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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 10 of 10. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by amigan on October 12, 2007, at 9:24:06
Hi.
I was wondering... L-dopa is converted into dopamine inside the brain, so why this drug doesn't cause any mild stimulation or euphoria?I took half pill of Madopar (l-dopa 200mg + benseraside 50mg per pill) and didn't feel anything.
With 1 pill i become nauseous and with 1 and a half i vomit.. I didn't notice any psychotropic effect. Why?
Posted by Netch on October 12, 2007, at 12:26:46
In reply to Why l-dopa doesn't cause..., posted by amigan on October 12, 2007, at 9:24:06
> Hi.
> I was wondering... L-dopa is converted into dopamine inside the brain, so why this drug doesn't cause any mild stimulation or euphoria?
>
> I took half pill of Madopar (l-dopa 200mg + benseraside 50mg per pill) and didn't feel anything.
> With 1 pill i become nauseous and with 1 and a half i vomit.. I didn't notice any psychotropic effect. Why?
>Consider yourself lucky since l-dopa can be addictive. Nausea is a known side effect from l-dopa. Statistically there's a certain percentage that will experience nausea and you seem to have fallen into this category... many side effects are transient though.
/Netch
Posted by amigan on October 12, 2007, at 12:46:09
In reply to Re: Why l-dopa doesn't cause... » amigan, posted by Netch on October 12, 2007, at 12:26:46
> > Hi.
> > I was wondering... L-dopa is converted into dopamine inside the brain, so why this drug doesn't cause any mild stimulation or euphoria?
> >
> > I took half pill of Madopar (l-dopa 200mg + benseraside 50mg per pill) and didn't feel anything.
> > With 1 pill i become nauseous and with 1 and a half i vomit.. I didn't notice any psychotropic effect. Why?
> >
>
> Consider yourself lucky since l-dopa can be addictive. Nausea is a known side effect from l-dopa. Statistically there's a certain percentage that will experience nausea and you seem to have fallen into this category... many side effects are transient though.That's the first time i hear that l-dopa can be addictive. Are you sure that you didn't mix addiction with tolarance?
Anyhow, i can't see how a substance with no (pleasant) psychotropic action can be addictive. :-)
And that's what what i'm asking, essentially. Why i didn't experience anything from this direction. I do know that nausea is a common side-effect.
Posted by Netch on October 12, 2007, at 13:00:40
In reply to Re: Why l-dopa doesn't cause..., posted by amigan on October 12, 2007, at 12:46:09
"Levodopa (L-dopa), the mainstay of treatment for idiopathic Parkinson’s disease (IPD), has a mild stimulant effect and may cause agitation, restlessness, and euphoria even in normal subjects. It is associated with a well documented withdrawal syndrome consisting of confusion, muscular pain, and rigidity. This can progress to involve symptoms comparable with neuroleptic malignant syndrome, including pyrexia and increased creatine kinase.1 There is now good evidence that L-dopa is addictive, and there are many case reports of patients with IPD who seek to increase their L-dopa dose to high levels because of psychological dependence rather than therapeutic benefit.2 The largest series of such patients3 suggested that L-dopa dependence results in paranoia, hypomania, hypersexuality, and euphoria associated with weight loss and severe dyskinesias. Many of the behavioural changes are similar to those seen in amphetamine or cocaine abusers and have been termed "hedonistic homeostatic dysregulation". "
Posted by Sigismund on October 12, 2007, at 14:55:24
In reply to Why l-dopa doesn't cause..., posted by amigan on October 12, 2007, at 9:24:06
That's interesting that you didn't feel 200mg L-dopa with whatever that other thing in there is.
Sometimes, hardly ever, I take mucana, and one cap of that contains 130mg L-dopa and none of the other stuff that should make it happen in your brain rather than your body, and I notice that (classic dopamine feel from it, sex, a cool pool on a hot day, lying in the sun, that sort of thing).Interesting.
Posted by linkadge on October 13, 2007, at 14:06:26
In reply to Re: Why l-dopa doesn't cause... » amigan, posted by Sigismund on October 12, 2007, at 14:55:24
I could also depend on individual variences in dopamine release. Increased dopamine precursor doesn't necessarily translate to immediate increases in dopamine release.
