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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 9 of 9. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by femlite on January 3, 2004, at 7:36:37
Hi All,
Its been so long since Ive posted (or even lurked)wasnt sure my password was still good :)
Ive been that depressed. The 4th Pssychiatrist has been tried and left.
The WB wasnt working as well as before (after 4 months) but when he took me off it I plummitted. He wanted me to use Lamictal as a monotherapy for BP. The titration period was way to long to keep me afloat.
I had some Adderall the last Pdoc prescribed. (It didnt seem to agree with me back then) Out of desperation (that pit was so dark and deep) I decided to giv the Adderall another try, I was so far down what could it hurt to experiment? For two days I felt like a human being again. (two pills was all I had left of a 5 pill trial scrip). By the time my next pdoc visti rolled around I was really stressed as I knew this doc would not go for an Adderall solution to my life dilema. I started crying from the moment got there. Of course "he" considered that evidence that I was too "unstable" to take a stimulant. The idea that a woman might cry when faced with the fore knowledge that the person sitting in front of her, she will be required to beg from to have her life back, and be told NO, didnt cross his mind.
I vowed to never see another pdoc that day. My husband suggested I give a few days (he knows me pretty well) So Ive called another.
Its a week away and the anxiety is starting to bite at me like an annoying insect. And Im afraid it will get worse each day.
Questions fill my mind. What do I say? Im doctor shopping and the last 4 didnt pan out. And worse, I want to try a stimulant and see if I can get my life back on track?
I believe psych patients are seen as guilty till what....? as soon as they sit in that chair. Docs are human, hardness of heart is something all docs have to strugle with.
I feel so hopeless. If i keep searching will I will labled, branded? This is a small town.
Ive posted this on the psych board as well, but I feel that what Im looking for is emotional support as well.
I know some here have gone to far more than 4 pdocs in their search for the "right fit".
I sometimes feel more "disorderd" at the doctors office than any where. I cant seem to represent myself and now I feel like a criminal which makes it even harder.
I know in my heart that I am truly interested in doing what is good for me. I may be willing to experiment to get there. But in the end I know when to stop the experiment and move on. I just wish someone,a doctor, had that kind of faith in me as well. But I dont see having faith in your fellowing human beings as intrinsic to pdoc thinking. Thanks for listening
Posted by Karen_kay on January 3, 2004, at 22:18:56
In reply to Criminal or desperated, is it the same?, posted by femlite on January 3, 2004, at 7:36:37
Hello. It is so very hard. I have the same dx you do. Though I've only had 2 Pdoc's. I switched to the second after the first put me on Lamictal starting at 100 mgs when I asked him several times if the dosage was too high and he reassured me it wasn't. So, I took it and a few months later (I didn't get the rash luckily, but I was severly depressed and wished I would get it :(, I told him he started me high. He was shocked! But, I ended up switching when I changed therapists and groups altogether. My new Pdoc once accused me (not to my face but in a meeting when my therapist was present) of trying to get klonopin to "get a buzz". He also accused me of "coercing my therapist into believing I was manic" when I was actually suffering from antipsychotic enduced akathesia. Now, you tell me how I could talk my therapist into believing I was manic when I had akathesia? I told him I think I'm manic. I was in his office pacing, straightening bookshelves, talking nonstop, ect. He made me make an emergency apt. with my Pdoc. But, I didn't "coerce" him. BS! But, after that, I just have to accomodate my Pdoc. If I have anxiety, I don't ask for antianxiety meds. I actually stopped them without his knowledge, and told him months later (HA! So much for being a Drug abuser!!) I also keep accurate notes of any and all side effects for any meds I take. Now, we don't have any problems. I just suspect he gets quite a few drug abusers in his office and I told his in a straight forward manner that I know klonopin works and that's what I want. He took it the wrong way. I suppose I could see why now. But, he gave me the script and didn't hesitate for a second. That's what bothers me....
