![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 25 of 25. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Bellamarie79 on September 1, 2003, at 11:05:37
I just started Wellbutrin and so far I like it, next week i go to 300. I know it can help with weight loss--how long before that happens--anybody else have good experience with Wellbutrin?
Posted by Sebastian on September 1, 2003, at 18:43:14
In reply to Looking for good experiences with Wellbutrin, posted by Bellamarie79 on September 1, 2003, at 11:05:37
I take 300 mgs, love it. Helps me cut down on smoking, eat less, more energy, no problems sleeping. Works best if you space them out through the day. Shouldn't take long for it to kick in, ... I take the SR is that the one you take?
Posted by Quixote on September 2, 2003, at 4:29:15
In reply to Re: Looking for good experiences with Wellbutrin, posted by Sebastian on September 1, 2003, at 18:43:14
Has anyone ever had any loud ear ringing with Wellbutrin? Or with Lexapro? How about Lexapro and Adderall?
Please forgive this long detailed post, but i really sincerely ask for any help anyone can offer me.
I'm trying to figure out what exactly caused the terrible terrible )))>>SCREEEEEEEE<<((ing that often kept me from getting much benefit. Can't call it "ringing": it was that one note in fingernails down a chalkboard that makes you jump or cringe- except it was continuous. And LOUD. And got louder quickly, cumulatively. It made reading or sleeping near impossible, and became even louder than my usual car radio and tv volume setting.
My PMHNP just didn't seem to take it seriously, actually seeming annoyed that it bothered me so much,(as if it were only background department store music).
After an 'AOK' physical ear exam, my PMHNP said that "ear ringing" was a side-effect of Wellbutrin, discontinuing my dose of 150mgs(SR) without trying any alternative. 3 more months of ))>>screeeeing<<(( agony continued, but my PMHNP disregarded my description of it's intensity, also my suggestion that the "ear ringing" was from the Lexapro, insisting that i keep taking it. I began Adderall, then, for my ADD. It was a true godsend, it 'normalizes' me more than anytime in my life i've ever known. But the ))>>screeeeing<<(( continued and my requests for an alternative to Lexapro fell on 'deaf ears'. PMHNP suggested that it was the Adderall causing "ringing". It had become unbearable. So finally in desperation, i tapered off myself, and FINALLY the ))>screeeeing<(( has stopped. This seems to have made my PMHNP a little disgruntled. She's referred me out.Was the problem unique to _me_ , or has anyone else ever heard this kind of "ringing" ?
....i'm hoping someone will answer.
Quixote
Posted by HenryO on September 5, 2003, at 3:02:03
In reply to Ear Ringing HA! / Wellbutrin?Lexapro?Adderall?, posted by Quixote on September 2, 2003, at 4:29:15
The tinnitus is being caused by the Wellbutrin.
Posted by tealady on September 5, 2003, at 6:08:57
In reply to Ear Ringing HA! / Wellbutrin?Lexapro?Adderall?, posted by Quixote on September 2, 2003, at 4:29:15
I had this when on no meds for a couple of years. It increased in volume and pitch. I guess it means some level of something is out of whack..I wonder what it is. Anyone know?
Jan
Posted by HenryO on September 6, 2003, at 4:34:17
In reply to Re: Ear Ringing ..what is the cause?, posted by tealady on September 5, 2003, at 6:08:57
I know there are support groups for people with tinnitus. Maybe you can do a google search or two and get some info. When I had it I found it more than irritating.
Posted by tealady on September 7, 2003, at 7:59:02
In reply to Re: Ear Ringing ..what is the cause?, posted by HenryO on September 6, 2003, at 4:34:17
Thanks. Mine's gone now too thankfully. Hopefully Quixote may look in there.
I did have it for about 2 years, but it stopped around the time I started thyroid meds.
Yes, it is more than slightly annoying..very loud and mine had a direct relationship between pitch of sound and loudness... got louder with higher pitch as it intensified over time.
It is one of numerous symptoms of hypothyroidism, but that just means something in the brain/ear/canals must be out of whack.
I just wasn't sure if it was known what was altered by Wellbrutin to cause the tinnitus.Jan
Posted by EscherDementian on September 8, 2003, at 9:47:44
In reply to Re: Ear Ringing ..what is the cause?, posted by tealady on September 5, 2003, at 6:08:57
i've just learned that my ear ringing is caused by alcohol.<--this is only one pint or a glass of wine, nothing more or stronger. This ringing is new. i am still waiting for the occasional 'electric-head-zingies' from weaning off Lexapro to stop, however.
(The single glass of wine or beer has a completing/calming/wholeness effect, which is why i take it, when i feel edgy. i couldn't tolerate Wellbutrin because of the ear ringing).
Is there something that is shared by Wellbutrin and alcohol? Dopamine perhaps?
