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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 10 to 34 of 34. Go back in thread:
Posted by rskontos on May 4, 2008, at 16:25:28
In reply to Re: Something I read today got me thinking, posted by muffled on May 4, 2008, at 0:52:12
Muffled, I am with you there. I too have no memory of my younger life, and yet both of my sisters tell me stuff that has happened and it still inspires no recollection. I was having memories come back to me but I shut them down. they scared me because of the SA stuff. Slowly on my own, I am letting them come back. I have learned to control them on my own somewhat. I can open my mind to them some, and I can close it some. I am just knowing at some point they will take over and I won't be able to control it. At least this is my belief, and to be honest I am not sure if it when help or hinder to know all the gory details. If it would give me more of an identity or not and if it would help unfragment or cause more of a rift. Do you get that.
But I get how you feel. I feel this same so much of the time:( and I am not sure therapy helps.
rsk
Posted by rskontos on May 4, 2008, at 16:26:19
In reply to Re: Something I read today got me thinking, posted by Dinah on May 3, 2008, at 18:17:40
I dont know Dinah, but I do think the memories has something to do at least for me I have lost mine becuase of what they contain.
rsk
Posted by rskontos on May 4, 2008, at 16:28:24
In reply to Re: Something I read today got me thinking » rskontos, posted by Sigismund on May 4, 2008, at 2:39:23
Well I would agree except I know my mind went to great lengths to escape mine so it is hard for my mind not to say your identity is something to escape too. I have a hard time knowing reality too. I don't know. Like I said I might be f**ked.
And the Memory is identity. It is you. I did not write I just read it and wondered.
It is a puzzle.
rsk
Posted by rskontos on May 4, 2008, at 16:33:37
In reply to Re: Something I read today got me thinking, posted by vwoolf on May 4, 2008, at 8:23:18
Ahhhhh, then I think it is right and I am f**ked until I deal with the naked ugly truth. But being dissociative I struggle with finding it and my mind allowing my memories to be restored. I was on the path and the flashbacks were coming fast and I got so frightened as I wasn't as prepared as I thought. Be careful what you wish is so true. So now I must start over as the memories are repressed again. I can open my mind to an extent but there is a huge extent others control still. So I still have huge amounts of work to do.
I really appreciate your response. Self awareness is only recently become something I am being to explore. I still make choices dictated not by me.
Man this is great. Thanks so much for the reply.
rsk
Posted by Sigismund on May 4, 2008, at 16:46:44
In reply to Re: Something I read today got me thinking » Sigismund, posted by rskontos on May 4, 2008, at 16:28:24
There's an interesting fim called "Memento" (sp?) about someone who entirely lacks short term memory.
He retains his identity, but of course has difficulties with function.
Posted by B2chica on May 5, 2008, at 8:06:57
In reply to Something I read today got me thinking, posted by rskontos on May 3, 2008, at 18:02:02
i hope that's not true. cuz i don't have lots of memories. well i do but not good ones. i'm always scared to death someones going to ask me to share memories of my childhood and all i can think of is someone abusing me. a memory of fear, shame and humiliation.
every time someone in my family tells a story of when i was younger i am so surprised by that story...i just don't remember it. whether it be good, scary, funny-whatever.and the thought that one entity 'defines' me i don't like. i feel we are shaped by many. memories are but one.
Posted by B2chica on May 5, 2008, at 8:07:59
In reply to Re: Something I read today got me thinking » rskontos, posted by Sigismund on May 4, 2008, at 16:46:44
i would like to see that one. i'll have to try and find it.
> There's an interesting film called "Memento" (sp?) about someone who entirely lacks short term memory.
>
> He retains his identity, but of course has difficulties with function.
Posted by Dinah on May 5, 2008, at 8:11:05
In reply to Re: Something I read today got me thinking » rskontos, posted by B2chica on May 5, 2008, at 8:06:57
> and the thought that one entity 'defines' me i don't like. i feel we are shaped by many. memories are but one.
I like that. And I agree.
Posted by rskontos on May 5, 2008, at 15:49:51
In reply to Re: Something I read today got me thinking » rskontos, posted by B2chica on May 5, 2008, at 8:06:57
B2c, I too hope not but I do know for me, at least, my memories and the escape of them, has shaped me. Well, actually what is behind them. So I guess if you look at it more in depth, meaning, the memories are shaped by events, sometimes powerful beyond belief and those events shape the person, those events being good or bad, then the memories put down in memory banks, whether remembered or not, do shape your identity is a truth I can understand. Whether or not you remember them still can impact your behavior in terms how how you act. The brain can shield you by repression of those memories, it will repress the good and the bad, it still shapes you. Now hopefully along the way, you will have additional memories that you do remember and those events shapes you more, a marriage, a graduation, good friends, a job, etc. I can understand this. I hope that we can slowly with awareness like vwoolf said replace those painful memories and re-write them with better ones so we don't go over and over them.
