Posted by Vincent_QC on December 13, 2008, at 7:21:07
In reply to Re: Nardil + Insomnia - Re to 'ParnateStarted2008' » Vincent_QC, posted by ParnateStarted2008 on December 12, 2008, at 17:03:08
> Oh I have a question, maybe dumb but.. is a "pdoc" a regular family doctor or a Psychiatrist? Im guessing its a psychiatrist when people use that term.
>Hi mister Parnate!!! Lol
Omg...I always write long messages...lol So another time, thanks for your answer ;-)
Ok, I will try do explain myself more well, my English is not at his best, especially with the memory problems I have since a little while. I lived a couple of years with only English speaking people (my mother tongue is French), so yeah Im a "Québécois"...I hope Im not scarring you with that declaration...lol... I don't know why but I always have difficulty to improve my English level, maybe Im retarded! hahaha ;-)
So where to begin? I have a family doctor, who follows me since 1995. It's a specialist for anxious problems and depression. He also works in a hospital as a family doctor, but I always meet him at his private clinic, he is very busy and dont accept new patientsits the number one doctor in tue Quebec city for the psychological problems.
In March 2007, after the Nardil try, and 10 years of research of the miracle pill, he write a referral paper for a psych to me, since he was not able to continue his treatment with me, or to find something to cure me well. We try almost everything together since 1995, so he was probably tired of taking care of me...lol No, Im just kidding but he know at time that I will be able to have a more good follow up of my case at the psychiatric hospital than only with him. At the psychiatric hospital they have a special center with psychologists and its a place where the treat people with anxious problems with CTB, they call it in French Clinique des troubles anxieux. Thats one of the only places in the Quebec province where they have this kind of treatment offer. IF you go in the private system, you can get a very good psychologist who will do the same treatment, but you will have to pay more than 100$ for each meetings with him/herI dont work, so no money, so I have to wait in the public system and take what they give to me!!!
So I get the paper in march 2007, here in the Quebec province, the medical system is very SLOW and I cant pick up the psychiatrist I want, in fact we don't have a lot of psychiatrist over here. I know only 2 psychiatrist hospitals specialized with psychiatrics problems in the Quebec province, one in Quebec city, another one in Montreal city, and probably others in smaller cities but I dont know themand I donT own a car to drive thereYeah, I use the car of my mom (I know, im 32yo im shy to tell you this), but well I dont want to drive 5 hours just to see a psychiatrist We have a lot of OLD psychiatrists here, and they are a lot crazyI dont want to have an old psychiatrist who will treat me like sh*t and the new one I got 3 weeks ago is young, he is not afraid with the old drugs like MAOIs, he like the wok he did and he like to have a very strict follow of each of his patients.
You are lucky, having the chance to pick up the psychiatrist you want, thats my dream. I want to move into your province, thats seemed easier than here. So you're from British Colombia...I understand why you can choose you psychiatrist cause you have more medical services there, well I think...your province have probably more money allowed to the medical system, or you have more doctors...one thing is sure, in the Quebec province, they need more doctors, since the delay before getting an appointment with a doctor is VERY long. I think the ratio of doctors/patients is something like 1 doctor for 1000 patientsWell to continue with my little story, I Get my paper in march 2007 and in the Quebec province we have to follow this rules to have an access with a psychiatrist...IF you donT go to the emergency of the general hospital and meet a psychiatrist there and wait in the close room for an indeterminate time, you have to go to a "CLSC", that's a kind of small medical clinic, they put this in place to "apparently" reduce the number of people in the hospital emergencies...but anyway, I had to take an appointment with a "social worker" sorry, I don't know the real name of this kind of job in English...Anyway, I had to wait 2 months before meeting him, I see him at the end of may 2007, I fill some papers, he send my referral paper to the psychiatrist hospital in Quebec city, and I had to wait until the 22 October 2007 before I meet the first psychiatrist they give to me. The first I get was not very good, I had him for 1 year, I just get the new one 3 weeks ago and he is better. He do a very good job, dont hesitate to give 1 appointment by week, especially when you begin a new drugs, so yeah I feel in good hands with him.