Posted by galkeepinon on September 9, 2003, at 20:49:23
In reply to Re: Ear Ringing HA! / Wellbutrin?Lexapro?Adderall?, posted by HenryO on September 5, 2003, at 3:02:03
I'm wondering about this!!!! I'm on week 6~just about to finish it up. My ear is ringing bad off and on. I'm getting a little worried.
Still on 10mg of Lex.> The tinnitus is being caused by the Wellbutrin.
Posted by tealady on September 9, 2003, at 21:28:33
In reply to Re: Ear Ringing ..what is the cause?, posted by EscherDementian on September 8, 2003, at 9:47:44
> i've just learned that my ear ringing is caused by alcohol.<--this is only one pint or a glass of wine, nothing more or stronger. This ringing is new. i am still waiting for the occasional 'electric-head-zingies' from weaning off Lexapro to stop, however.
>
> (The single glass of wine or beer has a completing/calming/wholeness effect, which is why i take it, when i feel edgy. >
Now you menton it a single stubbie of beer or glass of wine does the same for me..I wonder if that was the cause...I'm not getting the ear ringing now though and still get the same effect from the beer or wine.
I was looking back at some old posts on another forum and it seems for some reason the ear ringing just phased itself gradually out..it gradually lessened to a mild buzz and then stopped over time. I may had been on some meds back then(I remember trying Aurorix, Serzone, Zoloft all individually)..I'll have to see if I can find anything
Jan
Posted by EscherDementian on September 10, 2003, at 15:54:52
In reply to Re: Ear Ringing ..what is the cause?, posted by tealady on September 9, 2003, at 21:28:33
Thanx, Jan
i'll be watching to see what you found.Have since revised the thought that it is CAUSED by alcohol... rather the brain chem that alcohol and Wellbutrin have in common.
(Was not having my pint or glass back then when it was REAL bad, anyway)nnnnNNNNNNNNNNNnnnnggg- oh, that's the modem ;)
Escher
Posted by tealady on September 11, 2003, at 7:07:34
In reply to Re: Ear Ringing ..what is the cause? » tealady, posted by EscherDementian on September 10, 2003, at 15:54:52
Thinking on it, in my case I would have to say the ear ringing definitely was not related to alcohol intake..it was no different then, than now, when I have no ear ringing.
What was unusual about the time was a chronic lack of sleep..caused by a dog next door that barked almost nonstop.. for years. Still barks, but owner puts him inside at night and is now old and a bit hoarse(not enough!)..thank goodness. So I am unsure if a chronic lack of sleep could casue the ear ringing. At the time I just blamed the dog noise, so I don't know if a persistant loud noise could do it. That's what I put it down to at the time.I have since heard that many who are still hypothyroid and not yet optimised on their thyroid drugs have the exact same ear ringing, or had it before treatment. ..and I did have hypothryoid symptoms back then...
I went to my GP's today to see what notes he had..and guess what, forgot to ask about the ear ringing! What a surprise...sorry, I have this almost non existent short term memory
I did ask about some of my pmeds, but he didn't have a much more notes than me..he did remember the time I came in after I thought a car was speeding straight at side of my car, and then I started shaking ..that's when I gave up the pdrugs, but he hadn't noted it down, sigh.
I'm just trying to piece together things to see if I can form some pattern...
Jan
Posted by EscherDementian on September 11, 2003, at 12:31:05
In reply to Re: Ear Ringing ..what is the cause? » EscherDementian, posted by tealady on September 11, 2003, at 7:07:34
>I'm just trying to piece together things to see if I can form some pattern...
Do you find it frustrating that the pdoc isn't the one looking for a pattern when you ask "why" about a specific something?
i was frustrated when my PMHPN first simply quoted the side-effect profile of Wellbutrin. Then when it persisted well beyond discontinuing Wellbutrin, she shrugged my distress off as unimportant, rather than looking further into it, or for a pattern. It seemed to me to be very lazy on her part not to at least propose a few questions for me that might help her discover a reason.
Afterall, thats why they earn the bigbux$ isn't it? ;) Let's get some customer support here!
i'm going to have my thyroid checked, thank you for the suggestion. Many years ago i DID have hypothyroidism. Except that the ear ))>>screeing<<(( didn't exist then, and has since stopped now since being off Lexapro and Addderall too.
Know anything about a good liver cleanse making a difference while taking meds?Keep me posted if you discover a pattern or a reason for it-? Thanx!
Escher
P.S.
no one has yet offered up an answer re: what brain chem or bio reaction Wellbutrin & Alcohol have in common. -->Anyone?
Posted by galkeepinon on September 11, 2003, at 13:38:10
In reply to Re: Ear Ringing ..what is the cause? » tealady, posted by EscherDementian on September 11, 2003, at 12:31:05
>>>>what brain chem or bio reaction Wellbutrin & Alcohol have in common. -->Anyone?
