Posted by JLx on August 28, 2005, at 1:53:52
In reply to life is f*cked up (poss trigger ) p B civil!!!, posted by snapper on August 26, 2005, at 1:55:49
Hi Clint,
I read some of your previous posts to see if this one was a more of an acute mood or a chronic condition, and apparently it's a bit of both. It looks like you've been struggling with certain things for a long time, but have a lot of compassion and worthiness to offer people nevertheless.
I'm glad to see that you feel as if life is worth living and repairing despite your current state, and also recognize how much pain you would cause others in your own self-destruction. I hope you can see that there's strength there that you can build upon.
Whatever state we're in, it's uniquely ours so I don't mean to suggest that "I know how you feel" by saying, I recognize some similarities in experience and thinking, so I hope you won't mind a few comments that you can take in a "for what it's worth" manner.
>…but I just do not know after everyone has told me that Jesus is the answer…
I can think of a few possibilities when a religious concept like this isn't "working". One is that it's wrong. Another is that it's wrong *for you*. You note that "everyone has told me". Do you believe it? A Muslim will tell you that Islam is the answer. Since you've mentioned addictions, a 12-stepper will tell you that a twelve step program is the answer. In fact, they will tell you that addiction is primary, i.e. if you don't address that first, no amount of therapy, meds or whatever will solve your problem. What are you willing to believe? What do you actually believe?
And then, once believing, what are you willing to do within that framework? In a conversation I once had with somebody some years back, I recall her ruefully admitting that she was expecting God to fix her and she was frustrated that her demand wasn't being met, in a "What was I thinking?" kind of way. I thought, "Hmm...you mean I'm NOT supposed to expect God to fix me? And then get ticked off when it doesn't happen? Then what's this all about?". In time, with effort and exploration, I came to learn that the idea wasn't to say, "Ok, ok, I surrender...now where's my prize?" but to walk a path paying attention to guides and signposts with an attitude of trust and acceptance of the rightness of where I end up. Iow, there's practice, truth-seeking, exploration and learning involved. "Doing the footwork and leaving the outcome up to God".
It's not easy, especially to do alone, which is why people flock together in churches, other groups and even message boards, ;) reinforcing, correcting and encouraging one another. What are you willing to participate in?
>I don’t fully get it… what the f*ck is he doing in my life other than allowing me to be “forgiven” for the f*cking sins that I have committed against his Father … Our God who sent himself in his form of us…the image of man to forgive us for our sins against him … the same dude that created us and I did not even ask to be f*cking created……. I am supposed to worship him and believe that there is a hope AND a future for my life when all I have seen for half or more of my life is loneliness, agony, addiction, strife, rage, dis-appointment,rejection, mental fuckededness, addictions, temptations, and all the other f*cking b*llshit that goes along w/living this god-damn f*cking miserable life of depression, severe anxiety, loneliness ,emptiness weather I try to him or god or ask and claim my healing. In Jesus’ name… I am sick of living the hope the dream the victory that the bible he promises he claims in the Bible. A hope for the future … one of good things and not bad….
I'm not a Christian but these sentiments suggest to me that perhaps Christianity is not for you, OR perhaps you need to more fully explore the concepts that you address here. You're angry, you seem to feel cheated that what you've been promised isn't being fulfilled. In effect, that God/Jesus isn't acting in your life in the way that you've been lead to believe you can expect. Have you talked to a paster or other knowledgable person that you respect about these ideas?
If we think of God as person-like, doing person-like things, as the Christian tradition seems to suggest, throw in rhetoric like "ask and you shall receive", well it's hard not to feel angry and bewildered if the implied promise isn't realized. So, perhaps the concept is not so simple?
I prefer to think of spiritual surrender in a less anthropomorphic manner so I don't run into difficulties with defining God, having authority issues with God, certain expectations or whatever. I'm drawn to the concepts of Taoism and sometimes think of the Tao, or way, literally as a river and where am I in relation to it? Am I floating peacefully, allowing myself to be borne along to wherever I'm meant to be, or am I struggling, trying to swim upstream because I'm convinced I'd rather be there. Or am I not even in the water but instead shivering with fear on the bank or nearly planted in the soil with obstinancy? Or much more rarely, is the flow instead within me, guiding me effortlessly? In the Christian tradition, this would be expressed perhaps instead as an attitude of "Thy will be done" and living in accordance with that will.
Either way, I don't think we are necessarily promised that it will be an easy ride, but more that we may have our ride eased through our spiritual practice.
Of course, this is the kind of observation that doesn't usually cut much ice when someone is in a lot of pain. If that's the case, I hope your venting provided some relief.
(Now if this was the Alt Med board instead of Faith, I'd be asking you if you supplemented with magnesium, because it's helped me a LOT, including alleviating the kind of suicidal ideation that you're expressing here. There I slipped it in! :))
JL
poster:JLx
thread:546816
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faith/20050811/msgs/547474.html