![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 38 to 62 of 85. Go back in thread:
Posted by AuntieMel on March 3, 2006, at 10:37:55
In reply to Re: Ethics, posted by 5 on March 2, 2006, at 22:03:06
Is it possible that you were hurt because you have some transference issues, too? Maybe in a way we all do.
----------------
my block...
i was extra hurt because it was him
and i trusted him--------------------
Posted by muffled on March 3, 2006, at 11:18:01
In reply to Re: Transference » 5, posted by AuntieMel on March 3, 2006, at 10:37:55
Just sometimes blocks feel so much like you been sucker punched, and it really pisses you off on a variety of levels when you get sucker punched.
Posted by AuntieMel on March 3, 2006, at 13:50:55
In reply to Re: Transference, posted by muffled on March 3, 2006, at 11:18:01
I am sure it does.
I am merely trying to talk to her on a logical level instead of an emotional one. Most of the time that's the type of discussion she prefers.
Posted by muffled on March 3, 2006, at 15:55:39
In reply to Re: Transference » muffled, posted by AuntieMel on March 3, 2006, at 13:50:55
Posted by Deneb on March 3, 2006, at 17:06:17
In reply to Re: I'm sorry » Deneb, posted by Dinah on March 2, 2006, at 20:29:09
> *My* Bob didn't mind. But he was a TV star, so maybe that makes a difference. You could ask Dr. Bob if he minds, or if it makes him uncomfortable. And if it does, then you can respect him by not doing what makes him uncomfortable. And if he doesn't, then I suspect the rest of us can stand it. And maybe even, if we let ourselves, reminisce a bit.
Do you really think that Dr. Bob will answer my question Dinah? What if he doesn't reply? Does that mean I can continue posting about loving him?
What if I asked him in person? Would he answer me? Does Dr. Bob actually answer questions and talk in real life? Will he talk to me? What will we talk about? Did you talk about current events? Will we talk about how Babble is run? I hope Dr. Bob talks to me. Does Dr. Bob answer personal questions? Will he answer interview-type questions?
If I ask him, "Dr. Bob, what gave you the idea to start up Psych-Babble?" Will he answer me?
What about, "What is the most difficult thing being an online moderator?"
What about, "Why did you choose to become a pdoc?"
What about, "How many countries have you been to?"
What about, "What is your favourite colour?"
What about, "Did I make you feel bad when I sent you all those threats?"
What if I apologize for making my threats, do you think Dr. Bob will acknowledge and accept my apology?
Will we make small talk? Will we talk about the weather?
Do you think Dr. Bob knows that my hamsters died?
Do you think Dr. Bob reads my posts, I mean really reads them, not just scan them?
Okay, that's a lot of questions. LOL
What if I say, "I love you Dr. Bob," in person. What will Dr. Bob say then?
Deneb
Posted by JenStar on March 3, 2006, at 17:40:25
In reply to Asking if Dr. Bob minds, posted by Deneb on March 3, 2006, at 17:06:17
Without knowing Dr. Bob, here's my guess:
He'll answer questions about why he started babble and why he became a pdoc, travel he's done. He will probably accept your apology, but will steer away from personal talk and details, or anything that might seem "therapy-ish."
Maybe you won't want to say that you love him when you meet him face to face, because the physical presence of him will be so different from the imaginary Dr. Bob that you love right now? Maybe you'll see immediately that it would be kind of weird and strange and not even accurate to say that you love him, because you love the IDEA of him and not the REAL person?
I think it's important to keep in mind that you're meeting him as the moderator of this board, NOT as a therapist, penpal, on-line friend, or doctor. So it won't QUITE be as personal as you'd (probably) like.
Again, that's my guess, based on what a "typical" person might do in such a situation. It's also based on what *I* would probably do if I ran such a board and had agreed to meet members. As a way of self-protection, and a way of protecting members from getting too attached, I'd probably have to stay somewhat detached from them as people, no matter how interesting they were.
I could be totally wrong, of course. :) But I like to put forth my theories. :)
But I think you should expect the least so you don't end up disappointed.
