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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 23 of 23. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Susan47 on October 7, 2006, at 14:15:22
I know this is a silly question, considering .. but, how much does it actually hurt and for how long after you slit your wrists?
Posted by wishingstar on October 7, 2006, at 16:06:40
In reply to Dear Atticus, posted by Susan47 on October 7, 2006, at 14:15:22
Susan, I know I'm not the person you were directing this at.. and in fact, I'm not sure I've ever even posted to you before, so hello! But I'm concerned. I dont know you well but I'm wondering why you're asking about cutting your wrists.. I'd imagine it's not general curiousity. What's going on? No one here, myself included, wants you to hurt yourself. It sounds like things are going prety badly for you right now though. Can you tell me (us) some more about what's going on? I'm here to listen.
Posted by tofuemmy on October 7, 2006, at 20:22:35
In reply to Dear Atticus, posted by Susan47 on October 7, 2006, at 14:15:22
Posted by Susan47 on October 8, 2006, at 13:33:04
In reply to Re: Dear Atticus, posted by wishingstar on October 7, 2006, at 16:06:40
I'm holding one of my sharpest knives to my wrists lately and wondering what it feels like. I can't cut the skin yet as of yet but I can get it to separate a bit and leave a mark. It's just in my desperate moments I do it but I wonder what I can do to kill myself off.
I don't think it has to be this way but I don't know how to make it any different. I'm trying to think positive thoughts .. it isn't easy.
I've been thinking about how to end the pain.
Posted by Declan on October 8, 2006, at 14:34:27
In reply to Re: Dear Atticus » wishingstar, posted by Susan47 on October 8, 2006, at 13:33:04
I hope my saying this doesn't really give you the jerks, but is it possible to see the pain as a gift.
No? Well, if not a gift, something that you accept and do not resist?
I wonder if you can accept it whether it is less damaging to your spirit?
Posted by gardenergirl on October 8, 2006, at 19:44:23
In reply to ***** TRIGGER for Susan's post**** SI suicide (nm), posted by tofuemmy on October 7, 2006, at 20:22:35
Posted by gardenergirl on October 8, 2006, at 19:51:29
In reply to Re: Dear Atticus » wishingstar, posted by Susan47 on October 8, 2006, at 13:33:04
Susan,
Please seek help IRL. Considering taking your own life and coming up with a specific method is a severe and urgent symptom. It's also beyond the scope of this board to provide you with the kind of support required to help you stay safe.It's also not appropriate for anyone on this board to help you hurt yourself. If I were Atticus or anyone else to whom you posed your question, I might feel offended or upset that someone wanted me to help them hurt themself. Or that someone asked me to perhaps "relive" what could have been a very personal and/or traumatic time.
Please take care of yourself. Honor yourself or at least your children by contacting someone who can help you stay safe and help you get through what sounds like a very painful time.
Take care,
gg
Posted by alexandra_k on October 9, 2006, at 4:34:53
In reply to Re: Dear Atticus » wishingstar, posted by Susan47 on October 8, 2006, at 13:33:04
> I don't think it has to be this way but I don't know how to make it any different. I'm trying to think positive thoughts .. it isn't easy. I've been thinking about how to end the pain.
(((((Susan))))))
I'm sorry things are so hard for you right now.Are you still seeing your t? Have you been able to tell her how you are feeling? Is therapy bringing stuff up for you?
I understand it is about wanting the pain to go away and not seeing any other way to do that. I don't think that is the answer though, Susan. It is likely to leave you feeling a whole lot worse.
Things will feel better. Things have felt better before and they will feel better again. It can be hard to see that when you are feeling so bad, though. You have been feeling pretty low for a while, huh.
I think you are a terrific person, Susan. I'd miss you so very much if anything were to happen to you. I want to come visit you one day.
Can you talk to your t?
Can you do something nice for yourself?
Hang in there.
Posted by zazenducky on October 11, 2006, at 13:55:07
In reply to Please seek help » Susan47, posted by gardenergirl on October 8, 2006, at 19:51:29
Please don't post anything that could lead others to feel accused or put down. Please do not make hypothetical statements which could lead others to feel shamed or accused of unkind behaviour. Please do not take it upon yourself to speak for others. I believe Atticus is a kind sensitive compassionate person. I do not think you speak for anyone but yourself. I do not think Atticus response would resemble yours as he is as I said sensitive and kind. If you or others have questions about this or about posting policies in general, or are interested in alternative ways of expressing yourself, please see the FAQ:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#civil
If I were Atticus or anyone else to whom you posed your question, I might feel offended or upset that someone wanted me to help them hurt themself. Or that someone asked me to perhaps "relive" what could have been a very personal and/or traumatic time.
