![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 21 of 21. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by sar on August 19, 2001, at 1:21:11
is it worth it? i'm so scared. last night a flirty year-long friend and i were intimate--he drove nearly 300 miles to see me--in a little red sports car. very sixteen-candlesesque. he seems to like me, but i'm so fucking frightened of exerting energy on possible love. he's very sociable and flirtatious so i can't figure out if i'm some fling or if he's meaningful. i like him a lot and i am scared. he knows of my mood disorders, not in detail, and he knows alot about me--but i just feel so *vulnerable* right now that i'm terrified of being hurt. can depression and new love ever jive? (my meds are working well, but i'm still *extremely* sensitive to (perceived or real) rejection)
thanks,
sar
Posted by mila on August 19, 2001, at 4:14:56
In reply to depression and crushes, posted by sar on August 19, 2001, at 1:21:11
> is it worth it?
go for it, sar. you'll never know unless you try.
people do not really reject us, they just set us free for the new people to enjoy. that's it. if it happens, just say, 'oops, sorry, I thought you were someone else!"
set aside your medical condition for a while, it is not like you are talking about marriage or anything yet. labels can put people off or at least offer them an easy/difficult (it depends) route for excuses, but the reality of a living person won't.
do not be afraid of exerting energy on love. in some sense, depression is a lot of energy that haven't found its outlet, that is why little pills work magic on us. they are not particularly loaded with energy, but they make whatever energy is already there available to us. spend it all!!! at the very least you'll be remembered as the girl who knew how to love fully...
good luck
mila
Posted by Willow on August 19, 2001, at 4:30:40
In reply to depression and crushes, posted by sar on August 19, 2001, at 1:21:11
My psych says I was suffering from post traumatic stress when I met my hubby. In general we've had a good relationship for the past 16 years. But had I been in my right mind would have I got involved? Probably not? But alot of these questions are easy to answer in hindsight. No relationship is perfect, they all need work which means a lot of communication.
Posted by sar on August 19, 2001, at 10:33:41
In reply to Re: depression and crushes, posted by mila on August 19, 2001, at 4:14:56
> > is it worth it?
>
> go for it, sar. you'll never know unless you try.
you are right. fear holds too many of us back.
> people do not really reject us, they just set us free for the new people to enjoy. that's it. if it happens, just say, 'oops, sorry, I thought you were someone else!"
what an optimistic way of viewing it! i'd thought he was a philanderer and sleep-around, but as it turns out, he's actually much purer than that. i think that's why i'm doublly confused. also, we won't be living in the same city until january...never done the long-distance thing before, and now that we've been v.v. intimate all night, my heart feels attached. i think it works differently for men.> set aside your medical condition for a while, it is not like you are talking about marriage or anything yet. labels can put people off or at least offer them an easy/difficult (it depends) route for excuses, but the reality of a living person won't.
yes yes, i agree. it is nothing serious yet, i've just not felt this way about a person for a long time. for the past year it was easier for me to go out with guys who liked and respected me, then fuck them over as some sort of preventitive method of being fucked over myself. this guy tho--i just really like him. he could already hurt me, and that frightens me.> do not be afraid of exerting energy on love. in some sense, depression is a lot of energy that haven't found its outlet, that is why little pills work magic on us. they are not particularly loaded with energy, but they make whatever energy is already there available to us. spend it all!!! at the very least you'll be remembered as the girl who knew how to love fully...
true, true! depression is such an energy-sucker. i do have some little magic pills now and am feeling better. prior to that, i grew my leg hair out and growled at any man who flirted with me. am much less bitter now, but part of my diagnosis (as "borderline") is extreme sensitivity and romantic relationships just tear me up...perhaps i should just be a nun. it would cut the drinking out, i wouldn't have to shave, and i wouldn't have to worry about this shite.good luck
> milathanks mila. i'll keep you updated if you are interested. & how are you?