JenStar
Posted by JenStar on March 3, 2006, at 17:48:13
In reply to Re: Ethics, posted by Deneb on March 2, 2006, at 23:50:23
Deneb,
it worries me when you write posts like this. It seems (and correct me if I'm wrong) that you might be implying that posters here have no personal responsibility for owning their own emotions or responses to blocks, or even for writing the things that get blocked in the first place.Are you implying that Dr. Bob, as the one who assigns blocks, is totally responsible for the state of mind & emotional unheaval of the blocked parties?
To me, that is sort of like saying that people who commit crimes should not have to go to jail because it will upset them. Or that Olympic athletes who are caught doping or taking steroids should not have medals taken away (even if they know it would happen if they got caught) because it will make them desperate and possibly suicidal. The deal is, this site has rules about posting, and everyone knows what they are. We can choose to familiarize ourselves with the rules, and can choose whether to break them or not. And then it's up to us to face the consequences. Right? I just don't get why people are making this so personal about Dr. Bob...
What about personal responsibility?
JenStar
Posted by Deneb on March 3, 2006, at 18:04:23
In reply to Re: Ethics » Deneb, posted by JenStar on March 3, 2006, at 17:48:13
> Deneb,
> it worries me when you write posts like this. It seems (and correct me if I'm wrong) that you might be implying that posters here have no personal responsibility for owning their own emotions or responses to blocks, or even for writing the things that get blocked in the first place.I think Dr. Bob should own up to his mistakes.
>
> Are you implying that Dr. Bob, as the one who assigns blocks, is totally responsible for the state of mind & emotional unheaval of the blocked parties?No, I'm not saying that at all. What I am saying is that Dr. Bob should find out exactly how harmful blocks are and maybe change policies to make this place more supportive. This is supposed to be a *supportive* place to be. It would kind of defeat that purpose if one were to find out that say, 70% of people here were harmed by the blocks instead of helped. What if all that was needed was a reduction in lengths of blocks? Blocks seem to hurt a lot of people IMO, both the blockee and friends of the blockee, maybe even lurkers.
>
> To me, that is sort of like saying that people who commit crimes should not have to go to jail because it will upset them. Or that Olympic athletes who are caught doping or taking steroids should not have medals taken away (even if they know it would happen if they got caught) because it will make them desperate and possibly suicidal. The deal is, this site has rules about posting, and everyone knows what they are. We can choose to familiarize ourselves with the rules, and can choose whether to break them or not. And then it's up to us to face the consequences. Right? I just don't get why people are making this so personal about Dr. Bob...Rules to what end? What if the rules or the enforcement of the rules ends up defeating the very purpose of this site? Support and education. I dunno, maybe I just don't like rules. Maybe I should go back to usenet.
Maybe I have a bit of anarchist in me. ;-)
Deneb
Posted by Deneb on March 3, 2006, at 19:25:47
In reply to Re: Asking if Dr. Bob minds » Deneb, posted by JenStar on March 3, 2006, at 17:40:25
> Maybe you won't want to say that you love him when you meet him face to face, because the physical presence of him will be so different from the imaginary Dr. Bob that you love right now? Maybe you'll see immediately that it would be kind of weird and strange and not even accurate to say that you love him, because you love the IDEA of him and not the REAL person?
I think you're absolutely right JenStar. I don't love people in real life. (Except my family, but even then I don't really feel affection towards them). I think the most likely scenario would be that I would be too afraid to talk to Dr. Bob.
> I think it's important to keep in mind that you're meeting him as the moderator of this board, NOT as a therapist, penpal, on-line friend, or doctor. So it won't QUITE be as personal as you'd (probably) like.
There better be some interesting weather then. ;-)
> I'd probably have to stay somewhat detached from them as people, no matter how interesting they were.
I think that's too bad. What would be the purpose of meeting then?