Just a thought.......since Wellbutrin is a norepinepherine enhancer, classified as a dopamine-reuptake blocking compound, Wellbutrin has a chemical structure unrelated to any other antidepressant medication. Does this alcohol issue have the same result?
The only thing I can come up with is a viewpoint, in my opinon: Biologic psychiatrists as a whole are unapologetic in their view that they have found the road to the truth, namely that mental illnesses for the most part are genetic in origin and should be treated with biologic manipulations, like medications, ECT, and claims of biologic psychiatry are wildly overstated, unproved and essentially self-serving~the reality of treating patients, medications have profound limitations. I know that if the only tool I had in treatment was a prescription pad, I would be a poor psychiatrist. Good Luck~I'm positive someone has a better answer.
Larry?
Posted by EscherDementian on September 11, 2003, at 16:54:45
In reply to Re: Ear Ringing ..what is the cause? » EscherDementian, posted by galkeepinon on September 11, 2003, at 13:38:10
(ring is what bells do!!)
Thank you, galkeepinon, Ah-So! Your info does make a _good_ bit of sense to me.
i've learned much since posting my first time. It sends me a little more equipped for assisting my process with a new pdoc. And thank you, too, for the info that Wellbutrin is a norepinephrine ENHANCER, and dopamine re-uptake BLOCKING compound, AND a structure unrelated to other antidepressants. The below-mentioned PMHNP wouldn't try an alternative. Told me that it was DOPAMINE causing the ear "ringing". And therefore the Adderall, too. i am here at home *sighing* with incredible gratitude to you for the sensibility this corrected information makes for me. *deep-sigh!*
Your re-proposed question about the alcohol issue- all i can add is that i am not a regular or heavy drinker; occasional pint of microbrew, often have my glass of wine with mineral water, no hard liquor at all. i was not drinking when all this was occurring, it didn't appeal to me. Since having medication discontinued, though, i find i have again begun to crave a beer or glass of red wine for calming effect.
Now that i think of it, never before was the _same_ LOUD ))>screeeing<(( that is mentioned below, nor has it returned since absence of the med combo i was taking.
--->Escher
Wants to officially change the terminology in psych documentation from "ringing" to "screeeing".
And is thinking about writing Webster's. ;)
.
.
.
First post: (sorry everyone-)
>>I'm trying to figure out what exactly caused the terrible terrible )))>>SCREEEEEEEE<<((ing that often kept me from getting much benefit. Can't call it "ringing": it was that one note in fingernails down a chalkboard that makes you jump or cringe- except it was continuous. And LOUD. And got louder quickly, cumulatively. It made reading or sleeping near impossible, and became even louder than my usual car radio and tv volume setting.
>
>My PMHNP just didn't seem to take it seriously, actually seeming annoyed that it bothered me so much,(as if it were only background department store music).
After an 'AOK' physical ear exam, my PMHNP said that "ear ringing" was a side-effect of Wellbutrin, discontinuing my dose of 150mgs(SR) without trying any alternative. 3 more months of ))>>screeeeing<<(( agony continued, but my PMHNP disregarded my description of it's intensity, also my suggestion that the "ear ringing" was from the Lexapro, insisting that i keep taking it. I began Adderall, then, for my ADD. It was a true godsend, it 'normalizes' me more than anytime in my life i've ever known. But the ))>>screeeeing<<(( continued and my requests for an alternative to Lexapro fell on 'deaf ears'. PMHNP suggested that it was the Adderall causing "ringing". It had become unbearable. So finally in desperation, i tapered off myself, and FINALLY the ))>screeeeing<(( has stopped. This seems to have made my PMHNP a little disgruntled. She's referred me out.
>
>Was the problem unique to _me_ , or has anyone else ever heard this kind of "ringing" ?
....i'm hoping someone will answer.
>
>Quixote
>
Posted by tealady on September 11, 2003, at 22:43:09
In reply to Re: Ear Ringing ..what is the cause? » tealady, posted by EscherDementian on September 11, 2003, at 12:31:05
sorry, I got lost somewhere, Do you thik it was the Lexapro? causing this scrreeeeing. As it stopped did yours fade out..like reduce in volume and turn into a buzz before disappearing completely? Like the levels of something were drpping or rising gradually?
My ear scrreeeeing was when I was trialling different pdrugs..not sure which ones though. I do have a list of ones I tried. I wasn't on any that you have tried, but I may have been on ones with similar effects/pathways.
If you do have any thoughts on what is was, please let me know
Jan
Posted by EscherDementian on September 12, 2003, at 16:12:02
In reply to Ear scrreeeeeing, posted by tealady on September 11, 2003, at 22:43:09
It reduced in volume/level, after first quitting the Wellbutrin (still taking Lexapro), but not until later quitting the Lexapro for a week(cold turkey sudden stop once to test) did it really honestly start reducing.
