![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 16 of 16. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by PreemieNurse on December 18, 2005, at 22:59:05
I've been hanging around lurking for a bit now and finally decided today that it was time to register and post. This may not be the right board, but the newbie board is just not very active and this is the one that I seem to be drawn to read the most. I'm on an email list from another group, but for some reason, I just can't seem to relate to them. This post may be triggering on several issues, so please be aware of that if you decide to read all the way through.
Anyway, my story...I am a 36 yr old single mom of three kids (ages 16, 8, and 6), a full time NICU nurse, and as of Jan, a full time student again. I experienced a 14 yr history of sexual, physical, and emotional abuse and incest. As soon as I left my family home and married my now ex-husband, I put all of that behind me, so I thought. I could sit and tell you the details of what happened to me, but I never put any emotional depth behind it. It didn't touch me. It was like it happened to someone else. I honestly didn't even realize that it had an effect on me. Like some of you, I had to sit at family dinners and holidays with several of the people that did this to me and pretend like it had never happened, year after year.
When I hit my mid to late twenties, things started to fall apart. I couldn't keep it together anymore for some reason. I was severely depressed, my marriage was starting to disintegrate, and I didn't feel like I could be a mother to my kids anymore. Somehow, even through all that, I still managed to finish a full-time school program and become an LPN. My husband and I got divorced when I was 32. Keep in mind however that I certainly didn't marry the specimen of manhood. After he moved out, I was left completely alone with my own demons for the first time and it all hit the fan. I started seeing a new therapist, that thankfully I had a really good raport with, and went off the deep end. I ended up in a psych hospital three times, made three suicide attempts, lost my house because of not being able to work, lost custody of my kids for a year and almost lost my job too. I went on/off many different medications. I spent hours on the roof of a nine-story parking garage (right outside my doctor's office) trying to work up the courage to jump. I remember one day standing there just after an appointment counting the cars driving past below me and telling myself that I would jump after the tenth one, the next tenth one, etc. I completely zoned out after one session and ended up in a hotel room with a fifth of alcohol, a drug overdose and a sliced open wrist. I started using drugs again, a problem that I had as a teen. I picked up a guy off the internet, took him to a hotel, had sex with him, let him slap me around a bit, and then sent him on his happy little way and never talked to him again. I had sex in a bar with some guy that I didn't even know his name and still don't to this day. I can't even begin to tell you all the things that I did during that time period. I wanted to die and couldn't find the courage to even do that. Then, I hated myself for not being able to kill myself. My therapist and I did very little work on my abuse issues because everything was concentrated on just keeping me alive during that time. To this day, I'm still not sure why I'm alive and how I was able to get past that time period.
I remember the day that I came out of the hospital the last time. No one was there to pick me up and I simply walked out the front door, got in my car and drove myself away alone. Their only stipulation before discharging me was that a nurse had to walk out to my car and remove any sharp objects and drugs. There was still blood all down the driver side door. I stopped at the gas station to fill up the tank and stood there thinking about how I wasn't supposed to be alive anymore at that point. I had never felt so sad, so empty, so completely alone as I did right then. I even felt like my therapist had abandoned me at that point. He had called 911 and had the police sent to that hotel room when I called him to say goodbye. He betrayed me. Yeah, I know. "If you hadn't wanted to be saved, then you wouldn't have called him." I didn't want to be saved. I wanted to say goodbye. I wanted to hear his voice. I wanted to be able to carry that sound in my mind until I was gone. I wanted him to know what had happened. But, I ended up in the hospital instead and never heard another word from him until I was released. They called him to set up an appointment. He told me to just keep the appointment that we would have had a week and a half later. I felt completely naked, raw and stripped of every defense I had at the moment and he just nonchalantly told me that he would see me in 10 days. I think that's when I really shut down to him. He was the first person in my life that I had ever really trusted and that I felt like cared about me as a person. But, I think it disappeared on that day, right then. Then, I went home and logged onto a newgroup that I was a member of, only to find out that a friend had attempted suicide at almost the exact time that I did and had succeeded. Talk about feeling like a failure.
