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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 62 to 86 of 89. Go back in thread:
Posted by raisinb on April 25, 2009, at 13:31:05
In reply to Re: bye for now babble...., posted by rskontos on April 24, 2009, at 21:46:27
I will miss you too, rsk. I hope you come back soon. You have been such a help to me here.
Posted by raisinb on April 25, 2009, at 14:56:01
In reply to Re: hey guys » raisinb, posted by stellabystarlight on April 24, 2009, at 17:58:31
I hear you, stella. Subjective and inconsistent or harsh enforcement can be just as bad as no rules. If Twinleaf was unfairly blocked, I agree with bringing her back into the fold. I miss her wisdom too.
Hope we all get through this.
Posted by Kath on April 26, 2009, at 16:21:29
In reply to Re: PWD Yet Again » Dr. Bob, posted by SLS on April 24, 2009, at 17:19:06
> > Thanks for apologizing to Scott. Maybe you're straining to stay sober, too?
> >
> > Bob
>
> Dr. Bob:
>
> That was a very compassionate act.
>
> I can't remember your ever attempting to allow someone to heal in such a way as to actually offer a potentially insightful and helpful suggestion.
>
>
> - Scott~ ~ ~ ~ Dr. Bob - that also struck me - that you are aware of verne's struggle & your post seemed like you were seeing Verne as a real human being with problems, feelings, etc......rather than you only being the 'rules' guy. It's not the first time I've seen you post like that & when you do, I really appreciate it.
Thx, Kath
PS - by saying 'struggle' I hope I am not being insulting or hurtful. I didn't know how else to put it.
Posted by Kath on April 26, 2009, at 16:25:08
In reply to Re: bye for now babble...., posted by rskontos on April 24, 2009, at 21:46:27
Jeez - it certainly won't be the same without you!!!
:-(
((((((((you)))))))))
luv, Kath
Posted by Sigismund on April 26, 2009, at 18:18:00
In reply to Re: bye for now babble...., posted by rskontos on April 24, 2009, at 21:46:27
I'm sorry to hear that. You have always been a kind presence here. I think Fayeroe blocked herself for a month after receiving a PBC or something like that. It does sound optimistic, but I think what is currently happening is way better than what happened before, specifically zazenduck's block
Posted by Sigismund on April 27, 2009, at 3:16:09
In reply to Re: bye for now babble.... » rskontos, posted by Sigismund on April 26, 2009, at 18:18:00
I'm clearly behind the eightball.
It seems that Fayeroe's formula had the same result as Bob's though.
What was hers?
Multiply something by the stars in the sky and deduct 7% for rain?
Posted by Dr. Bob on April 29, 2009, at 9:13:57
In reply to Re: PWD Yet Again ) Dr. Bob, posted by Kath on April 26, 2009, at 16:21:29
> > There does seem to be this persistent idea that I have all the power and posters have none.
>
> Could you please tell me what power we have with the exception of leaving?
>
> rskYou do have the power of flight. And the power to fight.
You also have the power to show others how they might interpret things more charitably, to encourage them to apologize, and to suggest they not address those they can't get along with. You have the power to help them avoid being blocked. And of course you have the power to apologize yourself.
--
> So we have this thing in the U.S. military called an "amnesty box". When you are departing from a war zone and have illegal paraphenelia, before you have to go through search points at the Port, you can place it in the box and the illegal act is ignored. Stuff like bomb shells, stuff from Sadaam's palaces, Iraqi weapons, other stuff people take as souveniers, drugs--anything.
>
> People will look the other way--in terms of the law--if a person had the sensibility to discard what they knew they shouldn't have brought back. It encourages trust and good will. It allows reflection. It fosters integrity-doing the right thing.
>
> So how about having a PB amnesty box--forgive and unblock everyone - and start over.
>
> garnet71Exactly! And here we have an "apology box". When you post something uncivil, you can dissociate yourself from it (place it in the box) by apologizing. It may not necessarily be forgiven, depending on who you've been uncivil to, but as you say, it fosters trust, good will, reflection, and integrity.
But it depends on having the sensibility to "discard" what's uncivil. Soldiers aren't forgiven if they keep paraphernalia that's against the rules.
--
> > Dr. Bob:
> >
> > That was a very compassionate act.
> >
> > I can't remember your ever attempting to allow someone to heal in such a way as to actually offer a potentially insightful and helpful suggestion.