>
Posted by Susan47 on October 11, 2006, at 22:57:41
In reply to Re: Please be civil sensitive and kind » gardenergirl, posted by zazenducky on October 11, 2006, at 13:55:07
In the depths of despair it's almost impossible to think of how others would view my desperation. Thank you for your blessed words of understanding .. everyone who's understood this desire to have the world - and yourself - disappear because it's just too much will know how it's impossible to think clearly.
Thank you so much for understanding.
You yourself would probably make an excellent T ... and I'm apologizing if, in fact, I brought up old pain for someone who's really experienced it .. but in reality I believe that if you've been there, there's some comfort in knowing you're not alone ...
Posted by Susan47 on October 11, 2006, at 22:59:07
In reply to Re: Dear Atticus » Susan47, posted by Declan on October 8, 2006, at 14:34:27
> I hope my saying this doesn't really give you the jerks, but is it possible to see the pain as a gift.
> No? Well, if not a gift, something that you accept and do not resist?
> I wonder if you can accept it whether it is less damaging to your spirit?What a wonderful way this could be to turn things around. And yes, you're right .. it's a gift to have great pain, but a backhanded one. !!!
Posted by Susan47 on October 11, 2006, at 23:13:49
In reply to Re: Dear Susan, posted by alexandra_k on October 9, 2006, at 4:34:53
Honestly, I can't understand how my suicidal ideation (is that what it is?) .. got to this point. I mean, I've been having these feelings for more than thirty years .. but this is the first time I've gone this far .. not that I haven't thought of it before ... I don't want to be here ever again ... I feel really like a failure. It's the feeling of being a complete failure that's impossible to take. It's too hard .. I mean what's the point, what is the Point? I'll die one day in any case .. why drag myself through thirty-plus more years of pain and failure? What the hell for? That's how it feels. But then I do think about my kids .. someday I might be a grandmother and that would be the reason to keep going .. but is it enough? I mean, how many billion people are there on this planet already, suffering or not .. what is the Point??? For me, it isn't in religion that I could ever find reason enough. Some people would say that God is a good enough reason .. but in my case I simply do not believe in a god and never will .. even the Higher Power they speak of in NA isn't enough for me to believe in ..
Do you know what, Alex? If I were a different person, I would be a Human Rights Lawyer. I would go to fight for the freedom of people, children included, who have had all their human rights taken away by the American CIA in their prisoner of war camps. That would be a reason to live. I can't imagine the suffering of others, people who didn't ask for the horrible lives they're living .. but what I just begin to understand is that my suffering, although internal and some would say self-imposed by my own thoughts, is in its own way just as great ... Damn. Is that a silly thought? Why do people suffer, why is there so much suffering and then blindness to that suffering from others who cannot see nor understand nor believe it?
Harper's magazine has this heartwrenching picture of a POW in one of the US prison camps, hooded .. sitting barefoot on the ground, holding his small barefoot child ... the cruelty humans inflict on others .. the humans inflicting that cruelty cannot ever have felt the pain of the truly depressed. I don't believe it. I think true, deep depression ("weltschmertz") is a gift, I think it makes us more deeply compassionate .. but I could be wrong. I could be dead wrong. Could be, depression also makes people cruel .. what makes people cruel? How could so many "good" Americans inflict so much pain, so much harm, on innocent people?Doing something nice for myself .. that would be learning how to use my brain again, after years on marijuana almost destroyed what I had left of one...
>
>
Thanks for being here, Alex. I love you.
Posted by Declan on October 13, 2006, at 0:19:46
In reply to Re: Dear Atticus » Declan, posted by Susan47 on October 11, 2006, at 22:59:07
It's the sort of thing that is more fun to say than to hear.
Posted by Declan on October 13, 2006, at 0:35:03
In reply to Re: Dear Susan, posted by alexandra_k on October 9, 2006, at 4:34:53
Still, having said that, the pain of opiate withdrawal is best dealt with by welcoming it. But maybe it's all a load of nonsense. Really I have no idea.
Posted by Damos on October 16, 2006, at 17:21:04
In reply to Dear Atticus, posted by Susan47 on October 7, 2006, at 14:15:22
Dear Sweet Susan,
Dear lady, it has been too long, and for that I am sorry. I miss you. This is entirely selfish but I don't want you to leave us just yet as we haven't talked long enough, or deep enough - not even nearly. There is so much more to you that I'd like to take a long time getting to know. Depths to you I've yet to experience. Ways of being we've yet to explore. I believe in you so much Susan, just so very much. I know it's been a long hard road with lots of ups and downs, but it's been a pleasure to walk it with you. Wish I knew a way to soothe your hurts and ease your pain - wish that so much.
Susan, you are one of my very first babble firends and I will always be grateful for all that we've shared - always.
I went sailing for the first time last week. Just hope you felt me wishing you there. We were on a 40ft Jeanneau out on the harbour. It was the most beautiful day 33 C (92 F), cloudless, the sky was an amazing azure, and the breeze was deliciously light. Spent most of the day on the port ropes and winches and on the helm. The skipper was about my dads age and said "for someone who's never sailed before you've got a good feel for the breeze", so different to anything my dad would've said. Was wishing you there so hard. Imagining you there sipping champagne, just being, forgetting all about life's cr*p for a bit.
