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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 20 of 20. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by cricket on June 2, 2006, at 9:26:17
Greetings everyone,
I used to post on this site up to about 6 months ago. Perhaps some of you remember me.
First of all, I want to thank everyone for all their support. I think I spent about a year on this site and it was a time when many people here were caring and insightful and responsive.
But I also want to put out a word of caution because in many ways this site was harmful to me.
I know that I am an aberration in this regard and I truly believe that for most people this site is a wonderful service. So for the longest time I didn’t think that posting about my experience here would be appropriate.
However, just in case I am not unique, and there are others out there who may be experiencing something similar I decided just to throw it out there.
During the time I was posting here I was going through a very difficult time in therapy. I often doubted my therapist (his competence, his caring, his experience, well just about everything) and I doubted myself even more.
The more I read here the worse it got. Although no one seemed to have a perfect therapist nor a perfect therapy relationship, everyone seemed to experience therapy in a similar way (lots of attachment, longing for therapist, desire to test boundaries) and I didn’t feel these things and so I felt worse and worse. Something was wrong with me, something was wrong with my therapist, something was wrong with both of us.
I shut down more and more in therapy and spent months in almost complete silence. My therapist became more and more frustrated and every session (when I managed to go at all) became a dreaded event for both of us.
I began to drift away from here for various reasons and then stopped posting and then even reading altogether.
And during that time after I left here, I think more of me as I am (not how I think I am supposed to be, not how everyone else seems to be) started to peek through and my therapist switched gears completely. He said that he too had been trying to help me in the traditional way (discussing the past and helping me see less than desirable patterns that were remnants of that past) but I didn’t suffer from PTSD. He said, "Almost no one comes in here with as much self-discipline as you, as much willingness to take 100% responsibility for the way your mind has developed so I think I need to change the way I work for you."
We basically decided that I didn’t really need therapy, but if there was anything in my present life that I wanted to work on he would be happy to try and help.
I couldn’t really think of anything but we’ve continued to see each other weekly although I am not sure it’s therapy at this point. I just tell him what’s going on in my mind, what my various parts have said and thought and felt over the course of the week and he just sits there with a big smile on his face. He actually says very little.
This has been going on for a few months now and I don’t think I have ever felt more content or peaceful in my life. I feel completed accepted for exactly who I am in this moment. I feel no compulsion to think or do anything in any particular way. I feel free in ways I never have before.
And yet if I read on here, I find it so easy to slip into thinking I’m defective, less than human, unfeeling, etc. And then I think why doesn’t my therapist help me with this and why doesn’t he say and do the things other therapists say and do.Now I realize all along that my desire to conform, to fit into that little round hole that I thought if I could just squeeze myself into I would get the perfect help, pushed my therapist into doing therapy in ways that weren’t suitable. I contorted myself and he tried to adapt to my contortions.
Once I backed away, he could back away and everything fell into place.
So, my advice would be if anyone suspects that something similar may be going on for them, it might be worth trying a Babble break for a few weeks.
I wish everyone peace and happiness.
Posted by B2chica on June 2, 2006, at 10:12:07
In reply to Babble Experience, posted by cricket on June 2, 2006, at 9:26:17
hi cricket.
thank you for your post. i think it was very well said.
i think that this is important to say. because although i think all of here have many things in common. sometimes this is the only place a lot of us actually feel we belong and want to keep that feeling. so although i hope this isn't happening, who knows.personally i have had a really great experience here. and quite frankly this is sometimes better for me than my real therapy was.(the bad ones)
but i think if nothing else it is very important for us to self monitor and realize if we are needing to take a break from babble, or even from therapy for that matter. sometimes we need this to step back and figure out where we are now and where we want to go from here.i was in pretty intense therapy for about a year with a great T, when he moved i saw someone basically to fill that place and to continue therapy. but it wasn't working. i stopped therapy, 1) because for three months all therapy was doing was costing me money and making me more upset and frustrated and hurt. 2)because i wanted to keep a connection to my old T and 3)because i wasn't sure what to do next. although my break hasn't been long i already feel stronger and better for my decision. i am now ready to find another T to start some preliminary work. but i needed that time (a few months) to realize that i wasn't going in the direction i wanted, and i wasn't being helped as i needed.
now i'm more sure and feel good about the decisions i made.i think everyone needs to step back once in a while to 'take inventory'.
i know that you were talking specifically about babble, but i think this is true for other realms in our lives as well.and i am very happy to hear that you are doing so well.
b2c
Posted by Dinah on June 2, 2006, at 10:45:34
In reply to Babble Experience, posted by cricket on June 2, 2006, at 9:26:17
I understand.
I also worry sometimes that we self select to a particular type of therapy, or a particular way of looking at therapy, that puts off other people with other ideas. :(
For example, I think it's hard to get a good CBT discussion rolling here.
I wish I could think of a way the place could be more inviting to different therapy experiences. Because it really depends on the client what is and isn't useful.
