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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 9 of 9. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by sregan on September 18, 2006, at 13:32:56
My results are:
7-8AM 28 (13-24) HIGH
11-noon 5 (5-10)
4-5pm 2 (3-8) LOW
11-Mid 2 (1-4)DHEA 3 (3-10) BORDERLINE
Estradiol 11 Male (20-49) 1-3 pg/ml HIGH
Progesterone 131 Male (adult) 5-96 pg/ml HIGH
Testosterone 33 Male: 40-70 pg/ml LOWTSH 37 25-85
T4 .26 .17-.42
T3 .40 .28-1.1
TPO Neg Neg (Thyroid Mocrosomal, SIgA)
I suspected I was HIGH cortisol in the AM but am a little puzzled by the LOW @ 5pm. I got no idea what the Estradiol-Testosterone mean. Can anybody give me some help on that.Shawn
Posted by Jost on September 18, 2006, at 22:15:55
In reply to 24 hour cortisol salivary results (need help inter, posted by sregan on September 18, 2006, at 13:32:56
Hi.
I'm wondering: were these results from a test that a doctor did, or was this a home test, that you did and sent to a lab?
Jost
Posted by sregan on September 19, 2006, at 9:42:32
In reply to Re: 24 hour cortisol salivary results (need help i » sregan, posted by Jost on September 18, 2006, at 22:15:55
Jost,
It was from a test I did at home. Should there be a difference? The company was Diagnos-Tech, referred by canaryclub.org.
> Hi.
>
> I'm wondering: were these results from a test that a doctor did, or was this a home test, that you did and sent to a lab?
>
> Jost
Posted by notfred on September 23, 2006, at 15:33:11
In reply to 24 hour cortisol salivary results (need help inter, posted by sregan on September 18, 2006, at 13:32:56
Are these free or bound ? It is the free ones that matter, hormones can also be bound up to protein
so they are unusable.Estradiol 11 Male (20-49) 1-3 pg/ml HIGH
Progesterone 131 Male (adult) 5-96 pg/ml HIGH
Testosterone 33 Male: 40-70 pg/ml LOWLevels of these hormones vary greatly over time, so you need several tests of the free hormones to really know where the levels are.
Posted by sregan on September 25, 2006, at 15:57:40
In reply to Re: 24 hour cortisol salivary results (need help i, posted by notfred on September 23, 2006, at 15:33:11
It was salivary so I assume it is free? I just had a visit with my MD and he is checking serum testosterone (and a PSA).
> Are these free or bound ? It is the free ones that matter, hormones can also be bound up to protein
> so they are unusable.
>
> Estradiol 11 Male (20-49) 1-3 pg/ml HIGH
> Progesterone 131 Male (adult) 5-96 pg/ml HIGH
> Testosterone 33 Male: 40-70 pg/ml LOW
>
> Levels of these hormones vary greatly over time, so you need several tests of the free hormones to really know where the levels are.
Posted by tealady on October 1, 2006, at 2:29:46
In reply to 24 hour cortisol salivary results (need help inter, posted by sregan on September 18, 2006, at 13:32:56
> My results are:
>
> 7-8AM 28 (13-24) HIGH
> 11-noon 5 (5-10)
> 4-5pm 2 (3-8) LOW
> 11-Mid 2 (1-4)
>
> DHEA 3 (3-10) BORDERLINE
>
> Estradiol 11 Male (20-49) 1-3 pg/ml HIGH
> Progesterone 131 Male (adult) 5-96 pg/ml HIGH
> Testosterone 33 Male: 40-70 pg/ml LOW
>
> TSH 37 25-85
> T4 .26 .17-.42
> T3 .40 .28-1.1
> TPO Neg Neg (Thyroid Mocrosomal, SIgA)
>
>
> I suspected I was HIGH cortisol in the AM but am a little puzzled by the LOW @ 5pm. I got no idea what the Estradiol-Testosterone mean. Can anybody give me some help on that.