> I could be totally wrong, of course. :) But I like to put forth my theories. :)
LOL, yes, I hope you're wrong. I don't think Dr. Bob will talk too much. I don't think he'll get personal either. I think he might start asking me about Canada and our weather. LOL Then I'll ask him about Chicago weather. ROFL
Deneb
Posted by Deneb on March 3, 2006, at 21:04:01
In reply to Re: Asking if Dr. Bob minds » JenStar, posted by Deneb on March 3, 2006, at 19:25:47
I love it when Dr. Bob comes on site and redirects stuff. I just love it so much. I love how he spends time here and how he reads a lot of posts.
He's been away for a few days now and I miss him.
I wonder what he thinks about? I wish I could get into his mind. I'm going to wish really hard for that. Maybe some magic will happen.
I wish I could be Dr. Bob for a typical day. I wonder what his life is like? I think he has a lot of friends. I think he's an outgoing type of guy.
Why am I so fascinated with Dr. Bob?
Has anyone else here been as fascinated with him as I am? Have there been other Babblers who "loved" Dr. Bob? What were they like?
I wish we could have fun together, like go to the zoo and eat ice cream.
I wonder what Dr. Bob thinks of this situation of me loving him? What do you think he thinks?
I love him so much. :-)
Awww, he's great. Smiling me.
I have an idea. :-) I'm going to get started on it tomorrow. I hope he likes it. :-)
Or, maybe it's a bad idea...
Dr. Bob, would you accept a gift from me?
Deneb
Posted by Deneb on March 3, 2006, at 21:51:58
In reply to Re: Asking if Dr. Bob minds, posted by Deneb on March 3, 2006, at 21:04:01
That was inappropriate of me to ask.
I don't really love you.
Sorry.
I think I just want attention.
Posted by sleepygirl on March 3, 2006, at 21:57:50
In reply to Re: Ethics » Deneb, posted by JenStar on March 3, 2006, at 17:48:13
Posted by Deneb on March 4, 2006, at 0:20:56
In reply to I'm sorry Dr. Bob, posted by Deneb on March 3, 2006, at 21:51:58
Dr. Bob,
I'm just really confused. I don't know if I really love you or not. I don't know if I sometimes post about this to get attention. I just don't know anymore. I think maybe I do actually like you very much at times and think you're my friend.
Dr. Bob, I was thinking of giving you a gift, but would it be inappropriate for you to accept it? I don't want to appear like a fool. Maybe it would be better if I gave everyone else the same gift. Yes, that is what I'll do....
Then it won't be inappropriate, because I'm giving everyone the same gift.
I'm going to try really hard to not be insane from now on. I don't want people to be afraid of me. I'm gonna try really hard to not be so insane with the love thing. I don't want you to be afraid of me. Don't worry, I would never stalk you.
I'm really relatively normal in person. I really am.
Deneb
Posted by Deneb on March 4, 2006, at 0:25:18
In reply to Re: I'm sorry Dr. Bob, posted by Deneb on March 4, 2006, at 0:20:56
> I'm really relatively normal in person. I really am.
Actually, on second thought, scratch that. I'm pretty abnormal in real life too. I don't even have any friends. I'm awkward and can't socialize properly. I'm just waaay more quiet and less dramatic in real life. I *promise*.
Posted by 5 on March 4, 2006, at 4:06:52
In reply to Re: Transference » 5, posted by AuntieMel on March 3, 2006, at 10:37:55
> Is it possible that you were hurt because you have some transference issues, too?
of course. i didn't really care when doc john blocked me for 4 weeks. so of course that comes into it.
> Maybe in a way we all do.
well... i would have thought so yes. actually... i am having trouble getting my head around the idea that some people seem to think they don't have any transference stuff going on for dr bob at all. that one boggles me. really. but... it is uncivil to say someone is having a transference response... so there it is.
Posted by JenStar on March 4, 2006, at 10:39:56
In reply to Re: Transference » AuntieMel, posted by 5 on March 4, 2006, at 4:06:52
hi Mel,
I think it's hard to see it when you're IN it, though? I mean, if *I* have transference, it might be near impossible for me to get that I do.