sar
Posted by sar on August 19, 2001, at 10:45:53
In reply to Re: depression and crushes, posted by Willow on August 19, 2001, at 4:30:40
> My psych says I was suffering from post traumatic stress when I met my hubby. In general we've had a good relationship for the past 16 years. But had I been in my right mind would have I got involved? Probably not? But alot of these questions are easy to answer in hindsight. No relationship is perfect, they all need work which means a lot of communication.
it's difficult to say, isn't it, when we have all of these psych problems. if you read my post above i should just cut off contact with all people and be a nun and knit dolls for children.
communication is also weird when you've just started something with someone. "why did you bring me here?" i whispered to him in the middle of the night at his apartment in the other city. "because, dude, you've got to miss austin and i haven't seen you all summer" he said (he'd been overseas and we were at his roommate's birthday party)--being casual is pretty important in the beginning.
last year i was a bitch to men. if they liked me i'd skrew them over good. that doesn't make me feel spiritually clean, but at least i wasn't getting hurt.
i know this is weird. anymore insight/advice would be appreciated.
sar
Posted by mila on August 19, 2001, at 10:58:14
In reply to Re: depression and crushes » mila, posted by sar on August 19, 2001, at 10:33:41
good mornign, sar :)
> true, true! depression is such an energy-sucker. i do have some little magic pills now and am feeling better. prior to that, i grew my leg hair out and growled at any man who flirted with me. am much less bitter now, but part of my diagnosis (as "borderline") is extreme sensitivity and romantic relationships just tear me up...perhaps i should just be a nun. it would cut the drinking out, i wouldn't have to shave, and i wouldn't have to worry about this shite.
>
on a lighter note, sar, nuns are so devoted to loving jesus, it's astonishing. does your heart pound with joy when you think about this heavenly groom? one of the reasons i have never got to be a nun is precisely that. I do not enjoy jesus as a man, nor do i believe he's like me as a woman:) (i do not drink his blood and bite into his flesh every sunday, and my outfit lacks in starch)
>
> thanks mila. i'll keep you updated if you are interested.please do. you are very lovely, and have an amazing presence of spirit. i am still looking for a girl like you in the bookstores i visit to help me out with selection of interesting titles. girls that work there all look like healthy gums from the toothpaste commercials. i shy away from them.
< & how are you?
i am alright today. just cleared the house from the males and enjoying my 6th cigarette with a cup of coffee. it is raining outside, the pizza dough is raising in the kitchen, and i love it all.
hugs,
mila
Posted by kazoo on August 19, 2001, at 11:19:49
In reply to depression and crushes, posted by sar on August 19, 2001, at 1:21:11
I had a "crush" once.
She was about 300 pounds.
She got stuck in a vintage XKE.
We missed dinner and the opera as a result.
kazoo
Posted by susan C on August 19, 2001, at 12:22:01
In reply to Re: depression and crushes sar, posted by mila on August 19, 2001, at 10:58:14
Do you have the pattern?
No, seriously, or for that matter, not seriously,
I remember talking to my best friend from hs years and years ago. I had just been intimate with my now husband, and it was the night before he left for a month long vacation. I called her up and said, I have never felt this way before...I am so frightened. This could be 'it'. She said, go for it.Then I had to wait a month.
May I have a piece of Pizza please?
I will fly over to get it when it is ready.
Mighty Mouse.
> good mornign, sar :)
>
> > true, true! depression is such an energy-sucker. i do have some little magic pills now and am feeling better. prior to that, i grew my leg hair out and growled at any man who flirted with me. am much less bitter now, but part of my diagnosis (as "borderline") is extreme sensitivity and romantic relationships just tear me up...perhaps i should just be a nun. it would cut the drinking out, i wouldn't have to shave, and i wouldn't have to worry about this shite.
> >
> on a lighter note, sar, nuns are so devoted to loving jesus, it's astonishing. does your heart pound with joy when you think about this heavenly groom? one of the reasons i have never got to be a nun is precisely that. I do not enjoy jesus as a man, nor do i believe he's like me as a woman:) (i do not drink his blood and bite into his flesh every sunday, and my outfit lacks in starch)
> >
> > thanks mila. i'll keep you updated if you are interested.