> >
> > SLS
>
> Dr. Bob - that also struck me - that you are aware of verne's struggle & your post seemed like you were seeing Verne as a real human being with problems, feelings, etc......rather than you only being the 'rules' guy. It's not the first time I've seen you post like that & when you do, I really appreciate it.
>
> KathThanks, I appreciate your support!
Bob
Posted by Sigismund on April 29, 2009, at 15:28:30
In reply to Re: what power we have, posted by Dr. Bob on April 29, 2009, at 9:13:57
>You do have the power of flight.
Which they did.
But your idea is a good one.
Did it come in just after zazenducke's block or does it only apply to some?
Posted by Kath on April 29, 2009, at 21:04:09
In reply to Re: what power we have, posted by Dr. Bob on April 29, 2009, at 9:13:57
>... to encourage them to apologize, and to suggest they not address those they can't get along with. You have the power to help them avoid being blocked.
~ ~ ~ I wonder about this. I can't imagine how to encourage someone to apologize, etc, except in a Babblemail...because if we have a problem with a post, we're supposed to do the "notify administration" aren't we? But I guess a kind, polite, caring Babblemail would do the trick.
Kath
Posted by Tabitha on April 30, 2009, at 2:07:44
In reply to Re: what power we have, posted by Dr. Bob on April 29, 2009, at 9:13:57
You have the power to pick your battles.
Battling Dr. Bob on PB Admin? Generally results in frustration and effects on policy ranging from
- none
- the exact opposite of what you intended to accomplish
- some other seemingly random policy change that isn't what you wanted.Choose wisely!
Posted by Dr. Bob on April 30, 2009, at 9:35:26
In reply to Re: what power we have » Dr. Bob, posted by Sigismund on April 29, 2009, at 15:28:30
> But your idea is a good one.
>
> Did it come in just after zazenducke's block or does it only apply to some?Thanks! Posters have always had the power to apologize.
Bob
Posted by jai narayan on May 6, 2009, at 20:32:14
In reply to Re: PWD Yet Again » Dr. Bob, posted by SLS on April 24, 2009, at 17:19:06
Verne I love you. I know I've said that before but now I really mean it.
and yes Dr. B's voice has changed.
Posted by verne on May 7, 2009, at 2:18:06
In reply to Re: PWD Yet Again, posted by jai narayan on May 6, 2009, at 20:32:14
Jai,
I appreciate your feelings but we've never met and all that you know about me is here at Dr Bob's website.
We exchanged a few emails in the past but that went nowhere. As with many others, I put far more into it than you did. I responded in length to one of your emails and got no response. Where was the "love" then?
So I guess (to quote the song), tell me what "love" is then? Forget what I wrote on the social thread when I encouraged you. We've never even met and any feelings are based on only words.
I'm coming to my senses and leaving this site for good.
enough,
Verne
Posted by verne on May 8, 2009, at 1:05:48
In reply to Online Love, posted by verne on May 7, 2009, at 2:18:06
Jai, I'm sorry I was so abrupt with you. I was out of line but still think most online relationships aren't REAL. I'm really sorry I was so mean about it.
Verne
Posted by Sigismund on May 8, 2009, at 2:04:08
In reply to Re: Online Love » verne, posted by verne on May 8, 2009, at 1:05:48
>but still think most online relationships aren't REAL
At least this way we don't have to really meet each other.
Posted by verne on May 12, 2009, at 18:58:31
In reply to Re: Online Love » verne, posted by Sigismund on May 8, 2009, at 2:04:08
Hey Sig,
The babblelites meet annually and sometimes on their own. Some babble relationships have evolved into something in the real life - or what, we in the know, like to call the matrix.
Actually, I don't know anything and I'm adrift. I'm surprised I wasn't blocked for being so downright mean and sarcastic to Jai (sorry again) and wish to appeal my non-block. Review my posts and at least find the sarcasm and block me for a year.
Some of you do meet and find happiness. I don't get it, this love with words that people "speak" online. I think Harold Pinter was getting at this with plays like "Homecoming" and "The Caretaker"
Just after I renounced "online romance" I saw the movie, "Message in a Bottle" and, although repelled, it told me this sort of thing was real for some people.
So I sincerely apologize to the group and Jai, in particular, for being so insensitive. I also think I brought it on with my flirtatious social post. So, in a way, I ambushed the first person to respond.
I'm trying to make a case, that I should have been blocked.