Posted by Tabitha on June 2, 2006, at 11:50:29
In reply to Re: Babble Experience » cricket, posted by Dinah on June 2, 2006, at 10:45:34
I've felt like an odd duck here too, since there are so many people in love with their therapist, and that hasn't happened to me in my therapy. It bugged me for a while. It prompted me to talk about it more in therapy, about my feelings for her, or lack of feelings for her, and it became a positive thing to have talked about it with her. But I did feel inadequate about it for a while. Not that I want to be in love with my therapist in a painful longing way, but I couldn't help wondering, like you did, if I was somehow cold and lacking, because I didn't go through that with her.
I'm glad you found peace with it all. Thanks for coming back and sharing.
Posted by gardenergirl on June 2, 2006, at 12:09:32
In reply to Babble Experience, posted by cricket on June 2, 2006, at 9:26:17
I'm really glad you were able to sort this out and that it's helped you move forward. Feeling accepted just as you are in this moment is such a wonderful feeling. I'm glad you are feeling that way, and I'm glad you shared your experience here with us.
Take care,
gg
Posted by pseudoname on June 2, 2006, at 12:12:34
In reply to Babble Experience, posted by cricket on June 2, 2006, at 9:26:17
> I know that I am an aberration in this regard
Then I am, too. I like what Dinah said about the Psych board: that it seems to self-select for a particular type of therapy experience. I don't know why that's the case here, though.
At the Toronto get-together last month, a couple of us (by no means all) voiced observations (complaints?) similar to yours. I sometimes want to scream in isolation and frustration when I read yet another post here by someone who's in love with her therapist. Obviously, those are *very* important and serious experiences, and I'm glad people have an outlet here to discuss them, but they're not my experience at all, and the discussions aren't helpful to me. (I have serious doubts that the cathartic, dyadic, nondirective therapies that foster such experiences are ultimately very helpful to anyone, but that's another discussion. I think my doubt is well-supported by the data from this board, though.)
Thanks so much for posting.
___________(P.S. I don't want anyone to refrain from posting about their love for their therapist. I just wish more people with OTHER therapy perspectives would also post on the Psych board.)
Posted by ClearSkies on June 2, 2006, at 12:50:50
In reply to self-selecting » cricket, posted by pseudoname on June 2, 2006, at 12:12:34
>
> (P.S. I don't want anyone to refrain from posting about their love for their therapist. I just wish more people with OTHER therapy perspectives would also post on the Psych board.)OK by me. I've kept in the shadows too.
ClearSkies
Posted by cricket on June 2, 2006, at 13:43:49
In reply to Babble Experience, posted by cricket on June 2, 2006, at 9:26:17
Thank you all for responding so sincerely.
I hope that Babble does become a place where all types of therapy and therapy/client/patient relationships are discussed.
I hope that in the meantime those who have more ego strength than I do hang in there and bring some diversity to the discussion.
Take care everyone.
Posted by muffled on June 2, 2006, at 14:08:18
In reply to Re: Babble Experience, posted by cricket on June 2, 2006, at 13:43:49
Posted by Larry Hoover on June 2, 2006, at 15:40:46
In reply to Babble Experience, posted by cricket on June 2, 2006, at 9:26:17
> Greetings everyone,
Hey. Good to see your "face" again.
> So, my advice would be if anyone suspects that something similar may be going on for them, it might be worth trying a Babble break for a few weeks.
>
> I wish everyone peace and happiness.
>Thank you for your thoughtful post. You have done some amazing things with yourself.
Lar
Posted by caraher on June 2, 2006, at 17:13:14
In reply to self-selecting » cricket, posted by pseudoname on June 2, 2006, at 12:12:34
> (P.S. I don't want anyone to refrain from posting about their love for their therapist. I just wish more people with OTHER therapy perspectives would also post on the Psych board.)
It never occurred to me that people who aren't "in love with my T" would take all the talk about that here as a sign of somehow inferior therapy. I haven't had this experience either and I'm very glad I haven't!
But it seems inevitable that those who are obsessed with their therapists will be the more active members. That's just the nature of the beast! Take away those threads and I think there's still quite a lot here.
Posted by Daisym on June 3, 2006, at 1:54:08
In reply to Re: Babble Experience, posted by B2chica on June 2, 2006, at 10:12:07
And yet, there are threads here NOT about the client/therapist relationship that no one responds to. And so many threads seem to get redirected if not about the relationship. I can think of several topics immediately --talking about God/religion in therapy, body imagine in therapy and therapist disclosure. Each of these had a few reponses but pretty much from the same people or between two people.
I'm feeling frustrated by this thread, I guess because we seem to have thoughtful, articulate shadow babblers who are lurking instead of posting. How do we change that?
I'm horribly unhelpful around this because I'm so stuck in the relationship angst. Sorry all.
Posted by pseudoname on June 3, 2006, at 11:32:14
In reply to Re: Babble Experience, posted by Daisym on June 3, 2006, at 1:54:08
> And yet, there are threads here NOT about the client/therapist relationship that no one responds to.
The threads about the T relationship are really evocative. They're easy to reply to on a number of levels: sympathetically, with advice, with personal history, with outrage, from ethical/legal viewpoints, with more questions, etc. (Not "easy" like in uncomplicated, but it's immediate and you "click" with what the person is saying.)
