Posted by linkadge on November 16, 2008, at 6:27:01
In reply to Re: Anyone Ever Feel More Confused At This Forum?, posted by bulldog2 on November 15, 2008, at 9:27:50
>after almost 40 years of trying almost every >modality (diet,exercise,accupuncture,chinese >medicine etc) I have been very disappointed with >the results.
Well, you can throw prescription drugs into that list else we wouldn't be having this conversation. Nevertheless, there are tons of ways to try highly regulated alternative substances. You can buy things like taurine in regulated quanitities. I don't think "diet" alone can help bipolar disorder nor do I think "acupuncture" or "chinese medicine" can either. Chinese medicine consists of a handful of monoamine oxidase inhibiting adaptogens, which are certainly not mood stabilizers.
There are a number of alternative agents which I do think can help bipolar disorder though.
>This field is poorly regulated with dozens of >modalties available. Claims are often
>made with no scientific validation.Thats why you need to do your own research and use the agents for which there is evidence efficacy.
>So if there are things that work it is like >looking for a needle in a haystack.
Not necessarily. The manic phase is associated with elevated calcium and PKC metabolism for isntance. Calming mania often responds to agents that stabilize calcium function in neuronal membranes. There are many studies that show taurine for instance can stabilize calcium currents while exerting a powerful antioxidant effect. Omega-3 fatty acids inhibit protein kinase C function and GSK-3b function just like ithium and valproate. Omega-3 also upregulates the neuroprotective protin BCL-2 just like lithium and valproate.
>I have read that mouse studies are more often >wrong than right.
Most of the psychoactive drugs we ingest are the product of rodent screening processes. Sure they can be wrong, but they do indicate potential benefit.
>While healthy living is certainly a good adjunct >to getting better right now alternative health >needs to get organzized
I'd say conventional medicine needs to get organized too.
>and weed out what works from what is often >quackery. I've probaly spent thousands on >ineffective treatments.
I have spend 10's of thousands on innefective prescriptions (had I been the one paying for them). So whats your point?
>As to toxic meds that is not just psychotropic >meds but allopathic western medicine period. >Most meds are toxic to some degree and rarely >cure but address symtpoms. But i guess sometimes >that's the best we have.
No, its not necessarily the best we have, its the best that can be patented. Its the best that money can be made from.
If anthocyannins from blueberries could be patented, they would. If turmeric could be patented it would. If omega-3 could be patented, it would, if melatonin could be patented, it would.
>I remember years ago reading a book by Patty >Duke about her battle with bp. Life was >spiraling out of control. Drinking >binges,delusions,one night stands, tamper >tantrums and her life just falling apart. She >started lithium and the storm abated. Now the >med may be toxic and eventually destroy her mind >but I guess one has to weigh the options.
One can't well weight the options if one doesn't undestand their options or know a little bit about their disorder. I am not saying that mood sbailizers don't work (for some people). I am saying that for many bipolars they don't work well enough and have unnaceptable side effects.
Agnets like omega-3 and taurine are being studied at Harvard for their mood stabilizing effects. The researhcers in these studies note similarities in the biochemical targets of these agents and other mood stabilizers. While agents like this may not replace conventional mood stabilizers for some individuals, well controlled studies indicate that even severe bipolars can significantly reduce their need for medications by adding agents like this to their regiment.
Studies by Dr. Andrew Stoll concluded that such medication changes like this can help many bipolars live in a more well state.
>But for her it was a miracle.
>Hopefully one day we will know what the mind >needs. Right now we really just don't know what >the mind needs. To many claims and not enough >hard core evidence.There is some very good evidence and research of what is going wrong in the bipolar brain. I would urge you to read some of the conclusions and findings of Dr. Manjii, a molecular biologics at the forefront of research on bipolar and the biochemical targets of mood stabilizing medications.
>I personally believe that some brains have >faulty wiring from birth just like any organ can >be defective. I don't know that we ever be able >to cure people like that with the right >supplements.I partially agree with you. But then why would you want to down a handful of lamotrigine and olanzapine (or other drugs which geneally supress the brains ability to establish new connections) when you can feed it with agents capable improving the conenctivity and functionality of the brain.
Note: I do put lithium on this list since it has some neurotrophic capacity, but most other BP medications do not.
Linkadge
poster:linkadge
thread:862827
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20081114/msgs/863308.html