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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 25 of 29. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by muffled on December 21, 2005, at 20:56:31
My T wants me to get a psych asessment and proly go to a psychologist eventually. She also wants me to join a DBT group.
I been feeling bad , so I went to GP for zoloft and clonezapam. T wanted me to on stuff in new year but I couldn't wait. She phoned my GP to clue her in to what was going on a bit. My GP (long time GP) says to me what my T said cuz she says she don't wanto talk behind my back. Thats nice. But it was just what me and T had already talked about. T said I was getting worse to Dr. She didn't say that to me specifically.
Anyhow I think T grows tired of me. I think she was really put out that I spazzed last week.
I think she thinks its bad that I so stressed after appts. But isn't that normal? We talk and stuff thats so ahrd for me, so of course I stressed. She says weird things sometimes.
I phoned her cell Thurs night at 10 pm cuz I was totally spazzing. I NEVER normally call her cell. I just leave messages at her office.
Anyhow, I left a rather garbled message on her cell, and she did say she got it (next day?) cuz she had a big huge dinner party she was getting on. She said she thot she phoned Sun. Anyhow, it was all abit odd.Sorta seemed like she was making excuses. You would have thot she would have clicked in that something was big wrong since I phoned her cell.
Then at one point she said jokingly that she wasn't even gonna apologize bout not returning call, cuz of what she'd just explained to me, but I didn't really get. She's got a thing about phoning I think.
And yet, when I left message at her office re: me going to GP she called back quite promptly.
Should I just let this go or bug her about it cuz i don't really understand. I think she was a bit rattled over my freak out. I think she's a bit rattled cuz I'm 'getting worse'. But really I think it would get worse cuz I trying to do things that are hard for me, but presumably it gets better with practice.
She says I have a phobia to emotions.
My last appt Ithink I was there well over an hour, mebbe over 1 and a half hour.
I guess she wanted to get info on what happened.
I feel lost and confused. Don't see T until Jan 3. GP that week too. Dunno bout the rest.
The clonezapam seems to work better than the xanax for me at the moment.
I dread the zoloft. My guts are alredy bad from stress.
Sigh.
Anybody got anything clever to tell me that I'm missing cuz I so mixed up?
Yep, like that clonezapam.
Muffled
Posted by alexandra_k on December 21, 2005, at 21:08:50
In reply to New meds???Psych assess, DBT????LOST, posted by muffled on December 21, 2005, at 20:56:31
I think DBT would be GREAT for you. Really really really :-)
Sounds like your therapist... Is looking out for what is best for you. Really. It can be hard for t's to know what to do / say sometimes. Sounds to me like she is anxious to find the thing that is likely to help you and she isn't so sure about how much she is helping you...
I really think DBT would be great if you could get in to do that :-)
Really :-)
And they have the phone thing all sorted out. Your DBT t should tell you upfront about how many / what times phone calls are / are not appropriate and how soon you can expect a response etc.
And... Your SI. They would try and help you figure out some alternatives. And... Help you get more in touch with your emotions and be able to identify them and modulate them etc :-)
>
Posted by sleepygirl on December 21, 2005, at 21:11:37
In reply to New meds???Psych assess, DBT????LOST, posted by muffled on December 21, 2005, at 20:56:31
hhhmm, so she is concerned about you and wants to know that you'll be OK between appointments, perhaps that relates to the DBT (a lot of which is about reducing self-harm, tolerating strong emotions, mindfulness-identifying and coping with emotions)
I don't think she is tired of you, just concerned for you and eager probably to get you the treatment she feels you need. And the antidepressant thing, well you know they say it takes a while until people have an adequate level of the stuff in their system, so the sooner the better, especially it being a holiday soon and all.
She's concerned, do you think she should be?
Posted by muffled on December 21, 2005, at 21:32:43
In reply to Re: Yay!!! DBT :-) » muffled, posted by alexandra_k on December 21, 2005, at 21:08:50
> I think DBT would be GREAT for you. Really really really :-)
***Whoah!Ok, good endorsement! Never done dbt myself.
>
> Sounds like your therapist... Is looking out for what is best for you. Really. It can be hard for t's to know what to do / say sometimes. Sounds to me like she is anxious to find the thing that is likely to help you and she isn't so sure about how much she is helping you...***Yeah, I think maybe i a little too much for her. She has basic training and quite a bit of experience, but I dunno whats with her and me.
>
> I really think DBT would be great if you could get in to do that :-)***Don't think it'll be a problem, and our health care pays for it!!!Bonus.
