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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by jparsell82 on May 18, 2005, at 19:27:48
In reply to Re: Anyone ever tried an Abilify + Amisulpride combo?? » jparsell82, posted by pro_social_soon on May 18, 2005, at 15:54:48
> > Anyone ever tried this?? Thanks
> >
> > Josh
>
> Why would you wanna mix D2/D3 antagonist with DA2 partial agonist/DA3 antagonist ?I meant low dose Amisulpride, where it preferentially blocks presynaptic D2/D3 receptors enhancing dopaminergic transmission.
Posted by rod on May 19, 2005, at 12:22:41
In reply to Re: Anyone ever tried an Abilify + Amisulpride combo?? » pro_social_soon, posted by jparsell82 on May 18, 2005, at 19:27:48
I tried, but didnt like the abilify very much. I havent treid Abilify on its own. And I am still taking Solian (Amisulpride) 50mg and are somewhat satisfied with it. Coadministration of Abilify caused mild dysphoria, SSRI like numbness and decreased libido. I am doing better without Abilify...
Posted by Declan on May 19, 2005, at 23:43:27
In reply to Re: Anyone ever tried an Abilify + Amisulpride, posted by rod on May 19, 2005, at 12:22:41
Hi Rod
Do you find low dose amisulpride picks you up a bit? Wondered whether to take it for, you know, anhedonia.
Declan
Posted by antidote9 on December 15, 2012, at 21:13:45
In reply to Re: Anyone ever tried an Abilify + Amisulpride combo?? » pro_social_soon, posted by jparsell82 on May 18, 2005, at 19:27:48
> > > Anyone ever tried this?? Thanks
> > >
> > > Josh
> >
> > Why would you wanna mix D2/D3 antagonist with DA2 partial agonist/DA3 antagonist ?
>
> I meant low dose Amisulpride, where it preferentially blocks presynaptic D2/D3 receptors enhancing dopaminergic transmission.would the enhanced dopaminergic transmission treat Amisulpride side effects such as hyperprolactineamia? i am interested in starting on this combination for that reason. would like to know if it helps in any other way.
Posted by SLS on December 16, 2012, at 0:44:04
In reply to Re: Anyone ever tried an Abilify + Amisulpride combo??, posted by antidote9 on December 15, 2012, at 21:13:45
> > > > Anyone ever tried this?? Thanks
> > > >
> > > > Josh
> > >
> > > Why would you wanna mix D2/D3 antagonist with DA2 partial agonist/DA3 antagonist ?
> >
> > I meant low dose Amisulpride, where it preferentially blocks presynaptic D2/D3 receptors enhancing dopaminergic transmission.
>
> would the enhanced dopaminergic transmission treat Amisulpride side effects such as hyperprolactineamia? i am interested in starting on this combination for that reason. would like to know if it helps in any other way.It is an interesting idea to combine Abilify with amisulpride. I have never seen it done.
What would happen if you were to use pramepexole instead of Abilify?
- Scott
Posted by SLS on December 16, 2012, at 0:46:10
In reply to Re: Anyone ever tried an Abilify + Amisulpride combo??, posted by SLS on December 16, 2012, at 0:44:04
> What would happen if you were to use pramepexole instead of Abilify?
Spelling: That should be "pramipexole".
- Scott
Posted by antidote9 on December 16, 2012, at 16:16:14
In reply to Re: Anyone ever tried an Abilify + Amisulpride combo??, posted by SLS on December 16, 2012, at 0:44:04
i researched it and found that pramipexole is a potent dopamine agonist used in depression...it would be contraindicated for schizophrenia. however i found that Abilify and Risperdal is used successfully to counteract the hyperprolactinemia in patients.
it might be the go.
Posted by Lamdage22 on December 18, 2012, at 1:03:01
In reply to Re: Anyone ever tried an Abilify + Amisulpride combo?? » pro_social_soon, posted by jparsell82 on May 18, 2005, at 19:27:48
It sounds interesting.
Even with medium dose, where it should have a stabilizing effect.You would wanna mix these in different dosages to lower the high moods and higher the lows.
Is low dose amisulpride weight-neutral?
