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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 12 of 12. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by sunnydays on January 27, 2007, at 12:44:17
I had really really bad nightmares last night. I think I jinxed myself because I was feeling very unstable all afternoon yesterday - just almost anything would trigger a memory and I would get really shaken, but I remember thinking that at least I wouldn't have dreams with that stuff in them because I've only had those kind of dreams twice. Well, I think I jinxed myself, because make last night number three.
I just had all these nightmares about my brother raping me (which isn't what happened with him, but it easily could have in the situation I was in) and it was really disturbing. And the worst part was, and I don't think I'll be able to tell my therapist this, was that it was really arousing dream. It just has me pretty shaken today and I don't know what to make of it or what to do about it. How do you prevent a nightmare? Could it be because this is the anniversary weekend of everything happening to me that this is coming up? I mean, it came up a little last week in therapy too, but no specifics, and I was fine for a full two days after the therapy session, so I don't think that was it.
Anyway, ideas, thoughts, whatever would be helpful. I'm kind of shaken.
sunnydays
Posted by caraher on January 27, 2007, at 13:09:38
In reply to Nightmares **sex abuse trigger**, posted by sunnydays on January 27, 2007, at 12:44:17
(((sunny)))
I don't know whether you can prevent a nightmare; it's not easy, anyway. It sounds like you're ashamed that you found the dream arousing, which echoes what I've heard often afflicts sexual abuse survivors - shame about their physical reactions. You didn't ask to have *that* dream any more than anyone asks to be abused, and during sleep your body just does whatever it does.
I hope you don't tie yourself up in knots worrying about what the dream "means." I especially hope you don't think it means anything negative about you! There may be, and probably are, "reasons" you had this kind of dream, and understanding those reasons may be helpful. But above all, be kind to yourself. Nobody should think less of you for having these nightmares - not even you!
Posted by toojane on January 27, 2007, at 14:40:49
In reply to Nightmares **sex abuse trigger**, posted by sunnydays on January 27, 2007, at 12:44:17
> I had really really bad nightmares last night. ... Anyway, ideas, thoughts, whatever would be helpful. I'm kind of shaken.
Hi Sunnydays,I often feel like a complete and utter charlatan if I dare to offer any advice to other people's posts because I myself am an absolute mess but I certainly have lots and lots of experience with nightmares.
I haven't found any way to stop them but managing the distress the day (or days) afterwards is easier if I write it down, in detail. I think nightmares are like messages from your mind and writing it down says clearly - okay, got that message, roger that. It doesn't make the nightmares stop, for me, but it seems to lessen the daytime revisiting.
Posted by Daisym on January 27, 2007, at 18:36:35
In reply to Re: Nightmares **sex abuse trigger** » sunnydays, posted by toojane on January 27, 2007, at 14:40:49
Sometimes I avoid sleeping so I can avoid the nightmares. This is a bad strategy because the more tired I am, the worse the dreams are. Sleeping pills or a glass of wine before bed sometimes minimize the dreams. Not always though.
I agree with toojane, writing down dreams is really useful. That way you don't have to carry it around, you can put it away for later reflection. As far as being aroused, this is common, both for dreams and when you are retelling some event, particularly a sexual event. How would you propose to control this physically programed response? Think of it like passing gas...you might not want to have gas but assuming you are human, your biology dictates that you will. It is how you expell that gas and where, that counts. Just like what you do with your arousal counts. Please don't beat yourself up over it.
Anniversaries are hard. If you think it would help, please write more about what happened to you here. I think sharing and receiving support can calm down the psyche's need to force it up and out in our dreams, even in non-concrete, very symbolic ways. I know it is hard, but I think it will help. I promise to read and reply.
Take good care of yourself.
Hugs,
Daisy
Posted by sunnydays on January 27, 2007, at 19:21:12
In reply to Re: Nightmares **sex abuse trigger**, posted by caraher on January 27, 2007, at 13:09:38
I don't know whether you can prevent a nightmare; it's not easy, anyway. It sounds like you're ashamed that you found the dream arousing, which echoes what I've heard often afflicts sexual abuse survivors - shame about their physical reactions. You didn't ask to have *that* dream any more than anyone asks to be abused, and during sleep your body just does whatever it does.
**** Thanks, yeah, I know, but it kind of freaks me out. I know I didn't ask to have the dreams intellectually, but it is so hard to accept at some level.