>
> Really :-)
>
> And they have the phone thing all sorted out. Your DBT t should tell you upfront about how many / what times phone calls are / are not appropriate and how soon you can expect a response etc.***GOOD. Double GOOD.
>
> And... Your SI. They would try and help you figure out some alternatives. And... Help you get more in touch with your emotions and be able to identify them and modulate them etc :-)
> >
***Wow, that sounds pretty much like exactly what I need to do.
Terrics said she didn't do well with dbt, I'll have to ask her why?
Thanks for the enthusiastic reply Alex! Thats was nice :)
Got yer babblemail THX.
Muffled
Posted by fallsfall on December 21, 2005, at 21:38:20
In reply to Re: Yay!!! DBT :-) » alexandra_k, posted by muffled on December 21, 2005, at 21:32:43
I found DBT to be helpful. I only did it for 6 months (most people go for a year). But it did help. It helps you learn skills that help you to cope with stuff. I found it very educational.
Posted by muffled on December 21, 2005, at 21:41:21
In reply to Re: New meds???Psych assess, DBT????LOST » muffled, posted by sleepygirl on December 21, 2005, at 21:11:37
> hhhmm, so she is concerned about you and wants to know that you'll be OK between appointments, perhaps that relates to the DBT (a lot of which is about reducing self-harm, tolerating strong emotions, mindfulness-identifying and coping with emotions)
***Sounds good.
>
> I don't think she is tired of you, just concerned for you and eager probably to get you the treatment she feels you need. And the antidepressant thing, well you know they say it takes a while until people have an adequate level of the stuff in their system, so the sooner the better, especially it being a holiday soon and all.
> She's concerned, do you think she should be?***I guess she concerned, she seems to have wickedly high boundaries in some ways and not in others. I think she proly does care and thats why such huge boundaries. But it makes it hard cuz she's just not there reliably except for appts. The rest of the time its sort of iffy to try and get ahold of her. She's pretty good bout eventually returning messages left at her office. But not totally reliable about it.
I am taking care. I phoned our local crisis line to find out what I can do if I freak (since my T seems iffy), and they will send a mental health team out to a place of your choosing (eventually) and they will assess you and if need be can get you admitted. So I am trying to cover my bases here.
Thanks Sleepy,
Muffled
Posted by muffled on December 21, 2005, at 21:43:40
In reply to Re: New meds???Psych assess, DBT????LOST, posted by muffled on December 21, 2005, at 21:41:21
Posted by muffled on December 21, 2005, at 21:44:38
In reply to Re: Yay!!! DBT :-) » muffled, posted by fallsfall on December 21, 2005, at 21:38:20
Posted by sleepygirl on December 21, 2005, at 21:54:35
In reply to Re: New meds???Psych assess, DBT????LOST, posted by muffled on December 21, 2005, at 21:41:21
Maybe you could discuss with your T what you might do in the event of a crisis, maybe outline phone guidelines, all that stuff, so it's a bit more reliable and stable for you when you're not feeling so great
Posted by muffled on December 21, 2005, at 22:04:50
In reply to Re: New meds???Psych assess, DBT????LOST » muffled, posted by sleepygirl on December 21, 2005, at 21:54:35
> Maybe you could discuss with your T what you might do in the event of a crisis, maybe outline phone guidelines, all that stuff, so it's a bit more reliable and stable for you when you're not feeling so great
***We did.
She will not return calls on weekends.
She checks her office machine 'regularly'.
I can call her cell weekdays, but she may or may not answer, and may or may not answer messages left on cell.
So thats it. Sort of iffy.
Other than that, call crisis line (if you can get thru, sometimes they very busy) or goto emerg.
Thats the protocol.
I'm a little leery of phoning crisis line cuz I did one time and they sent out cops and I was kicking the window in their car and the bastards peppersprayed me right in the eyes. Then I ended up at hosp. face down with a wet cloth for my burning eyes, in restraints at emerg. It was ugly.
They didn't have to peppersray me, there are other options. I never hit them or threatened them EVER. I just wanted outof the car. Bastards.
Muffled.
Posted by sleepygirl on December 21, 2005, at 22:06:35
In reply to Re: New meds???Psych assess, DBT????LOST » sleepygirl, posted by muffled on December 21, 2005, at 22:04:50
yeah..that sounds a bit over the top there. How do you feel about the crisis line?
Posted by muffled on December 21, 2005, at 22:16:27
In reply to Re: New meds???Psych assess, DBT????LOST » muffled, posted by sleepygirl on December 21, 2005, at 22:06:35
> yeah..that sounds a bit over the top there. How do you feel about the crisis line?
