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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 22 of 22. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by violette on August 5, 2010, at 15:13:53
In reply to Re: Was Told To Take No More Meds From Someone In » 8675309, posted by Phillipa on August 2, 2010, at 12:28:48
Phillipa,
Do you think it would be good for you to keep talking with your ex-husband? I don't know your whole situation but have read some of your past posts. I think he could be a mentor for you through understanding, encouragement, and support.
I know what it's like to experience emotional abuse. And if you are around that for long enough, the abuser's words will take over your superego-eventually you internalize those words.
On the other hand, if you have someone close to you who believes in you-you can internalize that too, and believe in yourself. You could also find more of that with a social group through volunteer work....people who see the positives in you and through mutual joy of being in such relationships.
This concept is a large component of how psychotherapy works. It is truly transforming to have someone who accepts you with positive regard and understanding and who sees your strengths. It's a different kind of love. But you can have some of those effects if you surround yourself with people who view you in that light.
:)
BTW-please don't feel you have to justify your questions, actions, or decisions to anyone here. I view you as a thoughtful, intelligent, empathetic, caring person, and someone who might benefit from some encouragement, but also someone who has the ability to experience the joys of life.
Posted by Willful on August 5, 2010, at 15:13:53
In reply to Re: Was Told To Take No More Meds From Someone In » Phillipa, posted by violette on August 2, 2010, at 13:30:23
Phillipa doesn't need to justify her questions and hesitations-- but I do know, as someone who has in the past put in what I thought was a lot of time and energy trying to respond to her confusion, and to encourage her to take what she seemed to think would be positive steps that she was afraid to try-- that it might be important for her to review some of her habits.
It isn't healthy when you avoid taking risks and chances because you can always find some person who'll tell you they had a bad experience-- or thinks you shouldn't do it. In my experience, Phillipa is very likely to ask you for all sorts of help and then turn around the next day and act like she hasn't a clue what to do, and is at a complete loss and needs someone to help her with advice. Or suddenly, someone else has made some negative comment about the drug, or she heard something bad about it-- and eveything you thought you had communicated to her, during the back and forth, goes out the window.
I'm sure she is a caring empathic person, but she seems to be at a terrible disadvantage in that she allows herself to be blown around by the random, uninformed, and who-knows-how motivated input of almost anyone-- neighbors, docs she runs into in the emergency room, ex husbands, someone she talked to in the supermarket, etc
I wish she could act more decisively and I don't mean to hurt her feelings or tell her she needs to justify anything to me. What I hope is that she'll realize a bit that she needs to take these risks, and try some meds that might help her, even if she's afraid of some unforeseen difficulty.
Willful
Posted by violette on August 5, 2010, at 15:13:53
In reply to Re: Was Told To Take No More Meds From Someone In » violette, posted by Willful on August 2, 2010, at 17:32:46
Yes, well many of the people here have longstanding issues too, but deal with them differently or don't talk about them. I also recognize some are more vocal about those issues than others. Some ask questions and look for support yet others seem to be more comfortable pointing out things they think a person *should change* about him/herself.
I guess I just don't see how the way Phillipa deals with her issues is better or worse than the way others deal with their issues since she isn't harming others in doing so.
Posted by ed_uk2010 on August 5, 2010, at 15:13:53
In reply to Re: Was Told To Take No More Meds From Someone In » violette, posted by Willful on August 2, 2010, at 17:32:46
>What I hope is that she'll realize a bit that she needs to take these risks, and try some meds that might help her, even if she's afraid of some unforeseen difficulty.
Absolutely. Without taking a chance, no progress is made. Phillipa has recently been prescribed a new antidepressant medication (Lexapro) by her doctor. It is very important, in my opinion, that she gives this treatment a chance to work. This means that it must be taken consistently and at an adequate dose. Stopping and starting is no good - neither is the use of subtherapeutic doses.
In many ways, I think it would be very beneficial for Phillipa to avoid reading psycho-babble whilst trying a new antidepressant. The med should be taken as directed by the prescriber, without constantly questioning its appropriateness. Phillipa does seem to focus mainly on anti-medication threads. This only serves to cause anxiety, confusion and indecisivess. It is not an aid to her recovery.
I have tried to help Phillipa on numerous occasions but I do feel that she is not often responsive to my advice. It seems that a negative thread on p-babble or some scaremongering news article has more influence - and not in a good way. The outcome is generally the same.... deciding not to try a new treatment, stopping a treatment which has recently been started, or continuing to take an old medication which does not appear to be helping.
I would like to see Phillipa make some progress with regard to her anxiety and depression. In order for this to happen, she will certainly need to be more decisive and give any new medication a chance to help.
Phillipa does not have to explain or justify her behaviour to anyone on this forum, including me. The reason that I say what I do is because I am concerned that Phillipa's involvement with certain aspects of psycho-babble might actually be hindering her recovery. In particular, reading and posting on a large number of anti-med threads is far from therapeutic.
