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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by farshad on March 19, 2018, at 14:35:21
In reply to Re: How can I block Cortisol? » farshad, posted by farshad on March 19, 2018, at 14:29:45
> > > > has anyone seen this study ? its from 1998 . I think they are suggesting there could be CRF1 mutations but unrelated to cushings disease>
> > > >
> > > > I quote from the study ...No mutations affecting the CRF1-R protein have been found in all tumors analyzed. However, we found a significant overexpression of the CRF1-R messenger RNA in ACTH-secreting pituitary adenomas vs. inactive adenomas and normal pituitaries. We conclude that mutations of the CRF1-R are unlikely to be involved in Cushing's disease. We suggest that the overexpression of the CRF1-R messenger RNA may be related to a disturbed receptor regulation in ACTH-secreting pituitary adenomas...
> > > >
> > > > https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9745449
> > > >
> > > > English is my 3rd language so maybe someone can explain this that understands it better_
> > >
> > > I found 2 possible mutations that I have related to ACTH>
> > >
> > > PDE8B https://www.selfdecode.com/gene/pde8b/#advanced-summary
> > >
> > > ACE (Angiotensin I converting enzyme) https://www.selfdecode.com/gene/ace/
> >
> > --------------
> > One mutation in human PDE8B (His350Pro), from a patient with severe adrenal hyperplasia, impaired PDE8B catalytic activity, and its expression in Hela cells resulted in increased cAMP-signaling, suggesting a role for cAMP in development of adrenal hyprerplasia. Such PDE8B mutations may not directly cause adrenal hyperplasia, however, since PDE8B KO mice do not develop adrenal tumors (Tsai and Beavo 2011). Inactivating PDE11A gene mutations are also associated with the development of adrenal hyperplasia and Cushing syndrome (Libe et al. 2008), and with Carney complex (CNC). CNC is caused by germline mutations in the alpha regulatory subunit of PKA (PRKARIA) and is associated with endocrine tumors, including nodular adrenal hyperplasia and adrenal and testicular tumors (Levy et al. 2011;Libe et al. 2011). PDE11A mutations may also play a role in susceptibility to prostate cancer (Faucz et al. 2011) and testicular germ cell tumors (TGCT) (Horvath et al. 2009).
> > ------------
> >
> > https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4275405/
> >
> >
> > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Congenital_adrenal_hyperplasia
> >
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Angiotensin (Angiotensin I converting enzyme)
I dont know what to think this is all so confusing. So I have mutations in my CRF1 gene specifically with the PDE8B causing excessive cortisol and the Secretion of CRH, ACTH, and cortisol is increased by stimulation of angiotensin AT(1) receptors.So it all goes in a loop and just further pushes each other to the max?
Posted by farshad on March 19, 2018, at 14:40:31
In reply to Re: How can I block Cortisol?, posted by farshad on March 19, 2018, at 14:35:21
> > > > > has anyone seen this study ? its from 1998 . I think they are suggesting there could be CRF1 mutations but unrelated to cushings disease>
> > > > >
> > > > > I quote from the study ...No mutations affecting the CRF1-R protein have been found in all tumors analyzed. However, we found a significant overexpression of the CRF1-R messenger RNA in ACTH-secreting pituitary adenomas vs. inactive adenomas and normal pituitaries. We conclude that mutations of the CRF1-R are unlikely to be involved in Cushing's disease. We suggest that the overexpression of the CRF1-R messenger RNA may be related to a disturbed receptor regulation in ACTH-secreting pituitary adenomas...
> > > > >
> > > > > https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9745449
> > > > >
> > > > > English is my 3rd language so maybe someone can explain this that understands it better_
> > > >
> > > > I found 2 possible mutations that I have related to ACTH>
> > > >
> > > > PDE8B https://www.selfdecode.com/gene/pde8b/#advanced-summary
> > > >
> > > > ACE (Angiotensin I converting enzyme) https://www.selfdecode.com/gene/ace/
> > >
> > > --------------
> > > One mutation in human PDE8B (His350Pro), from a patient with severe adrenal hyperplasia, impaired PDE8B catalytic activity, and its expression in Hela cells resulted in increased cAMP-signaling, suggesting a role for cAMP in development of adrenal hyprerplasia. Such PDE8B mutations may not directly cause adrenal hyperplasia, however, since PDE8B KO mice do not develop adrenal tumors (Tsai and Beavo 2011). Inactivating PDE11A gene mutations are also associated with the development of adrenal hyperplasia and Cushing syndrome (Libe et al. 2008), and with Carney complex (CNC). CNC is caused by germline mutations in the alpha regulatory subunit of PKA (PRKARIA) and is associated with endocrine tumors, including nodular adrenal hyperplasia and adrenal and testicular tumors (Levy et al. 2011;Libe et al. 2011). PDE11A mutations may also play a role in susceptibility to prostate cancer (Faucz et al. 2011) and testicular germ cell tumors (TGCT) (Horvath et al. 2009).