>
> I hope you don't tie yourself up in knots worrying about what the dream "means." I especially hope you don't think it means anything negative about you! There may be, and probably are, "reasons" you had this kind of dream, and understanding those reasons may be helpful. But above all, be kind to yourself. Nobody should think less of you for having these nightmares - not even you!***** Thank you. I'll try not to be too hard on myself.
sunnydays
Posted by sunnydays on January 27, 2007, at 19:22:34
In reply to Re: Nightmares **sex abuse trigger** » sunnydays, posted by toojane on January 27, 2007, at 14:40:49
> I often feel like a complete and utter charlatan if I dare to offer any advice to other people's posts because I myself am an absolute mess but I certainly have lots and lots of experience with nightmares.
**** No, no problem at all. Anyone who's ever had problems knows it's much easier to advise other people than to apply their advice to yourself.
> I haven't found any way to stop them but managing the distress the day (or days) afterwards is easier if I write it down, in detail. I think nightmares are like messages from your mind and writing it down says clearly - okay, got that message, roger that. It doesn't make the nightmares stop, for me, but it seems to lessen the daytime revisiting.**** Thanks. Maybe I'll try that.
sunnydays
Posted by sunnydays on January 27, 2007, at 19:34:40
In reply to Re: Nightmares **sex abuse trigger**, posted by Daisym on January 27, 2007, at 18:36:35
> Sometimes I avoid sleeping so I can avoid the nightmares. This is a bad strategy because the more tired I am, the worse the dreams are. Sleeping pills or a glass of wine before bed sometimes minimize the dreams. Not always though.
**** Thanks. Yeah, I couldn't possibly avoid sleeping - I require more and more lately. I don't have any sleeping pills, and I'm not old enugh to drink legally, so those are out.
> I agree with toojane, writing down dreams is really useful. That way you don't have to carry it around, you can put it away for later reflection.
**** Yeah, I think I'll try that.
As far as being aroused, this is common, both for dreams and when you are retelling some event, particularly a sexual event.
**** I guess I know this, but it's hard for me. Arousal is such a shameful thing for me that I have a hard time accepting it ever, let alone in this context.
Anniversaries are hard. If you think it would help, please write more about what happened to you here. I think sharing and receiving support can calm down the psyche's need to force it up and out in our dreams, even in non-concrete, very symbolic ways. I know it is hard, but I think it will help. I promise to read and reply.
**** I'll try. Basically what happened was that my brother and I were alone in the house because my mom left to go somewhere. I was a sophomore in high school, and my brother was in sixth grade. He had bipolar disorder (undiagnosed at the time) and he was probably manic. He exposed himself to me, and tried to force himself on me and tried to get me to look at him for like two or three hours. Eventually I went to the kitchen and he followed me and I screamed at him and he went to his room. I don't want to go into a whole lot more detail than that, but that's the basics. It was really scary, and my parents didn't have the best response to the whole thing. There are many things I beat myself up about it because he was younger than me and I should have been able to stop it, and it was hard.
sunnydays
Posted by Daisym on January 27, 2007, at 20:34:08
In reply to Re: Nightmares **sex abuse trigger** » Daisym, posted by sunnydays on January 27, 2007, at 19:34:40
(((Sunnydays)))
How scary for you. Thank you for sharing this, I hope it helps to hear that anyone would have been scared in a situation like that. I'm sorry for your brother too, he must have been hard to live with at that time.
You know I have boys, right? I think a 6th grade boy in a manic state would be hard for a grown up to handle, let alone a teenage girl. I can understand the wish to have been able to do something but the reality of it might help you give yourself a bit of a break.
I think I can see why your dreams have been so scary. Often the things we are most afraid of are what get stuck in our unconscious. So what didn't happen, but could have, would be the thing that is stuck. Especially since your parents perhaps didn't respond as well as they could have. That makes all the difference in the world, what happens after a trauma for a child. I hope they are helping you now. And I know you have a great therapist, so you have help there too.
I think you need to tell him about the dream and the arousal part. It is really important to talk about all of this and not let it go underground and become a secret.
I hope tonight is peaceful.