I mean, I'm sure you're right -- given that transference is not reserved only for therapists, but can be applied to ANYONE we meet, anywhere -- I'm sure I do have transference feelings of some kind for Dr. Bob. I don't know him, so of course I'm going to make assumptions about what kind of person he is based on the little information I have.I extrapolate AND interpolate using tidbits and stuff he posts, and just the general knowledge about this site.
But I don't have a "crush" on him, nor do I think about him when I'm not posting, nor do I really wonder too much about him. I probably wonder LESS about him than I do about some of the posters here, because to me the posters are more REAL. I know more about them, so I end up caring more about them, and hoping that they're doing OK.
What do you think? Do you think that YOU have transference for Dr. Bob of any kind?
JenStar
Posted by verne on March 4, 2006, at 11:29:43
In reply to Re: Transference » AuntieMel, posted by 5 on March 4, 2006, at 4:06:52
5, (are you related to 7of5?)
I just took a closer look at the thread about nukes on the politics board and the discussion about ethics, transference, and blocks on this board.
I've said before that I don't think blocks should be for very long, and certainly not doubled or tripled. That's like an indefinite form of probation. (I'll get to the point later - like a sentence in German, you have to wait until the verb at the end to find out what I'm talking about)
I agree about the transference. Without Dr Bob's pic and active hands-on involvement, it wouldn't be much of an issue. It's hard to form an attachment with just the "webmaster".
When I first discovered Babble in 2000-2001, I thought it was the best site on the net to compare notes about medication - what's not said by the doctor or the pharmacist. What's really going on. I knew it wasn't my imagination when, for example, I gained 10 pounds overnight on Serzone. Babble spared me a lot of grief in my many drug trials and search for a "cure".
When I rediscovered Babble in 2004 I first noticed the politics, faith, administration, social, and other boards. Now Babble, for me, became a mixed blessing. Involvement on the other boards seemed to increase my level of anxiety and lead to more than the usual drinking.
It took me awhile to understand why the other boards even existed until one of the babble old-timers explained that these topics were causing others distress on the main board.
In other words, it was an attempt to quarantine and safely contain volatile "trigger" topics. This was the ultimate way to flag potential troublesome threads. (my problem is I open them anyway) Afterall, the main goal of the site is to be "supportive".
Which brings me to your recent trouble on the politics board - the post about "people with nukes". The babble-correct way to express it would go something like this: "The US has nukes yet doesn't want certain other countries to have nukes." or "wants nukes for some countries and not for others", leaving motives and judgment out of it.
But, perhaps, your style of posting - relentlessly exploring ideas and challenging another person's views, your kind of sharp, logically driven, brainstorming, debating, style doesn't always fit into the Borg - I mean Babble - model. How do you conform your thoughts to the Babble without losing yourself in the process?
What if you're more interested in content than style points? You want to get there without the acrobatics. And is there a way to discuss ideas in babble-perfect without sacrificing one's identity and joining the circus?
You may have arrived at your own answer. I noticed, lately, that when you venture too close to the edge, you stop and say, "...so there it is". As Tobey McGuire's character says in the movie, "Ride With the Devil": "I'm not saying it's good, I'm not saying it's bad, it just IS".
Verne
Posted by Tamar on March 4, 2006, at 21:54:21
In reply to Re: I'm sorry Dr. Bob, posted by Deneb on March 4, 2006, at 0:20:56
Deneb,
I’m sure it’s OK to love Dr Bob. I’m certain it doesn’t make him feel uncomfortable or unhappy.
I reckon the important thing is to think about why you love Dr Bob so much. A few days ago you agreed with the idea that he is safe (if I remember correctly). Maybe safety is especially important to you.