> > > ------------
> > >
> > > https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4275405/
> > >
> > >
> > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Congenital_adrenal_hyperplasia
> > >
> >
> > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Angiotensin (Angiotensin I converting enzyme)
>
>
> I dont know what to think this is all so confusing. So I have mutations in my CRF1 gene specifically with the PDE8B causing excessive cortisol and the Secretion of CRH, ACTH, and cortisol is increased by stimulation of angiotensin AT(1) receptors.
>
> So it all goes in a loop and just further pushes each other to the max?
>
here are the 2 CRF1 mutations btw
https://www.selfdecode.com/gene/crhr1-it1/
https://www.selfdecode.com/gene/mgc57346-crhr1/
Posted by farshad on March 19, 2018, at 15:16:20
In reply to Re: How can I block Cortisol?, posted by farshad on March 19, 2018, at 14:40:31
> > > > > > has anyone seen this study ? its from 1998 . I think they are suggesting there could be CRF1 mutations but unrelated to cushings disease>
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I quote from the study ...No mutations affecting the CRF1-R protein have been found in all tumors analyzed. However, we found a significant overexpression of the CRF1-R messenger RNA in ACTH-secreting pituitary adenomas vs. inactive adenomas and normal pituitaries. We conclude that mutations of the CRF1-R are unlikely to be involved in Cushing's disease. We suggest that the overexpression of the CRF1-R messenger RNA may be related to a disturbed receptor regulation in ACTH-secreting pituitary adenomas...
> > > > > >
> > > > > > https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9745449
> > > > > >
> > > > > > English is my 3rd language so maybe someone can explain this that understands it better_
> > > > >
> > > > > I found 2 possible mutations that I have related to ACTH>
> > > > >
> > > > > PDE8B https://www.selfdecode.com/gene/pde8b/#advanced-summary
> > > > >
> > > > > ACE (Angiotensin I converting enzyme) https://www.selfdecode.com/gene/ace/
> > > >
> > > > --------------
> > > > One mutation in human PDE8B (His350Pro), from a patient with severe adrenal hyperplasia, impaired PDE8B catalytic activity, and its expression in Hela cells resulted in increased cAMP-signaling, suggesting a role for cAMP in development of adrenal hyprerplasia. Such PDE8B mutations may not directly cause adrenal hyperplasia, however, since PDE8B KO mice do not develop adrenal tumors (Tsai and Beavo 2011). Inactivating PDE11A gene mutations are also associated with the development of adrenal hyperplasia and Cushing syndrome (Libe et al. 2008), and with Carney complex (CNC). CNC is caused by germline mutations in the alpha regulatory subunit of PKA (PRKARIA) and is associated with endocrine tumors, including nodular adrenal hyperplasia and adrenal and testicular tumors (Levy et al. 2011;Libe et al. 2011). PDE11A mutations may also play a role in susceptibility to prostate cancer (Faucz et al. 2011) and testicular germ cell tumors (TGCT) (Horvath et al. 2009).
> > > > ------------
> > > >
> > > > https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4275405/
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Congenital_adrenal_hyperplasia
> > > >
> > >
> > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Angiotensin (Angiotensin I converting enzyme)
> >
> >
> > I dont know what to think this is all so confusing. So I have mutations in my CRF1 gene specifically with the PDE8B causing excessive cortisol and the Secretion of CRH, ACTH, and cortisol is increased by stimulation of angiotensin AT(1) receptors.
> >
> > So it all goes in a loop and just further pushes each other to the max?