Posted by SLS on December 18, 2012, at 6:51:55
In reply to Re: Anyone ever tried an Abilify + Amisulpride combo??, posted by antidote9 on December 16, 2012, at 16:16:14
> i researched it and found that pramipexole is a potent dopamine agonist used in depression...it would be contraindicated for schizophrenia. however i found that Abilify and Risperdal is used successfully to counteract the hyperprolactinemia in patients.
>
> it might be the go.
Risperdal is notorious for producing hyperprolactinemia and galactorrhea. Under what circumstances would it reduce the secretion of prolactin?Abilify has been described as a dopamine system stabilizer (DSS) by some researchers. Your idea might work.
- Scott
Posted by antidote9 on December 18, 2012, at 16:30:55
In reply to Re: Anyone ever tried an Abilify + Amisulpride combo?? » antidote9, posted by SLS on December 18, 2012, at 6:51:55
Abilify is D2 dopamine agonist so it does not affect the full spectrum of dopamine which would effect hallucinations. Because it allows for some of the dopamine, it reduces the rate that prolactin is produced as it would in normal circumstances where dopamine exists and is not diminished as it is with risperdal.
i am trialing this combination from next week because i have a problem with hyperprolactinemia.
Posted by SLS on December 18, 2012, at 16:39:56
In reply to Re: Anyone ever tried an Abilify + Amisulpride combo??, posted by antidote9 on December 18, 2012, at 16:30:55
> Abilify is D2 dopamine agonist so it does not affect the full spectrum of dopamine which would effect hallucinations. Because it allows for some of the dopamine, it reduces the rate that prolactin is produced as it would in normal circumstances where dopamine exists and is not diminished as it is with risperdal.
>
> i am trialing this combination from next week because i have a problem with hyperprolactinemia.
Okay. I think I understand now. You are going to use Abilify to combat the hyperprolactinemia produced by Risperdal. Is that right?
- Scott
Posted by antidote9 on December 18, 2012, at 16:43:03
In reply to Re: Anyone ever tried an Abilify + Amisulpride combo?? » antidote9, posted by SLS on December 18, 2012, at 16:39:56
yes, thats right.
Posted by SLS on December 18, 2012, at 17:06:30
In reply to Re: Anyone ever tried an Abilify + Amisulpride combo??, posted by antidote9 on December 18, 2012, at 16:43:03
> yes, thats right.
Good luck. Please post your results. It is actually a pretty important experiment that you and your doctor are conducting.
- Scott
Posted by antidote9 on December 18, 2012, at 17:13:14
In reply to Re: Anyone ever tried an Abilify + Amisulpride combo?? » antidote9, posted by SLS on December 18, 2012, at 17:06:30
Thanks. Its been done before. There are results on the web that show a dramatic reduction in the prolactin from this. i dont have the links though, i would have to repeat the research to find them.
it will take some time for the results to present themselves but i will post to let you know.
cheers,
ioana.
Posted by antidote9 on December 18, 2012, at 17:30:16
In reply to Re: Anyone ever tried an Abilify + Amisulpride combo?? » antidote9, posted by SLS on December 18, 2012, at 17:06:30
this is not the link that i found previously but just another one with similar results achieved with this combination:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3004714/
there is more there if you search for it.
Posted by antidote9 on December 18, 2012, at 17:48:36
In reply to Re: Anyone ever tried an Abilify + Amisulpride combo?? » antidote9, posted by SLS on December 18, 2012, at 17:06:30
....and this one:
Posted by Lamdage22 on December 20, 2012, at 2:23:35
In reply to Re: Anyone ever tried an Abilify + Amisulpride combo?? » antidote9, posted by SLS on December 18, 2012, at 6:51:55
Risperdal is notorious for producing hyperprolactinemia and galactorrhea. Under what circumstances would it reduce the secretion of prolactin?
>
> Abilify has been described as a dopamine system stabilizer (DSS) by some researchers. Your idea might work.
>
>
> - ScottI agree on both. Risperdal gave me gyno. I would like to try Abilify badly and kick out Geodon. Geodon seems to have severe sexual side effects with its SNRI properties.
