Posted by Nickengland on June 7, 2005, at 10:05:00
In reply to Re: Decriminalisation would at least be step in right, posted by alexandra_k on June 6, 2005, at 23:59:12
>Nicotene. Nicotene is more addictive than opiates with respect to the percentages of how many people successfully give up.
The PHYSICAL withdrawal symptoms from opiates are no worse than a severe case of the flu. The PSYCHOLOGICAL withdrawal is worse for nicotene than it is for opiates.Are you saying the two are not in the same class??
If someone quits smoking, sure they go through some pretty bad psychological withdrawal symptoms...I think overall though the heroin user goes through worse withdrawal symtoms lol..have you seen Trainspotting?! The heroin user who relies on burgling peoples houses and mugging people, selling every posession they have, proves this case - as people who quit smoking do not go to such extream lengths to feed there habit. Regardless of whether heroin is legal or not, the drug remains the same.
I think ours views are somewhat different about the effects that drugs have on people, shows that New Zealand is better off than the UK with regards to the crime, scale and consumption of drugs used. From the C.I.A website of country profiles:
New Zealand
Disputes - international:asserts a territorial claim in Antarctica (Ross Dependency) [see Antarctica
(no mention of drugs)
In the UK however...
Illicit drugs:
producer of limited amounts of synthetic drugs and synthetic precursor chemicals; major consumer of Southwest Asian heroin, Latin American cocaine, and synthetic drugs; money-laundering centerAs you can see Drugs, and their problems are far worse here than in your country and so if you lived here and saw the destruction they have done then maybe your views would be different? Just goes to show how opinons can differ depending on where you live in the world i guess..
>I think the damage comes because of the criminal association.
I think the damage comes from the drug its self.
> Alcohol and drink driving offences continue to rise...if alchol was illeagal would they be still rising at the rate they are now?
I think so.
> Smoking related diseases continue to rise, if smoking was illeagal, would they continue to rise at the rate as though they were legal?
I think so.
So you have answered you're own question, with regards to some of the damage these drugs cause, would still continue to rise if heroin would be made legal.
>Yeah. But the laws are different there. I know people who have died of alchohol related (caused) illnesses. Same with tobacco related. With respect to prison - thats because the laws are different. I do know someone in jail presently for drunk driving..
I was talking about prison, with regards to the crime involved in obtaining money to feed a heroin habit eg 80 or 90% of burglaries over here are commited by heroin & crack addicts. (new zealand maybe different)
>Then why are people ruining their lives by porning possessions etc for money for the next hit?? Is it that the price is reduced to start with in the attempt to create more regular customers???
Yes masively reduced prices to start with to get you hooked. Sometimes the first samples will not even cost a penny..but as you want more the prices increases etc.. There was a report of given out freebies to school kids too if I remember corectly.
Overhere this is why I think if the goverment could tax heroin, we would undoubtly have the most expensive heroin in the world!..with regards to tax. Ciggarette smuggling here is BIG buesiness, people much prefer to buy cigarettes "illegally" for £2.50, through crime, than rather pay £5.00 and pay the tax man...it would be the same for smack too im sure. Tax here is a joke lol.
I wonder if for some countries it would better to stay illegal than it would others to make them legal? I mean like a poor African country compared to America?
Like I said before though, I'm not saying that perhaps all drugs should be kept illegal.Its how you get to the stage of making them legal is the toughest thing.
Re: my statement
The first issue, is in my opion to tackle organised crime related to drugs such as heroin cocaine cannabis etc.. This has to be a global effort and really the polititions who are closest to this effort are mostly corrupt...
How do you stop this? how do you stop columbian cocaine drug war lords? or Afgan heroin smugglers...because at the moment their profits and their empire is on the rise and its multi-billion $ business - and while they keep rising, the idea of making all drugs legal sinks even more...
Also with this, the current global situation is that goverments are trying to burn down and destroy coca fields, burn down and destroy opium crops. Why??..because surely they are trying to eradicate the drug from its source?..is this becuase they think the drug causes more harm in the world than it does good?
For example what does man-kind benefit from Crack?..Does crack make the world a better place and so the government should be telling people and our children that its right to smoke crack?...making something legal gives the message its ok as opposed to something that illegal is not ok.
How would you like to see crack made legal, the age limit for smoking here is 16, would this be the same for crack?
poster:Nickengland
thread:506791
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/poli/20050509/msgs/509021.html