> >
> here are the 2 CRF1 mutations btw
> https://www.selfdecode.com/gene/crhr1-it1/
> https://www.selfdecode.com/gene/mgc57346-crhr1/
>
So its obvious that there is something wrong with my genetics specificaly the cortisol/fight or flight stress related ones, which is why I think I have such bad anxiety . Can anyone help me out so I can understand this simple?
Here are some other cortisol genes I found I have problems with(does this make sense to anyone?):
https://www.selfdecode.com/gene/gnas/#advanced-summary - Constitutive activation of the adenylate cyclase enzyme leads to over-production of several hormones IE cortisol?
https://www.selfdecode.com/gene/nr3c2/#advanced-summary - Mutations in the NR3C2 gene lead to a nonfunctional or abnormally functioning mineralocorticoid receptor protein that cannot properly regulate the specialized proteins that transport sodium and potassium
2 others
https://www.selfdecode.com/gene/h6pd/#advanced-summary%C2%A0%C2%A0
Posted by farshad on March 19, 2018, at 15:30:37
In reply to Re: How can I block Cortisol?, posted by farshad on March 19, 2018, at 15:16:20
> > > > > > > has anyone seen this study ? its from 1998 . I think they are suggesting there could be CRF1 mutations but unrelated to cushings disease>
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > I quote from the study ...No mutations affecting the CRF1-R protein have been found in all tumors analyzed. However, we found a significant overexpression of the CRF1-R messenger RNA in ACTH-secreting pituitary adenomas vs. inactive adenomas and normal pituitaries. We conclude that mutations of the CRF1-R are unlikely to be involved in Cushing's disease. We suggest that the overexpression of the CRF1-R messenger RNA may be related to a disturbed receptor regulation in ACTH-secreting pituitary adenomas...
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9745449
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > English is my 3rd language so maybe someone can explain this that understands it better_
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I found 2 possible mutations that I have related to ACTH>
> > > > > >
> > > > > > PDE8B https://www.selfdecode.com/gene/pde8b/#advanced-summary
> > > > > >
> > > > > > ACE (Angiotensin I converting enzyme) https://www.selfdecode.com/gene/ace/
> > > > >
> > > > > --------------
> > > > > One mutation in human PDE8B (His350Pro), from a patient with severe adrenal hyperplasia, impaired PDE8B catalytic activity, and its expression in Hela cells resulted in increased cAMP-signaling, suggesting a role for cAMP in development of adrenal hyprerplasia. Such PDE8B mutations may not directly cause adrenal hyperplasia, however, since PDE8B KO mice do not develop adrenal tumors (Tsai and Beavo 2011). Inactivating PDE11A gene mutations are also associated with the development of adrenal hyperplasia and Cushing syndrome (Libe et al. 2008), and with Carney complex (CNC). CNC is caused by germline mutations in the alpha regulatory subunit of PKA (PRKARIA) and is associated with endocrine tumors, including nodular adrenal hyperplasia and adrenal and testicular tumors (Levy et al. 2011;Libe et al. 2011). PDE11A mutations may also play a role in susceptibility to prostate cancer (Faucz et al. 2011) and testicular germ cell tumors (TGCT) (Horvath et al. 2009).
> > > > > ------------
> > > > >
> > > > > https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4275405/
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Congenital_adrenal_hyperplasia
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Angiotensin (Angiotensin I converting enzyme)
> > >
> > >
> > > I dont know what to think this is all so confusing. So I have mutations in my CRF1 gene specifically with the PDE8B causing excessive cortisol and the Secretion of CRH, ACTH, and cortisol is increased by stimulation of angiotensin AT(1) receptors.
> > >
> > > So it all goes in a loop and just further pushes each other to the max?
> > >
> > here are the 2 CRF1 mutations btw
> > https://www.selfdecode.com/gene/crhr1-it1/
> > https://www.selfdecode.com/gene/mgc57346-crhr1/
> >
>
>
> So its obvious that there is something wrong with my genetics specificaly the cortisol/fight or flight stress related ones, which is why I think I have such bad anxiety . Can anyone help me out so I can understand this simple?
>
> Here are some other cortisol genes I found I have problems with(does this make sense to anyone?):
>
>
>
> https://www.selfdecode.com/gene/gnas/#advanced-summary - Constitutive activation of the adenylate cyclase enzyme leads to over-production of several hormones IE cortisol?