There was a period of a week&1/2 or so then i was taking Adderall ONLY and i was fine. No screeeing at all. Maybe soft ring'buzzing'(?), ?_maybe_?, but not disruptively noticeable.When the depression rollercoaster & head 'zaps' made Lexapro withdrawals terrifying & painful i went back on it and painful scrEEEEeeing returned. Reduced the dose immediately from 20mgs->10mgs. Still screEEeing disruptively, but volume reduced.
After two weeks (and no alternative from PMHNP, who STILL negated my distress & insisted i stick with Lexapro but toiletflush remaining ADDerall), i halfed Lexapro dose again to 5mgs, only raising to 10mgs one or two times when the 'zaps' got real bad. If discontinuing ADDerall made any difference at all in volume/level, i couldn't have noticed: without Adderall i was miserably distracted by the continuous 'fingernail on chalkboard' effect.A couple weeks later, noticeable screeeing toned down to buzz to gone. UNTIL i made the mistake of drinking 12oz of microbrew (6%alcohol by volume) to try to calm down. SCUHREEEEEEEE!!! Yow! no more beer for me! Screeeing for the rest of the eve, then silence again waking the up the next morning. But in as much fatigue and depression as ever before - there's no benefit for me from Lexapro at this low dose.
Days later ran out of Lexapro altogether. Wretched withdrawal side-effects began in a few days, but no screeeing. Found 3 day's ADDerall in my camping gear and gratefully had 3 day's relieved return to calm 'normalized' thinking; no screeeing resulted.
A week later, drank 2 glasses of microbrew at a b-b-q: >scuhREEEEEEEEE!!!< and the little Lexapro withdrawal'zaps' were now intensified. (i know, i know, no more beer!) ...but i know it's not that alone. Seems to be Lexapro residual IN COMBINATION. (like you too?)Wow, tealady, please forgive my lengthy detailed reply. Hope these blisters on my keypad aren't for naught :P What do you think? Or ANYBODY generous enough to share an insight or chemical explanation to this Spherical Riddle,
i'd Mobius Spiral and Metamorphose in gratitude,
Escher
Posted by tealady on September 13, 2003, at 8:00:14
In reply to Re: Ear scrreeeeeing » tealady, posted by EscherDementian on September 12, 2003, at 16:12:02
Well this is beyond my capabilites, so I'm hoping some one will jump right in and correct me, but here goes ..for a guess
I looked up http://sl.schofield3.home.att.net/medicine/psychiatric_drugs_chart.html ..I got this reference from a post on this site
then I cut out all drugs that you or I have taken and put them together here
http://www.geocities.com/jan55qld/pdrugs.xls
The problem is , I am not sure and have no notes..and nor has my DOC!!! on when I got the ear ringing.
I'm assuming in late 98 and 99 is te period of the ear schreeeing, although I have always heard "high pitched motor type" noises..like the fridge nw I think of it and others cant..but that is a definite noise..
If so, I was "probably" on Lovan, an SSRI.., which has the same 5-HT reuptake inhibition +++ (which would mean strong level of) as your Lexapro....
So assuming this is right..
> It reduced in volume/level, after first quitting the Wellbutrin (still taking Lexapro), but not until later quitting the Lexapro for a week(cold turkey sudden stop once to test) did it really honestly start reducing.
>
> There was a period of a week&1/2 or so then i was taking Adderall ONLY and i was fine. No screeeing at all. Maybe soft ring'buzzing'(?), ?_maybe_?, but not disruptively noticeable.
>
> When the depression rollercoaster & head 'zaps' made Lexapro withdrawals terrifying & painful i went back on it and painful scrEEEEeeing returned. Reduced the dose immediately from 20mgs->10mgs. Still screEEeing disruptively, but volume reduced.
>
> After two weeks (and no alternative from PMHNP, who STILL negated my distress & insisted i stick with Lexapro but toiletflush remaining ADDerall), i halfed Lexapro dose again to 5mgs, only raising to 10mgs one or two times when the 'zaps' got real bad. If discontinuing ADDerall made any difference at all in volume/level, i couldn't have noticed: without Adderall i was miserably distracted by the continuous 'fingernail on chalkboard' effect.
>
> A couple weeks later, noticeable screeeing toned down to buzz to gone. UNTIL i made the mistake of drinking 12oz of microbrew (6%alcohol by volume) to try to calm down. SCUHREEEEEEEE!!! Yow! no more beer for me! Screeeing for the rest of the eve, then silence again waking the up the next morning. But in as much fatigue and depression as ever before - there's no benefit for me from Lexapro at this low dose.