I told you that because we ALL have run-ins with our Pdoc's from time to time. That is bound to happen. It can't always be a cake walk. They have off days, and we have off days. But, do you have any friends (or family members) who see Pdocs? Could you get suggestions? You said you live in a small town. Does it bother you that people in town know that you are seeing a Pdoc? If that is the case, is there a larger city that you would be willing to drive to. There would be a larger selection as well. Also, is insurance an issue? As well as therapy. My therapist and Pdoc is in the same building so that makes it rather convinient. I can schedule appointments together so I don't have to make two trips. Also, I can complain to my therapist about my Pdoc and vice versa :) (And that happens frequently!!!! I just hope they don't do the same :( I just thought of that.....
It is hard to find a Pdoc you like. I don't really care that much about finding one I like. I didn't care much for him when I first met him. In fact, I really disliked him! But, after the first few visits, I typically only meet with him for 20 minutes every month, but now he talks a lot so he only charges me for 20 minutes and he talks between 45 minutes to an hour. But, since I've started coming "prepared" he seems to like me a lot more and I'm quite fond of him as well. So, my best suggestion is to give it some time. My Pdoc got me on a med, by my suggestion, that has me feeling the best I've ever felt in my life! And he doesn't understand how it works by itself but it does. I think any other Pdoc would have said no, or would have put me with an add on at least. So, mine listens. Something I didn't think he did in the beginning. Try a new one and just give the relationship some time to grow. It's like a friendship of sorts (strange way to think of it, I know!!)
Posted by femlite on January 4, 2004, at 9:48:10
In reply to Re: Criminal or desperated, is it the same?, posted by Karen_kay on January 3, 2004, at 22:18:56
Thanks Karen for writig.
Im glad you have the med you need I believe may be BP but Im also PSTD and possibly ADD. I have the added complication of chronic pelvic and back pain. Things seem so complicated.
When I tried the Lamictal, we were only able to go up 5 mg every 2 weeks, starting at 12mg. I was in bed most of the month. I hve children at home. I couldnt go on like that. It would have been 3 months before we would get even close to a therapuetic level.
I was with this pdoc 6 vists. longer than any other.
No I couldnt ask around. But my GP has made a coulple of the refferals.
Iknow it will take time, but I feel very humiliated when I feel a desperate need to be able to function, (even if that means manic at the moment) an that know one cares. He even muttered something under his breath about "if you were a student..." implying that the need to study is What?... more valuable than taking care of my family. And I am a STUDENT! Which I told him. I take on line courses at a state university. Im soooo behind.
I felt like he thought I was untrustworty or he just didnt give a dam*. He escorted me out and there seemed no way to make it work. We were not communicating very well.
Im happy to hear your situaton is working out. It is encourging to hear.
By the way what is akathesia?
> Hello. It is so very hard. I have the same dx you do. Though I've only had 2 Pdoc's. I switched to the second after the first put me on Lamictal starting at 100 mgs when I asked him several times if the dosage was too high and he reassured me it wasn't. So, I took it and a few months later (I didn't get the rash luckily, but I was severly depressed and wished I would get it :(, I told him he started me high. He was shocked! But, I ended up switching when I changed therapists and groups altogether. My new Pdoc once accused me (not to my face but in a meeting when my therapist was present) of trying to get klonopin to "get a buzz". He also accused me of "coercing my therapist into believing I was manic" when I was actually suffering from antipsychotic enduced akathesia. Now, you tell me how I could talk my therapist into believing I was manic when I had akathesia? I told him I think I'm manic. I was in his office pacing, straightening bookshelves, talking nonstop, ect. He made me make an emergency apt. with my Pdoc. But, I didn't "coerce" him. BS! But, after that, I just have to accomodate my Pdoc. If I have anxiety, I don't ask for antianxiety meds. I actually stopped them without his knowledge, and told him months later (HA! So much for being a Drug abuser!!) I also keep accurate notes of any and all side effects for any meds I take. Now, we don't have any problems. I just suspect he gets quite a few drug abusers in his office and I told his in a straight forward manner that I know klonopin works and that's what I want. He took it the wrong way. I suppose I could see why now. But, he gave me the script and didn't hesitate for a second. That's what bothers me....