>
>
>
> https://www.selfdecode.com/gene/nr3c2/#advanced-summary - Mutations in the NR3C2 gene lead to a nonfunctional or abnormally functioning mineralocorticoid receptor protein that cannot properly regulate the specialized proteins that transport sodium and potassium
>
>
>
>
>
> 2 others
>
>
>
> https://www.selfdecode.com/gene/h6pd/#advanced-summary%C2%A0%C2%A0
>
>
>
> https://www.selfdecode.com/gene/serpina6/#advanced-summaryDo you guys think all of this can be fixed just by taking Metyrapone? Since it blocks cortisol.
Posted by farshad on March 19, 2018, at 16:30:38
In reply to Re: How can I block Cortisol?, posted by farshad on March 19, 2018, at 15:30:37
> > > > > > > > has anyone seen this study ? its from 1998 . I think they are suggesting there could be CRF1 mutations but unrelated to cushings disease>
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > I quote from the study ...No mutations affecting the CRF1-R protein have been found in all tumors analyzed. However, we found a significant overexpression of the CRF1-R messenger RNA in ACTH-secreting pituitary adenomas vs. inactive adenomas and normal pituitaries. We conclude that mutations of the CRF1-R are unlikely to be involved in Cushing's disease. We suggest that the overexpression of the CRF1-R messenger RNA may be related to a disturbed receptor regulation in ACTH-secreting pituitary adenomas...
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9745449
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > English is my 3rd language so maybe someone can explain this that understands it better_
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > I found 2 possible mutations that I have related to ACTH>
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > PDE8B https://www.selfdecode.com/gene/pde8b/#advanced-summary
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > ACE (Angiotensin I converting enzyme) https://www.selfdecode.com/gene/ace/
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --------------
> > > > > > One mutation in human PDE8B (His350Pro), from a patient with severe adrenal hyperplasia, impaired PDE8B catalytic activity, and its expression in Hela cells resulted in increased cAMP-signaling, suggesting a role for cAMP in development of adrenal hyprerplasia. Such PDE8B mutations may not directly cause adrenal hyperplasia, however, since PDE8B KO mice do not develop adrenal tumors (Tsai and Beavo 2011). Inactivating PDE11A gene mutations are also associated with the development of adrenal hyperplasia and Cushing syndrome (Libe et al. 2008), and with Carney complex (CNC). CNC is caused by germline mutations in the alpha regulatory subunit of PKA (PRKARIA) and is associated with endocrine tumors, including nodular adrenal hyperplasia and adrenal and testicular tumors (Levy et al. 2011;Libe et al. 2011). PDE11A mutations may also play a role in susceptibility to prostate cancer (Faucz et al. 2011) and testicular germ cell tumors (TGCT) (Horvath et al. 2009).
> > > > > > ------------
> > > > > >
> > > > > > https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4275405/
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Congenital_adrenal_hyperplasia
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Angiotensin (Angiotensin I converting enzyme)
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > I dont know what to think this is all so confusing. So I have mutations in my CRF1 gene specifically with the PDE8B causing excessive cortisol and the Secretion of CRH, ACTH, and cortisol is increased by stimulation of angiotensin AT(1) receptors.
> > > >
> > > > So it all goes in a loop and just further pushes each other to the max?
> > > >
> > > here are the 2 CRF1 mutations btw
> > > https://www.selfdecode.com/gene/crhr1-it1/
> > > https://www.selfdecode.com/gene/mgc57346-crhr1/
> > >
> >
> >
> > So its obvious that there is something wrong with my genetics specificaly the cortisol/fight or flight stress related ones, which is why I think I have such bad anxiety . Can anyone help me out so I can understand this simple?
> >
> > Here are some other cortisol genes I found I have problems with(does this make sense to anyone?):
> >
> >
> >
> > https://www.selfdecode.com/gene/gnas/#advanced-summary - Constitutive activation of the adenylate cyclase enzyme leads to over-production of several hormones IE cortisol?