>
> please do. you are very lovely, and have an amazing presence of spirit. i am still looking for a girl like you in the bookstores i visit to help me out with selection of interesting titles. girls that work there all look like healthy gums from the toothpaste commercials. i shy away from them.
>
> < & how are you?
>
> i am alright today. just cleared the house from the males and enjoying my 6th cigarette with a cup of coffee. it is raining outside, the pizza dough is raising in the kitchen, and i love it all.
>
>
> hugs,
> mila
Posted by mila on August 19, 2001, at 13:47:50
In reply to the image of a nun knitting, posted by susan C on August 19, 2001, at 12:22:01
> Do you have the pattern?
>
> No, seriously, or for that matter, not seriously,
> I remember talking to my best friend from hs years and years ago. I had just been intimate with my now husband, and it was the night before he left for a month long vacation. I called her up and said, I have never felt this way before...I am so frightened. This could be 'it'. She said, go for it.
>
> Then I had to wait a month.
>
> May I have a piece of Pizza please?
>
> I will fly over to get it when it is ready.
>
> Mighty Mouse.
>your pizza's ready, ma'am. please, come to the table!
p.s. i have waited for a year...
p.p.s. i do not know if it is relevant, but 8 years later i coerced my husband to enter the theological seminary. It took me three months to convince him. today he sais he is grateful. he has never become a priest afterwards, but he's got his sense of humour back as far as religion concerned. and i made many friends with nuns. they are not what sar imagines them to be. not at all.
Posted by kid_A on August 19, 2001, at 14:45:17
In reply to depression and crushes, posted by sar on August 19, 2001, at 1:21:11
sar,
i say get what love you can in whatever its form may be when you can get it... its important sometimes not to have expectations, to live within the moment, to be here now, and not be in the future or have some predetermined expectation as to what one persons intentions may be...my therapist says that i have a tendency to fall for easy love, to fall for people who's aquaintence and familiarity maybe predetermined by mutual aquaintences... that its easier for me to fall for friends, or for (worse yet) friends girlfriends since its easy, its easy love...
there has allready been so much advice dolled out allready on this subject you may have formed your own opinion, but enjoy the connection, because when we can connect, in whatever way, that is really what life is about... perhaps it turns out to be only for a little while, but that ultimate connection is what we are after...
enjoy it...
pax and love,
k_A
~~~~
Easy living, easy hold
Easy teething, easy fold
Easy listening, easy love
Easy answers to easy questions
Easy tumble, easy doll
Easy rumble, easy fall
I get up on easy love
I get up on easy questions-radiohead "coke babies"
Posted by susan C on August 19, 2001, at 17:54:10
In reply to Re: the image of a nun knitting, posted by mila on August 19, 2001, at 13:47:50
> > Do you have the pattern?
> >
> > No, seriously, or for that matter, not seriously,
> > I remember talking to my best friend from hs years and years ago. I had just been intimate with my now husband, and it was the night before he left for a month long vacation. I called her up and said, I have never felt this way before...I am so frightened. This could be 'it'. She said, go for it.
> >
> > Then I had to wait a month.
> >
> > May I have a piece of Pizza please?
> >
> > I will fly over to get it when it is ready.
> >
> > Mighty Mouse.
> >
>
> your pizza's ready, ma'am. please, come to the table!
>
> p.s. i have waited for a year...
> p.p.s. i do not know if it is relevant, but 8 years later i coerced my husband to enter the theological seminary. It took me three months to convince him. today he sais he is grateful. he has never become a priest afterwards, but he's got his sense of humour back as far as religion concerned. and i made many friends with nuns. they are not what sar imagines them to be. not at all.
Posted by kiddo on August 19, 2001, at 18:46:47
In reply to MMMM Pizza, fresh basil? (np), posted by susan C on August 19, 2001, at 17:54:10
I don't have the stuff to make fresh pizza :-( so I have to order mine... bummer.
Kiddo
> > > Do you have the pattern?