BUT, I also continue to see my family doctor at the same time. I see him for others things, like the by-pass surgery I get to loose weight a couple of years ago, and others things like that. He continues to advise me, he is a LOT open minded. He dont hesitate to said the truth about a drug, when the new Cymbalta appear on the market, he said that it was another ***** drugs, a less effective effexor-xr versionHe never try TCAs on me cause he know they are not good for social phobia, so you see, he tell you the thruth, he is not push by the pharmacy industry or companies he dont promote the use of newer products over the old one who are now genericHe is also open minded and he know what he do, BUT Im a lost case, and he never succeed to cure mebut I continue to see him cause I know that if I need help, or for example, I want to increase the Parnate to more than 70mg/day and the psychiatrist I had dont want, I will told it to my family doctor and he will fill a prescription to me.Understand??? I HOPE they are not members of this forum!!!! Hahahaha Im not supposed to see 2 doctors at the same time. But well, I think with years, we learn to get what we want from the public medical systemwe have no choice (when you dont have money like me of course)
So you see, we can't pick up the psych doc here, you take the one they give to you and that's it! Sure, I can go to a general hospital, and ask to meet a psychiatrist there, but they are not good at all and they will send you to the psychiatrist hospital anyway, they are just there to dispatch peoples or in case of severe crisis, you know, people who attempt suicide or things like that...So they lock up them in a big room, and they treat them, normally they return home the day after cause the system is overload!!! No wonder why I was not an emergency case last summer when I walk myself to the general hospital to be treating for my AD and my benzo addiction...
> Hi Vincent, fellow Parnate Starter. I am amazed by your story and struggles and accomplishments. Your story is extremely interesting to me. Here is a little bit about who I am:
> -I live in Canada, British Columbia. I went to college in Alberta on and off over the last 6 years.
> -I'm 23 years old, almost 24
> -Ive had social phobia all my life
> -By 17 I became agoraphobic and depressed and began my journey of medication and councelling.
> -Between the age of 18-23 I have abused alcohol heavily and benzo's only a few times
> -This summer I was diagnosed with Bipolar2
> -I often get completely obsessed with psychotropics to 'fix/help my life' as do alot of people here I bet
> Thats me in a NutShell
>
Same here, I'm also obsessed with psychotropics!!! I think I read more books about drugs to cure AD or any others psychiatric problems than all the psychiatrists or doctors do.Buspar was the first drug I tryI was 19yo at the time and its was a new drug, fresh on the market since less than 2 weeksAt the time, social phobia was not really well know, it was at the beginning of the 90sit was a new medical termpanic attacks and anxiety was more commons terms used at the time, but social phobia was more a personality problem than other thing for the regular doctor.
I switch fast on the PAXILit was also a new drug at the time. I was treat with it from 19yo to 24 yoI gain more than 150 pounds on it, I never answer very well to it, I think the psychologue (I donT know the word in Englishbut they cant prescribe drugs, they just do CTB therapy)anyway the psychologist I had at the time help me more than the Paxil I was at 40mg/day at the time. I had no libido at all, apathy was my main personality trait at the time, I was not caring about anything, I had no emotion, I had no motivation at all, I was just eating like a pig, to do a short story it was not helping at all but it was just like a security pill for me. I learn to cope with my social anxiety at the time, I also learn how to AVOID social situations, AVOID the public places in general, especially the ones where I cant get out when I wantplane, bus, school class
> Thats crazy!
>The benzo drugs are CRAZY anywayI dont understand why they prescribe them in 2008, thats the more powerful drug in the world And I know my Ashton book by heart!!! Lol AND I can say benzo drugs are not good at all. I used to drink a lot of alcohol on them too Drinking a 26 oz bottle of vodka with more than 8mg of Rivotril was nothing extraordinary for meand I was always in a good shape the morning after!!! I had school the morning after, I had 3 or 4 BIG coffees and I was walking at school, listening to the teatcher for 3 hours long, taking note on my laptop, sometimes speaking with the people near me, I Was productivebut completely on DRUG I do this for more than 1 year, 4 nights a week, I was going at the university full time at the same time, it was crazy as hell. My family doctor always think that I was lucky to not have more problems than this with the benzo drugs cause I blend them often with alcoholAnyway, Im in life now, so I guess thats not so dangerous. I never pass out or have a problem by blending them with alcoholI always remember what I do the night beforeI just get MORE ADDICTED to benzo drugs by doing this. So its why I tell you that benzo drugs are not goodBefore I used them, I never had an alcohol problemYeah, I had a street drug problem back in my teenager yearsbut I was just an occasional drinker before 2005
> I tried cipralex too. I was on it for about 1.5 months. I dont remember very much because it made me soo tired I just slept everywhere even on a hard floor for 24 hours. I tried up to 30mg's too. It did absolutely nothing.