> >
> >
> >
> > https://www.selfdecode.com/gene/nr3c2/#advanced-summary - Mutations in the NR3C2 gene lead to a nonfunctional or abnormally functioning mineralocorticoid receptor protein that cannot properly regulate the specialized proteins that transport sodium and potassium
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > 2 others
> >
> >
> >
> > https://www.selfdecode.com/gene/h6pd/#advanced-summary%C2%A0%C2%A0
> >
> >
> >
> > https://www.selfdecode.com/gene/serpina6/#advanced-summary
>
> Do you guys think all of this can be fixed just by taking Metyrapone? Since it blocks cortisol.
How am I supposed to decipher all this?..
https://www.selfdeco...m/gene/cyp17a1/ - this condition affects the function of certain hormone-producing glands
https://www.selfdeco.../gene/ppargc1b/ - Activates transcritional activity of estrogen receptor alpha, nuclear respiratory factor 1 (NRF1) and glucocorticoid receptor in the presence of glucocorticoids.
https://www.selfdeco...m/gene/txnrd2/
https://www.selfdeco...dvanced-summary - adrenocorticotropic
Posted by Phillipa on March 19, 2018, at 18:08:43
In reply to Re: How can I block Cortisol?, posted by farshad on March 19, 2018, at 16:30:38
Hi what languages do you speak? I am no med expert. I looked at you first post link and googled this. Don't know if will help or not Phillipa
https://rarediseases.info.nih.gov/diseases/12867/acth-secreting-pituitary-adenoma
Posted by Lamdage22 on March 20, 2018, at 12:36:33
In reply to Re: How can I block Cortisol? » farshad, posted by Phillipa on March 19, 2018, at 18:08:43
how is cortisol measured? I may do the same test
Posted by ed_uk2010 on March 20, 2018, at 18:42:57
In reply to Re: How can I block Cortisol?, posted by Lamdage22 on March 20, 2018, at 12:36:33
> how is cortisol measured? I may do the same test
Cortisol levels vary greatly throughout the day and according to circumstances. You can't just measure the level randomly and get a useful result.
If cortisol is markedly elevated for a prolonged period, there are usually physical/medical symptoms as well as psychiatric symptoms. It would not be usual for a medical cause of high cortisol to present with psychiatric symptoms in isolation.
You would need to perform at least two of the below tests to identify an issue with elevated cortisol:
1. A 24 hour urine collection and analysis for cortisol content (this test is often done twice),
2. A late night saliva test for cortisol concentration,
3. An overnight dexamethasone suppression test with morning analysis of blood cortisol level.
You cannot perform a dexamethasone suppression test (no. 3) alone to look for a primary issue with cortisol. The normal suppressor pattern is often disrupted in severe depression (with or with anxiety) and in psychotic depression, with pts becoming non suppressors.
Posted by farshad on March 22, 2018, at 11:28:39
In reply to Re: How can I block Cortisol? » farshad, posted by ed_uk2010 on March 16, 2018, at 17:54:35
>
> If tests demonstrated that you had an abnormally high level of cortisol, the first step would be to investigate the cause. Scans may be done to look for tumors on the adrenal glands (CT abdomen), or the pituitary (MRI head). Cortisol excess caused by tumors are sometimes treated with surgery. Medication is generally used when the condition is inoperable.
>
>
>if I operate and remove the tumour Wont it just grow back ?
Also what else do you think could be causing high cortisol/acth besides a tumour and regular mental problems?
Posted by farshad on March 22, 2018, at 11:30:54
In reply to Re: How can I block Cortisol?, posted by farshad on March 22, 2018, at 11:28:39
>
> >
> > If tests demonstrated that you had an abnormally high level of cortisol, the first step would be to investigate the cause. Scans may be done to look for tumors on the adrenal glands (CT abdomen), or the pituitary (MRI head). Cortisol excess caused by tumors are sometimes treated with surgery. Medication is generally used when the condition is inoperable.
>
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
> if I operate and remove the tumour Wont it just grow back ?also wouldnt i feel the tumour or how does that work? can you have a tumour anywhere? what causes tumours? what types of tumours are there or how many?
>
> Also what else do you think could be causing high cortisol/acth besides a tumour and regular mental problems?
Posted by farshad on March 22, 2018, at 11:31:17
In reply to Re: How can I block Cortisol?, posted by farshad on March 22, 2018, at 11:30:54
> >
> > >
> > > If tests demonstrated that you had an abnormally high level of cortisol, the first step would be to investigate the cause. Scans may be done to look for tumors on the adrenal glands (CT abdomen), or the pituitary (MRI head). Cortisol excess caused by tumors are sometimes treated with surgery. Medication is generally used when the condition is inoperable.