Linkadge
Posted by cactus on October 13, 2007, at 19:49:12
In reply to Re: Why l-dopa doesn't cause..., posted by amigan on October 12, 2007, at 12:46:09
Ropinirole made me vomit a few times when I increased my dose. It has to be done slowly
Posted by amigan on October 13, 2007, at 21:47:13
In reply to Re: Why l-dopa doesn't cause... » amigan, posted by Sigismund on October 12, 2007, at 14:55:24
> That's interesting that you didn't feel 200mg L-dopa with whatever that other thing in there is.
> Sometimes, hardly ever, I take mucana, and one cap of that contains 130mg L-dopa and none of the other stuff that should make it happen in your brain rather than your body, and I notice that (classic dopamine feel from it, sex, a cool pool on a hot day, lying in the sun, that sort of thing).
>
> Interesting.I don't know... 130mg are enough to produce a psychoactive effect for you, while i didn't feel anything at 300mg except of nausea and vomiting. I can only assume that:
1. This mucana extract has either other psychoactive substances or substances that potentiate l-dopa greatly.
2. I drink fairly large amount of coffee and i read that caffeine promotes the release of dopamine.
Could this masks the effects of l-dopa, assuming that the level of dopamine inside the brain was already high due to the action of caffeine?3. I have some kind of "CNS dopamine insensitivity" if such thing exists.. and thus, i only manifest peripheral symptoms like vomiting (although nausea is not peripheral, if i'm not mistaken)
Does anyone know if there is such case??
Perhaps i should try to take a dopamine agonist like bromocriptine and see if this is the case.
Posted by Darwin on October 14, 2007, at 13:41:48
In reply to Why l-dopa doesn't cause..., posted by amigan on October 12, 2007, at 9:24:06
I tried L-Dopa once and it made me depressed. Dopamine is often associated with euphoria but I think it also can cause dysphoric feelings depending on what part of the brain it is active.
I also tried the antidepressant Bupropion which is a dopamine uptake inhibitor and experienced no feelings of euphoria. Surprisingly, when I quit Bupropion I did experience a couple of days of mild euphoria as a withdrawal effect.
My point is, pro-dopamine drugs are not necessarily euphoric or stimulating.
Posted by amigan on October 16, 2007, at 18:25:58
In reply to Re: Why l-dopa doesn't cause..., posted by amigan on October 13, 2007, at 21:47:13
> > That's interesting that you didn't feel 200mg L-dopa with whatever that other thing in there is.
> > Sometimes, hardly ever, I take mucana, and one cap of that contains 130mg L-dopa and none of the other stuff that should make it happen in your brain rather than your body, and I notice that (classic dopamine feel from it, sex, a cool pool on a hot day, lying in the sun, that sort of thing).
> >
> > Interesting.
>
> I don't know... 130mg are enough to produce a psychoactive effect for you, while i didn't feel anything at 300mg except of nausea and vomiting. I can only assume that:
>
> 1. This mucana extract has either other psychoactive substances or substances that potentiate l-dopa greatly.
>
> 2. I drink fairly large amount of coffee and i read that caffeine promotes the release of dopamine.
> Could this masks the effects of l-dopa, assuming that the level of dopamine inside the brain was already high due to the action of caffeine?
>
> 3. I have some kind of "CNS dopamine insensitivity" if such thing exists.. and thus, i only manifest peripheral symptoms like vomiting (although nausea is not peripheral, if i'm not mistaken)
> Does anyone know if there is such case??
> Perhaps i should try to take a dopamine agonist like bromocriptine and see if this is the case.Ok. I got 5mg of bromocriptine today. It's the first time that i'm trying a dopamine agonist. The only thing i perceived was a mild sensation of fatigue which is included on the adverse effects list.
No libido or mood enhancement were observed, (In fact, it makes me feel rather dysthymic!) no augmentation of caffeine like this link suggest:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=10996051&dopt=Abstract
no nothing.
This is the end of the thread.
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