Posted by violette on August 5, 2010, at 15:13:54
In reply to Re: Was Told To Take No More Meds From Someone In » Willful, posted by ed_uk2010 on August 2, 2010, at 18:16:44
"The reason that I say what I do is because I am concerned that Phillipa's involvement with certain aspects of psycho-babble might actually be hindering her recovery. In particular, reading and posting on a large number of anti-med threads is far from therapeutic. " Ed_UK
That was a nice thing to say and can see how you are trying to help. I suppose I think more along the lines of her husband-that she has it in her to figure out what she should do, which also goes along with my general views that the best results may be realized by helping lead people towards what they *can* do based on their strengths rather than what they *shouldn't* do based on potential weaknesses.
But I know everyone has their owns ways of trying to help others...trying to help is a positive thing as long as it doesn't hurt the person you're trying to help and Phillipa didn't say she was hurt after all so maybe advice to what she *shouldn't* be doing is helpful to her.
Posted by ed_uk2010 on August 5, 2010, at 15:13:54
In reply to Re: Was Told To Take No More Meds From Someone In » ed_uk2010, posted by violette on August 2, 2010, at 18:28:41
>That was a nice thing to say and can see how you are trying to help.
Thanks. I understand your point and I do hope that Phillipa is not offended or upset by my post.
One of the problems with psycho-babble is that you can get completely different advice all the time - sometimes completely opposite advice. Since Phillipa tends to be rather indecisive where meds are concerned, the constantly conflicting advice is problematic. This is why I think it might be best for her to avoid too much p-babbling during trials of new meds. Assuming that she has a pdoc that she can trust, I think it would be best for her to concentrate on taking the advice of her pdoc (and maybe a couple of close friends), rather that asking the opinion of people on babble - who generally have no medical qualifications.
Posted by violette on August 5, 2010, at 15:13:54
In reply to Re: Was Told To Take No More Meds From Someone In » violette, posted by Willful on August 2, 2010, at 17:32:46
"Phillipa doesn't need to justify her questions and hesitations-- but I do know, as someone who has in the past put in what I thought was a lot of time and energy trying to respond to her confusion, and to encourage her to take what she seemed to think would be positive steps that she was afraid to try-- that it might be important for her to review some of her habits....What I hope is that she'll realize a bit that she needs to take these risks, and try some meds that might help her, even if she's afraid of some unforeseen difficulty." - Willful
No one here owes anyone anything for putting in a certain amount of time/energy to respond to questions or posts.
Some fears are irrational. Some are real. Who are we to say which fears should be faced head on, and which ones need to be worked out through understanding and compassion-things that may help strengthen a person to build up courage to face such fears when a person is ready to face them? And maybe fears are an element of her illness-can't anxiety usually be traced to irrational fears?
To tell someone who is afraid, or perceived to be afraid, to just not be afraid is similar to telling someone who is depressed to just be happier.
If there are fears, getting to the root of them may have different results than pointing out what someone is doing 'wrong', insinuating one would be better *only if* one did x,y,x...?
If a person who is depressed-someone who doesn't have the motivation to exercise and prepare home cooked meals were told--"if you only reviewed your habits, perhaps you would not be so depressed"...it may add to their discouragment, or so I'd imagine. I think most people know such changes would help them, but building up the courage to make changes is another thing. And some people may feel bad enough not doing what they *should* be doing.
Or at least when I was depressed in the past, I'd feel discouraged when I read online - if people only ate better and exercised more, they wouldn't be so depressed...while I knew that was true, that making those changes would help if even just a bit, because I didn't feel capable of doing those things-it made me feel worse to hear this as it would reinforce how i somehow am faulty for not doing x-y-z...in a state of depression, I'd beat myself up. On the contrary, if people understood how difficult it is to make those positive changes while in that state of mind, encouraging me by suggesting alternatives-such as baby steps, or things they've done with success despite being depressed, etc., would help me to feel more hopeful, and give me some inspiration towards making positive changes.
I guess it all depends on the unique situation of an individual.
Posted by 8675309 on August 5, 2010, at 15:13:54
In reply to Re: Was Told To Take No More Meds From Someone In » Willful, posted by violette on August 2, 2010, at 20:56:37
When warm and runny help isn't helpful and tough love type help isn't helpful, where is there to go? This is not a new situation, it has cultivated over a lot of time. Lots of frustration happens when help is requested for what seems the purpose to debate why a certain suggestion is unworkable
Phillipa, I do not understand the goals of your posts or what you want from forum members. Are you being helped by what you are reading or the results of your polling?
Posted by Willful on August 5, 2010, at 15:13:55
In reply to Re: Was Told To Take No More Meds From Someone In » Willful, posted by violette on August 2, 2010, at 20:56:37
Posted by violette on August 5, 2010, at 15:13:55
In reply to Re:Please don't post to me, Violette (nm) » violette, posted by Willful on August 3, 2010, at 0:40:46
Willful-I don't remember ever originating a post to you, but have only responded to your posts to me which tend to point out the faults in what I have said....but also haven't come across a thread started by you about your own struggles or shortcomings.