> >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > if I operate and remove the tumour Wont it just grow back ?also wouldnt i feel the tumour if I had 1 or how does that work? can you have a tumour anywhere? what causes tumours? what types of tumours are there or how many?
> >
> > Also what else do you think could be causing high cortisol/acth besides a tumour and regular mental problems?
>
>
Posted by ed_uk2010 on March 22, 2018, at 16:39:33
In reply to Re: How can I block Cortisol?, posted by farshad on March 22, 2018, at 11:28:39
I seriously doubt you have a tumour.
You're obviously concerned about cortisol though. You'd have to have the tests to put your mind at rest.
Posted by baseball55 on March 22, 2018, at 18:16:47
In reply to Re: How can I block Cortisol?, posted by ed_uk2010 on March 22, 2018, at 16:39:33
You know, you seem to believe that your anxiety is caused by high cortisol. But the reality is that anxiety itself CAUSES high cortisol. People with Cushing's do not feel anxiety due to the high cortisol. You should look up the symptoms for Cushing's before you conclude that you have a cortisol problem.
Posted by Phillipa on March 22, 2018, at 20:06:25
In reply to Re: How can I block Cortisol?, posted by baseball55 on March 22, 2018, at 18:16:47
Posted by farshad on March 23, 2018, at 7:35:23
In reply to Re: How can I block Cortisol?, posted by baseball55 on March 22, 2018, at 18:16:47
> You know, you seem to believe that your anxiety is caused by high cortisol. But the reality is that anxiety itself CAUSES high cortisol. People with Cushing's do not feel anxiety due to the high cortisol. You should look up the symptoms for Cushing's before you conclude that you have a cortisol problem.
What people with chusings do not feel anxiety? how do u know?
also I said I have mutations in my cortisol/acth genes causing this high cortisol if not the tumour. or some autoimmune disorder. so eventually my cortisol would get high becuase of the mutations no matter what becuase you cant avoid stress.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/20011602/https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3312460/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1884405/
Posted by farshad on March 23, 2018, at 23:16:39
In reply to Re: How can I block Cortisol? » ed_uk2010, posted by farshad on March 16, 2018, at 8:53:47
guys just 1/2 last questions.. Are the CRH (Corticotropin-releasing hormone) receptor 1 and 2 part of the Glucocorticoids? and Miconazole will block that?
Posted by ed_uk2010 on March 24, 2018, at 0:17:59
In reply to Re: How can I block Cortisol?, posted by farshad on March 23, 2018, at 23:16:39
>guys just 1/2 last questions.. Are the CRH (Corticotropin-releasing hormone) receptor 1 and 2 part of the Glucocorticoids? and Miconazole will block that?
Hi,
CRH receptors aren't glucocorticoids, no.
The natural glucocorticoid in the body is cortisol. Synthetic glucocorticoids used in medicine include prednisone, prednisolone and dexamethasone. Glucocorticoids act on glucocorticoid receptors and have numerous effects... for example, reduction of inflammation and elevation of blood glucose.
>Miconazole will block that?
Miconazole does not block CRH receptors.
The related drug ketoconazole is used to treat Cushing's syndrome because it reduces the synthesis of cortisol, and may (possibly) be an antagonist of the glucocorticoid receptors. Miconazole itself is generally only used as a cream to treat fungal infections.
Posted by farshad on March 24, 2018, at 11:22:14
In reply to Re: How can I block Cortisol?, posted by ed_uk2010 on March 24, 2018, at 0:17:59
> >guys just 1/2 last questions.. Are the CRH (Corticotropin-releasing hormone) receptor 1 and 2 part of the Glucocorticoids? and Miconazole will block that?
>
> Hi,
>
> CRH receptors aren't glucocorticoids, no.
>
> The natural glucocorticoid in the body is cortisol. Synthetic glucocorticoids used in medicine include prednisone, prednisolone and dexamethasone. Glucocorticoids act on glucocorticoid receptors and have numerous effects... for example, reduction of inflammation and elevation of blood glucose.
>
> >Miconazole will block that?
>
> Miconazole does not block CRH receptors.
