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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by Dinah on November 18, 2008, at 13:10:32
Am I the only one who has trouble discerning the real from the vividly imagined experience?
Which is actually something of a quote from Head, a Monkees movie. Although they may have gotten it elsewhere.
The other night I was supposed to order the pizza. I ran through the imaginary conversation in my mind, picturing the words I would speak and the answers I would get. I think I often do that so I'll be prepared. The place wasn't open yet and I needed to call a few minutes later. My husband arrived there and found no order. He called me and I was positive I had placed the order. I remembered doing it! I ran it through my mind and realized I hadn't anchored it in any way. Some of the OCD stuff involves anchoring something in a way that I know I did it (like turning off the stove or calling in a pizza order) because it's hard to remember this time if you've done something many times. I realized I didn't remember giving the name to the pizza place, so my memory wasn't "anchored". So I probably didn't actually call it in.
My therapist nodded knowingly when I described this, as if he was not at all surprised.
Was he not surprised because it was a normal enough thing to do? To imagine the experience and then have trouble discerning the imagined from the real? Or was he nodding because it fit into some disorder he thinks of me as having?
I didn't ask at the time because I didn't want to divert from the flow of the story. But I was just wondering if anyone else has trouble with that.
Posted by Dinah on November 18, 2008, at 13:12:00
In reply to The vividly imagined experience, posted by Dinah on November 18, 2008, at 13:10:32
Addendum:
I don't think my husband thought it was a likely tale, even tho he too has his rituals for anchoring.
Posted by Wittgensteinz on November 18, 2008, at 18:21:41
In reply to Re: The vividly imagined experience, posted by Dinah on November 18, 2008, at 13:12:00
Maybe what is particular to you, and perhaps pathology related, is the habit of running through the scenario in such detail that the distinction between doing X in reality and anticipating doing X becomes blurred. I often have to rehearse carefully my phone calls. There have even been occasions I have gone as far as writing down what I need to say (that's because I often have to speak in another language and I hate making mistakes) - that said, I've never had this problem of thinking I've actually made the phone call and later realising I haven't.
What I have experienced however is the mixing of reality with vivid dreams/day dreaming - this tends to happen when my mental health is worse - when under a lot of stress. My (day)dreams will be so fast moving and vivid, and then all the imanges and happenings of the day/last days will blur together and discerning what is real and what is not can be difficult without checking. For example, whether I saw something on the news or whether I just dreamt it. If it's happening a lot in a short period of time, it can be quite unsettling.
When I was a student at university, there was a cleaner who would come and clean my room once a week (just in case people think I am a complete slob, it was a standard service that came with the room - I didn't hire a cleaner as such). It was nearly Christmas and I bought her some chocolates as a thank you present. I had them in my cupboard. Anyway, being a student I was often still asleep when she came round in the mornings to empty the bins. She would knock on the door to ask to empty the bin. I was certain that morning I'd woken up and given her the chocolates - it was so vivid - she'd knocked on my door to empty the bin, I got up and got them out of the cupboard and she was standing by the door. Anyway, that evening I was just getting something from the cupboard and there were the chocolates still there - I was baffled - afterall the bin had been emptied so I had gotten up. Then I had the faintest memory that I did indeed give her the chocolates but that she refused them and pushed them back into my hand. To this day I still don't know if any of that really happened. In the end I just left the chocolates behind in my room with a note. That Christmas she passed away, so I didn't see her again.
Sorry for the cheerful story!! Not sure if any of this helps answer your question.
I would guess your T suspects these lapses in memory (if that's what they are?) have something to do with a condition he perceives/suspects you as having. Can this be a part of OCD?
Witti
Posted by Dinah on November 18, 2008, at 19:11:40
In reply to Re: The vividly imagined experience » Dinah, posted by Wittgensteinz on November 18, 2008, at 18:21:41
It might indeed have been the OCD he was thinking of. I know I've probably mentioned anchoring before.
I don't think it could happen with anything that involved much activity, or anything unusual. It's more the everyday things. Like thinking about writing an email, composing the words in my mind, then thinking I actually wrote it since I did remember responding. Or calling for pizza. Or checking that the oven is off. Perhaps I just don't focus on the everyday closely enough.
I do know I have a relatively vivid imagination. I always had trouble with the walk through the woods meditation, because I'd start imagining all the bad things that were sure to come with the experience. Bugs, itchy leaves, stuff like that. My therapist would roll his eyes and say I was supposed to imagine a woods without those things. But that wouldn't be very realistic, would it?
Perhaps in your case it was because you were sleeping right around that time? Do you sometimes have that sort of dream where you get up, brush your teeth, eat breakfast, and then wake up to find it was just a dream?
Posted by LadyBug on November 18, 2008, at 19:19:06
In reply to The vividly imagined experience, posted by Dinah on November 18, 2008, at 13:10:32
More than a few times my T has told me: "in my mind I thought I called you because I had a conversation with you. Now I'm not so sure I called you and want to make sure I did". The times she "thought" she called, she actually didn't call.
I do the same with my kids, I'll think about something I need to tell them and later find out I never told them, I just thought I did.
Sometimes the brain doesn't know the difference between the imagination and the real.I wish at times I could imagine being in my T's office with her and have it seem real. I have conversations in my mind with her all the time.
Maybe my thoughts have nothing to do with what you are saying, except I believe my T thinking she called when she didn't is a good example of what you are talking about.
Dinah, did you ever get your pizza? Cuz, I'm starving about now and it sure sounds good.
Posted by Dinah on November 18, 2008, at 19:24:57
In reply to Re: The vividly imagined experience » Dinah, posted by LadyBug on November 18, 2008, at 19:19:06
Yes, precisely!
I would have believed her without a second thought.
I never did get my pizza. My husband called ahead to a place closer to our house. He and my son like it well enough, but if I'm going to eat that many calories I want it to be from the best pizza possible.
I wish you could have that vivid an experience with your imaginary therapist too. I wish I could have one with mine! That sort of imagining is never as close to the real as imagining a pizza order. :(
Thanks, Ladybug. I feel better now.
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