Posted by toojane on January 20, 2007, at 9:43:57
In reply to Re: Suffering » toojane, posted by Tamar on January 19, 2007, at 19:00:02
Hi Tamar, thank you for your very thoughful reply.
> Having said that, I'm not sure I agree with the idea that developing an aversion to suffering is a bad thing.
I think the idea is that there is suffering in life because it is a part of life and if someone exerts a great deal of effort trying to avoid suffering or to deny it, making choices in the hope of not encountering it or to flee from it, ultimately their efforts are futile.
>I also don't agree that suffering has meaning or that it purifies us.Have you read Man's Search for Meaning by Viktor Frankl or anything on existential psychotherapy? Frankl survived his stay in a concentration camp because he was able to find meaning in his suffering.
Nietzsche said "He who has a why to live for can bear with almost any how."
>I think at times it's possible for suffering to purify us, but to me it often looks as if suffering scalds us and damages us and makes us less than the people we could be.Hmmm. I think suffering can be transformative and at times can make a person more, not less.
>I strongly resist the idea that anyone deserves to suffer, or that suffering is a helpful way to encounter God.I absolutely agree that no one deserves to suffer. Have you heard that saying pain is inevitable but suffering is optional? It seems terribly glib and trite to me. As if suffering itself is a choice. And I don't believe suffering is a 'helpful' way to encounter God but I do believe that people who have suffered greatly are sometimes closer to God or more enlightened (or whatever terms are used in a particular faith) because of their experiences.
> My personal view is that to be fully human we need to try to alleviate suffering rather than to embrace it. My fear is that if we accept suffering as inevitable or purifying then we will no longer be moved by the suffering of the poor or the sick or the marginalised.This is where I get confused about the stance of accepting suffering. Is there maybe a difference between personal and public suffering? That you are meant to find a life's purpose in relieving the suffering of others while accepting your own? I'm not sure but doesn't there NEED to be judgement and anger and outrage about suffering because it is those things that cause people to act? Simple acceptance is passive, isn't it?
> Just my two cents.Thanks for those two cents :)
poster:toojane
thread:724132
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/psycho/20070119/msgs/724377.html