> > >
> > > No, seriously, or for that matter, not seriously,
> > > I remember talking to my best friend from hs years and years ago. I had just been intimate with my now husband, and it was the night before he left for a month long vacation. I called her up and said, I have never felt this way before...I am so frightened. This could be 'it'. She said, go for it.
> > >
> > > Then I had to wait a month.
> > >
> > > May I have a piece of Pizza please?
> > >
> > > I will fly over to get it when it is ready.
> > >
> > > Mighty Mouse.
> > >
> >
> > your pizza's ready, ma'am. please, come to the table!
> >
> > p.s. i have waited for a year...
> > p.p.s. i do not know if it is relevant, but 8 years later i coerced my husband to enter the theological seminary. It took me three months to convince him. today he sais he is grateful. he has never become a priest afterwards, but he's got his sense of humour back as far as religion concerned. and i made many friends with nuns. they are not what sar imagines them to be. not at all.
Posted by sar on August 20, 2001, at 0:25:41
In reply to Re: depression and crushes sar, posted by mila on August 19, 2001, at 10:58:14
dear mila,
my heart actually does pound with joy when i think of jesus, but that's only because i sometimes strive to be jesus-like. i really *admire* jesus but don't consider him a lust object.
thank you for the compliments, you are kind...i do have healthy gums (i think--should go to dentist soon) but would not qualify for toothpaste commercials. teeth a bit crooked.
i am envious of the coffee, cigs, and pizza. i quit smoking 4 days ago and gave up pizza about a week ago because you always have to get a *whole* pizza, and i would always just eat the whole thing, so good cheese tomatoes muchrooms black olives yum. i drink too much to eat like that.
i am glad you had a good morning, it sounds as if you're enjoying yourself...
thank you for your kind words. i don't understand what they mean, but i hold compliments tight even when they don't make sense to me. (i understand what you said, i just cannot comprehend them applying to me.)
have a good next morning too,
sar
Posted by sar on August 20, 2001, at 0:26:50
In reply to Re: depression and crushes » sar, posted by kazoo on August 19, 2001, at 11:19:49
> I had a "crush" once.
>
> She was about 300 pounds.
>
> She got stuck in a vintage XKE.
>
> We missed dinner and the opera as a result.
>
> kazoosounds more like a "jam" to me.
Posted by sar on August 20, 2001, at 0:30:20
In reply to the image of a nun knitting, posted by susan C on August 19, 2001, at 12:22:01
the image of a nun knitting is quite respectable, only i'd knit cool things like colorful hippie habits etc--
:)
sar
Posted by sar on August 20, 2001, at 0:35:34
In reply to Re: the image of a nun knitting, posted by mila on August 19, 2001, at 13:47:50
i've met some nuns. i just felt like indulging in a stereotype. but don't they devote their lives to goodworks? i'm sure some of them must knit, too--and if they don't, i could be the first knitting nun. i'd be terribly respectable. someone named allisonb once posted an article called "quilting for life" or some such and i've been interested in knitting ever since. i've been interested in the nunnery since this new boy came up. they might coincide nicely.
sar
Posted by sar on August 20, 2001, at 0:51:09
In reply to the image of a sun setting.... » sar, posted by kid_A on August 19, 2001, at 14:45:17
kid_A,
that's a philosophy i can certainly appreciate and try to practice. i can hear mick jagger singing now in my head, "i got no expectations..."
i wouldn't want him to have expectations of me at this point, either. it's just that this jive-yness has been going on over a year now, and now that he's shown me his more sensitive side i feel i've fallen hard, and i am frightened. i am frightened because i don't know how he feels. i always wish that other people would wear like post-it signs on their shirt saying how they feel...he doesn't know how i feel either...
i used to sing along with this janis joplin song called "get it while you can." her philosophy was there's no tomorrow, only today, grab whatever love you can and enjoy it while you can. but my mood has shifted. i want what i really want. something genuine.
i'm so scared i could cry. for awhile i wanted to be gay so that i wouldn't have to deal with all this male sketchiness. i regret not being a lesbian or even bi. i'm too sensitive. if he lets me down--
see, i've ceased to believe that men have any romance in them. i did have one boyfriend who truly loved me and we were together for years, but the others have been--unreliable, drug addicts, only after one thing--etc...
do men really care? i don't understand. do they keep caring? aside from that, my self-esteem is so low that i can't understand that anyone might feel the same way about me.
i'm in reparation now emotionally, and this seems like--heartache or something wonderful, and i can't decide.
