Posted by Dinah on October 21, 2012, at 9:22:11
In reply to Lou's response- » Dinah, posted by Lou Pilder on October 21, 2012, at 6:11:36
I think that at the very least you should stop making blanket statements about all mentally ill people and all medications.
It is important for antipsychotics to be used with people who become psychotic who are can be dangerous to themselves or others without medication. Withdrawal had diddly to do with it. My relatives had psychotic breaks far they were ever medicated, and were a danger to themselves, though not (to my knowledge) to others.
You say people on medication can be a danger to Jews. I say people who need medication and don't get it are dangerous to themselves and others. I saw their families be destroyed, even if they weren't physically a danger to others. And while that wasn't entirely because of their mental illness, their mental illness did deprive their children of a safe and reliable parent during a difficult time. I saw those same relatives restore their relationships while they were on medication.
I appreciate that you warn of the dangers of withdrawal. But that isn't enough to keep your words from potentially causing harm. I think you could potentially harm others by discouraging people who need medication from taking it. How would you feel if even one person who had severe mental illness was discouraged from taking psychotropic drugs, and as a result harmed themselves and others? I know you don't want to hurt others, Lou. But I very strongly believe you could.
If you would modify your message somewhat, so that you acknowledge that while psych drugs are overprescribed and can cause harm, it is important for those who do need medication to take it, I wouldn't say anything. If you were to say most of what you say with "unnecessary" in front of "medication", I wouldn't have a problem with it.
As my best recent pdoc used to say. "There are side effects from taking medication. There are side effects from not taking medications. It's up to you which side effects you will accept." I'd modify that a bit if someone is a danger to others.
I'm using psychosis as an example, because it's psychosis that I saw destroying families. I feel really strongly about that because it has directly had an impact on me. And yet, depression also runs in my family, and suicide from depression. Long before there were any drugs to cure it. A case could be made that your repeated talk about death could cause someone deeply suicidal to believe that their case was hopeless and they were doomed whether or not they took meds, so just as well kill themselves more directly.
I think you could harm others, Lou, however little you mean to do so. And I think you harm your own cause as well. People are more likely to take your legitimate points seriously if you aren't talking of death-o-meters. Frankly that made me so angry that thoughts of civility weren't uppermost in my mind. I was angry with you and angry with Bob that this was allowed. It went too far, Lou.
I do want to thank you for refraining from labeling me as anti-semitic. My feelings of anger with you stem from your own behavior, not your ethnicity or religion. Thank you for remembering that I like Jewish people, and study Jewish theology, and speak positively of the Jewish faith even in the face of opposition from others.
I don't want anyone to hurt you, Lou. I suppose I do want someone to protect the people who read this board from behavior I believe could potentially cause harm to others. So my main problem is with Dr. Bob, I suppose. He could keep you from making these statements on his board, whatever he says.
poster:Dinah
thread:1029274
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/admin/20120228/msgs/1029348.html