>
> I told you that because we ALL have run-ins with our Pdoc's from time to time. That is bound to happen. It can't always be a cake walk. They have off days, and we have off days. But, do you have any friends (or family members) who see Pdocs? Could you get suggestions? You said you live in a small town. Does it bother you that people in town know that you are seeing a Pdoc? If that is the case, is there a larger city that you would be willing to drive to. There would be a larger selection as well. Also, is insurance an issue? As well as therapy. My therapist and Pdoc is in the same building so that makes it rather convinient. I can schedule appointments together so I don't have to make two trips. Also, I can complain to my therapist about my Pdoc and vice versa :) (And that happens frequently!!!! I just hope they don't do the same :( I just thought of that.....
>
> It is hard to find a Pdoc you like. I don't really care that much about finding one I like. I didn't care much for him when I first met him. In fact, I really disliked him! But, after the first few visits, I typically only meet with him for 20 minutes every month, but now he talks a lot so he only charges me for 20 minutes and he talks between 45 minutes to an hour. But, since I've started coming "prepared" he seems to like me a lot more and I'm quite fond of him as well. So, my best suggestion is to give it some time. My Pdoc got me on a med, by my suggestion, that has me feeling the best I've ever felt in my life! And he doesn't understand how it works by itself but it does. I think any other Pdoc would have said no, or would have put me with an add on at least. So, mine listens. Something I didn't think he did in the beginning. Try a new one and just give the relationship some time to grow. It's like a friendship of sorts (strange way to think of it, I know!!)
Posted by Larry Hoover on January 4, 2004, at 10:04:15
In reply to Criminal or desperated, is it the same?, posted by femlite on January 3, 2004, at 7:36:37
About the Adderall....you really want to try it again, yes?
Why don't you plan ahead for the visit to the new doctor, and write out a brief and concise message for the doctor to read, rather than try and tell him, and get all flustered.
By taking some time to compose the note, you can get the details just so, and you won't have to worry about them coming out right.
Just a brief paragraph though, or perhaps, point form.
Example:
I had a trial script for Adderall (doseage?), but I didn't use them all. I recently tried the 2 pills I had left, and I felt very much better. I have used Lamictal and Wellbutrin, without good response.
He'll start asking questions, at that point.
Good luck,
Lar
Posted by Karen_kay on January 4, 2004, at 17:55:57
In reply to Re: Criminal or desperate, is it the same?, posted by femlite on January 4, 2004, at 9:48:10
Hello again... First of all, to answer you question akathesia is the inability to sit still. It's like a complete restlessness, I had to be moving constantly. It was horrible for me. I found it to be completely comparable to my manic phase, with the exception that I could sleep.
Larry's suggestion is great! Write down some of the past medication that worked for you, as well as medication that you were on that didn't. That way if you become flustered you have something you can look back to and can concentrate on.Your former Pdoc was out of line! I'm sorry that he even suggested that being a student was more valuable than being a parent. Sometimes people just don't think before they speak, obviously he was having that faulty moment in time.
It's important that you find a Pdoc soon. And in my experience I don't think I've had such good luck in finding one that clicks. What I do is try to make it click. But, I try hard to accomodate. I know that personally doctors like it when a patient is concise and consistent. So, if I have lists of symptoms, medications, hospitalizations, ect. they appreciate it. I can't come up with it off the top of my head, but I can have the information available for them. It helps to establish a rapport.
So, the first time you meet with your potential new Pdoc, have accurate records with current insurance info, dates of manic and depressive episodes with sypmtoms, be open to suggestions (even if you don't intend on following through!). I think just starting off on the right first with the first few visits may make all the difference.