Now, I am with a new therapist and have been for about a year and a half. I feel like we are just now beginning to touch on the very edges of the effects of my childhood. I have very little memory of it, no flashbacks, no waking up in the middle of the night in a sweat, and no panic attacks. However, I have yet to find the ability to tell him exactly what happened back then and I think that is a huge blocking point for me. There are only a few specific incidents that I recall, but I know that there were many more that I can't remember. My first memory is a sexual one. I was somewhere between 3 and 5 years old as I can best tell. I know that I hadn't started school yet.As for today, I'm certainly doing much better than I was doing three years ago, but how much better? I'm still alive. I don't feel so far removed from that period, though. I don't make plans to die anymore, but it's not that far away on some days. Guilt and fear keep me alive most of the time, but guilt and fear drive me towards wanting out most of the time too. Some days, it is a real battle still and no one in my real life knows that. I hide that from everyone. I'm ashamed of feeling that way when I am supposd to be cured of that. I'm tired of feeling like some kind of mentally defective object. I'm so tired of feeling like I'm someone that people have to protect themselves from (a touchy subject with my therapist right now). I'm tired of hating myself. I'm tired of being angry with myself all the time. I'm tired of feeling guilty. I'm tired of being alone. I'm tired of not being able to connect with anyone because I can't allow myself to even try.
As far as the touchy part with the therapist, like others that I have read in here, I have fallen completely for him. It's scary and extremely painful most of the time. One of the issues that I'm struggling with right now is the feeling that I have to protect him from me. I've even considered stopping therapy with him at times, just because of this. But even THAT thought is torture most of the time. I question myself constantly about this. Do I love him? Yes, without a doubt in my mind. I trust him completely and I've never trusted anyone before. I thought I trusted my previous therapist, but looking back over posts from my old newsgroup, I realized this weekend that just a few months into seeing him, I was already stating that I wasn't able to tell him certain things because I didn't feel safe enough. Is this real? I keep telling myself that it's not. I keep telling myself that I am just living a typical cliche. Everyone falls for their therapist, right? It's just part of the process. But you know what? It's maddening and insulting to think like that. This is so real to me when I admit it to myself. It's frustrating. We discuss it in depth and he knows how I feel. I put on my 'rational' hat and step back to look at it. Of course I would have these feelings. He knows more about me than anyone ever has known, he lets me say how I feel about things without making me feel judged, he focuses on me alone the whole time that I am there, he remembers everything I tell him, he's learned how to read my moods and feelings even when I can't find the words for them, and he makes me want to be a better person. There have been several (thousand) times in the past couple of years that I have been longing to do something destructive, but stop myself only because I don't want him to be disappointed in me. But there are a lot of things that he doesn't know about me also and I really know very little about him. I know, I make him who I need him to be and ignore the fact that he is probably just another typical man that leaves his dirty underwear on the bathroom floor and just rolls over to go to sleep after sex. In the last month, I have thought about him constantly. I need him. It's not even so much of a 'need' thing most of the time. I WANT him and I'm terrified at the depth of that. Here's my sappy confession. On two occasions, I've gotten in my car and driven around the hospital area just because I knew he was there and I wanted to feel some kind of connection with him. I have fought all of this so hard and I feel like I'm losing it sometimes.
Away from that issue, I'm to the point now with my therapy that I feel like I HAVE to go deeper (another extremely frightening thought). It seems like there is something pushing its way up through a lot of layers and if I don't acknowledge it and let it out, it will just break out on its own. Make any sense? It's a rage that I bite back on, a self-hate that will kill me one day, a guilt that drags me further down everytime I look at it, a thought that something is looking over my shoulder waiting for the moment to make me slip, an inevitability that I'm running from, and a fear that I will never be sane again once it's out. But it is screaming at me and when I'm alone writing something like this, I feel my sanity slipping a bit anyway.
Sorry so long for a first time post.