***Yeah. Major over the top. I'm not a grudge holder, but that is my one large grudge. I'd love to spray the guy that sprayed me one day. I just may do it.
The crisis line is OK. They don't have enough people though so sometime you can't get thru.
I remember awhile back I tried to get thru over a period of days and could just not.
The crisis guys were justified in calling the cops, or maybe it was the mental health guys, don't remember.
I think the crisis line is a good service really. I would proly be dead but for them one time, yeah, I'da done it.
Muffled
Posted by happyflower on December 21, 2005, at 22:24:03
In reply to Re: New meds???Psych assess, DBT????LOST, posted by muffled on December 21, 2005, at 21:41:21
((((((MUFFY)))))) I don't know what DBT is exactly, but I hope it helps you feel better.
So what does DBT stand for? D*mn blasted therapy? LOL Just kidding!
Posted by sleepygirl on December 21, 2005, at 22:26:30
In reply to Re: New meds???Psych assess, DBT????LOST, posted by happyflower on December 21, 2005, at 22:24:03
dialectical behavior therapy - something to do with the relationship of opposites and extremes...how zen
Posted by muffled on December 21, 2005, at 22:27:36
In reply to Re: New meds???Psych assess, DBT????LOST, posted by happyflower on December 21, 2005, at 22:24:03
> ((((((MUFFY)))))) I don't know what DBT is exactly, but I hope it helps you feel better.
>
> So what does DBT stand for? D*mn blasted therapy? LOL Just kidding!***Yeah! you ask me after I been at it awhile. I'd proly agree!!!
It stands for dialectical behaviour therapy or something like that. I think its like cbt with an attitude.
Muffled
Posted by muffled on December 21, 2005, at 22:29:13
In reply to Re: New meds???Psych assess, DBT????LOST » happyflower, posted by sleepygirl on December 21, 2005, at 22:26:30
> dialectical behavior therapy - something to do with the relationship of opposites and extremes...how zen
*****Ohhhh Sleepy- you good!
Posted by sleepygirl on December 21, 2005, at 22:32:31
In reply to Re: New meds???Psych assess, DBT????LOST » sleepygirl, posted by muffled on December 21, 2005, at 22:29:13
tanks muffs ;-)
Posted by happyflower on December 21, 2005, at 22:42:09
In reply to Re: New meds???Psych assess, DBT????LOST » happyflower, posted by muffled on December 21, 2005, at 22:27:36
sounds sexy to me! LOL please give me some DBT, please, now!
Posted by happyflower on December 21, 2005, at 22:44:53
In reply to Re: New meds???Psych assess, DBT????LOST » happyflower, posted by sleepygirl on December 21, 2005, at 22:26:30
> dialectical behavior therapy - something to do with the relationship of opposites and extremes...how zen
Hey, I am hip to that, ying and yang, just like yoga!!!! so cool, maybe I should suggest some ying yang yoga therapy for me. I have to appolize this free spirt had been in a locked cage too long. LOL
Posted by muffled on December 21, 2005, at 22:57:48
In reply to What the hay, trigger, trigger, tigger, bigger » sleepygirl, posted by happyflower on December 21, 2005, at 22:44:53
> > dialectical behavior therapy - something to do with the relationship of opposites and extremes...how zen
>
> Hey, I am hip to that, ying and yang, just like yoga!!!! so cool, maybe I should suggest some ying yang yoga therapy for me. I have to appolize this free spirt had been in a locked cage too long. LOL***Hey, I'm glad to see ya Happy!!
I goto goto bed now like a good girl.
Sweet dreams Happy!
Muffled
Posted by alexandra_k on December 22, 2005, at 1:05:40
In reply to Re: What the hay, trigger, trigger, tigger, bigger, posted by muffled on December 21, 2005, at 22:57:48
hmm there seems to be three good ones...
so i'll try and get them:http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0898620341/drbobsvirte00-20
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0898621836/drbobsvirte00-20
Haven't seen this but I wouldn't mind having a look...
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1593850662/drbobsvirte00-20
Posted by alexandra_k on December 22, 2005, at 11:48:47
In reply to Re: What the hay, trigger, trigger, tigger, bigger, posted by alexandra_k on December 22, 2005, at 1:05:40
I wrote more than that but then I lost my post...
But it probably is important...
I think...
Linehan was interested in helping people who had fairly recurrent thoughts / urges of SI and suicide. The biggest client population where those things are a factor is Borderline Personality Disorder and so she developed an interest in that.