Wanna be on low dose Melperon at night and low dose Abilify in the morning. Further on 25 or 30 Parnate.Need to convice my pdoc
Posted by SLS on December 20, 2012, at 6:10:59
In reply to Re: Anyone ever tried an Abilify + Amisulpride combo??, posted by Lamdage22 on December 20, 2012, at 2:23:35
> Risperdal is notorious for producing hyperprolactinemia and galactorrhea. Under what circumstances would it reduce the secretion of prolactin?
> >
> > Abilify has been described as a dopamine system stabilizer (DSS) by some researchers. Your idea might work.
> >
> >
> > - Scott
>
> I agree on both. Risperdal gave me gyno. I would like to try Abilify badly and kick out Geodon. Geodon seems to have severe sexual side effects with its SNRI properties.
> Wanna be on low dose Melperon at night and low dose Abilify in the morning. Further on 25 or 30 Parnate.
>
> Need to convice my pdocGeodon is an unpredictable drug. It obliterated what little cognitive ability my illness leaves me with. I actually experienced some depersonalization and maybe a hint of dissociation. Meanwhile, other people benefit a great deal from it.
With Abilify, expect some startup anxiety and insomnia. This doesn't happen with everyone, but know that it often disappears quickly. For me, these things resolved within a week. My treatment was initiated at 20.0 mg/day. True akathisia is also a possible reaction to Abilify. Try not to assume that startup anxiety and restlessness will evolve into full-blown akathisia.
Akathisia is characterized by:
distressing feeling of inner restlessness
subjective experience of "crawling out of one's skin"
inability to remain still
psychomotor agitation
fidgeting
rocking
pacing
shifting positions
shifting weight from foot to foot while standing
crossing and uncrossing legs
- Scott
Posted by Lamdage22 on December 20, 2012, at 13:41:30
In reply to Re: Anyone ever tried an Abilify + Amisulpride combo??, posted by SLS on December 20, 2012, at 6:10:59
Geodom + 20mg Parnate seemS to give me serotonin syndrome symptoms.
SNRI with MAOI = absolute no go.
Scott, whats the lowest abilify dosage you have seen effective for stabilizing and what weight effects are to expect from that dosage?
Also: Would Lamictal 125 mg and lithium xr in 100mg augment eachother in stabilizing?
I can absolutely not take weight gain sides for medical reasons. Most likely candidiasis.
Thx
Julian
Posted by SLS on December 20, 2012, at 14:44:32
In reply to @ Scott, posted by Lamdage22 on December 20, 2012, at 13:41:30
Are you bipolar?
Have you ever experienced mania?
What are you taking right now, and at what dosages?
> Geodom + 20mg Parnate seemS to give me serotonin syndrome symptoms.
>
> SNRI with MAOI = absolute no go.You are absolutely right. That's why I won't combine Geodon with a MAOI. Although it is an antipsychotic, Geodon also has SNRI effects.
> Scott, whats the lowest abilify dosage you have seen effective for stabilizing
2.5 mg/day for depression
10.0 mg/day for bipolar mania.> and what weight effects are to expect from that dosage?
I am not convinced that Abilify-induced weight gain is dosage-dependant.
Some people do gain weight with very low dosages. However, given the potential therapeutic value of Abilify, I would consider trying it and see if weight gain does occur. You can always stop taking it if you don't like how it affects you.
> Also: Would Lamictal 125 mg and lithium xr in 100mg augment eachother in stabilizing?
The NIMH used to employ that combination, especially for rapid-cycling presentations. Your dosages of Lamictal and lithium are a bit low, though - even for unipolar depression. What happens when you increase Lamictal to 200 mg/day or lithium to 300 mg/day?
I have seen the following combinations work. They can even be combined with Parnate.
Wellbutrin + Lamictal
Abilify + Lamictal
lithium + Lamictal
nortriptyline + LamictalIt might be interesting to combine Wellbutrin, Lamictal, and Abilify.
> I can absolutely not take weight gain sides for medical reasons. Most likely candidiasis.
I understand.
What is it about weight-gain that acts to exacerbate candidiasis?
Some people gain weight from lithium alone, but I don't know how it affects blood lipids or blood glucose.