>
> A week later, drank 2 glasses of microbrew at a b-b-q: >scuhREEEEEEEEE!!!< and the little Lexapro withdrawal'zaps' were now intensified. (i know, i know, no more beer!) ...but i know it's not that alone. Seems to be Lexapro residual IN COMBINATION. (like you too?)I didn't pay attention to whether it increased when I was drinkng or not.. I was assuming it was lack of sleep or noise causing it. It doesn't help when you mention it to your doc and it is glossed over, so in those days, I didn't realise it was related.
I definitely haven't had it since starting on T4/T3, and I don't get it with the tyrosine with the T3/T4..even with alcohol and lots of tyramines..Also I have my doubts about the chart I copied from, pretty sure it leaves lots out!
eg. I do think T3 affects acetylcholinerase..the enzyme that clears AcH from the synapses I think.. and don't ask me how that fits in... must do other things too that are not in that spreadsheet..or not known yet. I'm pretty certain T3 also affects serotonin....and That's not on the chart either..so it can't be relied on that much I guess.
If a lot of people had responded they took similar drugs and had the same symptoms..we'd have an answer...but it looks like it must be a combo, perhaps of having slightly lower than optimal thyroid function AND one of the drugs or alcohol and/or some stress?
In the meantime, what you just described is identical to what I had...it is nice to know that someone else in the world actually had the same thing, is it not?..not that I really want to wish it on anyone else ..but far better to know their is a cause, would be even better if one could pinpoint it
.
It is quite common amongst hypothyroid people, at least quite a no. responded that they had it and it went away with thyroid meds..perhaps that is also a link. I was not typical hypothyroid , but more borderline..so I would say sub-optimal and feeling symptoms, even if not reflected much in blood tests. I'm thinking you may be similar.
What I guess is it may be that for folks who are sub-optimal in thyroid function, then a strong 5-HT reuptake inhibitor could cause this? even maybe specifically a 5ht2c antagonist?
http://www.bentham.org/sample-issues/cmc9-8/spinks/spinks-ms.htm
I really don't know , but right now I am smiling that I ripped up my script for citalopram that endo gave me...this is what I want to find out..what one needs and what one should avoid.
BTW, do you have really good hearing usually? ..like acute hearing that can eavesdrop on conversations rooms away..or think the TV is too loud etc? That is a good sign of high serotonin..which one of the pathways I have no idea of.
Sorry, no much help, but I get lost with this stuff at presenT, so thoughts welcomed!
Just wanted you to know I was thinking on it
Jan
Posted by EscherDementian on September 14, 2003, at 13:06:23
In reply to Re: Ear scrreeeeeing, posted by tealady on September 13, 2003, at 8:00:14
Tealady, you are awesome, thank your for shared thoughts and research... Yes, it is nice to know that someone else in the world actually has the same thing <<relieved sigh>> and i agree:
>..but far better to know their is a cause, would be even better if one could pinpoint it.
>...this is what I want to find out..what one needs and what one should avoid.
Collectively rubbing our braincells together we're sure to get a spark!I'll be looking into the things you've suggested, and http://www.geocities.com/jan55qld/pdrugs.xls
(Thank you!) right after i conclude this post, and share what i find out (if anything) after my appt with a new pdoc. Am going to request some 'state of the union' tests for my thyroid, liver, etc. and everything else this new pdoc thinks might be pertinent. Going to ask pdoc to test for even far-reaching possible influences (challenge my med.insurance! YaH!) and i'll put what i learn out there for you, too.A few things you said "rang a bell"(sorry :P) for me, too:
Acetylcholinerase >))BONNGGggg(((<< may be an issue for me- isn't it produced in the liver? i have a pre-existing (but not alcohol caused)liver challenge. And seratonin *definately* lowers as AcH begins getting processed, i think (ergo the 'can't stop once get started' syndrome for some people, maybe?). ~Going to look into T3 (T3/T4), thank you.
Somewhere else in my notes i vaguely remember a mention of tyrosine, too. How do *you* take it?Lack of sleep and noise >)))BONNGGggg(((<< ... LOL, i, too went through a barking dogs/no sleep issue (do we live in the same neighborhood?!?), but it had been resolved before the meds and screeeeing. My lack of sleep was actually from torqued up long term anxiety PTS/depression/daytime sleep. But maybe that's still the same: 6/one=Half12/other...? About those fridge noises(!):
>I have always heard "high pitched motor type" noises..like the fridge nw I think of it and others cant..but that is a definite noise..
No, i don't seem to have *particularly* good hearing, but i HAVE always heard the 'fridge-noises', too! i've always called it "hearing the electricity on" as proven in silhouette each time we've had our annual PGE blackouts (i live in a forested area with decent storms and winds once a year).