In comparison alternative topics can seem idiosyncratic or dull.
> And so many threads seem to get redirected if not about the relationship.
I'd like to do a study of redirected threads: I'm pretty sure redirection is a discussion-killer.
> I'm feeling frustrated by this thread
I'm actually feeling encouraged by this thread. The board doesn't look as uniform now.
From now on, I will assume:
If *0* people respond, 30 people are interested.
If 1 person responds, 31 people are interested.
…etc. ;-)
Posted by littleone on June 4, 2006, at 21:13:33
In reply to Re: Babble Experience, posted by Daisym on June 3, 2006, at 1:54:08
> And yet, there are threads here NOT about the client/therapist relationship that no one responds to.
> I'm feeling frustrated by this thread, I guess because we seem to have thoughtful, articulate shadow babblers who are lurking instead of posting. How do we change that?I can't talk on behalf of anyone else, only on my own experiences. And I've been very hesitant to bring this up at all.
But I believe that posters in distress generate a lot of replies. Don't get me wrong, I don't just mean if they're s, but rather if the tone of the post is great angst or upset. People jump in trying to help make things better.
Whereas if someone is upset about something but posts with a calmer tone, then they generally get fewer replies.
Or in my case, very few replies. That's why I've tried to stop posting. Because I feel very hurt when I get few replies. I know part of that goes back to being ignored by my mum, but even knowing that hasn't made it any easier for me. The lack of response usually causes a lot more distress for me than the original issue I posted about.
That's why this poster lurks instead of posts.
Posted by Larry Hoover on June 4, 2006, at 22:39:37
In reply to Re: Babble Experience » Daisym, posted by littleone on June 4, 2006, at 21:13:33
> Whereas if someone is upset about something but posts with a calmer tone, then they generally get fewer replies.
Do you wonder if your tone suggests assurance? Less need, more reflection? Insight over raw emotion?
> Or in my case, very few replies. That's why I've tried to stop posting. Because I feel very hurt when I get few replies. I know part of that goes back to being ignored by my mum, but even knowing that hasn't made it any easier for me. The lack of response usually causes a lot more distress for me than the original issue I posted about.
>
> That's why this poster lurks instead of posts.....because I feel a kinship with you in some aspects of emotional reactions, and I can't imagine I'd not pick something up.
I'm a touch baffled, and sincerely sorry.
Lar
Posted by muffled on June 4, 2006, at 23:19:35
In reply to Re: Babble Experience » Daisym, posted by littleone on June 4, 2006, at 21:13:33
I think the more you post, the more people get to know you and are more likely to respond.
I have had plenty of threads that just sat there. But I keep posting away.
Its definately hard to not turn it into a popularity contest at first. But I have found that , that problem has passed for me completely.
Sorry littlone that you have felt ignored.
And good on ya for saying so!!!!
Take care.
Muffled
Posted by fairywings on June 5, 2006, at 1:21:35
In reply to Babble Experience, posted by cricket on June 2, 2006, at 9:26:17
Hi Cricket,
I remember you - glad you're doing well! I remember when you were posting about your difficulties and/or ambivalence about babble. I'm glad you were able to back off so you could take a look at the big picture for you. Sounds like you've been able to move forward, that's great!I guess babble is like a medication....it effects everyone in a bit of a different way.
fw
Posted by Larry Hoover on June 5, 2006, at 9:01:21
In reply to Re: Babble Experience » cricket, posted by fairywings on June 5, 2006, at 1:21:35
> Hi Cricket,
Okay, hold on. Cricket = littleone?
I get so messed up. Who is who and what and when and..... and I just don't even try to sort it out, most of the time.
Here's a trick to use, to address that thing you mentioned. If you post, and it just lays there. Post again, right there. Remind us. Sometimes I read a post that makes me want to think for a while, before answering. And then I can't find it. All the posts I've read look the same. That reddish colour. Which one was it? Who even posted it? <-- going back to my own difficulty remembering who is who is when is.....
So, remind us. 'Kay? Can I have some attention, over here, please?
It's not so hard, once you've done it.
Lar
Posted by Poet on June 5, 2006, at 10:48:46
In reply to Babble Experience, posted by cricket on June 2, 2006, at 9:26:17
I'll be in therapy for four years in August and I am not in love with my therapist. She and I have much in common and while I like it when we talk about movies or books, I know that our relationship is that of therapist and client. She's not my friend, even though we'd probably be great friends, it won't happen. There are boundaries and one big barrier- the one that is filled with all the things I've told her that I'd be horrified if anyone else found out.
Poet
Posted by AuntieMel on June 6, 2006, at 13:49:32
In reply to self-selecting » cricket, posted by pseudoname on June 2, 2006, at 12:12:34
Right. I think I wouldn't even like hanging out with mine. He doesn't do a thing for me and we really don't have much in common.
It sure helps keep it on a 'professional' level. And in some ways, because I don't give a whit what he thinks of me it actually frees me up to say things.
This is the end of the thread.
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