>
> The related drug ketoconazole is used to treat Cushing's syndrome because it reduces the synthesis of cortisol, and may (possibly) be an antagonist of the glucocorticoid receptors. Miconazole itself is generally only used as a cream to treat fungal infections.but on wiki it says miconazole is an antagonist on Glucocorticoid receptor , wouldnt that affect the Cortisol releasing hormones also if u block that?
Posted by ed_uk2010 on March 24, 2018, at 13:59:35
In reply to Re: How can I block Cortisol?, posted by farshad on March 24, 2018, at 11:22:14
>on wiki it says miconazole is an antagonist on Glucocorticoid receptor , wouldnt that affect the Cortisol releasing hormones also if u block that?
Hi Farshad,
Well... the glucocorticoid receptors are a different type of receptor to CRH receptors. They have a different role.
As far as I know, ketoconazole does not usually alter CRH levels much (from what I read on Pubmed). It may increase ACTH, however.
Miconazole is a drug used in creams, so I wouldn't look at that drug specifically.
Have you been to your doctor to discuss tests yet?
Posted by farshad on March 24, 2018, at 14:09:38
In reply to Re: How can I block Cortisol? » farshad, posted by ed_uk2010 on March 24, 2018, at 13:59:35
> >on wiki it says miconazole is an antagonist on Glucocorticoid receptor , wouldnt that affect the Cortisol releasing hormones also if u block that?
>
> Hi Farshad,
>
> Well... the glucocorticoid receptors are a different type of receptor to CRH receptors. They have a different role.
>
> As far as I know, ketoconazole does not usually alter CRH levels much (from what I read on Pubmed). It may increase ACTH, however.
>
> Miconazole is a drug used in creams, so I wouldn't look at that drug specifically.
>
> Have you been to your doctor to discuss tests yet?
>
>
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>so it wouldnt work? what about Metyrapone? that inhibits 11b hydroxylase. wouldnt that lead to less CRH release? btw what happens if u have high 11-Deoxycortisol lvls? Since inhibiting 11b hydroxylase will increase 11-Deoxycortisol, im wondering what the conseuqneses of that is .. increased aldosterone??
no havent been to the doc yet. becus i dont know what to test for.
I asked you but you didnt answer. am I supposed to test for Cortisol and ACTH ? is it possible to test for CRF1?
Posted by ed_uk2010 on March 24, 2018, at 16:13:39
In reply to Re: How can I block Cortisol? » ed_uk2010, posted by farshad on March 24, 2018, at 14:09:38
Hi F,
>that inhibits 11b hydroxylase. wouldnt that lead to less CRH release?
Not as far as I know. It leads to lower cortisol and higher ACTH like other cortisol synthesis inhibitors.
>btw what happens if u have high 11-Deoxycortisol lvls? Since inhibiting 11b hydroxylase will increase 11-Deoxycortisol, im wondering what the conseuqneses of that is .. increased aldosterone??
Metyrapone does increase 11-deoxycortisol, yes. The effects of this during Cushing's treatment aren't entirely clear.
In terms of aldosterone, metyrapone itself reduces aldosterone synthesis.... but because it increases ACTH, it may lead to the body attempting to produce more aldosterone. The overall effect could be either more OR less aldosterone being produced. During treatment, doctors carefully monitor potassium levels to help keep track of this.
>no havent been to the doc yet. becus i dont know what to test for.
I asked you but you didnt answer. am I supposed to test for Cortisol and ACTH ?I did answer :) Testing ACTH is not usual when initially looking for the possibility of high cortisol, no.
Although it's up to your doctor, and depends on your local lab, common tests when looking at the possibility of high cortisol are the overnight dexamethasone suppression test, and the 24 hour urinary cortisol collection test.
>is it possible to test for CRF1?
No, it's not possible to test for the level of CRF-1 receptors.
Alcohol is a common substance believed to activate CRF-1. So if you don't already, you could try a period of no alcohol and see if it helps your mental health.
Posted by farshad on March 24, 2018, at 16:22:21
In reply to Re: How can I block Cortisol? » farshad, posted by ed_uk2010 on March 24, 2018, at 16:13:39
> Hi F,
>
> >that inhibits 11b hydroxylase. wouldnt that lead to less CRH release?
>
> Not as far as I know. It leads to lower cortisol and higher ACTH like other cortisol synthesis inhibitors.