I am slowly learning to just be ok with my lack of memories and feelings. To be ok with my big ole dissy self.
But I am not really like therapy right now.
but that is another story.
rsk
Posted by rskontos on May 5, 2008, at 16:26:08
In reply to Re: Something I read today got me thinking » rskontos, posted by Sigismund on May 4, 2008, at 16:46:44
Sigismund, I think I will order that movie.
Sounds interesting. And I am still thinking about ego's. rsk
Posted by Sigismund on May 6, 2008, at 0:55:54
In reply to Re: Something I read today got me thinking » Sigismund, posted by rskontos on May 5, 2008, at 16:26:08
A long long time ago I was having an acid trip with a friend and we talked all night and at one point he said to me that someone had said to him
'Egos are fictional entities'So I was in an impressionable state and it made quite an impression on me.
Posted by seldomseen on May 6, 2008, at 7:59:19
In reply to Something I read today got me thinking, posted by rskontos on May 3, 2008, at 18:02:02
I'm not at all sure that "memory is identity" is true - although, it may be.
If we assume it is, then that still leaves room for a lot of hope. We are always creating new memories of different experiences.
Who is to say that the new (sometimes good!) memories aren't also shaping our identity?
Who is to say that we can't begin to re-write our identity by accumulating new and positive relationships, experiences and feelings?
Seldom.
Posted by rskontos on May 6, 2008, at 10:30:21
In reply to Re: Something I read today got me thinking » rskontos, posted by seldomseen on May 6, 2008, at 7:59:19
yes seldom I hope so as my old ones are inacessible by me at the present. and as for dragging them up well i am not sure bout that right now. i am not really bonding right now with my t and dragging them would be a lonely affair. I am having weird dreams and some flashbacks. I don't encourage them and he has to drag them out of me. I don't willingly tell them about them. I am a very reluctant participant at the moment. I still feel after all our talks he is bored. /so I am considering my options. Reading the article Muffled posted really made me think. So I am thinking maybe it is time to make some new memories elsewhere.
although for me being postive these days is increasing harder. But I am still trying.
How goes your work?
rsk
Posted by rskontos on May 6, 2008, at 10:32:19
In reply to Re: Something I read today got me thinking » rskontos, posted by Sigismund on May 6, 2008, at 0:55:54
So Sigismund, what was your impression of the statement "Egos are fictional entities". That they don't exist as the statement literally implies. Or is is deeper than that. I tried to read up on what the academics thought. I still have no direct thoughts on the subject.
What are your thoughts. You asked for ours.
rsk
Posted by rskontos on May 6, 2008, at 10:36:27
In reply to Re: Something I read today got me thinking, posted by rskontos on May 6, 2008, at 10:32:19
From what I read about Jung's thoughts it seems him reduced it more normal functioning egos and identities and for me I feel I am anything but that.
Maybe for those coming from fairly stable environments the ego functions very well and can establish a stable identity that helps the person in a variety of situations. I don't know. I don't know I have strong identities on any side.Again, your thoughts.
rsk
Posted by B2chica on May 6, 2008, at 13:33:48
In reply to Re: Something I read today got me thinking » B2chica, posted by rskontos on May 5, 2008, at 15:49:51
even if you believe that, remember. there IS a big difference between something Shaping you, and owning you.
yes our background and environment shaped us. but it is not US. we are MORE that our memories, we are our present and our future, we are our dreams and our ambitions. we are what we wish for others and for ourselves.
we are characters in our favorite tv shows, we are our favorite book authors, we are our favorite musicians, our favorite colors and our favorite foods.
we like and dislike things because of our experiences, but we are who we are because of our soul, our spirit. No one can shape that but us.Remember that dear rk.
remember that.b2c.
Posted by Sigismund on May 6, 2008, at 15:33:21
In reply to Re: Something I read today got me thinking, posted by rskontos on May 6, 2008, at 10:32:19
Well, one standard idea is that our sense of self is an illusion like film is an illusion.
In a film we have the sensation of continuity as our eyes and minds blur over the succession of stills to create the impression of movement.
Similarly our sense of ourselves could be seen to be created by the succession of present moments of conciousness that we smooth over and in so doing create the feeling of a continuous self.
I have no idea what I think of this.
I was talking to my doctor about some photos he had of sand forms in the Sahara, and I made some comment about self-replicating (non-living) forms, and I can't remember how we got there, but I do remember him saying as he laughed
'Nobody home'
meaning, I guessed something along the same lines.
I don't know.
Isn't that one reason why people love little children so much?
Because they have not lost the ability to live in the present?So, I'm just aimlessly wondering if the sense of self is strongest for those who have most trouble living in the present.
