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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 10 of 10. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Ian on September 15, 1999, at 6:53:27
Thanks jamie and dj for your comments. Being sceptical of a lot of psychopharm I felt I'd probably outstay my welcome here but I couldn't 'leave' as there's much more to this board than views on medication. Its a brilliant thing this board, there's a real sense of comunity and that in itself is therapeutic. Its good to have a place where you can talk about depression and not risk losing friends by boring them to death by it.
As far a hippocampi go I don't know any more than my second year neuroanatomy which is that it is basically a coiled up extension of the cortex very involved with memory and closely associated with the limbic system ande thereby emotion which makes sense as anything emotionally significant is easily remembered normally.As for having a clear mind I'm not so sure, being a doc everyone presumes that. I've had two things happen to me which have seemed to change my subjective reality. The first I previuosly mentioned which was being coerced into taking dothiepin at age 13 for school time misery. Its a drug used in the UK and I have'nt seen any references to it on this site, I think it has been introduced in the states as dosulepin. After that time emotionaly I felt stifled and slightly blunted. Didn't stop me though. Second thing was halfway through med school trip to Amsterdam with girlfriend it was rather emotionally charged and I had a panic stricken spacecake experience that I feel I've been compensating for ever since. My fairly sharp visual/conceptual mind deserted me rather and things I could grasp easily before became out of my reach. In order to remember things I've compensated by becoming a very serial type person linking a to b, b to c, c to d. abcd don't stick out clearly in the front of my mind,paper has become my brain for the sake of prioritising things. I managed to qualify and I guess most people look at that and think "well ther can't be too much wrong with him if he can do that" but as I'm sure Bob can verify a junior docs brain is often a long list of paper with things to do on it.
So these to things happen and I feel they must be some how related in Amsterdam one of the first things I wanted to do was cry and I couldn't then came the frightening thought roller coaster ride. I feel emotional catharsis protects the intricate working of cognition and when its all to much then the floodgates open either as rage or misery. This is all unscientific conjecture but its the only explanation that makes any sense to my self other than the fact I may be deluded. I'd appreciate top tips on amelorating cognitive hazes. I know the sensible things to do exercise, medication, no alcohol although I feel I'm turning into a drone regimenting my life for a 20% improvement. I'd be realy interested to here whether there is anyone else out there who feels a tricyclic AD has had a permanent effect on the way they feel, I have second hand information that I'm not the only person to experience this.
Right off for that run then...
Posted by Ian on September 15, 1999, at 8:02:53
In reply to Hippocampi (cont from previous session), posted by Ian on September 15, 1999, at 6:53:27
Replying to my own thread, you see your not the only one Barb. Just incase I gave the impression I'd had sudden psychopharm conversion I actually meant to say meditation instead of medication. Funny how you notice all the grammatical errors just after you submit something. Went for the run and have been coughing my guts up for the last ten minutes-not realy a very good advert for exercise.
Posted by Bob on September 15, 1999, at 11:55:55
In reply to Hippocampi (cont from previous session), posted by Ian on September 15, 1999, at 6:53:27
Was that TCA you referred to doxepin (from www.mentalhealth.com, it's the one closest in spelling ... then again, spelling hardly seems to mean anything in naming psychofarm products).
I don't know about anything permanent, but since I've been taking nortriptyline I've noticed a number of cognitive improvements, particularly for affective/cognitive tasks like goal setting and causal attribution. Some problems in STM, but most for stuff as you described -- lists of tasks, things to do, etc.
Cheers,
Bobbtw ... if folks want to do a little art therapy and learn some neuroanatomy at the same time, there are some realling good brain anatomy coloring books on the market. Get out yer crayons and color your seahorses any shade you want!
Posted by dj on September 15, 1999, at 11:56:35
In reply to Hippocampi (cont from previous session), posted by Ian on September 15, 1999, at 6:53:27
Ian,
I'm curious how useful you find the meditation for amelioriating brain fuzz & the running. How much of both do you do & what type of meditation?
For some interesting thoughts on the links between dis-ease and mental & physical tension check out my posting in shiatzu above where I exerpt part of an article by Jock McKeen & Ben Wong who were both doctors (the former with training in acupuncture from Oxford the latter a psychiatrist) before turning their attention to other approachs to wellness which you can find out more about at their site:
http://www.island.net/~jockben/They have some interesting theories developed over the past 20 or so years from observing themselves and others.
I too would appreciate all practical hints on "amelorating cognitive haze"...