Is good hearing really a sign of high Seratonin??? That throws a monkeywrench in the works about my thought that i was *low* seratonin. maybe-?Yet then again,>))BONNGGGgggg(((<<<< what you pondered re a strong 5-HT reuptake inhibiter (Lexapro @ 5-HT+++) OR specifically a 5ht2c antagonist possibly affecting someone sub-optimal in thyroid function in this way, definately bears looking into for me too. When i was hypothyroid, i was borderline in blood tests, and not typical. However, i was taken off the med (synthroid <-sp?) later, when my bloodtests no longer reflected that level.
i'll look at
http://www.bentham.org/sample-issues/cmc9-8/spinks/spinks-ms.htm
thanx again.Okay here's one for you~ what's your exercise or sunlight exposure like at these times? i was unable to take any daylight walking (-am not much of a schwarzenegger by any means, anyway. More like a (female version) Louis in Interview with a Vampire, sans eating rats ;)!) but i wonder if the lack of outdoor activities/sunlight that was going on then also had a part to play? Hmmm....no, now that i remember, it didn't matter. Activity/no activity, when i tried to read or sleep, the screeeing made it impossible to do either.
Heck, How about your bloodtype/diet correspondences while we're at it!? Ever read (about the link between blood type, bio-origins and diet/disease ):
"Eat Right 4 Your Type" (i know, corny title. Subtitle: 4 blood types, etc.)
i found fascinating information and experienced amazing results for my own blood type A- ....except since being 'pschyco-quixote', i couldn't keep a responsable nutrition intake if my sanity depended on it. Oh! maybe it did ;)~>>whew<<~
'till next,
EscherDementian
thinks making sound effects with typed font is a ^HOOT^(gosh, i'm sorry. SOMEBODY PLEASE pass the ADDerall?)
Posted by tealady on September 15, 2003, at 5:57:48
In reply to Re: Ear scrreeeeeing » tealady, posted by EscherDementian on September 14, 2003, at 13:06:23
> Tealady, you are awesome, thank your for shared thoughts and research... Yes, it is nice to know that someone else in the world actually has the same thing <<relieved sigh>> and i agree:
If you want to see some more folks with the same or similar have a read of these threads
http://forums.about.com/ab-thyroid/messages?msg=25672.1 Hissing in ears
http://forums.about.com/ab-thyroid/messages?msg=29148.1 ANOTHER "EAR RINGING" QUESTION
http://forums.about.com/ab-thyroid/messages?msg=45324.7http://forums.about.com/ab-thyroid/messages?msg=29013.1 Ringing and floating
Tinnitus anyone http://forums.about.com/ab-thyroid/messages?msg=28222.1
http://forums.about.com/ab-thyroid/messages?msg=39470.20
> >..but far better to know their is a cause, would be even better if one could pinpoint it.
> >...this is what I want to find out..what one needs and what one should avoid.
>
> Collectively rubbing our braincells together we're sure to get a spark!Maybe not..I've reached my brain cell limit<g>
> i find out (if anything) after my appt with a new pdoc.Now with his brain cells too.....more hope
> Am going to request some 'state of the union' tests for my thyroid, liver, etc. and everything else this new pdoc thinks might be pertinent.OK make sure you get TSH, FT4,TPO antibodies and liver function tests at the minimum!
You could add FT3 and TSI, TBII if your moods/energy goes up and down.
If female? add ferritin and if also over 35 add day 14 of cycle(meaning 14 days before next period starts) estradiol...
and whatever else the doc wants to run...probably the most important would be antiTPO (or anti microsomal antibodies instead or as well as), and the next most most important would be TSH. You have to get these at least.
And don't take "normal" as answers..get copies of your bloodwork ,you are legally entitled to a copy...and let me know what your results are.
TSH over 1.5 is iffy, over 2 need tyrosine at least! Antibodies can mean normal thyroids with normal hormone output still don't reach the receptors in normal amounts, so your body functions hypothyroid...
Also a good sign of hypothyroid is if your temperature under your arm are usually lower than 97.5? Try taking them when you awake in the morning and a couple of times during the day..when relaxing or on the computer, not after exercise
Oh ya, best to make your appointment for the blood tests first up in the morning and fast beforehand..or as early in the morning as possible and don't eat any sugars, carbohydrates at least before the test..due to TSH circadian rhythm and the why sugars may effect the TSH..and definitely no pdrugs/vits beforehand..fasting is best. Also best to take no iron, vitc or fish oil etc for 3 days before tests if testing ferritin. Ferritin is a biggy with females who are hypothyroid..or inclined a bit that way.Going to ask pdoc to test for even far-reaching possible influences (challenge my med.insurance! YaH!) and i'll put what i learn out there for you, too.
>
> A few things you said "rang a bell"(sorry :P) for me, too:
> Acetylcholinerase >))BONNGGggg(((<< may be an issue for me- isn't it produced in the liver? i have a pre-existing (but not alcohol caused)liver challenge. And seratonin *definately* lowers as AcH begins getting processed, i think (ergo the 'can't stop once get started' syndrome for some people, maybe?). ~Going to look into T3 (T3/T4), thank you.