Posted by Wendy B. on August 22, 2001, at 9:50:50
In reply to Re: the image of a sun setting...., posted by sar on August 20, 2001, at 0:51:09
> kid_A,
>
> that's a philosophy i can certainly appreciate and try to practice. i can hear mick jagger singing now in my head, "i got no expectations..."
>
> i wouldn't want him to have expectations of me at this point, either. it's just that this jive-yness has been going on over a year now, and now that he's shown me his more sensitive side i feel i've fallen hard, and i am frightened. i am frightened because i don't know how he feels. i always wish that other people would wear like post-it signs on their shirt saying how they feel...he doesn't know how i feel either...
>
> i used to sing along with this janis joplin song called "get it while you can." her philosophy was there's no tomorrow, only today, grab whatever love you can and enjoy it while you can. but my mood has shifted. i want what i really want. something genuine.
>
> i'm so scared i could cry. for awhile i wanted to be gay so that i wouldn't have to deal with all this male sketchiness. i regret not being a lesbian or even bi. i'm too sensitive. if he lets me down--
>
> see, i've ceased to believe that men have any romance in them. i did have one boyfriend who truly loved me and we were together for years, but the others have been--unreliable, drug addicts, only after one thing--etc...
>
> do men really care? i don't understand. do they keep caring? aside from that, my self-esteem is so low that i can't understand that anyone might feel the same way about me.
>
> i'm in reparation now emotionally, and this seems like--heartache or something wonderful, and i can't decide._________________
Sar,
Sorry to have missed the thread until today... you have a lot of good advice already and probably don't need my 2 cents, but y'all are gonna get it anyway...But first, a fantasy, inspired by the nun/knitting/boyfriend imagery:
I can see you cloistered away in the nunnery (legs shaven underneath the robe), and your New Man climbs up the ivy vines covering the cloister's walls to see you... he jumps in the window of your little cell, a cross is on the wall above your bed. He knows that underneath your robes is the sexy, beautiful, desire-throb Sar... He starts to take them off you, you help with all the little buttons and the hooks and the catches, your hair comes spilling out...
Eh, hem...
Out of fantasy-land, and into reality - ("Awwww, do we HAVE to?...")
All of it's very very exciting, and it has to start some way or another, and I love all these depressed (manic or no) people saying to Go For It...
You're scared, you want something genuine, that's right baby, don't settle for anything less.
Personally, I am striving to be much more careful, more choosy, in the next love affair... But I'm not 23, I'm 41 - still sexy, still very much in need of the right man, kinda lonely but still happy in my way... But terribly burned by the last one which ended 8 months ago, gas poured on the whole thing, and a match thrown in and BOOM... Still nursing sores from that one...
I have a writer friend who says: don't let them have it for nothing. Let the relationship develop over time. Figure out if he's a jerk or not first. She also says, a novel idea if there ever was one: the longer it takes for you to end up in the sack with him the better. At least you know he's not just in it for the short term. I ask: but what if I'm the one who wants to get into HIS pants??? What do I do then??? But the clock struck midnight, the oracle went away, and I am stuck with the same questions as you, dear Sar.
*******
Joni Mitchell interlude (esp. for you Canadians out there) -
I am a woman of heart and mind
with time on her hands,
no child to raise..
You come to me like a little boy,
and I give you my scorn and my praise...
You think I'm like your mother,
or another lover, or your sister, or
the Queen of your dreams,
or just another silly girl
when love makes a fool of me...*********
But you are already in the sack, so to conquer the fear, the best you can do now is to find out where his head is at... If he can't see you for a week, does he go crazy? Is he calling you? Can you sort of back up a little and get to know him better, and talk, just talk, it's such a good thing. We can't live without connection with another soul...