Posted by femlite on January 4, 2004, at 20:32:09
In reply to Re: Criminal or desperate, is it the same? » femlite, posted by Karen_kay on January 4, 2004, at 17:55:57
Thanks so much to both of you.
I feel so desperate just thinking of a new pdoc visit. I need to believe that my needs are not criminal and have hope.
Posted by Karen_kay on January 5, 2004, at 16:48:10
In reply to Re: Criminal or desperate, is it the same?, posted by femlite on January 4, 2004, at 20:32:09
Your needs are not criminal! You're going to see a Pdoc, not a parole officer. I'm sorry, I was being more informative than supportive :( I think first of all, try to go in with a positive attitude! It makes all the difference in the world. Listen to some calming music in the car, or bring headphones on the bus, ect... Try to relax on your way in. Also, convince yourself that this *WILL* be a positive experience! If you can do something fun before you go, do it! (Go to the park, read a fav. book, get your nails done, something you enjoy) Try to be relaxed before you go in. Just try to tell yourself that this will be a positive experience and you just may have one!!!
Posted by femlite on January 8, 2004, at 9:12:03
In reply to Re: Criminal or desperated, is it the same? » femlite, posted by Larry Hoover on January 4, 2004, at 10:04:15
Larry, thank you for the well thought out advice, I feel I really need a plan, otherwise I feel so vunerable, which only adds to my feelings of desperation and fear.
Do you have any experience with this medication? I am somewhat hesitant of using even though it helped.Do you think it can be used in a healthful way? Iam worried about further depleting my endocrine systems and possibly undermining my precarious state of health, (fibro, back pain, etc...)
And yet I am equally desperate to get my life moving forward and out of the rut I seem to have been in for so long.
Can supplements and good nutrition, be used to find a balance?
I value your opinion and hope to bennifit from it.
regards,
femlite
> About the Adderall....you really want to try it again, yes?
>
> Why don't you plan ahead for the visit to the new doctor, and write out a brief and concise message for the doctor to read, rather than try and tell him, and get all flustered.
>
> By taking some time to compose the note, you can get the details just so, and you won't have to worry about them coming out right.
>
> Just a brief paragraph though, or perhaps, point form.
>
> Example:
>
> I had a trial script for Adderall (doseage?), but I didn't use them all. I recently tried the 2 pills I had left, and I felt very much better. I have used Lamictal and Wellbutrin, without good response.
>
> He'll start asking questions, at that point.
>
> Good luck,
> Lar
Posted by femlite on January 8, 2004, at 9:24:28
In reply to Re: Criminal or desperate, is it the same? » femlite, posted by Karen_kay on January 5, 2004, at 16:48:10
Its okay karen, I think I need both information and support. For me they can often be the same. I feel so lost at times in the world of mental health.
I find that I feel more mentally disturbed when Im at the pdoc visit, than anywhere else. when I get home and see my beautiful kids, hold my cat, or walk out the country lane I live on to get my mail I feel so different from the vulnereable, defensive, fearful and sad individual sitting in the chair across from a doctor holding a pen poised above a note pad.I need help, and yet feel unable to express it without feeling labeled, judged, instead of viewed as a whole person going through a tough time.
Thank you so much for all your encouragement. It is a new year. I am going to tell myself that all day, up to the moment of my next visit (today) and beyond. This could be the best of visits and I will try to see it that way.
thank you
> Your needs are not criminal! You're going to see a Pdoc, not a parole officer. I'm sorry, I was being more informative than supportive :( I think first of all, try to go in with a positive attitude! It makes all the difference in the world. Listen to some calming music in the car, or bring headphones on the bus, ect... Try to relax on your way in. Also, convince yourself that this *WILL* be a positive experience! If you can do something fun before you go, do it! (Go to the park, read a fav. book, get your nails done, something you enjoy) Try to be relaxed before you go in. Just try to tell yourself that this will be a positive experience and you just may have one!!!
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