Well I think AcH is in all body cells/neurons..normally, so anything that effects it ihas to be a biggy..and it probably works in with serotonin and everything else too. Not sure if science knows a lot about it...obviously more than I know <g>> Somewhere else in my notes i vaguely remember a mention of tyrosine, too. How do *you* take it?
>Well if you are going for blood test, don't start on it until after the tests as it will increase your thyroid output
If male, take between 1000mg and 2000mg when first get out of bed before meals..preferably an hour before many protein
If female, 500mg first thing in morning..or after lunch as this is when estrogen levels are highest, debatable. I take 500mg in the morning on waking at present. I have tred 2000mg..too much.
Females. I have just found out, don't need as much tyrosine as males.> Lack of sleep and noise >)))BONNGGggg(((<< ... LOL, i, too went through a barking dogs/no sleep issue (do we live in the same neighborhood?!?),
lol
>but it had been resolved before the meds and screeeeing. My lack of sleep was actually from torqued up long term anxietyyes, I have that anxiety too
>TS/depression/daytime sleep. But maybe that's still the same: 6/one=Half12/other...? About those fridge noises(!):
> >I have always heard "high pitched motor type" noises..like the fridge nw I think of it and others cant..but that is a definite noise..
> No, i don't seem to have *particularly* good hearing, but i HAVE always heard the 'fridge-noises', too! i've always called it "hearing the electricity on" as proven in silhouette each time we've had our annual PGE blackouts (i live in a forested area with decent storms and winds once a year).actually I always called them electrical noises too...I really hate my computer,some electric lights even, but the fridge is the pits! I don't hear it now on thyroid meds, hmm and lights don't really bother me any more either...what a reason to take thyroid meds! Maybe I sleep sounder?
> Is good hearing really a sign of high Seratonin??? That throws a monkeywrench in the works about my thought that i was *low* seratonin. maybe-?
I was just testing ya!! I had always thought I was low on serontonin too..but I wondered! I really have no idea though.
But normal speech hearing, like thinking the TV is on too loud is a sign of high serotonin. Also you are usually higher in morning than in evening, so some folks need to turn TV up in morning and down at night.I gave McPac a link to some serontonin posts I searched for
>
> Yet then again,>))BONNGGGgggg(((<<<< what you pondered re a strong 5-HT reuptake inhibiter (Lexapro @ 5-HT+++) OR specifically a 5ht2c antagonist possibly affecting someone sub-optimal in thyroid function in this way, definitely bears looking into for me too.Well this kinda reads that they LOWER this 5HT2c..an antagonist. So low levels to start with ..and they lower it? If only knew what a 5HT2c does..like is it reponsible for fridge noises?...imagine asking a doc that!Ha, ...He'd think I had other problems in my head, <g>
When I was hypothyroid, I was borderline in blood tests, and not typical. However, i was taken off the med (synthroid <-sp?) later, when my bloodtests no longer reflected that level.
>
> i'll look at
> http://www.bentham.org/sample-issues/cmc9-8/spinks/spinks-ms.htm
> thanx again.
>
> Okay here's one for you~ what's your exercise or sunlight exposure like at these times?at present, rotten ..going to start exercising tomorrow!
i was unable to take any daylight walking (-am not much of a schwarzenegger by any means, anyway. More like a (female version) Louis in Interview with a Vampire, sans eating rats ;)!)well I haven'rt seen that one so still don't know what you look like <g>
but i wonder if the lack of outdoor activities/sunlight that was going on then also had a part to play? Hmmm....no, now that i remember, it didn't matter. Activity/no activity, when i tried to read or sleep, the screeeing made it impossible to do either.
Nah, don't think so. I was surprsingly trying to exercise dalily back then! or most of the time , amnd there was no difference due to exercise level
> Heck, How about your bloodtype/diet correspondences while we're at it!? Ever read (about the link between blood type, bio-origins and diet/disease ):
> "Eat Right 4 Your Type" (i know, corny title. Subtitle: 4 blood types, etc.)
> i found fascinating information and experienced amazing results for my own blood type A-I'm blood type A too!!!!
....except since being 'pschyco-quixote', i couldn't keep a responsable nutrition intake if my sanity depended on it. Oh! maybe it did ;)
I did look at it once I think ,,or some diet on blood type, and I didn't like the foods!
>
> ~>>whew<<~
> 'till next,
> EscherDementian
> thinks making sound effects with typed font is a ^HOOT^
>
> (gosh, i'm sorry. SOMEBODY PLEASE pass the ADDerall?)