Your love thing is not at all insane. On the contrary, it is very sensible. I think it’s a good thing for you to be able to feel love. And there are lots of different kinds of love, or facets to love. There are lots of questions you could ask yourself. For example:
1. Do you want Dr Bob as a lover or as a father figure, or perhaps both (or neither)?
2. If you could do just about anything, how would you express your love for Dr Bob?
3. Do you feel that loving Dr Bob is a substitute for loving people in real life?
4. If you could substitute Dr Bob for one person in your real life, who would it be? Would you prefer to have Dr Bob instead of your father? Your uncle? A professor? A brother or cousin? What do you want most from him?
5. If Dr Bob had flaws, what could you live with? What couldn’t you live with?Of course, my questions could be completely pointless. They’re based in my experience rather than in theory.
Nevertheless, I believe you’re completely normal. Don’t fret about your feelings. You’re in good company…
Tamar
Posted by Deneb on March 4, 2006, at 23:04:35
In reply to Re: I'm sorry Dr. Bob, posted by Tamar on March 4, 2006, at 21:54:21
> Deneb,
>
> I’m sure it’s OK to love Dr Bob. I’m certain it doesn’t make him feel uncomfortable or unhappy.Really? That makes me happy then. :-)
>There are lots of questions you could ask yourself. For example:
> 1. Do you want Dr Bob as a lover or as a father figure, or perhaps both (or neither)?LOL, not as a lover! Most parsimonious explanation....father figure. LOL
> 2. If you could do just about anything, how would you express your love for Dr Bob?
I want to give Dr. Bob a hug. :-)
> 3. Do you feel that loving Dr Bob is a substitute for loving people in real life?
Not at all. I have limitless love. :-)
> 4. If you could substitute Dr Bob for one person in your real life, who would it be? Would you prefer to have Dr Bob instead of your father? Your uncle? A professor? A brother or cousin? What do you want most from him?
I think it would be super cool to have Dr. Bob as my professor, but I somehow think my loving him makes him more like a father.
What do I want most from him? I want him to tell me that he doesn't not like me, and doesn't want me hurt. He has actually told me those things. ;-) He's already given me all I want and need. Maybe that's why I love him so much.
> 5. If Dr Bob had flaws, what could you live with? What couldn’t you live with?
I could tolerate Dr. Bob not answering all my questions and forgetting about things. I wouldn't be able to tolerate him being greedy and selfish.
> Of course, my questions could be completely pointless. They’re based in my experience rather than in theory.
I think they were very good questions. :-)
>
> Nevertheless, I believe you’re completely normal. Don’t fret about your feelings. You’re in good company…
>
> Tamar
>Thanks Tamar :-) *gives Tamar big hug*
Deneb
>
Posted by Dr. Bob on March 6, 2006, at 14:17:05
In reply to Re: Ethics, posted by 5 on March 2, 2006, at 22:24:03
> My point is that according to the ethics boards...
> His conduct is nothing to do with them.
> So the fact is that he can do whatever the f*ck he likes...
>
> He is god here.
> And he asks us to trust him...It's a lot to ask, I know. For some people, it may be too much to ask.
But I've also been thinking lately that some posters may feel it's unfair. I hold them to rules, but "can do whatever the f*ck I like" myself.
> IMO he is crazy anyways
Um, please be sensitive to the feelings of others.
But please also don't take this personally, this doesn't mean I don't like you or think you're a bad person.
If you or others have questions about this or about posting policies in general, or are interested in alternative ways of expressing yourself, please see the FAQ:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#civil
Follow-ups regarding these issues, as well as replies to the above post, should of course themselves be civil.
Thanks,
Bob
Posted by muffled on March 6, 2006, at 14:39:48
In reply to Re: Ethics, posted by Dr. Bob on March 6, 2006, at 14:17:05
> It's a lot to ask, I know. For some people, it may be too much to ask.
***I do in fact find this challenging
> But I've also been thinking lately that some posters may feel it's unfair. I hold them to rules, but "can do whatever the f*ck I like" myself.
***Oooh, talking my lingo, Bob repeated f*ck. Well, well. Its the old authority figure thing I struggle with I think. And the imbalance of perceived power.
> Um, please be sensitive to the feelings of others.
> But please also don't take this personally, this doesn't mean I don't like you or think you're a bad person.