Posted by tarabara on December 18, 2005, at 23:21:37
In reply to Hello..new here and long post (triggers ), posted by PreemieNurse on December 18, 2005, at 22:59:05
hi there. i have to at least say hi and say that i will respond to your post as soon as i can. i have a lot to respond to and some similar experiences but i cannot for the life of me keep my eyes open. i am so impressed and how far you have come with so little help. you are a strong determined woman. even though you feel like you are falling to pieces left and right, you continue to get yourself and find yourself the RIGHT help. in my opinion, about 1% of people can talk to their male therapists about their feelings of love. when i read that part, my mouth fell open. you sound like an amazingly strong and insightful woman and that's why you are still alive. that's what i kept getting from your post. you have a very unique bond with your therapist that many here can attest to does not happen very often. once again, i think it is testimony to your determination. i will touch on the details later when i can think clearly. i just wanted to say hi and tell you that your story is truly inspirational and that you kick *SS
Posted by Tamar on December 19, 2005, at 3:40:36
In reply to Hello..new here and long post (triggers ), posted by PreemieNurse on December 18, 2005, at 22:59:05
Hello and welcome!
Thanks for sharing your story. I agree with Tarabara: I’m really impressed at how far you’ve come, and at your courage in telling your therapist about your feelings of love.
I think when you fall in love with a therapist it’s very special and certainly not just part of the process. I’m sure that when it happens it means there’s a particular kind of special connection between the therapist and the client. It’s not all in your mind; it’s a function of the real relationship and the way you interact when you’re in the room together. And just because he interprets it symbolically, that doesn’t mean it isn’t real.
I know what you mean about wanting him. I want my therapist too, particularly when I’m having a hard day or I’m feeling depressed. I know you say you’re fighting it, but in my own experience I found that fighting it made it worse and was more painful. But I know it can be difficult to believe you’re allowed to want him. Sometimes it’s hard to believe that wanting him is a good thing, particularly because it hurts so much. The thing that helped me was to try to focus on the part of it that felt good, because it was the only way I could accept that there was something good about it…
It sounds to me as if you’ve been working very hard in therapy. I know the feeling of having to go deeper. It’s scary. Have you talked to your therapist about how to do it? You might need to take it very slowly indeed. I hope it goes well.
Tamar
Posted by fallsfall on December 19, 2005, at 7:44:34
In reply to Hello..new here and long post (triggers ), posted by PreemieNurse on December 18, 2005, at 22:59:05
Welcome to Babble.
It sounds like you have a wonderful open relationship with your therapist. That is worth so much. To be able to share with someone what is in your soul is very powerful. And, while you are so tired of living the way that you have, you do sound like you want to move past all of this to a happier time. And it sounds to me like you have the drive and courage to do that. It is hard to open up session after session, but it is so worth it.
I can't believe your therapist wouldn't see you until 10 days after you got out of the hospital. When I left the hospital the first time I drove straight to my therapist's office (of course, she had a family emergency and I had to see her colleague, but that is another story).
Your relationship with your therapist (even though it is painful) will get you through this.
Posted by Larry Hoover on December 19, 2005, at 9:10:42
In reply to Hello..new here and long post (triggers ), posted by PreemieNurse on December 18, 2005, at 22:59:05
> Sorry so long for a first time post.
You are very eloquent, and your insight is dramatic. Thank you for trusting us with your story.
There is a kind of therapy that might just be perfect for you. It's called EMDR. Eye Movement Desensitization and Reprocessing. It sounds hokey at first glance, but having used it myself, I can say that I remain almost mystified that it could work so well, so quickly.
Here's a quick look at it:
http://www.healthyplace.com/communities/depression/treatment/emdr/q_and_a.aspIt's these lines of your post, that bring me to suggest this new therapeutic angle: "Away from that issue, I'm to the point now with my therapy that I feel like I HAVE to go deeper (another extremely frightening thought). It seems like there is something pushing its way up through a lot of layers and if I don't acknowledge it and let it out, it will just break out on its own."
That's exactly the frame of mind you need to make EMDR effective. Although the therapy itself is fast, in a sense, it takes some preparatory work with the therapist who will conduct the EMDR sessions. An ethical therapist will not proceed unless you're ready for it. I have never had a sense of catharsis, nothing close, from anything else I've ever done to heal.
Anyway.....welcome. And I so admire your profession.