What drives me? I react badly to complements, yet worry about what people think about me. I live a tortured life. I rarely venture past the front porch. I'm in tears about the flickers losing their nest to the starlings. I can barely deal with life one day to the next.
My plan is to freeze myself to death this next winter. Don't call 911! It's Spring. I'm just tying up lose ends and waiting (9 months) until the temp drops low enough and get 2 qts vodka, which I haven't drank in 25 years, and deepfreeze myself. Everyone will think it was an accident. I can't and don't have insurance so that won't be a motive.
That's where I'm at. But, don't start calling the authorities since I'm happily alive, want to live, and my "accident" is at least 8-9 months off.
Sorry, this isn't administrative. I'm not in any immediate danger. Just tying up loose ends, hanging in there until the first really good freeze. Lots may change. That's just where I'm at now. Not even terminal or in bad health. I guess depression can do that to a person.
Got sidetracked. Just meant to apologize for the way I reacted to Jai's post about love. I used to cut myself if someone even said something nice about me or I got good grades. (Hello, fellow borderliners)
I should be blocked (please reconsider for the group's sake, Dr Bob. I won't be hurt).
Alcohol and borderline personality disorder is a scary combination. Again, I'm hopeful, making it longer between slips, getting support, may turn it around.
Most people at online poker games hate me in the end, perhaps, you will learn to.
love verne
after numerous attempts I couldn't get the book or DVD links to work. I would change one and the rest would reset.
Posted by Sigismund on May 12, 2009, at 19:11:52
In reply to Re: Online Love, posted by verne on May 12, 2009, at 18:58:31
Verne
Have you ever come across "Talking Heads" by Alan Bennett?
You might like it.
They are monologues that impart information in spite of the language used.
You can get the monologues read out by various people on CD which is how I came across them first.
Posted by Sigismund on May 12, 2009, at 19:17:14
In reply to Re: Online Love, posted by verne on May 12, 2009, at 18:58:31
'A Bed Among the Lentils' was the one I liked most.
Very very funny.
Posted by verne on May 12, 2009, at 19:35:55
In reply to Re: Online Love, posted by Sigismund on May 12, 2009, at 19:17:14
Thanks Sig,
I've already ordered the book. Read a couple quick reviews and I'm looking forward to actually reading it. (I usually just stack the books that I order on shelves) My intentions were good.
I'm hoping to start reading a couple books a week. A book "club" is growing among my daughter, me, and Kyra, my 9-month old granddaughter.
I would need to read 3 books per week to even catch up with my book purchases.
this looks like something I can dive right into.
On another note, one of my favorite groups in the 70's was the "Talking Heads". I only really liked one of their albums: think it was their first or second and called, just, Talking Heads. One of the few bands I ever saw in person.
Verne
Posted by Sigismund on May 12, 2009, at 21:03:06
In reply to Talking Heads, posted by verne on May 12, 2009, at 19:35:55
"Fear of Music" is my favourite.
Posted by gobbledygook on May 12, 2009, at 21:36:09
In reply to Re: Online Love, posted by verne on May 12, 2009, at 18:58:31
Talking Heads was a cool band, and David Byrne
is an innovator - the real deal. Saw them 4X.
And you are one interesting babblelite, Verne.
Very 3D to me here in this babbleland.Recently, with the help of your enlightening
posts, I've come to understand almost
everything going on at drbob.org(I think I do
anyway), and decided that you are the star of
the show around here. You are Neo!
I think I pseudo-love you - if that's possible.
You usually have me LOL on my matrix floor.
I wanna buy you dinner and psychoanalyze
psychobabble ad nauseum with you. Really.You don't know me, especially since I've changed
my name(for safety reasons as I'm a bit paranoid),
but you are welcome to use me to get blocked,
if that's what you really want. I won't take it
personally as I like you too much. We will apologize.
I'm ready. Flame away, Neo.Sincerely,
Gobbledygook
"Gobbledygook is a fictional character created for entertainment purposes and no resemblance to any actual person, living or dead, is intended. The opinions, views, thoughts, and feelings of Gobbledygook may not necessarily reflect those of his portrayer nor of his portrayer's employers, colleagues, associates, friends, family, or parole officer."