>
> >Same here, I was tired as hellbut not able to sleep at allexcept during the day I was doing LONG naps, all the afternoon And like I write yesterday, I stop it the 27 October 2008, and I still continue to feel some side effectsthe apathy never disappear, the fatigue also, the regular and strong headache is more strong than ever and its like this everyday and I continue to gain weight , even if I dont eat a lot. I was at 185 pounds before I begin the Cipralex, back at the end of August, Im now at 230 pounds. I had to buy new clothes again because of I cant fit on the ones I buy last augustSince my body image is the MAIN problem in my social anxiety, because I had morbid obesity before my gastric by-pass surgery, Im now more anxious about this weight gain and I Feel just like sh*t I have a bulimia problem also; I never mention it I thinkand the Cipralex activate this problem as wellThats a sh*tty drug for meNEVER again! I dont want to return to 445 pounds, like I was before my gastric by-pass back in 2001I suffer a lot from this surgery and I got a lot of problems alsoI do sever anaemia, I have no iron in my blood, I have to go to the hospital each month to receive intravenous iron, I have a hernia, all over my scar, its 20 cm long on my bellyI had a hernia curing surgery back in July 2004, and it was more painful than the gastric by-pass I had in 2001. The hernia is back, I need another hernia curing but I cant do it because its freaking me out I need to have a lot of extra skin remove with plastic surgery but I lack the 50 000$ to pay itso I hate my body, and no CTB or pills will make me accept the fact that my body is like this I cant watch me nude in a mirror, so you can imagine that I cant meet someone and do something sexual with himits a total discomfort situation among others
>
> This is Extreamly rare 1/1000 and almost non-existant if you titrate slowly as recomended. Lamictal has the lowest side effect profile of any mood stabilizer. It also has an antidepressant effect. Its a good ad-on to any AD to make the AD more effective, just like lithium. Lithium might be better for some people but has more side effects then LAmictal but not many when we compare it to other mood stabilizers.
>
I know this, and he know this alsobut he is just overstress with that because one of his patients almost pass out on itHe say that now he go slow on the dose at the beginningand just wait to see how react the person on itif no problem appear at week 1, he increase the dose faster> >
>
> Me too. I have the same amount of side effects on Parnate but they are different and I dont mind tolerating them as long as Parnate keeps working and gets better. Insomnia, over stimulated feelings, short bouts of anger are the main side effects im getting with Parnate. Its pro-libito for me.
>Pro-Libito??? Explain this to me!!! Lol Pro-LIBIDO ??? My god, the last thing I need for now is sexI never get a problem with sex on AD drugs, they never affect me, except for the Paxil and Nardilthe others one never affect ,y libido or my capacity to have sex.but anyway, Im not able to have sex with someone else because I hate my bodyNOW its more harder than before, since I gain this pretty 45 pounds !!!!
.
> >
>
> I agree completely. I feel human on Parnate and to a lesser extent Nardil. All the ssri's, snri's, sndri's and serotonin pumping type AD's ALL made me emotionless and I could never deal with their side effect profile.
