![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 11 of 11. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by sar on April 7, 2001, at 0:51:30
One more post as long as I'm here, because this one has been bothering me for awhile and I'm wondering if anyone has any medical knowledge/personal experience with this.
I've had a problem with blackout drinking for nearly a year now. The more my alcohol use increased, the more frequent and prolonged the blackouts became; my alcohol tolerance rose to where I could (and still can) drink like a fish but still function (i.e, remain not only coherent but quite animated as well). The people I hung out with were always surprised the next day when I didn't remember anything, though often in my blackouts I behaved badly (generally doing a lot of things I really wish I hadn't).
Mainly I'm wondering how and why my brain turns off so quickly when I drink, how all of this mememory is obliterated upon waking. The blackouts begin when I've got a good buzz but not even drunk yet.
(The last therp I had wouldn't talk about this with me, she said "let's talk about what drives you drink instead.")
For some background, my diagnoses over the past few years by various therapists have been Social Phobia, Generalized Anxiety, Dysthymia, and Severe Depression.
Thanks in advance,
sar
Posted by CarolynAnn on April 7, 2001, at 12:01:09
In reply to blacking out, posted by sar on April 7, 2001, at 0:51:30
>Are you on any meds? I had that problem when taking anafranil. I finally learned that I just could not drink while taking that. Since then I have switched to Luvox, and have not tried drinking. I guess I got scared...my mother was an alcoholic and I don't want to end up the way she did! Drinking and depression just don't mix, even though I really have to fight the urge to drink when I am depressed. Depression is bad enough without screwing up my life even more! Blackouts are scary...who knows what you might have done that you don't remember! No more for me, thanks. At least I hope not.
Posted by Wendy B on April 7, 2001, at 13:44:03
In reply to blacking out, posted by sar on April 7, 2001, at 0:51:30
Sar,
Sounds like classic bipolar tendencies to me, especially the bouts of drinking, the inability to remember, the animation, wishing you hadn't done what you'd done, etc. Bipolar illness is frequently co-morbid in people who abuse alcohol. Obviously, you know you can't keep doing that kind of drinking, you could be seriously hurt during one of those blackouts. The people you're drinking with may not be your real friends in a moment of crisis.
So I think your diagnosis might need some tweaking. You need a very good dr for that, try and find one. The other board has several threads on treatment-resistant depression and its relation to bipolar disorder. Read those -- it's very enlightening. The drinking bouts are not good, I know, my ex would occasionally do that, alone at home at least, so all I had to worry about is if he'd die in his sleep after inhaling his own vomit. Both are really scary, and NOT WORTH IT.
Going to AA may make you feel better... at least you should NOT be ignoring the alcohol issue in therapy. Find a new therapist, preferably one who has treated people with your kind of problems, but also a good psych-doc to check the diagnosis...
Best of luck,
Wendy> One more post as long as I'm here, because this one has been bothering me for awhile and I'm wondering if anyone has any medical knowledge/personal experience with this.
>
> I've had a problem with blackout drinking for nearly a year now. The more my alcohol use increased, the more frequent and prolonged the blackouts became; my alcohol tolerance rose to where I could (and still can) drink like a fish but still function (i.e, remain not only coherent but quite animated as well). The people I hung out with were always surprised the next day when I didn't remember anything, though often in my blackouts I behaved badly (generally doing a lot of things I really wish I hadn't).
>
> Mainly I'm wondering how and why my brain turns off so quickly when I drink, how all of this mememory is obliterated upon waking. The blackouts begin when I've got a good buzz but not even drunk yet.
>
> (The last therp I had wouldn't talk about this with me, she said "let's talk about what drives you drink instead.")
>
> For some background, my diagnoses over the past few years by various therapists have been Social Phobia, Generalized Anxiety, Dysthymia, and Severe Depression.
>
> Thanks in advance,
> sar
Posted by medlib on April 7, 2001, at 19:44:28
In reply to blacking out, posted by sar on April 7, 2001, at 0:51:30
sar--
The term "blackout" usually refers to a complete loss of consciousness; an alcoholic blackout is, however, a *partial* loss of consciousness characterized by antero- and retrograde amnesia. A high level of alcohol temporarily prevents the brain's hippocampus from encoding and storing memories surrounding the drinking event. Actually, recent research suggests that it is the sudden rise in levels of blood alcohol, more than the absolute amount of alcohol, which triggers the hippocampus to shut down. Thus, alcoholic blackouts are more common among younger, "binge" drinkers who drink to get drunk. (Alcohol is the #1 self-medication for social anxiety/phobia; you would find lots of people with symptoms similar to yours in AA, particularly in some of the younger chapter meetings.)
For more information, you might be interested in:
http://www.alcoholmd.comTake care---medlib
Posted by Sulpicia on April 7, 2001, at 20:06:49
In reply to blacking out, posted by sar on April 7, 2001, at 0:51:30
> Hi Sar--
Sorry but this is neither kind nor gentle nor trendy either.
Depression and alcoholism invariably come together. I always
thought that depression was the worst thing in the world. It
wasn't. Alcoholism was. Clinicians diagnose alcoholism by blackouts.
I don't know you but your pdoc sounds less than stellar. Any
chance of better help? Treating the depression is obviously necessary
and getting the anxiety to a managable level would be equally desirable.
It will help you stay away from the booze, which by the way, unless
you're totally unique, will need treatment too.Better pdoc?
AA is good too.
Good luck.
S.
