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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 9 of 9. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by LG04 on December 26, 2004, at 18:17:13
Hi, I'm having an absolutely horrible day. I've cried on and off, sobbing, for hours now. i spoke to my therapist this morning (we have a long distance relationship at this point) and i was upset at her about something and cried a lot and got mad at her and she reacted and got upset back at me. it was a terrible conversation. at the end, she told me that it's a lot harder than she thought it would be to deal with the transference issues over the phone, and it causes her a lot of helplessness and frustration and sometimes pain when i cry and cry. (i had no idea it was that hard for her) and that she's not as good on the phone at keeping her stuff out of our interactions, (which is true). my guess is she also still feels somewhat responsible for me in a therapist-kind of way, but can't do what she wants to do from across the world, and that's probably very hard. we both softened up a lot at the end and said we'll figure it out. and she said that if we didn't love each other and weren't so important to each other, then this wouldn't be happening, so at least we can know that. and again, that we'll figure it out together. next time we speak is wednesday. it feels like forever yet it also feels like too soon, after all the crying i've done, i feel scared to talk again so soon and possibly get upset again.
i am just in terrible pain at "losing" her, or at least losing the relationship that we used to have. i have never had the kind of support in my life that she gave me. she knew so much about my life, so many day-to-day details b/c we spoke a lot on the phone as well as met twice a week. she was like my guardian angel. she was always there, with very few exceptions. so loving and so interested and so caring and so understanding, it was beyond my wildest dreams to have that kind of regular, almost daily support. maybe she spoiled me. and i don't know how to let go of that. and i don't know if talking with her twice a week makes it easier or harder. in some ways, i can't envision not speaking to her. but in some ways, it is painful to speak b/c it reminds me of what was, that i can no longer have. that it's less than it used to be (the time, the degree of support, not the feelings), and probably less than it ever will be again. who would want to let go of that, especially someone with my issues? (incest, lots of other stuff)
already there are so many changes now that i live across the world from her. she knows much less about my daily life. she's not as big of a support as she used to be, simply b/c i don't see her or talk to her as much. i don't get to hug with her or smile with her or any of those connecting things that are part of the glue of a loving relationship. the time difference is 8 hours so most of the day i can't call her even if i'd want to. she wants to really limit my calls to twice a week, whereas before i could call her basically as much as i wanted to. she says she just can't do that anymore. it's very painful for me that she's setting more boundaries around our relationship, along with the changes that are already occuring simply due to circumstances.
i think she feels that maybe she did me a disservice by being there so much for me, that i got so dependent and now we have to lessen that dependency b/c it can't go on like this. we are in agreement that it is a goal to keep reducing the dependency. but usually that's done by being there when the person needs you, and as they internalize you and trust you, they don't need you as much. well i am having a hard time interalizing her b/c our relationship is changing so quickly. sometimes i feel so lonely without her, while other times i do quite well. when we have good conversations, i do much better. then i can internalize her until we speak again and it works fine.
but when we have bad conversations, which we've had more of in the past few weeks (ironically, the same time frame in which i feel i have been grieving our relationship more intensely and am probably more sensitive regarding whatever she says or does), i just lose it and feel like i can't do this anymore and i can't speak to her anymore, it's too painful. which she says is totally okay if i need that.
i don't know what to do. it would be so painful to take a long "time out" and stop speaking to her. but maybe it would break off the transference and dependency more quickly? or is it better to go more slowly even though it can also be very painful? will this just run our relationship into the ground?
i feel like she is burning out on me a little bit. this always scared me and now it feels like it's coming true, the idea of being "too much." she says she just needs more clarity, that she wants to be able to be there as best as she can for me and so needs to stick to twice a week. she has 3 kids and some evening appointments and with the time difference, it's hard. we talk 1 - 1 1/2 hours each time. i think she feels less competent over the phone and as she said, needs more time between calls to clear her head.
if there wasn't so much transference, it wouldn't be nearly as difficult. i have some thoughts on lessening the transference but then i think, what's the point? i should just stop talking to her, cry my eyes out for weeks and weeks, and move on. but i don't want to completely let go of her. i want to still talk to her, i just want to be able to do it without the pain.
we are both open to developing a different kind of relationship in the future, i.e. friendship of some kind. so this is also somewhere in the back of my mind. if i stop speaking to her, i'm afraid i would never be able to re-engage in a relationship with her b/c i'd be too scared of getting dependent on her or intense transference again. if we go more slowly, then i will work it thru with her (this is my hope anyway) and get to the other side. then at some point we can re-engage in a different kind of way. (i will be visiting the country where she lives for two months every summer for the foreseeable future).
i don't want to feel like i can't ever speak to her again b/c the transference will always come back. i want to work this thru. but is it possible over the phone in this way?
thanks in advance for your thoughts/advice. i am in a lot of pain.