>
> ShawnI've never seen thyroid saliva tests.. I think most use blood for these.. otherwise no antibodies is a big plus.. if its valid., and TSH seems not too high in range.. but really, if you are concerned at all, get your GP to do a blood TFT panel.
Cortisol.. supposed to go up and down during day and night..
for some reason you aren't getting your afternoon peak and have stacks at midnight. If valid you should be wide awake at midnight? You really have to match this test to your sleep patterns for it to have any meaning.. so when do you sleep?Morning looks OK.. just a bit over, noon is fine.. now if you usually sleep in the day and work night shift?
Posted by sregan on October 1, 2006, at 18:01:37
In reply to Re: 24 hour cortisol salivary results (need help inter » sregan, posted by tealady on October 1, 2006, at 2:29:46
I think my cortisol curve matches what one would expect for "melancholic" depression. I'm addressing the HPA overshoot at night that is my target. Drugs like imipramine and amitryptaline are supposed to help reset the HPA.
Posted by tealady on October 2, 2006, at 0:55:03
In reply to Re: 24 hour cortisol salivary results (need help i, posted by sregan on October 1, 2006, at 18:01:37
> I think my cortisol curve matches what one would expect for "melancholic" depression. I'm addressing the HPA overshoot at night that is my target. Drugs like imipramine and amitryptaline are supposed to help reset the HPA.
You're ahead of me.
I do think your curve needs restting though, not necessarily "lowering" of cortisol, as it isn't up high all thru the day, and I agree if you do get it "reset" then the highs will probably not be as high.
Do you have difficulty going to sleep at night with that high a cortisol level?
I couldn't stay awake til 11Pm little only midnight when I sampled my saliva cortisol , and I took the midnight one about 10:30PM.. by then it was undetectable low), but my morning one was OK (noon and aft on low side).
I figured for me the Undetectable cortisol was why I couldnt stay awake despite pinching myself
I tried Tri-cyclic antiD's about 15 yrs ago.. they didnt help me, but we are all individual.
I see you realise that these drugs also have an effect on cortisol levels..as well as wothdrawal from same.
Also there's a thyroid-pituitary-hypothalamus axis.. and cortisol affects this too, and it affects cortisol..so I think the HPA axis is a bit simplistic (but easier to teach).You mention a form of carnitine as well.
i'd assume B vits would also affect it (B1, B5 for starters?)
Sorry I can't help, as I feel you know more than me here:)
Posted by sregan on October 2, 2006, at 10:20:23
In reply to Re: 24 hour cortisol salivary results (need help i » sregan, posted by tealady on October 2, 2006, at 0:55:03
> I do think your curve needs restting though, not necessarily "lowering" of cortisol, as it isn't up high all thru the day, and I agree if you do get it "reset" then the highs will probably not be as high.
I read one article that particularly mentioned the CRH overshoot. There are a lot of articles regarding glucocorticoids (and CRH) and depression. In my experience I would go as far to say that my form of depression (which is mostly experienced as sustained anxiety) could be caused completely by the sleep disturbance. The better I sleep the better I feel (less symptomatic) period.
> Do you have difficulty going to sleep at night with that high a cortisol level?
My cortisol is LOW in the evening. Bottom of the scale. I have no trouble falling asleep. It's staying asleep. My awakenings seem to match the CRH/cortisol peaks that start around 3am.
> I tried Tri-cyclic antiD's about 15 yrs ago.. they didnt help me, but we are all individual.
It would be great if one size fit all in this case. Imipramine and mirtazapine are both supposed to be successful at resetting the HPA.
> Also there's a thyroid-pituitary-hypothalamus axis.. and cortisol affects this too, and it affects cortisol..so I think the HPA axis is a bit simplistic (but easier to teach).
Good point, I may need to look into that a little. My problem started with about 6 months of extreme stress and three years later I'm about to bottom out. This is why I've spent so much time looking to the HPA as it is indicated by chronic stress.
> Sorry I can't help, as I feel you know more than me here:)I really do appreciate your time, thank you.
Shawn
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