Posted by sar on April 11, 2001, at 15:23:02
In reply to blacking out, posted by sar on April 7, 2001, at 0:51:30
the good news is that I haven't blacked out in more than 2 weeks and that I've been two AA meetings.
the bad is that I'm still drinking nearly everyday, just not nearly as much in quantity.
thanks again yall,
sar
Posted by Sulpicia on April 11, 2001, at 20:23:42
In reply to thanks everyone..., posted by sar on April 11, 2001, at 15:23:02
> good for you.
aside from the problems with alcohol and depression,
the real problem with black outs is putting yourself
in harm's way.
Be well.
S.
Posted by Lisa Simpson on April 12, 2001, at 10:46:22
In reply to thanks everyone..., posted by sar on April 11, 2001, at 15:23:02
Hi Sar - been there, done that, got the T-shirt. Sorry to be flip, but you sound just like me. How long have you been drinking? How are the AA meetings going - are they helpful? Are you on any medication? Sorry for the many questions! It's just that you sound like me, and I'd be really interested to know all about you, if you have the time... and the inclination.
Lisa
Posted by sar on April 12, 2001, at 16:11:11
In reply to Got the T-Shirt..., posted by Lisa Simpson on April 12, 2001, at 10:46:22
Hey Lisa,
I welcome questions and it feels good to know that I've got some company--no apologies needed. I was a social drinker from age 15 until this time last year...breakup with longtime boyfriend precipitated it.
AA is okay. Before I went to the first meeting I had the strongest urge to pull over and buy a 24 oz to calm myself down but I realized that would be hmmm...inappropriate? stupid? :) Anyway, all the folks there were real cool but generally middle-aged...I thought I sensed some um maybe suspicion? they had with the few college-age kids there (there were 3 of us). Like we hadn't bottomed out, fought in the trenches etc. (This was just something I sensed, it was based on nothing they said.) Everyone clapped hard when I walked up for my "desire" coin (desire to stop drinking, you carry it to look at when u feel a craving).
In spite of having this coin, I really don't want to quit permanently. I want to learn how to return to normal social drinking...I know AA's studies have shown that the chances of this are rather low, but I'm not ready to resign myself to words like forever and never.
There's a lot of pain at these meetings, a lot of honesty. Some tears. I can relate to a lot of what they say and just listening to them (i haven't given my story and I don't even know that I believe I'm an alcoholic, just a problem drinker) has helped some sense kick in.
I'm not on any medication, though I'm looking into it. You know, another reason I haven't spoken at these meetings is that I have social phobia...I have to get a little drunk to tell a good story to a crowd! When I left the first meeting everyone was saying to me "bye!" and "thanks for coming, come back!" and I really wanted to stay and mingle with the rest of them to show them I'm nice, I'm not snubbin them, but I really needed to leave because I got really hot and dizzy and I was afraid my voice would shake. A lot of strangers looking at me expecting me to talk takes my breath away.
How are you doing? Do you drink still? I would love to hear your story, and thanks again for your concern.
irie,
sar
Posted by Lisa Simpson on April 14, 2001, at 10:22:53
In reply to blacking out, posted by sar on April 7, 2001, at 0:51:30
Hi Sar, thanks for your reply.
I'm still drinking, I'm afraid. I try to stop - on Monday, I say this is it, I'm not going to drink, but the trouble is my other half doesn't support me. Not that he doesn't want me to stop drinking, but he doesn't realise how big the problem is, and he can't be bothered to give me positive encouragement. I need someone to say "well done, you've gone a whole day without a drink" and give me a pat on the back. Then I know I could do it. But no-one cares one way or another, so I think, what the hell, I might as well have a drink. And so it continues. I know it sounds childish and silly, but if there was someone there just to praise me and give me the odd hug after a successful day of non-drinking, that would really help.
I have had seizures in the past, which the doctors could find no reason for. But if I'm honest, I'm pretty sure the drink is responsible for this. The most frightening thing about all this is that I lose my memory. In the morning, I can't remember anything about the night before. Although, like you say, I can hold my drink pretty well, and my other half doesn't know when I've put half a bottle away. I'm quite good at hiding it. And hiding bottles... sigh.
Dreadful, isn't it. You have my utmost sympathy. I have been thinking about going to AA, but that would mean admitting to my other half that I'm an alcoholic, and I don't think I could do that. He nags me about everything as it is, without giving him a weapon like this! Anyway, sorry to bore your socks off. Hope everything is going well with you at the moment.
Best regards
Lisa
Posted by sar on April 14, 2001, at 21:24:39
In reply to Re: blacking out, posted by Lisa Simpson on April 14, 2001, at 10:22:53
Hi Lisa,
Going an entire day without a drink can be so tough. Of course you need support and encouragement, that's natural! How can we go it alone successfully when we've become so adept at deception? I've thought of telling my parents about this so they might help me pay for therapy, but then I wouldn't be able to raid their liquor cabinet, they'd be watching it too closely. I guess I don't quite know what I want.
Well...you sneak drinks and hide bottles pretty well...do you think you could sneak over to an AA meeting? :)
I don't know if I'm completely down with AA's philosophy, but if you were to go, they would match you up with a sponsor--a reformed alcoholic who knows what it's like. Sponsors are there to help you as much as they can, and you can generally call them whenever you want for support, help, hugs, etc.
The other posters are right--blackouts are so dangerous! I hope you're being careful. I make myself drink more slowly now to avoid getting to that point--of course, it took one more awful experience about a month ago to make me come to that conclusion...that and this beer belly that makes all my pants too tight. I don't have nearly as many dreams about chugging Gatorade anymore, either.I hope you are doing well.
hugs,
sar
This is the end of the thread.
Psycho-Babble Social | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.org
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.