>
Jan
Posted by tealady on September 15, 2003, at 7:48:57
In reply to Re: Ear scrreeeeeing » EscherDementian, posted by tealady on September 15, 2003, at 5:57:48
Forgot to say. The Thyroid meds have not been easy to take, and are not a complete answer for me..and very hard to withdraw from for most, so unless you do have physical hypothyroid symptoms that you need to correct or blood tests that indicate a need, I would be inclined to try the tyrosine first. Also the thyroid meds may increase your anxiety..they did with me. Thyroid meds "tax" already stressed out adrenals.
Perhaps you may just need tyrosine to help cope with an SSRI and not get the ear schreeeeing? Or an anti anxiety med..up to your doc and you of course.
Knowing what I know now, I would have tried that route first...but get the tests if you can..like I said at least the TPO antibodies(or anti microsomal) and TSH. That will at least let you know where you stand.
Also thinking about it, my ear ringing stopped about the time I stopped taking antiD's too, only I'm not completely certain which ones as it occurred between 1997 ands 2000..and doc and me didn't keep notes.All I can go by is the dates I got the tablets filled at the chemists and a guess.
Twin?
Posted by EscherDementian on September 15, 2003, at 13:11:42
In reply to Re: Ear scrreeeeeing, posted by tealady on September 15, 2003, at 7:48:57
Reading, Reading, Reading... (sung to the tune of "Rawhide!")
=8^0 <--singing face with eyeglasses ?
>If only knew what a 5HT2c does..like is it reponsible for fridge noises?...imagine asking a doc that!Ha, ...He'd think I had other problems in my head, <g>
>LOL --Been there Done that Stained the t-shirt...
Hey, what a great topic for a thesis: Brain Cells Responsible for Fridge Noises.
ooops, gotta go- need to endpost and run (pdoc apptmt). i'll post anyway. Sorry only silliness here- will finish later- seriously!Escher
Is seeing double?
Posted by tealady on September 16, 2003, at 21:23:14
In reply to Ear Ringing HA! / Wellbutrin?Lexapro?Adderall?, posted by Quixote on September 2, 2003, at 4:29:15
PMHNP said that "ear ringing" was a side-effect of Wellbutrin, discontinuing my dose of 150mgs(SR) without trying any alternative. 3 more months of ))>>screeeeing<<(( agony continued, but my PMHNP disregarded my description of it's intensity, also my suggestion that the "ear ringing" was from the Lexapro, insisting that i keep taking it. I began Adderall, then, for my ADD. It was a true godsend, it 'normalizes' me more than anytime in my life i've ever known. But the ))>>screeeeing<<(( continued and my requests for an alternative to Lexapro fell on 'deaf ears'. PMHNP suggested that it was the Adderall causing "ringing". It had become unbearable. So finally in desperation, i tapered off myself, and FINALLY the ))>screeeeing<(( has stopped. This seems to have made my PMHNP a little disgruntled. She's referred me out.
Hi Quixote,
You were on the same meds as Escher...same person, different handles..or a coincidence?If you are different...are you saying it was the Lexapro you tapered off and the ear schreeeing quit?
This is the one under suspicion..
Jan
Posted by EscherDementian on September 28, 2003, at 7:38:21
In reply to Re: Ear Ringing HA! / Wellbutrin?Lexapro?Adderall? » Quixote, posted by tealady on September 16, 2003, at 21:23:14
Hi Tealady!
Yes, Quixote is me the first time i ever posted.
i let everyone know when i changed, but these boards move so quickly.i haven't been on in a week. Shall we pick up the ear screeeing mystery where we left off? (i have another monkeywrench to work with now)
Taking Zoloft and Adderall. Much higher dose of Adderall this time. No screeeeing. Upped the dose of Zoloft to 100mgs. And Guess What!?Uh-huh. That's right.
Want to know what i think NOW ?
Escher
Hears mistery calling.
Sound advice: It will probably keep ringing until it is answered.
Posted by tealady on September 28, 2003, at 8:57:52
In reply to Re: Ear Ringing HA! / Wellbutrin?Lexapro?Adderall? » tealady, posted by EscherDementian on September 28, 2003, at 7:38:21
> Hi Tealady!
>
> Yes, Quixote is me the first time i ever posted.
> i let everyone know when i changed, but these boards move so quickly.Ya, I found out. I'm new here, so I didn't know..but last week I come across your posts.
Guess that answers why it's best to keep one name, lol. It gets confusing if one thinks there may be someone else about who has similar symptoms. And as you say..the boards move quickly..and members change too>
> i haven't been on in a week. Shall we pick up the ear screeeing mystery where we left off? (i have another monkeywrench to work with now)
> Taking Zoloft and Adderall. Much higher dose of Adderall this time. No screeeeing. Upped the dose of Zoloft to 100mgs. And Guess What!?
>
> Uh-huh. That's right.
>
> Want to know what i think NOW ?sure do
>
PS. appreciate the Mars help(that was a goodie even if off by a day or two), but I worked out it was the dental anestheticJan
This is the end of the thread.
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