do well for these reasons.
We treat sucessfull actors like Gods, and they think thats what they are.
If their movies do well then it is even harder to listen to such comments because we know they hold a sharper sting.
If the movie does poorly, then it sends a strong message to Tom Cruise: "we don't need you as an actor, and we certainly don't need you as a religious figure"
Linkadge
Posted by Phillipa on July 3, 2005, at 20:03:51
In reply to Re: Comment War of the worlds Sucks, posted by linkadge on July 3, 2005, at 16:05:14
Well I just got home and see this Thread has developed a life of it's own. The funny thing is my ex-husband, when we were going through our divorce, asked me to read the Scientology book. I didn't. Did I miss anything? Fondly, Phillipa
Posted by gabbii on July 3, 2005, at 20:56:04
In reply to Entertainment and politics, posted by Declan on July 3, 2005, at 15:12:05
> Spielberg, Cruise.....Terrible films, terrible aesthetics. Who listens to these people? Lots of us I guess, but we should know better.
> But anyway what N was saying about bad trends in altruism, competitiveness, etc, referred I thought to the last 30 or so years, not the last 300. I agree. And I think we are going forward into a bit of a crunch.
> DeclanI think it's difficult to define altruism as a global quality. Historically though, the prediction of the degradation of society is expounded upon by doomsayers with every generation, and using very similar terminology.
According to the writings of Plato to those of Lear, the younger generation's decadence, selfishness, search for quick fixes and lack of respect for their elders, combined with the onslaught of consumerism is leading to a breakdown in the fabric of society.
Posted by 10derHeart on July 3, 2005, at 22:44:28
In reply to Re: hey gabbi...my new favorite spelling monitor ;-) » 10derHeart, posted by gabbii on July 3, 2005, at 13:18:24
> On another board I saw someone post that she considered herself highly intellectuel, and I just thought.. oh man.. wipe out.
oh no...that's not good...how embarrassing...or maybe not (!) well, it could have been worse, I guess...hmmm....
Intilekchewul? lol i'm silly....;-)
Posted by KaraS on July 4, 2005, at 14:46:10
In reply to Re: Comment War of the worlds Sucks, posted by linkadge on July 3, 2005, at 16:05:14
Amen
Posted by KaraS on July 4, 2005, at 19:54:16
In reply to geez, posted by linkadge on July 3, 2005, at 2:37:04
> I do not stand behind flmm's approach.
>
> It is *our* responsability to weigh the pros and con's of our treatment on a daily basis. If there is one lesson to be learned from this page, it is that, to an extent, you must be your own doctor.
>
> Patients need to understand the gravity and depth of the situation, and the treatment.
>
> Aspirin can save lives, but it can also kill you.
>
> I am not telling the families of the victom of aspirin death to keep quiet, and not tell their story. OTOH, I am not telling Bayer to halt sales of aspirin.
>
> The pro's and con's must be continually weighted and counterballenced.
>
> I am not angry in the least at Nevrov for coming an sharing his story, because without these accounts, the situation would be incompete.
>
>
>
>
>
> Linkadge
>Well said!
Posted by Dr. Bob on July 4, 2005, at 21:09:59
In reply to Re: SOMEONE MAKE THIS INSANITY STOP!!!!! » 10derHeart, posted by Susan47 on July 3, 2005, at 14:09:37
> it's been a long time since I've actually witnessed people more than 8 years old saying this type of stuff to each other
Please don't post anything that could lead others to feel accused or put down.
If you or others have questions about this or about posting policies in general, or are interested in alternative ways of expressing yourself, please see the FAQ:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#civil
Follow-ups regarding these issues should be redirected to Psycho-Babble Administration. They, as well as replies to the above post, should of course themselves be civil.
Thanks,
Bob
Posted by Susan47 on July 4, 2005, at 21:49:30
In reply to Re: please be civil » Susan47, posted by Dr. Bob on July 4, 2005, at 21:09:59
It sounded worse than what I actually was thinking, I was thinking of it as funny and true, definitely not saracastic. What I said was not meant maliciously. I'm sorry and apologize to anyone who read and understood it that way.
Posted by Declan on July 5, 2005, at 3:04:33
In reply to Re: Entertainment and politics » Declan, posted by gabbii on July 3, 2005, at 20:56:04
But society breaks down so regularly. 7 years before I was born 50 million people were killed by each other, and 100 million at least for the century. I think the ground can open up under our feet very easily.
Declan
Posted by AuntieMel on July 5, 2005, at 8:51:39
In reply to Re: discussion of denial of tools » Nezirov, posted by SLS on July 2, 2005, at 14:35:15
Re: denial of tools
For some people exorcism works.
Some get relief from prayer, some from scientology.
For some medication does the trick. For many of us it is not as effective.
Is there a right or wrong answer? I doubt it.
The brain is a remarkable and complicated organ. What some would call success others would call failure.
I recently was sent by my doc for an evaluation (second opinion) by a research psychiatrist at a well known mood disorders clinic at a well known university medical school/hospital. Part of the evaluation said:
"well organized thoughts, responsive, seems of average to above average intelligence."
Sounds good, right? Until it is known that the 'intellegence' used to be in the top two percent.
I really like discussing this type thing with you, Scott. Too bad this discussion went downhill.
Posted by trucker on July 5, 2005, at 18:47:52
In reply to Back to the original discussion please! » Nezirov, posted by ed_uk on July 3, 2005, at 5:48:09
hey ed,
how are ya? isn't it strange how there is hardly any of the ol crew here! i guess they got better huh! and moved on. well i will be here in and out from time to time. very busy with the animals. did i tell ya i saw my deer the other day. she made it thru the winter. thanks to the GOOD LORD HIMSELF!didn't mean to butt in. just want to say hi to you and all here.
trucker
Posted by Dr. Bob on July 5, 2005, at 22:25:25
In reply to I'm sorry., posted by Susan47 on July 4, 2005, at 21:49:30
This is the end of the thread.
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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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