> Thanks,
> Bob***Dunno if you'll answer this, but when I first came on the boards you said only real short one liners, and were pretty much completely impersonal. Now you say alot more comparatively speaking, and are actually interacting with bablers on here. I just wondered why such a radical change? Is it to do with your studies? Personal? for better functioning of this site,? all of the above?
Just FYI, I don't like or love you, I dunno who the hell you are. Just suspicious I guess. Should you reply. Thanks.
Muffled
Posted by Larry Hoover on March 6, 2006, at 14:52:55
In reply to Re: Ethics, posted by Dr. Bob on March 6, 2006, at 14:17:05
> But I've also been thinking lately that some posters may feel it's unfair. I hold them to rules, but "can do whatever the f*ck I like" myself.
> Thanks,
>
> BobWhoa! I just about jolted out of my chair.
But you're right.
Lar
Posted by Toph on March 6, 2006, at 15:59:16
In reply to Babble » Dr. Bob, posted by muffled on March 6, 2006, at 14:39:48
>
> ***Dunno if you'll answer this, but when I first came on the boards you said only real short one liners, and were pretty much completely impersonal. Now you say alot more comparatively speaking, and are actually interacting with bablers on here. I just wondered why such a radical change? Is it to do with your studies? Personal? for better functioning of this site,? all of the above?
...
> Muffled
>It's been my observation that Bob has always engaged in a somewhat conversational style on Admin, Muffled. If he were to start hanging out on Social, now that would indicate something's up!
Posted by 838 on March 6, 2006, at 17:16:15
In reply to Re: Ethics, posted by Dr. Bob on March 6, 2006, at 14:17:05
> > He is god here.
> > And he asks us to trust him...
> It's a lot to ask, I know. For some people, it may be too much to ask.It can be a bit challenging... Especially when you consider we have no board of appeal or anything... Your verdict is final...
> But I've also been thinking lately that some posters may feel it's unfair. I hold them to rules, but "can do whatever the f*ck I like" myself.
Er yeah. There is something to that methinks.
> > IMO he is crazy anyways
> Um, please be sensitive to the feelings of others.Sorry. Didn't mean to offend anybody. I meant that kind of affectionately. Kind of... I'm crazy I know that lol. But yeah okay sorry bout that.
> But please also don't take this personally, this doesn't mean I don't like you or think you're a bad person.Though when you pass civility judgement then you decide that something was accusatory or hurtful or whatever. Thinking back to my block... I feel very offended that you interpreted my words in that way... To the best of my knowledge nobody else did. Or if they did... Surely a more mature way to handle things would have been for someone to say they felt hurt and give me the change to put things right... Two weeks. I think another block really would destroy me... And I don't say that to try and blackmail you into not blocking me. Really. It is just that I can't bear it. I can't. And I know other peoples have said similar before... And I'm coming around to their way of thinking I am. Too long. Blocks are too long. Especially for peoples who typically post (a lot) every single day. And hurt... That you interpreted my post that way too. Whatever happened to charity?
Posted by muffled on March 6, 2006, at 19:09:34
In reply to Re: Ethics » Dr. Bob, posted by 838 on March 6, 2006, at 17:16:15
Though when you pass civility judgement then you decide that something was accusatory or hurtful or whatever. Thinking back to my block... I feel very offended that you interpreted my words in that way... To the best of my knowledge nobody else did. Or if they did... Surely a more mature way to handle things would have been for someone to say they felt hurt and give me the change to put things right... Two weeks. I think another block really would destroy me... And I don't say that to try and blackmail you into not blocking me. Really. It is just that I can't bear it. I can't. And I know other peoples have said similar before... And I'm coming around to their way of thinking I am. Too long. Blocks are too long. Especially for peoples who typically post (a lot) every single day. And hurt... That you interpreted my post that way too. Whatever happened to charity?
***Thats it exactly, Dr.Bob, it REALLY hurts people. I dunno if you get just HOW MUCH. The 'punishment so way outweighs the crime. HUGELY.
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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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