(So please don't freak about the therapy being developed for people with BPD. Point is... It is a therapy that is designed to help people with SI / suicidal urges, emotion dysregulation etc).
Here is what she has to say about BPD...
'Emotional Vulnerability: A pattern of pervasive difficulties in regulating negative emotions, including high sensitivity to negative emotional stimuli, high emotional intensity, and slow return to emotional baseline, as well as awareness and experience of emotional vulnerability. May include a tendency to blame the social environment for unrealistic expectations and demands.
[and i will add that sometimes the social environment does have unrealistic expectations and demands...]
Self-Invalidation: Tendency to invalidate or fail to recognise one's own emotional responses, thoughts, beliefs, and behaviours. Unrealistically high standards and expectations for self. May include intense shame, self-hate, and self-directed anger.
Unrelenting Crises: Pattern of frequent, stressful, negative environmental events, disruptions, and roadblocks - some caused by the individual's dysfunctional lifestyle, others by an inadequate social milieu, and many by fate or chance.
Inhibited grieving: Tendency to inhibit and overcontrol negative emotional responses especially those associated with grief and loss, including sadness, anger, guilt, shame, anxiety, and panic.
Active passivity: Tendency to passive interpersonal problem-solving style, involving failure to engage actively in solving of own life problems, often together with active attempts to solicit problem solving from others in the environment; learned helplessness, hopelessness.
Apparant competence: Tendency for the individual to appear deceptively more competent than she actually is; usually due to failure of competencies to generalise across expected moods, situations, and time, and to failure to display adequate nonverbal cues of emotional distress.
(Available from second link)
The third link was interesting to me... I started reading it (from the extract available online)... Interesting...
A lot of people think... That DBT would be helpful for anyone... Not just people with BPD.
What I found... Was that the individual therapist was important. Some therapists... Kind of try and 'tag on' the DBT stuff to the current way they do CBT therapy with clients with BPD.
That kind of misses the point...
Other therapists seem to understand *why* she altered things... And they use that to modify the way they normally practice CBT.
IMO... There is a huge difference.
Posted by muffled on December 22, 2005, at 12:28:59
In reply to Re: What the hay, trigger, trigger, tigger, bigger, posted by alexandra_k on December 22, 2005, at 1:05:40
Thanks Alex, this is all good. I will arm myself with info. And I will ask the person these questions. Those books by lineham that you linked to(thanks) , my T just got a copy of both of them a little while ago. Mebbe thats where she got idea of dbt group for me.
Makes me feel good to have someone onside with me.
Didn't puke on the zoloft last night. Thats good. the tranquilizers good too. I'm chilling mostly.
Still kinda scared somehow, but 'tranquilly' scared!
Have you heard anything about a place for you to live yet?
Thanks
Muffled
Posted by alexandra_k on December 22, 2005, at 12:37:13
In reply to Re:dbt » alexandra_k, posted by muffled on December 22, 2005, at 12:28:59
> Those books by lineham that you linked to(thanks) , my T just got a copy of both of them a little while ago. Mebbe thats where she got idea of dbt group for me.
ah... maybe she got the books because she was trying to figure out how to help you. Linehan says... a therapist working in isolation is NOT doing DBT. you see... when you are in DBT then you have to go to skills group (sort of group therapy) as well as having individual therapy. Skills group is where you learn and get to practice new stuff :-)
But in DBT... the therapists have to go to a kind of support group too... with each other. to check that they are all DBT focused etc and aren't lapsing back into some of the more unsavory ways of viewing things ;-) I know that the therapist group that my t was a part of used to do a mindfulness exercise to open the meeting (they are cool fun) and they would have a little bell to ring whenever anybody said anything judgemental or anything like that ;-)
those meetings really are very important...
and Linehan emphasises that...
so that is probably why... your t is thinking it would be better for you to do dbt properly :-)(kind of like civility rules for therapists)
;-)
> Have you heard anything about a place for you to live yet?
no.
you trying to scare me????!
(kidding)
i'm sure it will sort itself out (have applied...)
Posted by muffled on December 22, 2005, at 19:49:14
In reply to Re:dbt » muffled, posted by alexandra_k on December 22, 2005, at 12:37:13
Wow thats so great Alex to have this info. It will make it SO much easier for me if I know what to anticipate a bit. I tend to dissociate and get so lost when I am stressed which is, of course, no help at all. Damnded annoying.
My T would love you defending her. Its good for me to hear that stuff. I AM a bit defensive of her I guess. Was it that obvious???
Sometimes I don't even know what I write.
Sigh.
Thanks alot Alex, this stuff means alot to me. :-)
Muffled
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