Lar
Posted by B2chica on December 19, 2005, at 10:19:10
In reply to Hello..new here and long post (triggers ), posted by PreemieNurse on December 18, 2005, at 22:59:05
hello and a big welcome. i can't say it better than those before me, i read that and all i could think is that if nothing else you are resiliant (sp?). you are incredibly strong to have such rotten experiences yet somehow you've managed to come to the top, seek help while still fighting on your own.
i'm not much help with your feelings for your T, all i can say is just becareful and remember you are bonding with your T so that you can trust him, so is it a non-sexual bond or feelings of desire? maybe you should talk about your feelings about him to him?
anyway, i'm so sorry for what you went through and are still going through but i'm very glad you posted.
b2c.
Posted by Poet on December 19, 2005, at 22:24:55
In reply to Hello..new here and long post (triggers ), posted by PreemieNurse on December 18, 2005, at 22:59:05
Hi PreemieNurse,
I'm sorry that you can identify with having to be around family members and having to pretend bad stuff never happened, but I'm glad you decided to post about yourself.
I can't believe your old T called 911 on you and then acted like nothing important happened to you when you got out of the hospital. That is an awful hurt to have had to go through, but you did it and that shows your resiliance.
I don't have the same feelings for my T as you do for your new one, so I can't offer much advice on that. What I see as great in your relationship is how you feel able to be so open and honest. I have trouble talking in therapy and after three years can't say I'm very open especially on things that I know I need to be open on.
Keep up the resiliance and strength and keep posting.
Poet
Posted by PreemieNurse on December 20, 2005, at 10:36:07
In reply to Re: Hello..new here and long post (triggers ), posted by tarabara on December 18, 2005, at 23:21:37
> hi there. i have to at least say hi and say that i will respond to your post as soon as i can. i have a lot to respond to and some similar experiences but i cannot for the life of me keep my eyes open. i am so impressed and how far you have come with so little help. you are a strong determined woman. even though you feel like you are falling to pieces left and right, you continue to get yourself and find yourself the RIGHT help. in my opinion, about 1% of people can talk to their male therapists about their feelings of love. when i read that part, my mouth fell open. you sound like an amazingly strong and insightful woman and that's why you are still alive. that's what i kept getting from your post. you have a very unique bond with your therapist that many here can attest to does not happen very often. once again, i think it is testimony to your determination. i will touch on the details later when i can think clearly. i just wanted to say hi and tell you that your story is truly inspirational and that you kick *SS
Wow. Umm...thanks. I don't feel so inspirational most of the time though. Thanks for the welcome.
Posted by PreemieNurse on December 20, 2005, at 10:46:38
In reply to Re: Hello..new here and long post (triggers ) » PreemieNurse, posted by Tamar on December 19, 2005, at 3:40:36
> Hello and welcome!
>Thanks for the welcome. It's been really nice.
> Thanks for sharing your story. I agree with Tarabara: I’m really impressed at how far you’ve come, and at your courage in telling your therapist about your feelings of love.
>Sharing my story in THIS form is easy. I'm quite good at being able to remain anonymous. ;)
I don't think that it was courage that lead me to talking to him about my feelings. It was more like desperation.
> I think when you fall in love with a therapist it’s very special and certainly not just part of the process. I’m sure that when it happens it means there’s a particular kind of special connection between the therapist and the client. It’s not all in your mind; it’s a function of the real relationship and the way you interact when you’re in the room together. And just because he interprets it symbolically, that doesn’t mean it isn’t real.
>It certainly FEELS real.
> I know what you mean about wanting him. I want my therapist too, particularly when I’m having a hard day or I’m feeling depressed. I know you say you’re fighting it, but in my own experience I found that fighting it made it worse and was more painful. But I know it can be difficult to believe you’re allowed to want him. Sometimes it’s hard to believe that wanting him is a good thing, particularly because it hurts so much. The thing that helped me was to try to focus on the part of it that felt good, because it was the only way I could accept that there was something good about it…
>You're right. I find comfort in knowing that I'm not completely alone anymore. It may be only what it is, but for right now, I don't feel like I'm battling through life completely by myself.