Posted by sunnydays on January 27, 2007, at 20:56:08
In reply to Re: Nightmares **sex abuse trigger** » sunnydays, posted by Daisym on January 27, 2007, at 20:34:08
> How scary for you. Thank you for sharing this, I hope it helps to hear that anyone would have been scared in a situation like that. I'm sorry for your brother too, he must have been hard to live with at that time.
**** Thank you. I struggle with my feelings about my brother. On the one hand I care about him a lot, and always have and probably always will. On the other hand he scares me an awful lot because he gets really violent at times.
> You know I have boys, right? I think a 6th grade boy in a manic state would be hard for a grown up to handle, let alone a teenage girl. I can understand the wish to have been able to do something but the reality of it might help you give yourself a bit of a break.**** See, I just think that somehow there must have been something I could have done to predict it, or something. My therapist says that's sort of magical thinking though, because how could anyone have seen it?
> I think I can see why your dreams have been so scary. Often the things we are most afraid of are what get stuck in our unconscious. So what didn't happen, but could have, would be the thing that is stuck. Especially since your parents perhaps didn't respond as well as they could have. That makes all the difference in the world, what happens after a trauma for a child. I hope they are helping you now. And I know you have a great therapist, so you have help there too.**** My mother tries to help but she just doesn't know how, and I'm not sure she'll ever understand. There is also some abuse from her in the past, both emotional and physical, and I'm struggling hard with my relationship with her right now. She'd like to help, but at the same time she seems like she wants me to get over everything and go back to being her normal daughter and go back to acting exactly like she wants. My therapist is really wonderful. He helps so much.
> I think you need to tell him about the dream and the arousal part. It is really important to talk about all of this and not let it go underground and become a secret.***** But that's what I always do! :) Secrets are such a big part of my life, even still, and it's so hard. I'm thinking maybe if I put it in an email that would work. It might take me almost an entire session just to say the words, otherwise. He might not catch it in an email because he doesn't always have time to read them thoroughly, sometimes he just scans them for how I'm feeling, but I think that if I sent him an email, maybe that would be a way to mention it. It's just so embarrassing. See, until very recently, I was too embarrassed and ashamed to even discuss the prospect of having a boyfriend with him. I'll have to see.
> I hope tonight is peaceful.
**** Thank you. Me too.
sunnydays
Posted by Declan on January 27, 2007, at 22:58:49
In reply to Nightmares **sex abuse trigger**, posted by sunnydays on January 27, 2007, at 12:44:17
Ambivalence
The worst part for you was the arousal you felt.
Well, the arousal you felt is you, as is all the rest.
I suppose the problem is that if you felt aroused then you were complicit in it.Truly, try not to worry.
(But how?)
Posted by sunnydays on January 28, 2007, at 13:11:04
In reply to Re: Nightmares **sex abuse trigger** » sunnydays, posted by Declan on January 27, 2007, at 22:58:49
> (But how?)
Yeah, I think that's the key question. It's just been made such a shameful thing to me, that it's hard even to type it, let along speak it aloud to my therapist. But we'll see. I managed to sneak it into an email, so maybe he'll bring it up.
sunnydays
Posted by bil on January 28, 2007, at 15:44:20
In reply to Re: Nightmares **sex abuse trigger**, posted by sunnydays on January 27, 2007, at 20:56:08
Sunnydays, you said...
"See, I just think that somehow there must have been something I could have done to predict it, or something. My therapist says that's sort of magical thinking though, because how could anyone have seen it?"I read a book ages ago, (and now I can't remember the title or anything... sorry!) that said by blaming ourselves for being abused or victimised like this is a way that we take back control of the situation... because if we say 'I could have stopped this... therefore I was NOT a victim!" then we feel like we did have power.
In some ways, feeling like we had no power is more scary... and actually putting the blame where it belongs is even scarier!
Why did mommy hit me?
Because I am a bad girl, and made her do it.
It was my fault.
Nice little girls don't get angry at mommy.or.......
Nice little girls don't get angry at threatening little brother because she is older and should be looking after him.
Nice little girls don't get angry at parents who should have known better than to leave their daughter with a son who they damn well knew had some problems.
Nice little girls don't get angry at parents who ignored her fear, terror, and vulnerability.So pass that guilty stick so nice little girl can whack herself with it.
And then your subconscious replays it to try to MAKE YOU MAD!
Wow- I am starting to shake typing this... getting in touch with anger must be one of my triggers, lol! I'm good at self-blame, too.
Bil
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