Posted by verne on May 12, 2009, at 23:06:49
In reply to Re: Online Love » verne, posted by gobbledygook on May 12, 2009, at 21:36:09
There was a day I couldn't get enough of Leonard Cohen, Dylan, and all the other super talkers. But tonight I only ordered two copies of "Talking Heads 77" (this is no advertisement). Cohen, Dylan and the rest were like acid: I did it and don't want to go back (well maybe with the acid if it were legal) there's something about Cohen and Dylan I can't listen to anymore but the Talking Heads is different - something timeless.
I think the 77 album is the one that captured me. In fact, I saw them on tour in 78 or so. I can go back to the Talking Heads but just can't go back to Dylan. I had to have friends physically remove all of Leonard Cohen's music (back in the day of CD's) - I like, love, but gotta leave be for my own good.
I just bought two of Talking Heads 77 album so I can give one to my daughter. Their "big" hit "Psycho Killer" is actually my least favorite cut on the entire album. The rest is brilliant.
Sorry, Gobbled Be Ook, that I couldn't go out flaming. Shouldn't I be blocked just for caring about what you think?
redundantly,
Verne
Posted by jai narayan on May 25, 2009, at 19:15:28
In reply to Re: Online Love » verne, posted by verne on May 8, 2009, at 1:05:48
> Jai, I'm sorry I was so abrupt with you. I was out of line but still think most online relationships aren't REAL. I'm really sorry I was so mean about it.
>
> VerneI forgive you- sometimes I get mushy & gushy.
Posted by verne on May 28, 2009, at 2:18:53
In reply to Re: Online Love, posted by jai narayan on May 25, 2009, at 19:15:28
you weren't especially mushy or gushy. I was just wrong.
I mean, completely wrong.
Verne
Posted by twinleaf on June 2, 2009, at 17:55:18
In reply to Bob: Now, do the right thing and unblock Twinleaf » Dr. Bob, posted by stellabystarlight on April 22, 2009, at 19:17:53
> Bob,
>
> Now...do the right thing and unblock Twinleaf.
>
> Please!!!!!
>
> I know you're a busy man, but please read all the threads that's led to her blocks.
> I feel the reasons for her blocks are inconsistent at best.
>
> She is a fine person who's genuinely helped many here, including myself.
> She was an asset here!
>
> I am shocked by what I have witnessed here, and saddened by the loss of safety here.
> Also, the loss of fondness for you and babble.
>
> I'm absolutely sickened by the amount of pain she must be going through...(((sorry Twinleaf))).
>
> Please, Bob...undo this wrong.
>
> Stellabystarlight
>
Thanks so much Stella- I really did, and do, appreciate your support.I'd like to state once again my own conviction that I was blocked for three months for reasons which were clearly irrelevant and unimportant. I was not even given a warning so that I would know when the blocks were coming. I know for sure that I never said anything which hurt another poster here; my comments were about anonymous third parties, unknown to any of us, and I was mentioning them only to illustrate points that I felt were important- in one case, that a poster under unusual stress in her personal life should be treated with understanding and leniency rather than being abruptly blocked; in the second case, it was to illustrate how the rules had become so detailed that they coud be used to play a mean kind of game- hurting someone on purpose while staying within the verbal civility guidelines.
It is clear to me that the real reason I was blocked is because I pointed out serious weaknesses in the way this site is run. By blocking me, no-one needed to address these issues, and they didn't. But problems which are not addressed don't disappear. I am going to mention them one more time, and I hope that this time there will be some intelligent and cooperative discussion about them. They are: 1) not using flexibility and compassion for posters under severe stress, 2) elaborating the rules to such an extent that they can be misused to hurt others, and 3) rapidly increasing the block length of posters like me because the administrator does not happen to like what we say.
Blocks hurt a lot, and unjust, excessively long ones hurt far more, and require a lot of time in therapy to recover from. I have not seen anyone, other than a number of our therapists, address this central issue.
This was once one of the few places online where I felt free and safely held, and I valued the site very much for that. But once you have been blocked as severely as I was, it's impossible to feel that way again. If I were in Bob's place, I would try to value and respect the presence of each poster as much as possible, and would never use escalating blocks in a punitive manner. as he did to me. I'm not even sure whether blocks are necessary at all. I personally think that if someone is given a chance to rethink something excessive that they've said, 99% of the time they will gladly do so. They want to remain part of this community. I believe that would be much more in keeping with what this site is supposed to be: a forum for support, communication, friendship and information for persons suffering from, and recovering from, emotional illnesses. These are all people you should want to be especially careful not to hurt, Bob.
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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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