Posted by rskontos on May 6, 2008, at 20:22:16
In reply to think about this » rskontos, posted by B2chica on May 6, 2008, at 13:33:48
B2c,
I try
but
I don't have dream really anymore,
and as far as the future it seems so much work
but I guess I will try
i guess i need another t
I am not feeling good bodily today so it is harder emotional
you know.
But i will try again another day.
i am sad for those lost days, you know the ones where I was
unaware of all that I was doing before I know what and who I am.But I will try to regain positive thinking and I have an appointment with Integrated health consultant that specializes
in looking at holistic approach to hormones etc to see where you might be low to help your overall health and good feelings.
I still feel like my hormones are off, and that is attributing to my general low energy levels.My soul. There is something to think about and my spirit. I have let too many people shape me now is time to regain lost ground.
But thanks for your kind words my good friend!
Nice to see you around here. dear b2c(((((((B2c)))
rsk
rsk
Posted by rskontos on May 6, 2008, at 20:29:38
In reply to Re: Something I read today got me thinking » rskontos, posted by Sigismund on May 6, 2008, at 15:33:21
I have trouble living in the present I think, and I haven't a strong sense of self. I think we love little children for their ability to accept what is in front of them. They accept the now, whether or not they have a sense of self. Babies who have no sense of self yet, live in the now. They have shown we are program through DNA to love babies and children too. But, I do think for alot of us, we see children as pure. Without guile and guilt. And for a long time most children of healthy families grow up thinking the world revolves around them, egocentric. Which is a healthy state for them to be in. Until slowly they realize with many healthy interactions the world doesnt and they are ok with it. For too many of us, our knowledge of this is too quick and cruel. We are prevented from being egocentric. And for many this is what damages our sense of self early on.
I am just not sure either.
Interesting discussion though.
rsk
Posted by Dinah on May 6, 2008, at 20:54:39
In reply to Re: Something I read today got me thinking, posted by rskontos on May 6, 2008, at 20:29:38
I never can hold a stable sense of self because who I am today, how I feel about things and view the world, seems totally unrelated to how I viewed the world yesterday. I can say totally contradictory things and mean all of them, at that moment.
My therapist tries to remind me of all the many things about me that remain fairly stable, like my values I suppose. And I guess he's right.When he lays it out, I can see where he's right. But that just means I have a stable base for my self, not a stable sense of self.
Posted by Sigismund on May 6, 2008, at 21:24:24
In reply to Re: Something I read today got me thinking, posted by rskontos on May 6, 2008, at 20:29:38
That sounded right to me.
Posted by Sigismund on May 6, 2008, at 21:34:36
In reply to Re: Something I read today got me thinking » rskontos, posted by Dinah on May 6, 2008, at 20:54:39
When my father heard that a psychiatrist had said I didn't have a sense of identity, he snorted, thinking perhaps that he had come across my identity without any difficulty when he and I were fighting.
The Dinah on psychobabble seems very consistent, but perhaps it is a mistake to say that because someone seems consistent and therefore predictable that they have a strong sense of self?
In fact it might go the other way.
TS Eliot was famous for having predictable clear lines in his lived-in life, but much of his poetry refers to derangements in his sense of self, especially depersonalisation.One of my favourite photos is of my son aged a few months, and he is just looking out from his rug with that neutral absorbing expression.
If I say he seems quite without personality, I think you will understand what I am trying to refer to.
Posted by Dinah on May 6, 2008, at 22:51:50
In reply to Re: Something I read today got me thinking » Dinah, posted by Sigismund on May 6, 2008, at 21:34:36
:-)
I sometimes wish I was Dinah. But then, I also sometimes get upset that people seem to like Dinah more than they like me. :)
It's much easier to maintain consistency in asynchronous communications.
Even then, I sometimes read what I've written and wonder who on earth wrote it. lol.
Maybe my ego is stronger than my memory. :D
Was your son really neutral? My son was born with pretty much the same personality he has now. He was quite decided in his opinions and beliefs.
Posted by rskontos on May 7, 2008, at 13:39:04
In reply to Re: Something I read today got me thinking » rskontos, posted by Dinah on May 6, 2008, at 20:54:39
Dinah, yeah I get that too. I know for me, with my values, they are different depending on my inners. One I have has some very different ones. And ones I am not really too easy with. So I have to watch out for that. She has been having thoughts well, that is another story all together.
I would say that is good you have a stable base. So he understands you haven't a stable sense of self?rsk
Posted by rskontos on May 7, 2008, at 13:42:47
In reply to Re: Something I read today got me thinking » Sigismund, posted by Dinah on May 6, 2008, at 22:51:50
I would say my son was more neutral while my daughter has always had a distinctive personality. It is still true today. He is more neutral and quiet while she is the stronger one.
rsk
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