> It sounds to me as if you’ve been working very hard in therapy. I know the feeling of having to go deeper. It’s scary. Have you talked to your therapist about how to do it? You might need to take it very slowly indeed. I hope it goes well.
>I'm going to talk to him about it Friday. Actually, I'm going to give him my original posting that I made here and let it go from there. I feel like it's been going too slowly already. I want to start remembering things. Everyone says that memories will come when they are ready, I know.
> Tamar
>
>
Posted by PreemieNurse on December 20, 2005, at 10:49:20
In reply to Re: Hello..new here and long post (triggers ) » PreemieNurse, posted by fallsfall on December 19, 2005, at 7:44:34
> Welcome to Babble.
>Thanks!
> It sounds like you have a wonderful open relationship with your therapist. That is worth so much. To be able to share with someone what is in your soul is very powerful. And, while you are so tired of living the way that you have, you do sound like you want to move past all of this to a happier time. And it sounds to me like you have the drive and courage to do that. It is hard to open up session after session, but it is so worth it.
>Well, its kept me alive so far, so it must be worth something, right? Yeah, a happier time sounds lovely. If I could just remember what a happier time was...
> I can't believe your therapist wouldn't see you until 10 days after you got out of the hospital. When I left the hospital the first time I drove straight to my therapist's office (of course, she had a family emergency and I had to see her colleague, but that is another story).
>It was very damaging to the whole relationship, that's for sure.
> Your relationship with your therapist (even though it is painful) will get you through this.I hope so.
Posted by PreemieNurse on December 20, 2005, at 10:54:46
In reply to Re: Hello..new here and long post (triggers ) » PreemieNurse, posted by Larry Hoover on December 19, 2005, at 9:10:42
> > Sorry so long for a first time post.
>
> You are very eloquent, and your insight is dramatic. Thank you for trusting us with your story.
>Apparently, writing is one of my stronger points. Thank you for reading my story and responding. It helps.
> There is a kind of therapy that might just be perfect for you. It's called EMDR. Eye Movement Desensitization and Reprocessing. It sounds hokey at first glance, but having used it myself, I can say that I remain almost mystified that it could work so well, so quickly.
>
> Here's a quick look at it:
> http://www.healthyplace.com/communities/depression/treatment/emdr/q_and_a.asp
>
> It's these lines of your post, that bring me to suggest this new therapeutic angle: "Away from that issue, I'm to the point now with my therapy that I feel like I HAVE to go deeper (another extremely frightening thought). It seems like there is something pushing its way up through a lot of layers and if I don't acknowledge it and let it out, it will just break out on its own."
>
> That's exactly the frame of mind you need to make EMDR effective. Although the therapy itself is fast, in a sense, it takes some preparatory work with the therapist who will conduct the EMDR sessions. An ethical therapist will not proceed unless you're ready for it. I have never had a sense of catharsis, nothing close, from anything else I've ever done to heal.
>I read your link and it sounds very interesting. I had actually heard of it before, but have never really read up on it until now. I'll have to keep it in mind. That sense of catharsis is what I've been longing for all this time, I think. I've even said that to my T. "I want to have some kind of emotional breakthrough and just get everything out into the open! Don't you have some kind of pill for that??!!??" ;)
> Anyway.....welcome. And I so admire your profession.
>Thanks for the welcome. I love what I do and its always been the one place that I can be the person I want to be. I go in there and I'm smart, witty, fun to be around. Once I leave work however, that person seems to disappear.
> Lar
>
>
Posted by PreemieNurse on December 20, 2005, at 11:01:52
In reply to Re: Hello..new here and long post (triggers ), posted by B2chica on December 19, 2005, at 10:19:10
> hello and a big welcome. i can't say it better than those before me, i read that and all i could think is that if nothing else you are resiliant (sp?). you are incredibly strong to have such rotten experiences yet somehow you've managed to come to the top, seek help while still fighting on your own.
>Thanks for the welcome. It amazes me that everyone else sees me as strong when I can't seem to find a bit of that characteristic in myself.
> i'm not much help with your feelings for your T, all i can say is just becareful and remember you are bonding with your T so that you can trust him, so is it a non-sexual bond or feelings of desire? maybe you should talk about your feelings about him to him?