I will accept your request.
Posted by Willful on August 5, 2010, at 15:13:55
In reply to No problem, Willful » Willful, posted by violette on August 3, 2010, at 9:58:58
Posted by Dr. Bob on August 5, 2010, at 18:13:08
In reply to Re:Please don't post to me, Violette (nm) » violette, posted by Willful on August 5, 2010, at 15:13:55
> Please don't post to me
Please be sensitive to the feelings of others.
But please don't take this personally, this doesn't mean I don't like you or think you're a bad person, and I'm sorry if this hurts you.
It's up to you to decide whom you interact with. Sometimes interacting with others may be frustrating, staying civil may be a challenge, and new skills may help. If you're open to developing new skills (which I realize may not be why you came in the first place), that's another way in which you may be supported by other posters.
More information about posting policies is in the FAQ:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#civil
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#enforceViolette, I'm also sorry if you felt hurt.
Follow-ups regarding these issues should be redirected to Psycho-Babble Administration. They, as well as replies to the above post, should of course themselves be civil.
Thanks,
Bob
Posted by Willful on August 5, 2010, at 18:25:06
In reply to Re: please be sensitive » Willful, posted by Dr. Bob on August 5, 2010, at 18:13:08
I'm sorry if anything I've done hurt violette's feelings.
I didn't intend to have that effect.
Willful
Posted by sigismund on August 5, 2010, at 18:34:18
In reply to Re: Was Told To Take No More Meds From Someone In, posted by bleauberry on August 2, 2010, at 19:57:36
>Back to the special friend thing though.. This is an ex? Does your hubby know about this? I hope so, cuz otherwise that aint cool at all. If it is secret behind your hubby's back, you gotta cut off that secret relationship immediately and completely. That is, unless you are looking for a new relationship and wouldn't mind seeing yourself divorced.
Really?
Posted by Phillipa on August 5, 2010, at 20:28:09
In reply to Re: Was Told To Take No More Meds From Someone In, posted by sigismund on August 5, 2010, at 18:34:18
No problem Sigi husband knows and encourages it as he's a very wise man. He is the man I was married to that I never needed any meds as he was so reassuring and kind and always there for me. I've been on line with him today when not out shopping for ebay. Raining now so can't be outside. I enjoy helping others and a pet peeve of mine are those who take meds without investigating all aspects first. Real life people like my neighbors are a great source of knowledge. I will continue to be civil here and take meds If I feel they are in my best intersts. On the wall with the bioidenticals and definitely no biophosphinates. And a good number of neighbors tried and went off them. Many do take the bioidenticals. I get more labs on hormone levels soon. Will decide then. Just found this thread due to now being online. Fastinating what goes on when you're gone. And thanks Violette. Phillipa
Posted by Dr. Bob on August 6, 2010, at 1:13:42
In reply to Re: please be sensitive » Dr. Bob, posted by Willful on August 5, 2010, at 18:25:06
Posted by sigismund on August 6, 2010, at 2:17:11
In reply to Re: Was Told To Take No More Meds From Someone In » sigismund, posted by Phillipa on August 5, 2010, at 20:28:09
I don't consider it my business to know every detail of my wife or children's lives. Absolutely not. All I care about is that we can lead reasonably happy and sane lives, be kind to each other, help each other, and have some nice times. I'm completely beyond worrying about anything else.
I take bioidenticals. Maybe you are doing the best that can be expected. I have my doubts about meds, though of course I take them too.
Posted by Phillipa on August 6, 2010, at 19:52:12
In reply to Re: Was Told To Take No More Meds From Someone In » Phillipa, posted by sigismund on August 6, 2010, at 2:17:11
Sigi why would you take bioidentical hormones unless it's testosterone which I'm pretty sure it is. PJ
Posted by sigismund on August 6, 2010, at 22:01:50
In reply to Re: Was Told To Take No More Meds From Someone In » sigismund, posted by Phillipa on August 6, 2010, at 19:52:12
Yeah, it's testosterone. For some reason my DHEA levels are already quite high enough.
My integrative doctor thought it might help with the depression, and I expect it does.
Posted by Phillipa on August 6, 2010, at 22:05:42
In reply to Re: Was Told To Take No More Meds From Someone In, posted by sigismund on August 6, 2010, at 22:01:50
Really I have all three in a cream compounded and don't find any changes in mood. Still a witch. PJ
Posted by sigismund on August 6, 2010, at 22:15:00
In reply to Re: Was Told To Take No More Meds From Someone In » sigismund, posted by Phillipa on August 6, 2010, at 22:05:42
It helps me feel a bit more resilient. That's about it.
Posted by Phillipa on August 7, 2010, at 19:52:53
In reply to Re: Was Told To Take No More Meds From Someone In, posted by sigismund on August 6, 2010, at 22:01:50
Got labs for my hormones this week then the hormone doc in a week. Will see as I think I've become much younger
This is the end of the thread.
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