I realize I'm a little spacey here, wandering about with my musings, I just know the place you're in (scared), and hope all goes well, and want the updates, natch...
much love,
Wendy
Posted by sar on August 23, 2001, at 17:44:45
In reply to Re: the image of a nun getting... (?), posted by Wendy B. on August 22, 2001, at 9:50:50
dear wendy,
what do you do for a living? do write for harlequin? sillohuette? :)
that's what i'm afraid of--sores i can't afford. he does seem to care about me alot--all of this driving, the little kisses, e-mail from abroad all summer--but we did jump in the sack too early. i once wrote a treatise called "On Sluts and Fucking" or somesuch trying to reconcile feminism with evolution. my conclusion was that the girl really does have to hold out in order for things to work (usually) and i think that's damn unfortunate...but as the Chinese say, in order to conquer nature, you must obey it.
we worked and partied together for about a year before any of this happened...not as close friends, but we were definitely flirty and always had fun together...
i saw him 2 days ago. he played some funny jazz song for me that said "i want her to be my baby but i don't know how she feels about me" or somethin--"this is my song for you," he said casually, and then after it i didn't say anything but took hold of his hand--we were driving--great time we had--
i'm just afraid of sores i can't afford.
but that means not living.
i get confused too easily.
how are you, wendy? what happened with the last guy?
hope you are well--
love
sar
Posted by Wendy B. on August 24, 2001, at 10:54:05
In reply to Re: the image of a nun getting... (?) » Wendy B., posted by sar on August 23, 2001, at 17:44:45
> dear wendy,
>
> what do you do for a living? do write for harlequin? sillohuette? :)
>
> that's what i'm afraid of--sores i can't afford. he does seem to care about me alot--all of this driving, the little kisses, e-mail from abroad all summer--but we did jump in the sack too early. i once wrote a treatise called "On Sluts and Fucking" or somesuch trying to reconcile feminism with evolution. my conclusion was that the girl really does have to hold out in order for things to work (usually) and i think that's damn unfortunate...but as the Chinese say, in order to conquer nature, you must obey it.
>
> we worked and partied together for about a year before any of this happened...not as close friends, but we were definitely flirty and always had fun together...
>
> i saw him 2 days ago. he played some funny jazz song for me that said "i want her to be my baby but i don't know how she feels about me" or somethin--"this is my song for you," he said casually, and then after it i didn't say anything but took hold of his hand--we were driving--great time we had--
>
> i'm just afraid of sores i can't afford.
>
> but that means not living.
>
> i get confused too easily.
>
> how are you, wendy? what happened with the last guy?
>
> hope you are well--
>
> love
> sarSar,
Sores you can't afford, I think you're right. You have to be careful of course... I think it's sweet that he played that song for you... What an opportunity for you to have just asked him what he meant by it! Go for it, tell him your worries, see what he says. Maybe e-mailing him would be easier?
Ugghhh, I think I've spilled my guts a little about the last guy on this board, and am loathe to go into it again, was sort of "fired" from the relationship last January, with all sorts of excuses as to why, none of which I understood. We had been together for 2 yrs. I had taken him to my therapist because of his rapid cycling and then catatonic depressions... Whereupon he kinda 'stole' her from me, and I in essence went thru two big losses... It was a horror. I keep thinking that nothing can really hurt me after the craziness of my first (only) marriage, see thread above (Bags are Packed thread) for the gruesome details... But then, something almost as bad DID happen again, so I guess my immunity period was up!
So my most recent relationship meltdown was then made even worse by this guy starting to go out with a chick who was 15 yrs younger than we are, three weeks after he broke up with me. Wheeeee! Imagine the blow to my self-worth. A few weeks ago, I came to the conclusion that, well, he has lowered himself down to the level he's comfortable with. He kept saying: it's not about you, it's about me (whaa..? wasn't I half of the relationship?). But in the end, I realize he was right, he wasn't able to take somebody like me...