>I'm not sure really. I DO have sexual feelings towards him, but I think that's more of just a side effect. We talk extensively about it and its really helped to get it into the open. I trust him not to act on it and to not let me act on it. I know in my heart how much damage it would do.
> anyway, i'm so sorry for what you went through and are still going through but i'm very glad you posted.
>Thank you. I'm sure I will be posting more. I never felt comfortable on the email list that I'm on for some reason and really have only made one posting there. I belonged to another newsgroup for a long time and I don't seem to fit in there anymore. It made national news not too long ago and the place has fallen apart now, been overtaken by 'trolls'. It was home for a long time and I do miss the way it used to be, but that's over now.
> b2c.
Posted by PreemieNurse on December 20, 2005, at 11:12:01
In reply to Re: Hello..new here and long post (triggers ) » PreemieNurse, posted by Poet on December 19, 2005, at 22:24:55
> Hi PreemieNurse,
>Hi.
> I'm sorry that you can identify with having to be around family members and having to pretend bad stuff never happened, but I'm glad you decided to post about yourself.
>I'm sorry that anyone can identify with it at all. It sucks.
> I can't believe your old T called 911 on you and then acted like nothing important happened to you when you got out of the hospital. That is an awful hurt to have had to go through, but you did it and that shows your resiliance.
>What it did for the relationship is to make certain that the next time I was that far down, I would not call him at all. I understand why he had to call them. I even understand why he didn't see me in the hospital. It was a different facility than he was associated with at the time. He was still a resident and couldn't treat me at the other place. But, yeah, why the 10 day wait?
> I don't have the same feelings for my T as you do for your new one, so I can't offer much advice on that. What I see as great in your relationship is how you feel able to be so open and honest. I have trouble talking in therapy and after three years can't say I'm very open especially on things that I know I need to be open on.
>Oh, I still have a lot of trouble talking at times. But it's slowly getting easier. He is the first person that has ever let me have whatever feelings came up and didn't make me feel like they were wrong.
> Keep up the resiliance and strength and keep posting.
>I will. Thanks.
> Poet
Posted by Larry Hoover on December 20, 2005, at 12:21:59
In reply to Re: Hello..new here and long post (triggers ) » Larry Hoover, posted by PreemieNurse on December 20, 2005, at 10:54:46
> I read your link and it sounds very interesting. I had actually heard of it before, but have never really read up on it until now. I'll have to keep it in mind. That sense of catharsis is what I've been longing for all this time, I think. I've even said that to my T. "I want to have some kind of emotional breakthrough and just get everything out into the open! Don't you have some kind of pill for that??!!??" ;)
That's exactly what this treatment does. And, the outburst of the emotion that has been choking you, blocking you, requires real preparation. There's lots of information available about EMDR, and others here who have done it. For some reason, my sense is that it will suit you well.
Lar
Posted by James K on December 24, 2005, at 23:31:11
In reply to Re: Hello..new here and long post (triggers ) » PreemieNurse, posted by Larry Hoover on December 20, 2005, at 12:21:59
Hello. Thank you for sharing your painful story with us. I've been that far away myself, and although I'm not right now, I'm trying to learn that I have to work at it to stay okay.
As to the EMDR, my wife used it and it really helped her with trauma. I even used to steal the concept to self-help myself with flashbacks. It's funny how helpful techniques can fade away, but the negative ones are always at hand. I guess all I have to say is keep going, and EMDR is real.
Posted by happyflower on December 25, 2005, at 5:10:02
In reply to Re: Hello..and EMDR » Larry Hoover, posted by James K on December 24, 2005, at 23:31:11
Welcome!
I have also used EMDR for some tramatic past childhood abuse and it has changed my life even with one session of it. It really helps with the recurring troubling memories. You won't foreget the memories, but they will become less intense. I am doing it this week for the 2nd time for some new memories that have surfaced from my past. I am still nervous about it, because it is hard to think about those things. But I know it will probably let me let go of some lingering things. Good luck! :)
This is the end of the thread.
Psycho-Babble Psychology | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.org
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.