>I never feel like everybody, I always feel apart from them. I was a fat kid but thats not a good excuse. I was not the only one to be more fat at school and the others fat kids was able to make friends and have regular social interactionsme I was always alone, I was a punching bad kid, I was unable to defence myself, but at the same time, I had a BIG problem with the authorities in generalI had a lot of anger against everyone, at school I was a child problem with teachers, I was arrogant, I was always on drugs, especially in my high school days So I never help me On the top of that Im GAYHo dont be scary about that, I will not jump on you!!! Lol But you see, thats not helpingat 3 years old I was already like that, I always look at the boysnot the girlsBUT my sexual orientation was never a problem for me since I was fat and I dont look gayI was never treat as a gaybecause others childs always see me as a fat kid at firstand an easy target to be mistreat on my FAT problem
I try to change myself, I try to change a lot of things in my life and my approach with the others but every time I was able to approach new people, it was always weird peoples, problems people, I was abuse by them, I was giving my money to everyone, I was giving all I had to be accepted by the othersand I never get something in return
I always feel like I was from another planet. Now its the sameI look around me, I look at the world, and I feel that Im like the othersI found the world to be too fast for me, I feel like everyone is happy except me, I feel always watched by the others, I feel always guilty, if I go somewhere (social event or place) I feel like Im not like the others, I feel exclude, and the list goes on!!! Ho and if I go shopping and I dont do a plan in my head before about where I have to go, where I will find what I need or things like that I begin to freak out. Im not able to just go to the shopping mail and just looking aroundI always feel watched, like the people think that I will stole something, I feel overstress, over watchedso you can imagine why Im always tiredI cant put the switch off in my head. I always think about 10000000 things at the same time Sometimes I just lying in my bed and I think about the past, about the future, about the fact that I have more that 20 000$ of student loans to refund, that I dont finish my last year of university, that I dont work, that I dont have money, that I will have to refund my student loans soon even if I didnt finish my schoolI wonder when I will be able to return to schoolif I will be able to study again, since I have a lot of memory problems, I wonder about what I will do at night, if I know that Im suppose to go out at the bar with a friend at night, I imagine in advance all the night, how I will feel, I wonder if I will see someone who dont like me, I wonder if someone will come and talk with me, since Im not very good in my self presentation, I tend to show my negatives sides first and I always said negatives thingsso no wonder why the people dont find me attractive or interesting. BUT I try to changebut thats not easy I just begin another CTB therapy 3 weeks ago, its my third therapy I think, and I hope I will be able to change the way I feel inside me, my mental thinks and speech, and I hope I will be able to work on my social presentation, I dont want to become a popular guy, I just want to feel normal, like someone who is a part of this society you know
> Im at 70mg for 4days now. Its doing a OK job for SP. DEPRESSION(i dont think anyone could get depressed if on Parnate lol)well I feel like that anyway.
> Ok, sounds like you have a plan in place, good luck.
> Chow4Now.
>Well for now, Im only at 10mgI dont feel a lot of thingsbefore I begin the Parnate, I was already in bad shape and overstress so I cant say if all I feel inside my head is from the Parnate of just from my imagination I also have a fixation on the DIET thingI was not like this on the Nardil back in 2007. I do panic attacks, especially after I eat something that Im not suppose, like process cheese on my breadthings like thatI listen too much to my body, I have a fixation on it in fact
Im also complex a lot. I do social phobia, but at the same time I like to speak loud, I like to feel like Im the central attraction. Im a crazy bitch with the others, I dont like a lot of people, I like to be look by the others and I like the fact that Im different from the othersbut at the same time I fear the judgment of the othersStrange no???
The same apply to my lifestyle. I always find that the Coffee, for example, help me with my social interactions. My family doctor wanted that I stop coffee because he say it was bad for my anxiety, but when I dont drink coffee, I find that Im less awake, I tend to have more strong migraines but at the same time, the coffee make my hands and my feets completely moist and I can feel the anxiety augmenting with my intake of coffeeIm also a lot concern about my health but at the same time I smoke like I never smoke before, more than 1 pack by day, I dont eat a lot but I dont eat well, I know that coffee dont help me with the insomnia but I continue to drink it, even if its 9 PM, I wonder if I will be able to do a strict protein diet on the Parnate, since the powder whey protein seem to be not very safe I need some motivation but the Cipralex leave me completely empty Last spring, after my second Zoloft try in my life, I do a strict diet and I succed to loose more than 40 pounds on a strict diet , I eat just powder protein, a lot of vitamins, and green saladand a lot of waterthats itI was so happy like thisI mean at 185 poundsnow I look at myself and I hate what I seebut at the same time, I cant stop doing bad things to my bodyI cant stop eating sugar and fat foods I TRY the most I Cant but thats so hardI dont have the energy to do it nowbut if I dont stop gaining weight I know I will feel worst and worstThats not helping me
Well, thats enough for todaySorry if I bother youYou are very nice to take the time to read all of this and dont judge me
Have a nice day and again thanks a lot ;-)
Take care of you ok ;-)
poster:Vincent_QC
thread:866860
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20081204/msgs/868439.html