LG04
p.s. i tried a new therapist last week and the appointment did not go well. mostly i realized that i am not ready to be in therapy again. first of all i am still working thru this process with my former therapist. and second, i am just too emotionally drained. i had a very intense therapy experience and relationship with this therapist and do not have the energy to start another one. i'm just not interested. it's way too soon. also i've been in therapy for 12 years now, with 5 different therapists. maybe i'm just ready for a break.
Posted by Fallen4MyT on December 26, 2004, at 20:36:12
In reply to Missing T so much, dilemma - long, posted by LG04 on December 26, 2004, at 18:17:13
I am sorry you're missing T so much it must be very hard to do. Best of luck and hugs to you at this hard time in your life
Posted by rockymtnhi on December 26, 2004, at 21:55:05
In reply to Missing T so much, dilemma - long, posted by LG04 on December 26, 2004, at 18:17:13
Your post just reeks of pain. I am so sorry that you are experiencing all of this.
I couldn't help but think of the changing of the seasons while I was reading your post. In your world, it definitely is winter. The leaves have fallen from the trees and has left you exposed.
Your world really has changed...you are in different time zone and unfortunately at a different place than you were with your therapist. To me (someone who is not grieving like you are) sees that you will not be able to recapture what was.
I believe that she will always be with you even though she may not be available like she once was.
Take care.
Posted by gardenergirl on December 27, 2004, at 16:03:03
In reply to Re: Missing T so much, dilemma - long, posted by rockymtnhi on December 26, 2004, at 21:55:05
It seems terribly difficult for you and your T right now. I think the telephone is a very different way of communicating. It does give you some cues that you don't get via email or writing...the way the voice sounds, tone, pauses, etc. But it's not face to face. You and your T had such an intense relationship, I think any change to the way you communicate is bound to complicate things.
I wonder if perhaps instead of a break, you might try communicating via writing or email? Maybe this would decrease the intensity of the exchanges and allow you both time to process and edit if necessary. Just a thought...
And I'm sorry your appointment didn't go well. Can you tell us about it? Perhaps a break is indicated. Perhaps instead, you might consider approaching this therapy go-round as therapy-lite? Maybe go in with a specific and focused issue to work on...one that is a problem but not so serious and intense. Kind of like a trial run. If that goes well and you and the T feel it is indicated, then you could go deeper. Taking a break is another good option, but I am concerned that you might feel unsupported. Of course we are here, as always.
Good luck.
gg
Posted by pinkeye on December 27, 2004, at 19:02:09
In reply to Missing T so much, dilemma - long, posted by LG04 on December 26, 2004, at 18:17:13
Hi LG,
I have gone through a similar thing with my ex T.
I had to move out of my country after some time of therapy and missed him terribly for 2 years. I still miss him and talk to him in my mind by myself. In my mind I discuss all issues with him still.
I don't know of a good answer to tell you. It still hurts me and I miss him and wish he is there. But he is not - that is the reality and it sinks in after some point. And you just have to accept it. That is as best as it could get. That he or she is jsut not going to be there for you - they will probably care for you and like you, but can never be there for you as much as you need them to be.
Email communication helped me a lot - though after sometime, he stopped replying regularly and that has started hurting. So now, I have told him that I am going to stop writing to him - because it hurts too much to write and not receive a reply.
Anyway you look at it, it turns out to be very complicated at the end.
Posted by Shortelise on December 30, 2004, at 16:38:45
In reply to Missing T so much, dilemma - long, posted by LG04 on December 26, 2004, at 18:17:13
I have no advice, or words of wisdom - I am just so very sorry you are in this pain.
ShortE
Posted by LG04 on December 31, 2004, at 14:32:38
In reply to Re: Missing T so much, dilemma - long » LG04, posted by Shortelise on December 30, 2004, at 16:38:45
thanks everyone for your thoughts and words. they mean a lot. it's too hard for me to read/respond to other posts about people missing their old therapists. i feel guilty about it but i just can't do it right now.
LG
Posted by 10derheart on January 1, 2005, at 15:54:38
In reply to Re: Missing T so much, dilemma - long, posted by LG04 on December 31, 2004, at 14:32:38
You took the words right out of my mouth. I identified with far too many parts of your post. So much so I couldn't write back without becoming somewhat "unglued" I'm sorry, but I would be of zero help it seems. I can only think to give you hugs for now. Hope I can do better for you soon. Please let us know how you are, if you feel up to it. (((LG04))) - 10derheart
Posted by shrinking violet on January 2, 2005, at 11:19:00
In reply to Re: Missing T so much, dilemma - long » LG04, posted by 10derheart on January 1, 2005, at 15:54:38
((((((LG)))))))))
I'm sorry too, for not knowing what to say. My T and I are pretty close, but I will be losing her in May when I graduate, and it's already troubling me a great deal, so it's difficult to know what to say to someone else in a similar situation. I do hope that somehow you and your old T can work past these issues and have a good relationship on the other side; at least the option is there for you, you both just need to find a way to make it work. I wish you all the best in this transition.
Peace,
sv
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