Sorry you're so far away. Please stay with us 'cause I'd miss you a lot.
((((((((((Susan))))))))))
Damos
Posted by Susan47 on October 22, 2006, at 23:02:07
In reply to Dear Susan » Susan47, posted by Damos on October 16, 2006, at 17:21:04
Those ropes are actually called sheets ... weird, huh? The sheets oughtta be the sails .. but no, those are the main, the jib, the spinnaker .. and so on. Wish I was there too.
Your post made me feel happy .. thanks for sharing, Damos. I missed hearing from you. You have a sweet spirit and I'm so happy you found a new pleasure in life.
Enjoy!!! Keep on getting out there, for the time we have left on this planet is too short .. any joy you can find out there, grab it and hang on.
Posted by Jai Narayan on October 28, 2006, at 11:34:03
In reply to Atticus?, posted by Susan47 on October 7, 2006, at 14:18:06
> Are you around, are you there? I was wondering, does it hurt a lot when you slit your wrists? I'm afraid I might panic a bit too much, which is silly, considering I'm looking to obliterate myself anyway, and I know the pain is going to happen, but I was wondering how intolerable it is and does it get better, maybe actually I think a plastic bag is better. Actually that's probably the best thing to do.
my god Susan, what is going through your head?
remember that death is so final and no more chances to live.
Life is very precious, I can tell you are in pain right now but...please wait and reconsider.
Jai
Posted by gardenergirl on October 28, 2006, at 11:34:03
In reply to Atticus?, posted by Susan47 on October 7, 2006, at 14:18:06
Posted by Susan47 on October 28, 2006, at 11:34:03
In reply to Susan you are having a hard time?, posted by Jai Narayan on October 7, 2006, at 20:25:03
Just trying to come up with a plan that won't make me panic in the end.
Just wanting to end the pain, that's all.
Psychology and the way we think .. the way we think .. inner conversations ...
Posted by Declan on October 28, 2006, at 11:34:03
In reply to Re: Susan you are having a hard time?, posted by Susan47 on October 8, 2006, at 13:35:49
The only way I would manage to avoid panic at the end would be if the alternative was really really bad. Like torture, end stage illness, things like that. Otherwise the ambibivalence will always trigger panic.
Posted by Atticus on October 28, 2006, at 11:34:04
In reply to Atticus?, posted by Susan47 on October 7, 2006, at 14:18:06
I don't think it's a good idea to discuss the mechanics of a suicide attempt, either in this forum or anywhere else. I will tell you this (and you can read my poem on this site, "Spots," for more details): A suicide attempt of any kind is not some kind of peaceful passage to another, better place. It's not only painful -- it's indescribably terrifying once the process has been set in motion. You will never fight for your life -- no matter how unhappy you feel -- as much as you will when death becomes a real and imminent possibility. I was very lucky the EMS people arrived as quickly as they did. And in those long, long moments before they showed up, I remember fighting off unconsciousness with a tenacity and desperation that I'd never expected. "Spots" was intended as a cautionary tale of sorts. Please go straight to an ER if you feel as if you might hurt yourself. It's infinitely better than the alternative. Atticus
Posted by Susan47 on October 28, 2006, at 11:34:04
In reply to Re: Atticus? » Susan47, posted by Atticus on October 19, 2006, at 14:46:33
Perhaps I was trying to find the desire to live. Perhaps I was hoping that by taking the steps to end my life, I would thereby find a desire to live it.
What you said, Atticus, about fighting for your life at the end, gives me hope. I suppose that's backward. Finding hope by feeling what it would be like to be there, at the edge of dying.
Perhaps I'm hoping I can spark a near-death experience .. without actually dying.
Without the desire to really LIVE, how can I go through the motions day-to-day? The pain of just going through the motions, knowing that I'm WASTING the life I've been given, no matter how good someone else sees it as being .. I see it as small and desperate. Which isn't worth the effort to take another breath .. the things I tell myself, honestly .. it isn't right. It isn't right to be given a life that is this "good" and not really to engage in it.
I don't engage.
I want the desire, the Desire to Engage in my Life.
Did you find it long-term, Atticus?
Posted by Atticus on November 12, 2006, at 15:34:31
In reply to Re: Atticus? » Atticus, posted by Susan47 on October 22, 2006, at 22:40:20
Susan
I find the desire to really "engage in my life" a spotty proposition -- it's still a daily struggle to truly care about things going on around me and the things I feel I ought to be doing. At the moment, I feel very distant from the world and all the sturm und drang that fill it. I just carry on and do my best, I suppose. The long, long nights when I have complete insomnia seem to me the worst. Ta. Atticus
This is the end of the thread.
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