The antipsychotic, Latuda (lurasidone) is being studied for depression with good results. Like its chemical cousin, Geodon, it is supposed to be weight-neutral. Unlike Geodon, it is not an SNRI and should not produce serotonin syndrome. I have tried Latuda. I believe I was taking Parnate at the time. I don't recall it helping. Everyone is different, though.
Just to throw the idea out there, minocycline is an antibiotic with additional properties which are unrelated to infections. Among these unrelated properties are anti-glutamatergic and anti-inflammatory effects. These are thought to produce benefits in treating depression. I have reason to believe that minocycline may be particularly useful for people who have responded to Wellbutrin, Lamictal, or Abilify.
- Scott
Posted by antidote9 on December 20, 2012, at 16:40:51
In reply to Re: Anyone ever tried an Abilify + Amisulpride combo??, posted by SLS on December 20, 2012, at 6:10:59
thank you scott for warning me,
i will keep check of these side effects.
not sure of the dosage yet, i find out today.
i take 5-htp for insomnia. it is a supplement you can buy without a script and a precursor to serotonin which lets you sleep.
i find it helpful.
the Solgar brand has Valerian added.hope this helps.
Posted by antidote9 on December 21, 2012, at 3:03:57
In reply to Re: Anyone ever tried an Abilify + Amisulpride combo??, posted by SLS on December 20, 2012, at 6:10:59
just an update, my pdoc suggested using saphris 5mg x 2 a day instead to deal with the hyperprolactinemia, but after reading all the negative reviews later i am going to try on Solian instead. hoping it works.
Posted by SLS on December 21, 2012, at 6:44:14
In reply to Re: Anyone ever tried an Abilify + Amisulpride combo??, posted by antidote9 on December 21, 2012, at 3:03:57
> just an update, my pdoc suggested using saphris 5mg x 2 a day instead to deal with the hyperprolactinemia, but after reading all the negative reviews later i am going to try on Solian instead. hoping it works.
A friend of mine just started taking Saphris. She feels great. She suffers from schizoaffective bipolar-type. She has much more energy, motivation, and focus. Her delusions are gone. She also takes Seroquel 400 mg/day.
Can you tell me where I can find information about Saphris and hyperprolactinemia?
Thanks.
Good luck.
- Scott
Posted by antidote9 on December 21, 2012, at 15:21:04
In reply to Re: Anyone ever tried an Abilify + Amisulpride combo?? » antidote9, posted by SLS on December 21, 2012, at 6:44:14
> > just an update, my pdoc suggested using saphris 5mg x 2 a day instead to deal with the hyperprolactinemia, but after reading all the negative reviews later i am going to try on Solian instead. hoping it works.
>
> A friend of mine just started taking Saphris. She feels great. She suffers from schizoaffective bipolar-type. She has much more energy, motivation, and focus. Her delusions are gone. She also takes Seroquel 400 mg/day.
>
> Can you tell me where I can find information about Saphris and hyperprolactinemia?
>
> Thanks.
>
> Good luck.
>
>
> - Scottbecause Saphris is a relatively new drug (2007) there is not much literature on it on the web about this subject. however my pdoc says it does not raise prolactin level as the other ones do. in their leaflet inside the packet (and on the web when you google "saphris") it says it can raise prolactin levels like other D2 antagonists.
i am glad to hear your friend is doing so well on it , but for me it is a last resort after reading over 100 reviews most of which were negative.
thanks scott.
all the best with it and merry xmas.
Posted by antidote9 on December 21, 2012, at 17:27:36
In reply to Re: Anyone ever tried an Abilify + Amisulpride combo?? » antidote9, posted by SLS on December 21, 2012, at 6:44:14
this is info from the Saphris site...maybe you eill find it useful.
Laboratory test abnormalities: Prolactin
In short-term bipolar mania and schizophrenia trials, SAPHRIS caused no clinically significant changes in mean prolactin levels from baseline
The incidence of adverse reactions related to abnormal prolactin levels was 0.4% for SAPHRIS vs 0% for placebo
In a 52-week trial of patients with schizophrenia and schizoaffective disorder, the mean change from baseline for prolactin was a decrease of 26.9 ng/mL
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