Someone whose goal in life *would* be to write for such venerable presses as Harlequin or Sillhouette! (Actually, I don't know the latter, maybe you can fill me in?) Do you know how much money those authors make? I would be overjoyed! Meanwhile, I amuse my invisible friends on PS-babble with my twisted attempts at soft-porn... I do like the nun images, thanks for giving me the opportunity to get silly for a moment...
As for the sex-leads-to-love, or love-leads-to-sex quandry, I am totally torn. As I told you, my writer friend told me that from now on, wait as long as you can til you 'do it,' and I said to her that this advice reminded me too much of the puritanical warnings my parents used to give... 'men want only one thing,' 'don't give it away for free,' (like I should ask them to pay me for it? seriously, I've had lovers who I would have been happy to pay myself!) What did this mean to a budding feminist? That we should have no desire? That we should sit back and wait for a prince who'd bend down before us and ask our hand in marriage, and please, no sex beforehand? I didn't believe in that, and of course, neither did any of the guys I knew, who grew up alongside us little feminists, and they were out to get as much sex as we were...
So the writer-woman says, no, it's not like that, we should wait now for sex, not because we have no desire, or want to hide that part of ourselves, but because most people are jerks (not just men), and immediately hopping in the sack doesn't help with getting to know each other. At least not right away. So what's wrong with waiting? Giving oneself sexually is like giving them a BIG present, and you wouldn't give somebody you didn't know very well a present, would you?
Theoretically, I think she's right. And I have a history of acting impulsively, just doing what felt good, asking questions later, etc. I mean, that's my history, I'm not ashamed of it, it makes me what I am, etc. But I probably could have saved myself a couple of tears along the way... I tend to respond to any overtures of interest, or love, or just soul-talk, with wanting to go to bed with somebody. Having to do with my father leaving when I was a baby, etc.
So that's where I am now... I finally found out where my father lives, and am working on the hardest thing I've ever had to do, write him a letter and ask why he left and if we can now, 40 yrs later, have a relationship. It's just a wound that's never closed, and my new therapist and I think it will bring about some changes in the way I deal with men... We'll see... I can only hope.
Enough! I'm going out running now that my headache has gone away (met some friends by accident downtown last night, we drank sangria, ouch!)
Any other news on the guy, or other insights, let me know...
much love,
W.
Posted by susan C on August 24, 2001, at 13:17:04
In reply to Re: nuns and such, nunsuch, nonesuch » sar, posted by Wendy B. on August 24, 2001, at 10:54:05
The future in writing is to always have unresolved issues...so you can keep on writing and people keep on wanting to read, therefor buy your books.
This thought came up as I read you post...particularly about romances..oh, the swings, from page to page, paragraph to paragarh, sentence to sentence.
This sounds familiar.
may be this mouse will turn into jane, swinging with tarzan from tree to tree...aaaahhhh eeeee ahhhh.
Tough work, finding dad, writing a letter, asking for a relationship.
my thoughts are with both of you, hoping you also take a minute to think abut yourself...just you...nobody, but you
your wandering moustreel
> > dear wendy,
> >
> > what do you do for a living? do write for harlequin? sillohuette? :)
> >
> > that's what i'm afraid of--sores i can't afford. he does seem to care about me alot--all of this driving, the little kisses, e-mail from abroad all summer--but we did jump in the sack too early. i once wrote a treatise called "On Sluts and Fucking" or somesuch trying to reconcile feminism with evolution. my conclusion was that the girl really does have to hold out in order for things to work (usually) and i think that's damn unfortunate...but as the Chinese say, in order to conquer nature, you must obey it.
> >
> > we worked and partied together for about a year before any of this happened...not as close friends, but we were definitely flirty and always had fun together...
> >
> > i saw him 2 days ago. he played some funny jazz song for me that said "i want her to be my baby but i don't know how she feels about me" or somethin--"this is my song for you," he said casually, and then after it i didn't say anything but took hold of his hand--we were driving--great time we had--
> >
> > i'm just afraid of sores i can't afford.