> > I feel emotional catharsis protects the intricate working of cognition and when its all to much then the floodgates open either as rage or misery. ... its the only explanation that makes any sense to my self other than the fact I may be deluded. I'd appreciate top tips on amelorating cognitive hazes. I know the sensible things to do exercise, medication, no alcohol although I feel I'm turning into a drone regimenting my life for a 20% improvement. I'd be realy interested to here whether there is anyone else out there who feels a tricyclic AD has had a permanent effect on the way they feel, I have second hand information that I'm not the only person to experience this.
> Right off for that run then...
Posted by dj on September 15, 1999, at 12:58:36
In reply to Re: Hippocampi (cont from previous session), posted by Bob on September 15, 1999, at 11:55:55
> Some problems in STM, but most for stuff as you described -- lists of tasks, things to do, etc.
Awrighttttt, MBA (Mr. bob acronymn-ity) -- STM?? -- PT (puhleezeee tranlate...) -- sensory transcedental masturbation, senile trajectile maelstorms, simply too much, seemingly moderated tones, sasamat trained monkeys....???
Posted by RAB on September 15, 1999, at 14:55:32
In reply to Re:STM???, posted by dj on September 15, 1999, at 12:58:36
But if I can't speak in TLAs, I'll wind up looking more Y2K than 2K1!!
Short Term Memory.
Hope that makes everything AOK.
CYA
Bob
Posted by Ian on September 16, 1999, at 16:06:00
In reply to Re: Hippocampi (cont from previous session), posted by dj on September 15, 1999, at 11:56:35
In fairness I haven't realy given meditation a proper go on a long term basis. I propose systems for myself to live by like New Year's resolutions gone crazy.
When I have done meditation its been a couple of times a week. There's an authentic Thai buddist temple in the green surburbs of Wimbledon would you believe. I don't know the Thai names for the techniques they taught but
I generally just start counting breaths one to ten , then I transfer to labelling everything that I become aware of whether its a noise, a feeling or a thought. I feel tensions in my head sometimes and they tend to stick there, there's no great emotional release but they do tend to subside after a while. I become very aware of the sheer volume of silly thoughts in my head and gradually the number of thoughts decreases. Afterwards I do feel a bit more in touch with reality and less like I'm looking at the world through a pain of glass.
Cognitively stress doesn't help and in that way the meditation helps but I still feel that I can only see a smaller piece of the jigsaw than before my trip to Holland.
Exercise is a great anxiolytic and will raise my baseline mood it also helps my chest which I gave a real B&H bashing after Amsterdam-not clever for an asthmatic but I wasn't planning on sticking around at the time.
Why I don't regiment myself more to do what I know is good for me I don't know. I'm always looking for ifs and buts, I've got a scepticism and idealism that defeats practicality, if that makes any sense. My job tends to disrupt my exercise as I am literally resident one week then off the next, but I should be able to work around that one. I've just got to frame all this positively, I don't have failures just learning experiences ( why am I grinning as I type this ).
Anyhow thanks for the web site address I'll check it out. Its 22:00 here in the U.K. so night,night
regards
Ian
Posted by dj on September 16, 1999, at 19:48:18
In reply to reply to dj, posted by Ian on September 16, 1999, at 16:06:00
anxiolytic? B&H bashing?
Ian,
Got me with that word and expression. Perhaps Bob may have a solution to the acronymn...& the dictionary the word...
Sounds like you were on a self-destructve bender however you spell it... Your skepticism and idealism sounds like perfectionism which I relate to and which has huge links with depression...
5.50 p.m. here and the sun is finally peeking out from the grey skies...
Sante!
dj
Posted by Ian on September 17, 1999, at 8:48:53
In reply to Re: reply to dj, posted by dj on September 16, 1999, at 19:48:18
B&H-Benson and Hedges-reasonably strong cigarettes in the UK
Anxiolytic- sorry lapsing into medical lingo, lysis is to do with disolving and in this case I meant anxieties and tensions. One thing I am realising with myself is that I never realy appreciate my general level of stress until it has gone away, typically this has been after exams in the past although I was surprised how much more relaxed I felt the other day after I voiced my frustrations about something.
I was thinking that AA would be much more fitting if it stood for acronyms anonymous,
Ian
Posted by dj on September 22, 1999, at 8:15:13
In reply to Re:Re: reply to dj, posted by Ian on September 17, 1999, at 8:48:53
So Ian if you learned to be aware of and monitor your stress level and discuss frustrations regularly would that not have an anxiolytic effect? I have noticed relief on occasion when I have voiced my concerns and been heard. Others on their experience of this?
> Anxiolytic- sorry lapsing into medical lingo, lysis is to do with disolving and in this case I meant anxieties and tensions. One thing I am realising with myself is that I never realy appreciate my general level of stress until it has gone away, ... I was surprised how much more relaxed I felt the other day after I voiced my frustrations about something.
>
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