>
> >btw what happens if u have high 11-Deoxycortisol lvls? Since inhibiting 11b hydroxylase will increase 11-Deoxycortisol, im wondering what the conseuqneses of that is .. increased aldosterone??
>
> Metyrapone does increase 11-deoxycortisol, yes. The effects of this during Cushing's treatment aren't entirely clear.
>
> In terms of aldosterone, metyrapone itself reduces aldosterone synthesis.... but because it increases ACTH, it may lead to the body attempting to produce more aldosterone. The overall effect could be either more OR less aldosterone being produced. During treatment, doctors carefully monitor potassium levels to help keep track of this.
>
> >no havent been to the doc yet. becus i dont know what to test for.
> I asked you but you didnt answer. am I supposed to test for Cortisol and ACTH ?
>
> I did answer :) Testing ACTH is not usual when initially looking for the possibility of high cortisol, no.
>
> Although it's up to your doctor, and depends on your local lab, common tests when looking at the possibility of high cortisol are the overnight dexamethasone suppression test, and the 24 hour urinary cortisol collection test.
>
> >is it possible to test for CRF1?
>
> No, it's not possible to test for the level of CRF-1 receptors.
>
> Alcohol is a common substance believed to activate CRF-1. So if you don't already, you could try a period of no alcohol and see if it helps your mental health.
>hm... might try Alcohol then to disrupt my natural CRF1 activation, becuase it even has an effect on the CRF1 it should help my anxiety somewhat since its changing its natural course. And no I dont drink Alcohol ...So the only thing that would work for me is an CRH/CRF1 antagonist ...... F#ck!.... IM DOOMED..... Doctors dont prescribe CRF1 antagonists! And you can hardly find these online!
Posted by ed_uk2010 on March 24, 2018, at 16:51:50
In reply to Re: How can I block Cortisol?, posted by farshad on March 24, 2018, at 16:22:21
>hm... might try Alcohol then to disrupt my natural CRF1 activation, becuase it even has an effect on the CRF1 it should help my anxiety somewhat since its changing its natural course.
No, alcohol stimulates CRF-1 more. Since you are concerned about CRF-1, it would make sense to keep avoiding it. Sure, it might help anxiety for a bit... but it can get worse when it wears off.
>the only thing that would work for me is an CRH/CRF1 antagonist ......
If you only learn one thing from this forum, it should be that you never really know what will work until you try it. I don't think you're doomed at all. If you want treatment suggestions, you will need to share a lot more about your actual symptoms and what you've tried before. Give us more about you. How old are you, when did symptoms start? How do you feel? You are getting into scientific theories which could be completely false.
Posted by farshad on March 24, 2018, at 17:07:16
In reply to Re: How can I block Cortisol? » farshad, posted by ed_uk2010 on March 24, 2018, at 16:51:50
> >hm... might try Alcohol then to disrupt my natural CRF1 activation, becuase it even has an effect on the CRF1 it should help my anxiety somewhat since its changing its natural course.
>
> No, alcohol stimulates CRF-1 more. Since you are concerned about CRF-1, it would make sense to keep avoiding it. Sure, it might help anxiety for a bit... but it can get worse when it wears off.
>
> >the only thing that would work for me is an CRH/CRF1 antagonist ......
>
> If you only learn one thing from this forum, it should be that you never really know what will work until you try it. I don't think you're doomed at all. If you want treatment suggestions, you will need to share a lot more about your actual symptoms and what you've tried before. Give us more about you. How old are you, when did symptoms start? How do you feel? You are getting into scientific theories which could be completely false.
>
>
well I told u everything to know. im stuck at this now. zyprexa is the only med that worked for me. I didnt know why until today. it inhibit stimulated CRH release from the hippocampus.
Posted by Phillipa on March 24, 2018, at 17:46:21
In reply to Re: How can I block Cortisol?, posted by farshad on March 24, 2018, at 17:07:16
Hi F, Ed is extremly knowledgeable. It would be very helpful to know your age. And especially a list of the meds you have tried. And if you have a doctor who prescribed them all? Also the country you are living it might help Ed as he knows what meds are available in different countires. So you have been on zyprexa. But it didn't help you? Do you have any sort of diagnosis? thanks Phillipa
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