> >
> > but that means not living.
> >
> > i get confused too easily.
> >
> > how are you, wendy? what happened with the last guy?
> >
> > hope you are well--
> >
> > love
> > sar
>
>
>
> Sar,
>
> Sores you can't afford, I think you're right. You have to be careful of course... I think it's sweet that he played that song for you... What an opportunity for you to have just asked him what he meant by it! Go for it, tell him your worries, see what he says. Maybe e-mailing him would be easier?
>
> Ugghhh, I think I've spilled my guts a little about the last guy on this board, and am loathe to go into it again, was sort of "fired" from the relationship last January, with all sorts of excuses as to why, none of which I understood. We had been together for 2 yrs. I had taken him to my therapist because of his rapid cycling and then catatonic depressions... Whereupon he kinda 'stole' her from me, and I in essence went thru two big losses... It was a horror. I keep thinking that nothing can really hurt me after the craziness of my first (only) marriage, see thread above (Bags are Packed thread) for the gruesome details... But then, something almost as bad DID happen again, so I guess my immunity period was up!
>
> So my most recent relationship meltdown was then made even worse by this guy starting to go out with a chick who was 15 yrs younger than we are, three weeks after he broke up with me. Wheeeee! Imagine the blow to my self-worth. A few weeks ago, I came to the conclusion that, well, he has lowered himself down to the level he's comfortable with. He kept saying: it's not about you, it's about me (whaa..? wasn't I half of the relationship?). But in the end, I realize he was right, he wasn't able to take somebody like me...
>
> Someone whose goal in life *would* be to write for such venerable presses as Harlequin or Sillhouette! (Actually, I don't know the latter, maybe you can fill me in?) Do you know how much money those authors make? I would be overjoyed! Meanwhile, I amuse my invisible friends on PS-babble with my twisted attempts at soft-porn... I do like the nun images, thanks for giving me the opportunity to get silly for a moment...
>
> As for the sex-leads-to-love, or love-leads-to-sex quandry, I am totally torn. As I told you, my writer friend told me that from now on, wait as long as you can til you 'do it,' and I said to her that this advice reminded me too much of the puritanical warnings my parents used to give... 'men want only one thing,' 'don't give it away for free,' (like I should ask them to pay me for it? seriously, I've had lovers who I would have been happy to pay myself!) What did this mean to a budding feminist? That we should have no desire? That we should sit back and wait for a prince who'd bend down before us and ask our hand in marriage, and please, no sex beforehand? I didn't believe in that, and of course, neither did any of the guys I knew, who grew up alongside us little feminists, and they were out to get as much sex as we were...
>
> So the writer-woman says, no, it's not like that, we should wait now for sex, not because we have no desire, or want to hide that part of ourselves, but because most people are jerks (not just men), and immediately hopping in the sack doesn't help with getting to know each other. At least not right away. So what's wrong with waiting? Giving oneself sexually is like giving them a BIG present, and you wouldn't give somebody you didn't know very well a present, would you?
>
> Theoretically, I think she's right. And I have a history of acting impulsively, just doing what felt good, asking questions later, etc. I mean, that's my history, I'm not ashamed of it, it makes me what I am, etc. But I probably could have saved myself a couple of tears along the way... I tend to respond to any overtures of interest, or love, or just soul-talk, with wanting to go to bed with somebody. Having to do with my father leaving when I was a baby, etc.
>
> So that's where I am now... I finally found out where my father lives, and am working on the hardest thing I've ever had to do, write him a letter and ask why he left and if we can now, 40 yrs later, have a relationship. It's just a wound that's never closed, and my new therapist and I think it will bring about some changes in the way I deal with men... We'll see... I can only hope.
>
> Enough! I'm going out running now that my headache has gone away (met some friends by accident downtown last night, we drank sangria, ouch!)
>
> Any other news on the guy, or other insights, let me know...
>
> much love,
> W.
This is the end of the thread.
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